Who's in charge?

Puppy related raves and general interest that doesn't fit anywhere else
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raffy
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#101 Post by raffy »

@tronkel and ttuuxxx: Woof indeed is new, and for a while I was thinking that you are beating a new woof-y path of building dpup. The 4.* series is still open, and perhaps the dpup you've hand-made will make it in the series? (same comment for big_bass' slaxerpup.)

@ecomoney: The forum is for sharing ideas and not for asking/challenging another member. By all means tell us what you think to be the right answers to your own questions. Then everyone would feel better.
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bugman

#102 Post by bugman »

WhoDo wrote: @bugman - for the sake of accuracy, there have been two or three people excluded from the pack by John Murga. That took a LOT of fighting (and back biting) to provoke though. Thankfully such circumstances are extremely rare. 14,000+ registered forum users and only 2-3 exclusions ... ever! Your point is well proven.
if one of those was shroomy bee, then you'll have to re-consider your definition of the term 'people'

:roll: :lol:

edited to add that what i meant was less the banning of public nuisances and more something along the line of the ugly incidents at dsl and that other distro that schismed a few weeks ago [?]

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BarryK
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#103 Post by BarryK »

ttuuxxx wrote:Well Tronkel I'm compiling up the firefox 3.0.10 package right now, I've chosen that one over the 3.5 beta well because its a beta, lol
So i'll have my work cutout for me tonight and maybe some tomorrow, its getting late, So Thats my gift to Upup, if its just as quick as on Dpup, I might stick with Upup, but if it isn't, bye bye Upup and Hello Dpup.
ttuuxxx
ttuuxx,
I don't know of any particular reason why Dpup should be faster for you. As I've commented before, Lenny and Jaunty are incredibly similar.

However, there may be a discernable difference due to the different Xorgs. I'm not sure, maybe some accelerated Xorg DRI driver got into the Debian build but not in the Ubuntu build...

...I'm just having a quick look in woof/dpup/xorg_base/ and woof/dpup/xserver_xorg/ ...not sure, would have to compare with what is in woof/upup/xorg_base and xsrver_xorg.

Anyway, they should be essentially identical in terms of speed.
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hillside
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#104 Post by hillside »

One suggestion might be to assign a single delegate for each of the key areas on the forum
This is a good idea, but I think this may result in too large of a group. I generally like the idea of some kind of a council overseeing Puppy development, but I would warn against having a council that is overly large.

My guess would be that the group that makes the final decisions should be no more than 3 to 5 people. I would also recommend not having any kind of dictator, benevolent or not, who can veto the wishes of the group. I think you would be better off having an odd number of people in the group, always strive for consensus, but in cases where consensus is impossible, the majority rules. That way, more than one person is always making the final decision and no single individual can be "blamed".

(I know. Single individual is redundant. I felt the need for emphasis.)

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WhoDo
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#105 Post by WhoDo »

sullysat wrote:I also have a variety of old hardware that I can set up and test things on if necessary.
Now THAT will come in very handy in my new role, sullysat. If you don't mind I may call on you, via PM, when the need arises.
sullysat wrote:Finally, I teach computer networking and maintenance at a local college here. I recently began exposing my students to the possibilities of Linux operating systems. There are three new Puppy users out there because of the people in this forum. I don't know who you are, but I know you're out there and I appreciate your willingness to help.
Way to go, sullysat. Changing the world one mind at a time by offering a simple choice is a great way to do things.
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ecomoney
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#106 Post by ecomoney »

Raffy wrote:The forum is for sharing ideas and not for asking/challenging another member. By all means tell us what you think to be the right answers to your own questions. Then everyone would feel better.
Im sorry, sometimes I laugh when Im at the keyboard too, but then Puppy should be fun.

To quote a few numbers Ive estimated before, (hint - theyre not binary)

Puppy Linux Developers.......100's?
Puppy Linux Users.................100's of 100's?
Potential Puppy Linux users....100's of 100's of 100's?

Of course the Devs are really important, and the Devs need to know what to Develop for puppy to succeed in its mission, for then they are a successful Dev too.

I dont believe that the council would fully represent the full range of the people that use puppy, in reasonably accurate proportions, with the structure WhoDo has suggested.

Beem has the highest post count here, mostly from helping in the Beginners Help. Shouldnt he be consulted as to what puppy needs to change the most to meet its aims?
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ttuuxxx
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#107 Post by ttuuxxx »

ecomoney wrote:
Beem has the highest post count here, mostly from helping in the Beginners Help. Shouldnt he be consulted as to what puppy needs to change the most to meet its aims?
Actually I've been posting in here and have a higher count than Beem, and below is a list of the top 10 posters in the forum oh ya, WhoDo is #11 and Ecomoney is way down at #30!!! and the people ahead of me have 2yrs min more time on the forum so it shouldn't take long before I hit #1, maybe another year or so, lol
ttuuxxx

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/memberlist.php

ps.. You know micko right ecomoney? well he's the one just ahead of you on the list #29 and he only joined last Oct, you've been here 3yrs longer than micko, lol
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Sage
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#108 Post by Sage »

This kind of beauty contest is quite despicable. Two of those cited shouldn't be in the above list at all and, of the rest, I would only rely utterly on the advice from a further two - even they may not necessarily be the obvious ones.
By the same token, although my contributions are racking up, mainly due to length of service, I would hate to think that any of my social commentary be included towards a badge of honour. Indeed, as an IT outsider, I tend to ask the questions. So apart from a few well chosen words on HW topics, the value of my 3K+ entries probably approaches nil in terms of adding to the development of the mutt.
How about you?

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ttuuxxx
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#109 Post by ttuuxxx »

Hey sage I think anyone who hits 10,000 post should get a free official Puppy cd sent to him :)
right now we only have 1 in like 5+years lol, so I don't think it would break the bank.
well unless puppy got really popular.
ttuuxxx
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Billwho?
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#110 Post by Billwho? »

droope wrote:Hey, you know, i've said good things to you in the past... but i am getting a weird urge to blow your head off with a shotgun. :shock:

Please, PLEASE stop talking against Whodo's way of doing things. Or I will :twisted:
If you are referring to that fellow who used to post here occasionally called ecomoney. I've had the same urge recently. But have decided to follow WhoDo's example and "send him to Coventry" like WhoDo did with ttuuxxx at one stage. The only difference is I only supplied a "one-way ticket" so any posts by ecomoney now are obviously a figment of my imagination and I simply by-pass them to move on to the next real post in the thread.

I find that I am feeling much calmer now and my murderous urges have dropped off to almost nil.
Linux = Learning through doing :shock: :? :D
The learning curve may be steep but there is a light at the end of the tunnel.
You just have to pass the occasional oncoming train to get there.

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Aitch
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#111 Post by Aitch »

Billwho

That's good advice to anyone having personality clashes/problems
I know I've had a few & wish I'd have done it sooner

Aitch :)

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Billwho?
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#112 Post by Billwho? »

The only down side I have found so far is that I seem to be finding a lot of imaginary hits to my searches these days. Oh well, hopefully things will start to settle down soon and my imagination will go back to the way it used to be.
Linux = Learning through doing :shock: :? :D
The learning curve may be steep but there is a light at the end of the tunnel.
You just have to pass the occasional oncoming train to get there.

bugman

#113 Post by bugman »

i am at #41 and have never posted a single thing of consequence

[hooray for me]

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ecomoney
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#114 Post by ecomoney »

Your right Ttuxxx for clearing that up. Beems post count is mostly in the Users or beginners help section, therefore he woul have a good knowledge of which questions he has to answer over and over again, and would therefore have a better idea of Where puppy needs development in order to make it popular.

My post count? Well? I dont get my views of what Puppy needs soley from being on the forum 16 hours a day, I spend time with Puppy and its users face to face. On the other hand, while Im on here Im not making any money, which has been cited as my reason for being here.

The reason we all have different opinions is because we all have different experiences. The councils decisions, to represent everybody, must represent a wide range of experiences and opinions.
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#115 Post by 01micko »

ttuuxxx wrote:.. You know micko right ecomoney? well he's the one just ahead of you on the list #29 and he only joined last Oct, you've been here 3yrs longer than micko, lol
ttuuxxx
hehe... most of them in Pwidgets thread! I think I own more than half the posts there! And it is the longest thread on the forum by far!
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ComputerBob
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#116 Post by ComputerBob »

Lots of heat - very little light.

I've read every thread involving ecomoney's bug reports, suggestions, controversies, etc., and I just don't understand how this group of people can be so ingrown, so thin-skinned, so defensive, and can so happily shower so much hatred onto one person who it appears to me has sincerely tried to help IMPROVE Puppy Linux for all users like me, not just for his own purposes.

So maybe he hasn't showered the powers-that-be with as much fawning praise and blind subservience as some of you demand. You would all be wise to get over yourselves and your pitiful little "I'm in charge!" power-grabs, and deal with the issues that he has brought up, instead of treating him as "the enemy" for bringing them up.

In my experience "benevolent dictatorships" rarely survive to s second generation. As an outsider, it appears to me that Puppy will be another example of that.

Puppy Linux itself is a wonderful thing. But I'm back in the market for something to take Puppy's place on the charity PCs that I recycle, because it appears to me that the Puppy community is infected with rabies, and I really don't want to be associated with the hateful groupthink that has been happening here.
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#117 Post by ttuuxxx »

[quote="ComputerBob"]Lots of heart .quote]
Sorry Bob but your about 3 days late, no power struggle here, Barry's back and he's topdog, Once again he's the dictator. As for ecomoney well you can't grow roses with lemon juice.
ttuuxxx
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James C
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#118 Post by James C »

Ttuuxxx beat me in posting a response. :)

We do know who is in charge now and I believe he knows Puppy"s "mission".WhoDo did a fine job while he was in charge as coordinator, a rather thankless job.Besides, he was picked by BarryK to lead 4.20 and that is good enough for me.

I do not see a time when everyone is perfectly satisfied with Puppy, or any other OS for that matter. There are too many hardware variables as well as personal preferences as to which programs to include or exclude and how those programs will work, or not work, as the case may be.

Someone has to be in charge to make the final decisions, whatever his or her job title may be, and they cannot and will not make everyone happy.That is an impossible task.

For those who spend time on other linux forums it is rather clear that this type of thing happens to every distro, people complain, troll and flame. The only difference is on most other forums threads get locked and people get banned.

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#119 Post by 01micko »

ComputerBob wrote: ............because it appears to me that the Puppy community is infected with rabies, and I really don't want to be associated with the hateful groupthink that has been happening here.
So you've never been to the Mandriva forum? Plenty of passion there too. DSL? Tried that forum? :lol: :lol: :lol:
...and I just don't understand how this group of people can be so ingrown, so thin-skinned,....
C'mon Bob? Lighten up! You can always "change the channel" :wink:
Good luck in your quest to find a "better OS" for recycled computers, but I've a feeling you'll be back.

You don't need to get involved in the Politics. Some are probably oblivious to it. I find it entertaining!

Cheers
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raffy
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correction

#120 Post by raffy »

... here other members correct you and hope you get it.

Computerbob, ecomoney indeed has fine work to show for the community, but he is not alone. Those others go about helping in the forum and rarely do "preacher" stuff.

What you've seen in the recent posts above is impatience by some members on the returning "me vs you" dialogue, which they wanted to put behind.
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