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FirstRib default WeeDog Linux build system
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wiak

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 06:30    Post subject:  

Sorry, meant to implement the zram and tmpfs size options functionality by now. I have it worked out and was testing but been a bit distracted - looking at something else for a couple for days, but will be done after that.

wiak

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wiak

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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 09:57    Post subject:  

Progress Report

Have successfully tested a new flavour: FirstRib WeeDog Debuntu

The build_firstram_debuntu_initramfs04_s102.sh only needed one minor change to produce identical functionality (the resulting initramfs04.gz was tested in FirstRib Debian flavour build, but should also work with no code change with Ubuntu or Devuan).

The build_firstrib_debuntu_rootfsXX.sh script is structurally close to what it was before but using debootstrap rather than xbps. The plugin system (firstrib00.plug and so on) will work exactly as before but you will be using apt commands of course instead of xbps with this WeeDog flavour. I have tested simple firstrib00.plug with a few apt install commands in it during a build_firstrib_debuntu_rootfsXX.sh build, and it is worked fine.

One interesting feature is that build_firstrib_debuntu_initramfs04_s102.sh would work with a root filesystem created on any system that has debootstrap installed (and its normal dependencies, which include perl) as per Will Haley's blogs and as I described for using debootstrap in Puppy here:

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=963063#963063

However, I'm doing it a somewhat different way than that so build_firstrib_debuntu_rootfsXX.sh will work on systems that don't themselves have debootstrap installed, and no perl required anywhere at all, and this alternative FirstRib build method also provides the flexibility of firstrib00.plug like in FirstRib Void flavour. i.e. it is a pretty much a universal build system that should build successfully on most modern Linux systems without user-intervention (and fast, flexible and efficient using simple, easy-to-understand/modify build scripts).

All the usual WeeDog initramfs are of course available: changes=RAM, copy2ram, ability to use either numbered NNsfs filesystems and/or numbered NNuncompressed_directories, and ability to create rollback directories such as 50upper_changes, 51upper_changes, 52upperchanges (can include NNupperchanges sfs files and/or NNupperchanges directories) and so on.

Again, I leave it up to the build system users to create their own desktops, as it suits them, via firstrib00.plug facility. The following is from the successfully booted system (this particular test being with changes=RAM copy2ram on the grub kernel line):

Code:
# uname -a
Linux localhost 4.9.0-9-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.9.168-1 (2019-04-12) x86_64 GNU/Linux

# df -h
Filesystem      Size  Used Avail Use% Mounted on
/dev/sda2        53G   20G   30G  41% /mnt/sda2
inram           1.9G  279M  1.6G  15% /mnt/layers/RAM
overlay_result  1.9G  279M  1.6G  15% /
devtmpfs        1.9G     0  1.9G   0% /dev
tmpfs           1.9G     0  1.9G   0% /dev/shm
tmpfs           1.9G  8.9M  1.9G   1% /run
tmpfs           5.0M     0  5.0M   0% /run/lock
tmpfs           1.9G     0  1.9G   0% /sys/fs/cgroup
tmpfs           380M     0  380M   0% /run/user/0

# mount | head -n 3
/dev/sda2 on /mnt/sda2 type ext4 (rw,relatime,block_validity,delalloc,nojournal_checksum,barrier,user_xattr,acl)
inram on /mnt/layers/RAM type tmpfs (rw,nosuid,nodev,relatime)
overlay_result on / type overlay (rw,relatime,lowerdir=01,upperdir=/mnt/layers/RAM/upper_changes,workdir=/mnt/layers/RAM/work)


I need to tidy the scripts up now and put a couple of extra lines of logic in the build initramfs script to accomodate either Debian, Ubuntu, Devuan, or Void. More to come... the zram etc additions included. I'll probably publish theFirstRib WeeDog Debuntu scriipts next week once I have them tidied up the way I want them.

Anyway, now that I know I can create these new flavour build scripts I'm keen to get back to what I'm more interested in really - the new zram additions etc to the initramfs, so I'm not quite sure which I'll publish first (of course all the initramfs facilities/flexibility will work with all the flavours).

Note that, as before, I am not bothering to strip the size of the distributions. That can be done easily enough using separate utilities, for those that care about that (which I don't so much really).

EDIT: If I knew anything about Arch I'd be tempted to make a flavour for that too since it has its own debootstrap type ability. Maybe I will later... Unfortunately, Puppy doesn't have the Void xbps kind of package manager (I tried earlier but would be too much work) or debootstrap script capability but I prefer these native package manager solutions anyway. Nevertheless, I may yet manage to produce some Puppy system version of it, especially if 01scottman's pkg develops to work just with busybox and to not require some kind of Puppy skeleton rootfs downloaded/installed first - getting away from that rootfs skeleton model would be the best improvement Puppy itself could get IMO. Having said that, Debian-based systems aren't much better - I wish apt could stand alone and be able to install whole Debian/Ubuntu system by itself from scratch rather than need whole debootstrap build first... I much prefer Void in that sense - very elegant system design, but once Debian/Ubuntu system going, apt is an unmatched for facilities, that I know of, though xbps is pretty close and good enough.

EDIT2: My test WeeDog debuntu uses Debian's default systemd though (since that's what debootstrap download provides by default); but I see runit is available and from posts in DD thread it appears runit appears to work fine (with Devuan at least). Actually, systemd is also used on my other system, XenialDog, which is fine - I actually like having the chance to play with systemd configuration, but I do worry about its invasive nature for the future (the worry that too many key system components might come to depend on systemd - or is that worry an illusion? - I hope so).

wiak

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Last edited by wiak on Wed 21 Aug 2019, 18:36; edited 5 times in total
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rufwoof


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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 12:30    Post subject:  

Activating xlunch and then skippy-xd, has the xlunch program selection window shown as a window within the set of displayed/selectable windows (avoids having to take two screenshots). Intention of the attached image however is to highlight having a couple of xclocks running and sized quite large is a means to view the current date and time via mousing into the top left corner i.e. via skippy-xd.
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rufwoof


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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 12:54    Post subject:  

Question : what do you set the bootfrom kernel boot parameter to when booting from usb?

Frugal booting as I have been from hdd and /dev/sda1 is consistently /dev/sda1 when no usb's are also attached at bootup. But when a usb is plugged in at bootup then its a (kernel based) lottery as to whether the usb will be assigned to /dev/sda1 and the hdd assigned /dev/sdb1 or the other way around (usb assigned /dev/sdb1 and hdd assigned /dev/sda1).

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rockedge


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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 14:37    Post subject:  

rufwoof I really like your xlunch version! I have also played with just using jwm and xlunch and mc for the desktop.

my system with an internal HDD assigns the HDD always as /sda1 and the usb HDD I boot from is /sdb1...but if there is another usb drive attached then it is which usb device spools up quickest that gets assigned to sdb1 and not /sdc1. I try to use UUID which prevents the mix up in case of the 2 or more usb drives attached scenario
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rufwoof


Joined: 24 Feb 2014
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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 15:47    Post subject:  

rockedge wrote:
my system with an internal HDD assigns the HDD always as /sda1 and the usb HDD I boot from is /sdb1...but if there is another usb drive attached then it is which usb device spools up quickest that gets assigned to sdb1 and not /sdc1. I try to use UUID which prevents the mix up in case of the 2 or more usb drives attached scenario

Booting fine from hdd frugal, but using the same setup on usb and no luck. Tried bootfrom=/dev/disk/by-label/usb3 (where the usb stick has been set to have a label of 'usb3'), but looks like udev isn't up/running by that time so it crashes.

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rufwoof


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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 16:25    Post subject:  

rockedge wrote:
rufwoof I really like your xlunch version! I have also played with just using jwm and xlunch and mc for the desktop.

Void Smile of any tray etc. is nice. One quirk though is if you've chromium full screen (F11), stepping between tabs (ctrl-tab), add new tab (ctrl-t) ...etc. all works fine. But launching xlunch (bottom left hot corner) doesn't show. You have to activate skippy (top left corner) and then click on the xlunch window to see it. However that's only a issue if you want to stay in full screen chromium. Normal display (F11 to toggle off) and it all works fine. Alt-tab is also the other way to step between windows.

jwm is nicer that cwm as title bars for dragging smaller windows (galculator etc.) and resizing via the corners is better IMO than ctrl or alt + mouse type controls.

Once you get used to no tray and switching between full screens it does make other desktops look letter-box. Nice for mostly mouse/touchpad also, and with tilda terminal (cli) just a F1 press away and also full screened (with multiple tabs) its a great combination IMO. Some/many however seem to like zooming/restoring frames/windows (visible on the same screen at the same time).

As I mentioned before, skippy-xd and xlunch work very well under voidlinux, the best I've seen.
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rufwoof


Joined: 24 Feb 2014
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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 16:42    Post subject:  

Despite moderate use, all running in ram/swap with chromium playing a youtube etc. the cpu temps are lower than on other systems running much the same. Around 66 deg versus 70 deg when moderate/heavy loaded.

Nice feature with the later tilda is they've adjusted it to start from 1 rather than 0. I used to tweak that manually as alt-1 for the first tab ...etc. is just more intuitive/natural Smile
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rufwoof


Joined: 24 Feb 2014
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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 17:22    Post subject:  

Attached is my most recent firstrib00.plug (a actual gzip'd version)

root password set to 'letmein'
user password set to 'invalid'

Also creates some scripts such as /usr/local/bin/weather and /usr/local/bin/temp that would probably need tweaking for your own hardware/desires.

You'll also need to change the NETWORK settings, for your own ssid/password if using wireless (or be extended/changed if you connect via hard wired/ethernet).

Pretty much configures for a comfortable 1366x768 laptop screen sized resolution.

Likely the last one I'll post as from here it will evolve to be much more specific for me version (ssh keys and encryption, data links etc.)
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wiak

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 17:37    Post subject:  

rufwoof wrote:
Question : what do you set the bootfrom kernel boot parameter to when booting from usb?

Frugal booting as I have been from hdd and /dev/sda1 is consistently /dev/sda1 when no usb's are also attached at bootup. But when a usb is plugged in at bootup then its a (kernel based) lottery as to whether the usb will be assigned to /dev/sda1 and the hdd assigned /dev/sdb1 or the other way around (usb assigned /dev/sdb1 and hdd assigned /dev/sda1).


I've never had an issue on my machines using what my system detects the usb sticks uuid, but I imagine there may be an issue (and clearly there is, from your report, on your setup somehow). But does your set up boot from the usb stick sometimes? Else it should if trying again reversing sda for sdb in bootfrom=value. It may be difficult to duplicate any issue since booting fine all the time here after using both build scripts and any combination of options.

title FirstRib
uuid beda5956-551f-429d-8f42-6d1fd1ad13ac
kernel /firstrib5/vmlinuz usbwait=12 bootfrom=/mnt/sdb1/firstrib5 changes=RAM copy2ram
initrd /firstrib5/initramfs04.gz

wiak

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Last edited by wiak on Wed 21 Aug 2019, 18:18; edited 1 time in total
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rockedge


Joined: 11 Apr 2012
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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 17:53    Post subject:  

thank you rufwoof for the opportunity to give your firstrib.plug a run!

I am about to give it a run, 32 bit and 64 bit.
I also am seeing low cpu temps and the computer overall is cooler somehow. much less noisy as the fans barely run.

I am very pleased with WeeDog's I have built and their overall performance. ZoneMinder runs very stable, with all the bells and whistles. Very low overall base loads there is plenty of room to run multiple cameras and it is a breeze to compile packages from source. WeeDog makes a lean and mean web server with Hiawatha as well.

I will at some point also begin to build WeeDog's more specific to their purpose. I see a great potential here with Void to build an OS that is really tuned for Home Automation of Smart Home and camera security systems. Especially designed to run on less powerful, older computers tailored to fit in 2-4 gigs of RAM single or dual core cpu's. But also some versions ready for really strong computers.
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wiak

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 18:40    Post subject:  

Thanks from me too for your firstrib00.plug rufwoof. Assuming WeeDog systems become at all popular, these plugins will become a major part of its ongoing development since WeeDog default build, when no plugin provided, will always just be a very basic commandline booted system. So the main work from now on, aside from not-particularly-important (but fun and potentially useful) alternative to Void flavours, will be in individual's plugin developments (and I'm no desktop installation/design/config expert whatsoever myself).

wiak

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rufwoof


Joined: 24 Feb 2014
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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 18:48    Post subject:  

wiak wrote:
title FirstRib
uuid beda5956-551f-429d-8f42-6d1fd1ad13ac
kernel /firstrib5/vmlinuz usbwait=12 bootfrom=/mnt/sdb1/firstrib5 changes=RAM copy2ram
initrd /firstrib5/initramfs04.gz

Thanks wiak

usb3 stick, with grub4dos installed

/VOID folder ... content
bash-5.0# pwd
/mnt/usb/VOID
bash-5.0# ls
01firstrib_rootfs.sfs initramfs04.gz vmlinuz-4.19.67_1
bash-5.0#


menu.lst content

bash-5.0# cat menu.lst
# menu.lst
color white/blue black/cyan white/black cyan/black
#splashimage=/splash.xpm
timeout 15
default 0

###################################
title Void
#find --set-root /usb3.txt
uuid 4ea3148b-9309-42d6-972b-d2723a459c98
kernel /VOID/vmlinuz-4.19.67_1 usbwait=12 bootfrom=/mnt/sda1/VOID changes=ram copy2ram rdsh3
initrd /VOID/initramfs04.gz
###################################


Boots and exits to rd shell (#3) and shows

mount : mounting /dev/ram on /mnt/ram failed: No such file or directory
bootfrom is /mnt/sda1/VOID
mountfrom is /mnt/layers/RAM
lower is 01
upper_work is upperdir=ram/upper_changes,workdir=ram/work,xino=off
mount: mounting overlay_result on merged failed: No such file or directory
mount: mounting /mnt/ram on merged/mnt/ram failed: Invalid argument

Running cat /proc/cmdline indicates ...

usbwait=12 bootfrom=/mnt/sda1/VOID changes=ram copy2ram rdsh3

On exit from the rd shell it crashes.

No matter, not a necessity for me, and a long day with too much tipple/drink. Fresh eyes another day will likely reveal a stupid oversight somewhere Smile

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wiak

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 19:21    Post subject:  

rufwoof wrote:
Boots and exits to rd shell (#3) and shows

mount : mounting /dev/ram on /mnt/ram failed: No such file or directory
bootfrom is /mnt/sda1/VOID
mountfrom is /mnt/layers/RAM
lower is 01
upper_work is upperdir=ram/upper_changes,workdir=ram/work,xino=off
mount: mounting overlay_result on merged failed: No such file or directory
mount: mounting /mnt/ram on merged/mnt/ram failed: Invalid argument


EDIT: odd thing is I don't use any folder called /mnt/ram. RAM layer gets mounted to /mnt/layers/RAM (which after the mount overlay should be seen at merged/mnt/layers/RAM).

Yes, it will crash since the overlay to merged isn't working according to the above. I've seen these kind of messages - one reason can simply be that overlay module not being found and loaded. Since booting from hard drive okay, it must be already be there in your firstrib_rootfs/usr/lib/modules, so that can't be the issue. So it does look like some part isn't being found and mounted ... hmmm... tricky without having the same setup and hardware.

Does lsmod look okay (at that rdsh3 break point)?

I'd put rdsh0 rdsh1 rdsh2 rdsh3 all on the menu.list kernel line and then boot and at each stage check lsmod output, and also mount command output, and even df -h output, to see if can figure out what isn't being seen/mounted when needed. The set command run on its own should show bootfrom content (since that gets exported by these newer kernels), though your /proc/cmdline looks fine anyway.

My machine doesn't have usb3, so maybe it could be a module load issue (some other module needing loading in the long list) that I don't know about. If the modprobe -r command is stripping out something, that can be suppressed simply by making a blank file called modules_remove.plug in the bootfrom location (i.e. next to vmlinuz etc).

The rdsh1 shell break is the one that comes just prior to the overlay being mounted (so everything that mount overlay line needs has to be ready and correct at that point - mounts/overlay module etc). rdsh2 break comes immediately after the mount overlay should have worked (but clearly didn't or /mnt/layers/merged would hold the overlay result).

Time will tell I'm sure, especially if we get sufficient testers who are using different hardware - I'll try your firstrib00.plug build on my partners machine (which is pretty new so must have usb3 I guess - though I don't know anything about booting from new machines that boot with UEFI etc - my own machines are all old so I've never bothered looking into that.

I may put the WeeDog Debuntu flavour aside for the moment, since that was just my curiousity in action (tho nice to know I have working scripts for later publishing that). I really want to finish zram additions/capabilities and sort out any existing issues with what we have.

wiak

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rufwoof


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PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug 2019, 20:07    Post subject:  

Seems to be due to the changes=ram boot parameter, without that it boots OK. Suspecting its the mount -o mode=1777,nosuid,nodev,size=xxx tweak combined with a borderline size of my build (chromium, libreoffice etc.). Currently I've cpio extracted and changed init to exclude the size=xxx and I'm reforming the sfs using xz compression to see if that squeezes in. Suspecting some form of boundary/buffer overrun that is avoided when hdd frugal booted but that gets hit when booted via usb3. But that's just a guess. If so, perhaps using zram and suchlike could be inclined to potentially introduce difficult to identify/resolve issues (something to be wary of).
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