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 Forum index » House Training » Bugs ( Submit bugs )
Bug in the Puppy Linux Release Program
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perdido


Joined: 09 Dec 2013
Posts: 959
Location: ¿Altair IV , Just north of Eeyore Junction.?

PostPosted: Mon 10 Sep 2018, 10:22    Post subject:  Bug in the Puppy Linux Release Program
Subject description: Developement reduced to a single release in 3 years!
 

There seems to be a bug that prevents Puppy Linux from being officially released.
I present the following time table from Distrowatch for review.
This timeline of releases from Distrowatch says it all.

• 2017-12-05: Distribution Release: Puppy Linux 7.5 released by 666philb
• 2015-11-17: Distribution Release: Puppy Linux 6.3 "Slacko" released by Barry Kauler
• 2014-10-28: Distribution Release: Puppy Linux 6.0 "Tahrpup" released by Barry Kauler
• 2014-03-12: Distribution Release: Puppy Linux 5.7 "Slacko"
• 2013-08-13: Distribution Release: Puppy Linux 5.6 "Slacko"
• 2013-07-28: Distribution Release: Puppy Linux 5.7 "Precise"
• 2013-05-21: Distribution Release: Puppy Linux 5.6 "Precise"
• 2013-03-10: Distribution Release: Puppy Linux 5.5 "Precise"
• 2013-03-06: Distribution Release: Puppy Linux 5.5 "Slacko"
• 2013-03-03: Distribution Release: Puppy Linux 5.5 "Wary", "Racy"
• 2012-12-04: Distribution Release: Puppy Linux 5.4 "Slacko"
• 2012-10-23: Distribution Release: Puppy Linux 5.4 "Precise"

How can this be if there is continuous current developement?

This bug is hurting puppy worse than any other bug in WoofCE

.

Last edited by perdido on Mon 10 Sep 2018, 15:03; edited 1 time in total
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rufwoof

Joined: 24 Feb 2014
Posts: 2565

PostPosted: Mon 10 Sep 2018, 15:01    Post subject:  

Post adoption/acceptance of Debian Live projects within the Forums Puppy Projects section, from my experiences many soon become 'confused' about 'Puppy' and quickly lose interest for other alternatives. Lack of new blood/interest induces development incentive decay.
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musher0

Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Posts: 12700
Location: Gatineau (Qc), Canada

PostPosted: Mon 10 Sep 2018, 16:47    Post subject:  

Hi perdido.

Did you assemble this list yourself? Ah. From the DistroWatch site. I see.

A couple of "euh"'s... on my part, if I may. Maybe others will have noticed
as well?

There are two "Pups 7.5", one called xenialPup, 666philb's last pup, I
believe, and one called DPupStretch, currently being constructed by radky.

The slacko Pups are authored by PuppyLinux' new director: Mike Amadio,
aka 01micko, not BarryK.

As you certainly know, BarryK retired from PuppyLinux, 4-5 years ago now.
He is still active on parallel projects "Quirky" and "Easy".

~~~~~~

In my opinion, there is no bug in the "PuppyLinux Continuity Plan". Because
there is no real plan, PuppyLinux has always been a semi-anarchic
"do-ocracy". While the writers at DW are doing an excellent job generally
covering the Linux world, they are not catching this aspect of PuppyLinux.

IMO, the person we need to "push" Puppy in the "big, bad, world out there"
is a good public relations person, someone who really knows how to draw
positive attention to a project. And who would do basically just that.

E.g.:
Coming back to DPupStretch, a year and a half ago 4-5 top Puppy devs sort
of competed towards the production of a DPupStretch-7.0. We each produced
our own finally, but none was picked up and designated "official" and pushed
out the door.

Development wise, we were tailing the Debian people, if we had wanted to,
we could've published our DPupStretch-7 the same day Debian published
their official Stretch, but nah. There was some lack of initiative, or laziness,
or whatever, and no version of DPupSWtretch-7 ever left "the PuppyLinux
factory", so to speak.

Another example:
What happened to Sailor Enceladus' Devuan Pups? Again, pretty good stuff,
but not "pushed", not "supported" by any public relations initiative from the
PuppyLinux "Council of Elders" (or whatever they are called) or even by a
single Puppyist digging in his/her heels.

I'm talking about Sailor Enceladus above, but a lot of good PuppyLinux
implementations by various Puppy devs are in the same situation.

Puppists?

You only have five minutes to cry about this sad situation. (And please "cry
a river" if you do cry, because it is very, very sad indeed.)

However, when your five minutes are up, you're expected to roll up your
sleeves and do some good public relations work for Puppy.

Adopt one good, well-rounded, PuppyLinux variant and push it, push it,
push it -- in any media! Got it? Capiche?

Respectfully.

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musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
Fidèle elle commença, ainsi elle restera. (Prov. canadien) /
Faithful she began, so will she stay. (Canadian prov.)
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perdido


Joined: 09 Dec 2013
Posts: 959
Location: ¿Altair IV , Just north of Eeyore Junction.?

PostPosted: Mon 10 Sep 2018, 17:13    Post subject:  

musher0 wrote:
Hi perdido.

Did you assemble this list yourself?
A couple of "euh"'s... on my part. Maybe others haven't noticed?
.


The timeline is verbatim from distrowatch.
https://distrowatch.com/?newsid=10053

One "official" release in 3 years is dismal.



.
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 11033
Location: Charleston S.C. USA

PostPosted: Mon 10 Sep 2018, 17:17    Post subject:  

If you want a new version of Puppy.
Someone has to volunteer to develop it and release it.

No one gets payed to develop Puppy.

Nothing in Puppy is someones job! Shocked

If a version of anything, is going to be called an official Puppy version, it has to follow some basic rules, for how it was made.
Quote:
Q: What is an official Puppy Linux distribution?
A: It must meet two conditions. 1) It must be built using Woof-CE. 2) It must be endorsed as “official” by the Puppy Master.


About the Puppy time line.
There is no official Puppy time line and there is no need for one.
When it is broken and no longer does what is needed.
Time for a newer version of Puppy.

Puppy is not an OS that constantly has to change, so you can ask for more money, to get a newer version.

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When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
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musher0

Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Posts: 12700
Location: Gatineau (Qc), Canada

PostPosted: Mon 10 Sep 2018, 18:03    Post subject:  

perdido wrote:
musher0 wrote:
Hi perdido.

Did you assemble this list yourself?
A couple of "euh"'s... on my part. Maybe others haven't noticed?
.

The timeline is verbatim from distrowatch.
https://distrowatch.com/?newsid=10053

One "official" release in 3 years is dismal.
.

@Perdido:
Three years? Some early releases on that list are only months apart and
the latest by philb was last December, i.e. 9 months ago.

@bigpup:
About that woof-CE regulation, maybe we need to break loose of it and
consider the good current Puppy material produced by good ol'
remastering. It's a strong and healthy activity among Puppyists, and
the "Council of Elders" is leaving it out entirely.

@all
Why the "Council of Elders" is not yet officializing peebee's BionicPup is a
mystery to me.

My 2 ¢.

BFN

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musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
Fidèle elle commença, ainsi elle restera. (Prov. canadien) /
Faithful she began, so will she stay. (Canadian prov.)
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 11033
Location: Charleston S.C. USA

PostPosted: Mon 10 Sep 2018, 18:35    Post subject:  

Quote:
Why the "Council of Elders" is not yet officializing peebee's BionicPup is a
mystery to me.

Has he asked for it to be considered?
Is it at final release?

Remastering is not the same as starting from nothing and producing a new Puppy.

There is a very good reason to make a new Puppy, from nothing, by using Woof-CE.
Woof-CE contains all the latest versions of Puppy core files, programs, bug fixes, tweaks, etc... at the time you use it.
It also controls that you make a Puppy that works the Puppy way.
Woof-CE is the place that a lot of under the hood work is done on Puppy. How Puppy actually works.

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I have found, in trying to help people, that the things they do not tell you, are usually the clue to solving the problem.
When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
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Moat


Joined: 16 Jul 2013
Posts: 904
Location: Mid-mitten, USA

PostPosted: Mon 10 Sep 2018, 19:01    Post subject:  

As I see it, perfectly eligible Woof'd Puppies exist/have existed over the discussed time frame - the "blessing"... not so much (i.e. - crickets...!). I think that's the issue Perdido highlights, and I agree it's not at all good PR for Puppy.

Although I fully understand why the developers of these recent (truly excellent!!) Pups may not wish their product labeled as "official". Quite a responsibility beyond that point, I'd imagine!

Bob
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ITSMERSH


Joined: 02 May 2018
Posts: 316

PostPosted: Mon 10 Sep 2018, 20:33    Post subject:  

bigpup wrote:
Quote:
Why the "Council of Elders" is not yet officializing peebee's BionicPup is a
mystery to me.

Has he asked for it to be considered?
Is it at final release?

Remastering is not the same as starting from nothing and producing a new Puppy.

There is a very good reason to make a new Puppy, from nothing, by using Woof-CE.
Woof-CE contains all the latest versions of Puppy core files, programs, bug fixes, tweaks, etc... at the time you use it.
It also controls that you make a Puppy that works the Puppy way.
Woof-CE is the place that a lot of under the hood work is done on Puppy. How Puppy actually works.

Quote:
UPup Bionic Beaver (UPupBB) 18.05 (May 2018)
Woof-CE 32bit build using Ubuntu Bionic Beaver (18.04) components

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perdido


Joined: 09 Dec 2013
Posts: 959
Location: ¿Altair IV , Just north of Eeyore Junction.?

PostPosted: Tue 11 Sep 2018, 11:01    Post subject:  

Moat wrote:
As I see it, perfectly eligible Woof'd Puppies exist/have existed over the discussed time frame - the "blessing"... not so much
(i.e. - crickets...!). I think that's the issue Perdido highlights, and I agree it's not at all good PR for Puppy.

Although I fully understand why the developers of these recent (truly excellent!!) Pups may not wish their product labeled as "official".
Quite a responsibility beyond that point, I'd imagine!

Bob

+1

One "official" WoofCE puppy released since November 18th, 2015
for comparison
BK has made six (6) official releases of Quirky in the last two years.
https://distrowatch.com/?newsid=10112

Just glancing at those stats makes me want to download Quirky and check it out.

Well I've said my piece, just like life some things prosper and others fall into oblivion.
Peace, out.

.
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RetroTechGuy


Joined: 15 Dec 2009
Posts: 2911
Location: USA

PostPosted: Tue 11 Sep 2018, 12:04    Post subject:  

Perhaps the lack of new releases is actually a credit to the Devs from earlier releases... They make a product that is so solid, that we don't need to continuously upgrade our systems. Smile Smile Smile

Thanks you to all of the Devs who maintain the various versions of Puppy.

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perdido


Joined: 09 Dec 2013
Posts: 959
Location: ¿Altair IV , Just north of Eeyore Junction.?

PostPosted: Wed 12 Sep 2018, 07:36    Post subject:  

rufwoof wrote:
Post adoption/acceptance of Debian Live projects within the Forums Puppy Projects section, from my experiences many
soon become 'confused' about 'Puppy' and quickly lose interest for other alternatives. Lack of new blood/interest induces development incentive decay.


I see this as a problem also. There should be a sub-forum for other than puppy projects as actual puppy developement should not be buried
under seemingly off-topic developement of another OS.

I refer specifically to the "dog" variations that at best are a distant cousin in theme only, what forum newcomers are presented with is very
confusing and a distracting hinderence to actual puppy developement.

Not saying the "dog" variations are not wanted - but they are so prolific and popular that they deserve their own sub-forum

.
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roadkill13

Joined: 10 Aug 2011
Posts: 140
Location: United States

PostPosted: Wed 12 Sep 2018, 19:04    Post subject:  

Quote:
Just glancing at those stats makes me want to download Quirky and check it out.


Hi Perdido. I am using the 8.6 version of Quirky Xerus on my ultra small form factor Dell Optiplex 745 Pentium D at 2.0Ghz and 4Gigs of RAM. I have it as a full install and it runs extremely well on this old box. If it were available in a 32bit flavor I would have it on my old EEEPC 901. I am posting from it now using the latest version of Chrome. Although the quirky releases are considered experimental, they are quite stable and remind me of how Puppies were going into the 4.1x series. I started using them when the 2.10 version was released. I had a great time with them.
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p310don

Joined: 19 May 2009
Posts: 1234
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Wed 12 Sep 2018, 22:46    Post subject:  

Quote:
Perhaps the lack of new releases is actually a credit to the Devs from earlier releases... They make a product that is so solid, that we don't need to continuously upgrade our systems. Smile Smile Smile


+1 on this

I was going to say that for my personal use Tahr & Xenial have proven to be so rock solid and basically current that I don't find the need for anything new.

The dev struggle is to top virtual perfection..
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RetroTechGuy


Joined: 15 Dec 2009
Posts: 2911
Location: USA

PostPosted: Thu 13 Sep 2018, 10:01    Post subject:  

p310don wrote:
Quote:
Perhaps the lack of new releases is actually a credit to the Devs from earlier releases... They make a product that is so solid, that we don't need to continuously upgrade our systems. Smile Smile Smile


+1 on this

I was going to say that for my personal use Tahr & Xenial have proven to be so rock solid and basically current that I don't find the need for anything new.

The dev struggle is to top virtual perfection..

^^^^^^^ This!!!

I'm still running base 5.28 and some Rerwin mods on other machines.

I'm almost ready to upgrade to Xenial... Wink

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