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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Cutting edge
Sanderdog 1.5: load and use other linux distro in puppy
Moderators: Flash, Ian, JohnMurga
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mistfire

Joined: 04 Nov 2008
Posts: 1272
Location: PH
PostPosted: Fri 14 Jun 2019, 20:12    Post subject:  Sanderdog 1.5: load and use other linux distro in puppy
Subject description: chrooted underdog		  
Since underdog linux is retired. I think of a new approach based from chroot approach.

It works like an underdog but chrooted compared to mount at bottom layer. This script allows to load the other linux distro partition on the fly and use its application (even older linux distro versions) with desktop integration and file association without breaking the system

It has gui looks like the former underdog gui.

The chrooted environment only sees the host /root, /home, /mnt, and /media. Everyone is welcome to improve this program. Icon integration is the only missing piece.

How sanderdog works:
1. It will create a directory named /var/vfs
2. The target linux partition will be mounted at /var/vfs/ro_layer
3. Add some flag file at /var/vfs/rw_layer
4. mount /var/vfs/ro_layer, /var/vfs/rw_layer, at /var/vfs/rootfs
5. The /dev, /root, /proc, /sys, /home, /media, /tmp, and /mnt will be bind mounted at /var/vfs/rootfs
6. Generate chrooted desktop files at /usr/share/applications
7. Copy some mime xml files from /var/vfs/ro_layer to /usr/share/mime
8. Start some services (supports systemd, upstart, runit, and sysvinit [experimental])
sanderdog-1.5.pet
Description  * Now supports starting sysvinit services (experimental)
* Added arch compatibility matching
 pet

 Download 
Filename  sanderdog-1.5.pet 
Filesize  5.93 KB 
Downloaded  159 Time(s) 

Last edited by mistfire on Tue 16 Jul 2019, 03:51; edited 14 times in total
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wiak

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
Posts: 1842
Location: not Bulgaria
PostPosted: Sat 15 Jun 2019, 05:52    Post subject:  
I think suggestion is the same (or very similar, except for your planning to mount proc etc in middle layer) as being done in FirstRib leading to one version of WeeDog:

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=1029315#1029315

http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=1025462#1025462

http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=1027227#1027227

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=1030336#1030336

Having said that, FirstRib is being developed to test out both the above chroot overlay (preferred) or aufs fs methods but also more traditional initramfs switch_root (and perhaps also pivot_root with chroot) type boots.

Your middle layer would have to be a read/write layer of course, for proc etc, so maybe only possible with aufs? As far as I remember, but would have to re-read kernel notes on overlayfs, result is undefined according to specs of overlayfs if middle layer used as read/write?).

Looking forward to your own trials/test-code though, since the more code examples and developments like this the better!

wiak

EDIT: By the way, in English, chunder means to vomit, so maybe not the best name... Wink
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Terry H

Joined: 29 Mar 2009
Posts: 674
Location: The Heart of Muskoka, ON Canada
PostPosted: Sat 15 Jun 2019, 09:47    Post subject:  
wiak wrote:


EDIT: By the way, in English, chunder means to vomit, so maybe not the best name... Wink


I had quite a chuckle when I read the title. In the words of Men at Work, immortalized in song:
"I come from a land down under where beer does flow and men chunder".

So now having had a laugh, i congratulate both of you for your many contributions and innovations to puppy. Your contributions are very much appreciated.
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s243a

Joined: 02 Sep 2014
Posts: 2199
PostPosted: Sat 15 Jun 2019, 11:31    Post subject:  
I look forward to seeing how chunderdog works. It sounds interesting Smile. On another note I don't think that underdog should be retired. If you happen do do a woof-CE fork that keeps underdog, please let us know Smile.
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mistfire

Joined: 04 Nov 2008
Posts: 1272
Location: PH
PostPosted: Mon 17 Jun 2019, 10:12    Post subject:  
Update:
It works but here are some observations

1. Binded mountpoints /dev, /sys, /proc, and /tmp does not appear on top layer when mounted on middle layer. It requires to bind mount on top layer

2. Chrooted rootfs can see host /root, /media, and /mnt by mount binding on top layer

3. Auto generation of chrooted desktop files works but need to deal with Icons.

@s243a underdog was removed from woof-ce github. So an alternative solution is needed.
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s243a

Joined: 02 Sep 2014
Posts: 2199
PostPosted: Mon 17 Jun 2019, 10:25    Post subject:  
mistfire wrote:
Update:
It works but here are some observations

1. Binded mountpoints /dev, /sys, /proc, and /tmp does not appear on top layer when mounted on middle layer. It requires to bind mount on top layer

2. Chrooted rootfs can see host /root, /media, and /mnt by mount binding on top layer

3. Auto generation of chrooted desktop files works but need to deal with Icons.

@s243a underdog was removed from woof-ce github. So an alternative solution is needed.


Unless you want to maintain a separate fork of alternatively unless it is possible to provide underdog as a pet.

That all said perhaps the chunderdog idea is superior and none of these above two alternatives are necessary. I look forward to seeing how this progresses Smile
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mistfire

Joined: 04 Nov 2008
Posts: 1272
Location: PH
PostPosted: Tue 18 Jun 2019, 00:43    Post subject:  
Here is a simple chunderdog demo that I made

How to use this script:
1. Puppy host
2. You need an installed linux distro on a partition
3. Type this command on terminal
Code:
 ./chunderdog.sh [target linux partition]


4. It will enter chrooted shell, minimize the terminal
5. You will now see the additional applications came from other linux distro on Applications Menu. Also the underdog apps have file association too (for xdg-compliant file managers)
6. To quit the demo. Restore the minimized terminal and type "exit"

Also I need help to implement the following on chunderdog
1. Make /var/vfs/ro_layer/usr/share/icons and /var/vfs/ro_layer/usr/share/mime visible on host
2. Run services/daemons from chrooted underdog and stop them also upon exiting chrooted underdog
chunderdog.sh.zip
Description  Initial demo script

* Just remove .zip extension and set file permission to +x
 zip

 Download 
Filename  chunderdog.sh.zip 
Filesize  3.04 KB 
Downloaded  120 Time(s) 
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mistfire

Joined: 04 Nov 2008
Posts: 1272
Location: PH
PostPosted: Tue 25 Jun 2019, 02:59    Post subject:  
chunderdog is now called sanderdog (sandboxed underdog).

The pet package is attached at the first post of this thread
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mistfire

Joined: 04 Nov 2008
Posts: 1272
Location: PH
PostPosted: Wed 26 Jun 2019, 06:19    Post subject:  
Sanderdog-1.1 released

Changes:
* Improved chrooting
* Improved gui
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mistfire

Joined: 04 Nov 2008
Posts: 1272
Location: PH
PostPosted: Wed 26 Jun 2019, 18:55    Post subject:  
Take note, the chrooted application has (isolated) suffix on its name.
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01101001b


Joined: 08 Mar 2017
Posts: 92
Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina
PostPosted: Tue 02 Jul 2019, 03:56    Post subject:  Re: sanderdog 1.1: load and use other linux distro partition in puppy
Subject description: chrooted underdog		  
mistfire wrote:
[...]How sanderdog works:[...]
Mistfire, this is inmensely useful to me. I've tried and failed several attempts with underdog in the past and the present. Now I'll try this as soon as possible.
Thank you! Smile
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mistfire

Joined: 04 Nov 2008
Posts: 1272
Location: PH
PostPosted: Thu 04 Jul 2019, 06:55    Post subject:  
Sanderdog 1.2 released

Changes:
* More improvements
* Able to start some systemd service and autostart
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mistfire

Joined: 04 Nov 2008
Posts: 1272
Location: PH
PostPosted: Fri 05 Jul 2019, 02:36    Post subject:  
Sanderdog 1.3 released

Changes:
* Aside some systemd services, it can now start upstart services
* More bugfixes

Download link was on the first post of this thread
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mistfire

Joined: 04 Nov 2008
Posts: 1272
Location: PH
PostPosted: Thu 11 Jul 2019, 08:30    Post subject:  
Sanderdog 1.4 released

Changes:
* Added support for starting some runit services
* Failsafe added. Sanderdog will not run if 32-bit host attempts to load 64-bit linux distro

Download was on the first post of this thread
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rockedge


Joined: 11 Apr 2012
Posts: 1348
Location: Connecticut, United States
PostPosted: Thu 11 Jul 2019, 09:55    Post subject:  
I have been having success with firstrib (WeeDog) in various forms from a boot version to a chroot'ed one. The chroot'ed version of firstrib really works well with a Puppy Linux Bionic as host.

So I am going to give this script a try as this looks interesting and a potential approach to a LAMP system I am messing with.
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