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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Derivatives
Firefox Unuseable (by newbs) in Puppy 2.15ce
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ecomoney


Joined: 25 Nov 2005
Posts: 2183
Location: Lincolnshire, England

PostPosted: Wed 06 Jun 2007, 04:26    Post_subject:  Firefox Unuseable (by newbs) in Puppy 2.15ce
Sub_title: "Just works" fix needed
 

Ive been working on a new 2.15CE based setup for the Puppy Cybercafe, but have been unable to roll it out for wider testing because Firefox has a major bug with Crashing on Flash sites, including hotmail, youtube, ebay etc. Although this has already been documented here, here, and here, the instructions are very hard to follow for new puppies, and for me at least dont seem to work.

Certainly in our local area, not having access to these sites means that "The internet doesnt work", in terms of our users. Firefox is the mainstay of browsers and people are familiar with it. I can understand it not being included with the default puppies for space reasons, but any kind of permanent setup would need it as far as our user are concerned, with flash9 and javascript. I understand that (for the moment) these are closed source, and this is what is causing the problems as bugs in them cannot be rectified. Ive had no problems using flash 9 on our older 2.02ce and edupup (2.11 based) setups, so I can only conclude this problem only effects newer versions.

I think what needs to be done is a petget, dotpup or .sfs file, already preconfigured with Java, Flash9 and the flash bug fix already set up. This would make it easy for newbies to install using a graphical installer program or similar, without having to copy files around, edit them or enter the command line. Would someone more puppy-savvy than me (i.e. most of you!) please be kind enough to build a long term and usable solution to this vexing problem...THANK YOU!!!!!

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GuestToo
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Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 4078

PostPosted: Wed 06 Jun 2007, 06:25    Post_subject:  

i think the problem exists with other distros too ... in any case, setting the plugins path variable seems to work around the problem, it just needs to point to the plugins path directory where Firefox is installed ... the trouble is that Firefox can be installed anywhere, and for that matter, the directory could have any name

for example, i have Firefox installed on /mnt/hda11/firefox2/ ... so if i start Firefox this way, i don't seem to have problems with crashing:

export MOZ_PLUGIN_PATH=/mnt/hda11/firefox2/plugins
exec /mnt/hda11/firefox2/firefox "$@"

but most people will not have Firefox installed in that location

so it would be difficult to make a bugfix for Firefox ... it is easy to make one for Seamonkey, because that is installed in one place

a Puppy package could easily start Firefox by setting the plugin path first

it is very easy to install Firefox ... just download it, unzip it anywhere you like, and run ... but that makes it difficult to make a bugfix
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GuestToo
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PostPosted: Wed 06 Jun 2007, 06:37    Post_subject:  

a bugfix installer could search the file system for, for example, libnullplugin.so, and maybe reject files that are in a path that contains the word "seamonkey", and maybe try to find the file in a path containing the word "firefox", etc etc, but there would be no guarantee that the correct path to the correct plugins dir would be found in every case
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ecomoney


Joined: 25 Nov 2005
Posts: 2183
Location: Lincolnshire, England

PostPosted: Wed 06 Jun 2007, 10:26    Post_subject: Installer  

Thanks again Guestoo for coming to our aid!

Would a possible solution be to make a Firefox package with the fixes, flash9 and Java already in it? This way the installer would be aware of the install path and could patch the flash files accordingly.

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PostPosted: Wed 06 Jun 2007, 20:38    Post_subject:  

yes, that would work ... when the package installs it would know where it was installing to, and everything would be all set up properly

it probably would not be necessary to include Flash and/or Java in the same package, although that could be done
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ecomoney


Joined: 25 Nov 2005
Posts: 2183
Location: Lincolnshire, England

PostPosted: Wed 06 Jun 2007, 21:13    Post_subject: Firefox Browser "Package"  

Quote:
it probably would not be necessary to include Flash and/or Java in the same package, although that could be done


From what I have seen, flash 9 and Javascript are definetely "must haves" in any serious browsing machine, therefore it would make sense to have the whole lot as one package, setup to "just work" with a .pet (preferable) or a dotpup or .sfs. Ive never actually created a puppy package before (or got flash9/java/firefox to play happily together in 2.15ce - just a few "false dawns" after a few long nights trying!).

From what I understand (which is very little), a sfs is simply a read-only bunch of files with their directories that is automatically added to the puppy files and directories when it is placed in the same directory as the pup_save.2fs file. I dont have the faintest idea about a dotpup, but I hear that a .pet is basically a zipped up file/directory list with an install script, and a list of dependant libraries that must be installed in order for it to work. For ease of use by beginners, I think a .pet package that would work with the petget autoinstaller would be the easiest option.

I would really appreciate someone making a .pet package or similar of firefox/flash9/java, or at least some easy instructions on how to go about making one myself. This is one thing that could definitely do with an easy fix to be made available.

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Gekko


Joined: 22 Jul 2006
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Location: Sydney, New South Wales

PostPosted: Wed 06 Jun 2007, 21:48    Post_subject:  

Don't use 2.16 for your roll out, it is so god damn buggy that its just not worth it, use 2.14 and I can help you out.
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ecomoney


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Location: Lincolnshire, England

PostPosted: Wed 06 Jun 2007, 22:05    Post_subject: Hi Gekko  

Hi there Gekko, good to see you on here again, where have you been? Laughing .

I understand 2.15ce is an added onto 2.14? Things should be roughly the same? Things are already pretty far ahead with the 2.15 install (ITS SOOOO PRETTY!!!!). Its basically just this thats holding back the rollout.

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PostPosted: Wed 06 Jun 2007, 22:52    Post_subject:  

basically, you can install whatever applications you like, where ever you like

then make a compressed file with the various files in your applications ... for example, if you install Firefox in a directory called "firefox" in /usr/lib and and you put the Flash plugins in /usr/lib/firefox/plugins/ and you install Java in a directory called "jre" in /usr, you could do this :

cd /
tar czvf firefox.tgz /usr/lib/firefox/ /usr/jre/

now to install the firefox.tgz file on other machines, you can do something like this if the file is put in /

cd /
tar xf firefox.tgz

or if the file was put in /tmp:

cd /
tar xf /tmp/firefox.tgz

dotpups and dotpets work much the same way, though there may be things happening like "registering" so it shows up as a package in the manager's package list

you might want to also add files like /usr/local/bin/defaultbrowser and /usr/share/applications/Firefox-web-browser.desktop, etc etc

i don't know of many bugs in 216 ... for a frugal install, the pup_save file is not unmounted cleanly when Puppy shuts down, but there is an automatic fsck on boot which usually fixes the file system if necessary ... ls is aliased to 'ls --color' in /etc/profile, which won't work, it can be put in .bashrc but if SHELL=/bin/sh the ENV variable would need to be set too ... that is a minor bug ... some movies crash my system, but i think that is mismatched video libraries, and also applies to older versions of Puppy 2.x ... rxvt shuts down slowly, but that is because rxvt does not work right with the 2.6 kernel, i use aterm instead, it does not have that problem ... if you use unionfs it creates many unnecessary .wh. whiteout files, just use aufs, (i don't think Puppy 214 has aufs)

i can't think of any bugfixes to put in a service pack, other than the ls --color one ... the problem with unmounting the pup_save file cleanly should be fixed
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Gekko


Joined: 22 Jul 2006
Posts: 445
Location: Sydney, New South Wales

PostPosted: Thu 07 Jun 2007, 03:04    Post_subject:  

2.15CE is based upon 2.14. And I've been here the entire time, you just haven't noticed.
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