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 Forum index » House Training » Bugs ( Submit bugs )
keyboard errors in puppy 1.0.1 and 1.0.2
Moderators: Flash, Ian, JohnMurga
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oui

Joined: 20 May 2005
Posts: 2048
Location: near Woof (Germany) :-) Acer Laptop emachines 2 GB RAM AMD64. franco-/germanophone, +/- anglophone

PostPosted: Mon 23 May 2005, 16:41    Post subject:  keyboard errors in puppy 1.0.1 and 1.0.2  

hi

the keyboard X-Windows interface has 3 different errors:

a/ the ALT GR key don't work on all keyboard hardware.

on my Cybercom laptop it don't works in puppy.

it is terrible because the most keyboard layout's in puppy use the ALT GR for @, /, \, [, ], {, }. so it is not possible to write a correct email adresse, to write a WikiScript, to edit HTML etc...

b/ the most important occidental keyboard layout after English (German = de) don't works properly: it is in this version a REALLY BAD adaptation of the English Keyboard's: the keys for ` etc, don't work properly because the accent stay separate before the vowel ('e, `e etc and not , etc)... I find it is a second choice solution and is not acceptable longer. It is only a matter of the German layout: the other layouts work correctly regarding this function. One of both Portuguese or Brasilian (I am in MS-Window now and can't look at this) has a good and really very complete choice of signs for the most West-European languages without needed ALT GR, but no slash / (but three back slash "\"). I suppose it was an attack of Bill Gate using \ intensiv against Linux using / intensiv Smile)
It is probably only a writing error in the source.

3/ it is not possible to change the keyboard layout without restart puppy! so it would be very difficult to write a text where English-Greek or English-Russian etc. are mixed... it is a terrible restriction!

truly yours

oui
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Rich

Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 278
Location: Middlesbrough - UK

PostPosted: Mon 23 May 2005, 17:22    Post subject:  

I'm just discussing this bug with Allan in the chatroom.
Not sure if it's exclusively a puppy related thing ( entirely ).
the AgtGr key seems to be disabled in Mozilla/Firefox for some reason. doesn't work on mine either ( UK spec and settings ).

Not a problem to me, but if it's needed for an @ sign then it's more than annoying. Cut and paste shouldn't be the answer !


Rich
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oui

Joined: 20 May 2005
Posts: 2048
Location: near Woof (Germany) :-) Acer Laptop emachines 2 GB RAM AMD64. franco-/germanophone, +/- anglophone

PostPosted: Mon 23 May 2005, 18:03    Post subject: it's true  

hi

thank you rich

it's true. i can confirm it (and do so: cut + paste; but to do that you have to find first one @ or \ or / ... or to open extra an "heavy" text programm. mozilla is not the only one programm where this happen. what is with firefox?)

but i did never have this problem in mandrake move or mandrake 10.1 that i am using intensiv in the last time (but not mozilla... I use the gnome environment and open office of course, and as browser sometimes the MS-Window browser OffByOne under Wine because it's starts and operate very fast and is the same in both MS-Window and Linux)

yours truly

oui
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Rich

Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 278
Location: Middlesbrough - UK

PostPosted: Mon 23 May 2005, 19:22    Post subject:  

From tonights playing........I've found a way around it.

Talking to Allan, AltGR +2 gives the 'at' sign needed, but the AltGr key doesn't work in the browser.

SO.......try this


go to /usr/share/keymaps/i386/ then navigate to the keyboard language and layout you have. EG. /qwerty/dk for danish.

open the file as text and find the word 'at' . ( in the dk setup it's on the keycode 3 line. )
the line reads "Keycode 3 = 2 quotedbl at"

Edit the line to read "Keycode 3 = 2 at quotedbl" and save the file
reboot the system and when you try the keyboard , the 'at' symbol is with the shift key, whereas the doublequote symbol is obtained with AltGr.

this is only an example.... if you use the doublequotes regularly in a browser then it's a better idea to put the 'at' somewhere else. Simply find a symbol you don't use much ( or at all ) in the browser and type the word 'at' in the second column of the keyboard file, next to the key you want it on.

The process may take a bit of fine tuning to individual needs, but the method works !

Let us know if it's any use !



Rich
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Allan

Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 15
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Tue 24 May 2005, 03:39    Post subject:  

It's working like a charm. I now have my @ on shift-4 instead of the that was displayed before, not a big loss for me. Very Happy

Thanks a lot
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Allan

Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 15
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Tue 24 May 2005, 04:21    Post subject:  

I was so happy having the @-thing solved I forgot to mention that I had to choose finnish keymap instead of swedish because I could't find the swedish in /usr/share/kbd/keymaps/i386/qwerty. No problem since they are the same (for my use anyway). And I had to do a reboot to get it working.
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oui

Joined: 20 May 2005
Posts: 2048
Location: near Woof (Germany) :-) Acer Laptop emachines 2 GB RAM AMD64. franco-/germanophone, +/- anglophone

PostPosted: Tue 24 May 2005, 17:34    Post subject: make more with your ressources  

Hi Rich, hi Allan

I thank you very much for the information where the keyboard layouts can be find and changed.

A difficulty did happen to try it:

the directories .../qwerty etc. seem to be writting protected and it is not possible to change or add files in it.

but it is a very usefull indication!

On my laptop, all the signs of the "calculator block" (1234567890*-+./) works properly with one click on the "Fn"-Key. It is the same as "ALT GR" I find. I don't need two different sets of keys for numerals and 2 sets of "*-+./". One is enough for me. So it is possible to dispose of the key of all the numeral line and *-+./ for other purposes: 15 keys disponible for other more important purposes! I can certainly find an optimal solution for all my needs under using of this possibility if I find a way to overwrite the key map.

Concerning the German Keyboard:
It is really a bug - the definition in the map is really wrong (I can remember that ten years ago, it was often so in the first Linux distribs): the creator did forget to declare the "grave" as "dead_grave" and did declare the "dead_accute" as "apostrophe". It would be really easy to change it in the next distrib of Puppy and preserve so German people using those signs from this irritation... only 2 little details to change and the keymap works properly...

I find that for West-European people the Es-Keymap gives the most possibilities to be able to write a lot of languages. I will declare "" only as "dead-tilde" without "N" so it will be possible to write English, Portuguese, Spanish, French, Italian, German, Hollands, completely correct. Nordic people like you Allan, can let the special letters such as "dead_ring" on the Key of an adequate key... People with QWERTZ can use a more frienly "es" version with the QWERTZ layout.

It is a good and easy way to make Puppy really friendly for a lot people!

I did try today Puppy 1.0.0 with firefox (and use it now). I find it be the better choice for me.
No problem with "first loading" like in Opera.
And like for Opera, hotmail accept firefox (without java installation! but hotmail refuses the older java browser from Sun under the information that the java version is to old... hum!). Firefox is a really fine browser, I think...

yours truly

oui

Rich wrote:
From tonights playing........I've found a way around it.

Talking to Allan, AltGR +2 gives the 'at' sign needed, but the AltGr key doesn't work in the browser.

SO.......try this


go to /usr/share/keymaps/i386/ then navigate to the keyboard language and layout you have. EG. /qwerty/dk for danish.

open the file as text and find the word 'at' . ( in the dk setup it's on the keycode 3 line. )
the line reads "Keycode 3 = 2 quotedbl at"

Edit the line to read "Keycode 3 = 2 at quotedbl" and save the file
reboot the system and when you try the keyboard , the 'at' symbol is with the shift key, whereas the doublequote symbol is obtained with AltGr.

this is only an example.... if you use the doublequotes regularly in a browser then it's a better idea to put the 'at' somewhere else. Simply find a symbol you don't use much ( or at all ) in the browser and type the word 'at' in the second column of the keyboard file, next to the key you want it on.

The process may take a bit of fine tuning to individual needs, but the method works !

Let us know if it's any use !



Rich
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Rich

Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 278
Location: Middlesbrough - UK

PostPosted: Tue 24 May 2005, 17:50    Post subject: Re: make more with your ressources  

oui wrote:
Hi Rich, hi Allan

the directories .../qwerty etc. seem to be writting protected and it is not possible to change or add files in it.

Concerning the German Keyboard:
It is really a bug - the definition in the map is really wrong (I can remember that ten years ago, it was often so in the first Linux distribs): the creator did forget to declare the "grave" as "dead_grave" and did declare the "dead_accute" as "apostrophe". It would be really easy to change it in the next distrib of Puppy and preserve so German people using those signs from this irritation... only 2 little details to change and the keymap works properly...



files in qwerty weren't write protected in mine. Did you use ROX to access them ( right click and open as text ). That's all I did.

The German Keyboard Definition should be easy to edit into a correct layout.
If you can point me to a picture of a layout for a German Keyboard somewhere on the internet , I'll give it a go and upload the file ( if it works ). Then it's just a matter of saving the newfile into the keymaps and selecting it from the wizard.


Rich
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oui

Joined: 20 May 2005
Posts: 2048
Location: near Woof (Germany) :-) Acer Laptop emachines 2 GB RAM AMD64. franco-/germanophone, +/- anglophone

PostPosted: Thu 02 Jun 2005, 11:30    Post subject: different versions of Puppy  

Hi Rich

Thank you for your help!

a/ keyboard for different occidental languages

I have now a good layout of the german keyboard (an qwertz-keyboard; looks as a portuguese keyboard and different other european keyboards but the other keyboards are querty). with this keyboard, I can write using the "Fn"-Key of my laptop all following special char's without using "Alt-Gr" (because "Alt-Gr" don't answer in Mozilla). I did make it now in Mozilla in my puppy 1.0.2!

list of the signs without AltGr:

^ĩũ!"$%&/()=?{[ ] } \*|#'<>;:_,.@

and the most signs are there where her picture is on the key on the german keyboard to remember very easy the new layout (i find it is very important!)

using Alt Gr in Abiword, I can also write following spanish signs: (but not in Mozilla)

with this set of signs, it is possible to write
- english
- german
- spanish
- french
- italian
- hollands
- interlingue
- solresol

really correctly (exception: in mozilla)

german people need to activate 2 keys to write her

i will look if i find the code for german-s (i suppose it is to find in mandrake and for dead_ring for danish and add both)

it would be easy to make exactly the same but with an querty-design in the portuguese keyboard layout, better for portuguese, italian, spanish etc. people.

b) ability to overwrite the content in /usr

[quote="Rich"]
oui wrote:
Hi Rich, hi Allan

a) keyboard for different languages

the directories .../qwerty etc. seem to be writting protected and it is not possible to change or add files in it.

Rich


it's right Rich:

I did read later that the old Puppy versions have all a write protected "/usr" directory and only the newest give the possibility to overwrite "/usr" and preserve such code amenagements!

(i don't like mozilla, because of the funny "page source" function and don't like opera! for this reason, i did use yet puppy 1.0.0 before reading the new comment in the help files!)

c/ interlingue and solresol:

there are 2 major universal constructed languages

interlingue (ex occidental) is the only one language readable in the most countries of west europe and america and afrika (and other countries reading english like india etc.) without to need to learn it. it don't need special signs but it is better to have the ability to write also for the position of the tonic accent in a few words.

solresol is the language of the children in the marvellous st. spielberg's film "strange rencontre of the 3 art" 1977. it is
- the oldest universal constructed language (develloped 1817 .. 1856)
- the first language for different handicaped people (integrated signs and colors language and morse)
- completely impartial
- untill today stay the only one language for both handicapped and non handicapped people and fastly accessible for illiterate people (only 7 signs, the 7 music notes represented as numerals 1..7 like chinese people does really, to learn and at the same time learn to read musical notation without more efforts. do more!!!)

that is the reason why it is important for me that my keyboard can easy write this 2 languages also!

yours truly

franois
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Rich

Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 278
Location: Middlesbrough - UK

PostPosted: Thu 02 Jun 2005, 12:06    Post subject:  

Strange that you couldn't edit the keyboard files......
I'm using 1.0.1 and I've had no problems like this. That's not strictly true, thinking about it. I got an 'access/modification denied' error once while playing around in the command line. However, navigating to the files using ROX and then using the right click - open as text command always seems to work for me .

Rich
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oui

Joined: 20 May 2005
Posts: 2048
Location: near Woof (Germany) :-) Acer Laptop emachines 2 GB RAM AMD64. franco-/germanophone, +/- anglophone

PostPosted: Thu 02 Jun 2005, 16:42    Post subject: you are right! here is my keyboard choice (modified 3Jun5)  

Rich wrote:
Strange that you couldn't edit the keyboard files......
I'm using 1.0.1 and I've had no problems like this. That's not strictly true, thinking about it. I got an 'access/modification denied' error once while playing around in the command line. However, navigating to the files using ROX and then using the right click - open as text command always seems to work for me .

Rich


Hi Rich

You are right: The Help Page update from 17.5 "Package management", 2d paragraph named "Puppy Unleashed" says "Anyway, with the release of version 1.0.1, /usr became writable..." etc.

So if you use 1.0.1, you can overwrite /usr Very Happy
and I did use 1.0.0 because of Firefox and didn't be able of that!

It is ok and exactly conform to the announced comportment!

I am really sorry for firebox and the w3 browser, but it is so...

Yours truly

franois

Here is my keyboard choice:


# de.map: German keymap modified for a lot of occidental languages

keymaps 0-2,4-6,8-10,12
alt_is_meta
include "qwertz-layout"
altgr keycode 16 = at
control altgr keycode 16 = nul
altgr keycode 50 = mu
include "linux-with-alt-and-altgr"
plain keycode 83 = KP_Comma
include "compose.latin1"
include "euro2.map"
strings as usual

# Normal Shift AltGr Strg
keycode 1 = Escape Escape
keycode 2 = one exclam exclamdown
keycode 3 = two bar
keycode 4 = three section
keycode 5 = four dollar
keycode 6 = five percent
keycode 7 = six ampersand
keycode 8 = seven braceleft
keycode 9 = bracketleft parenleft guillemotleft
keycode 10 = bracketright parenright guillemotright
control altgr keycode 10 = Control_bracketright
keycode 11 = braceright equal
keycode 12 = ssharp question questiondown
control altgr keycode 12 = Control_backslash
keycode 13 = dead_acute dead_grave
keycode 14 = Delete Delete
alt keycode 14 = Meta_Delete
keycode 15 = Tab Tab
keycode 24 = o
Alt keycode 24 = +Oslash
AltGr keycode 24 = +Oslash
keycode 26 = dead_diaeresis dead_tilde
keycode 27 = at backslash
keycode 28 = Return
alt keycode 28 = Meta_Control_m
keycode 29 = Control
keycode 30 = a
Alt keycode 30 = +Aring
AltGr keycode 30 = +Aring
keycode 31 = s
Alt keycode 31 = +scedilla
AltGr keycode 31 = +scedilla
keycode 34 = g
Alt keycode 34 = +gbreve
AltGr keycode 34 = +gbreve
keycode 39 = +oslash +oe +Oslash
keycode 40 = +aring +ae +Aring
control shift keycode 40 = Control_bracketright
keycode 41 = dead_circumflex masculine ordfeminine Control_asciicircum
keycode 42 = Shift
keycode 43 = numbersign +ccedilla
keycode 46 = c
Alt keycode 46 = +Ccedilla
AltGr keycode 46 = +Ccedilla
keycode 51 = comma semicolon
keycode 52 = period colon periodcentered
keycode 53 = minus underscore Meta_minus
shift control keycode 53 = Control_underscore
keycode 54 = Shift
keycode 56 = Alt
keycode 57 = space space Meta_space nul
keycode 58 = Caps_Lock
keycode 86 = less greater bar
keycode 97 = Control
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