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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Projects
Classic Pup 2.14X -- Updated 2 series
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What is the best Puppy Version ever, LOL
2.14x
24%
 24%  [ 8 ]
2.14x
12%
 12%  [ 4 ]
2.14x
30%
 30%  [ 10 ]
Other: 2.14x only
33%
 33%  [ 11 ]
Total Votes : 33

Author Message
puppyiso


Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Posts: 595

PostPosted: Fri 22 May 2009, 23:03    Post subject:  

Hello, ttuuxxx

It is a great news that you are working on updating 2 series.

I am one of those people want that happen. Finally someone started "doing" rather than just "talking"

Sorry that I can only "talk"

The 2.14 Remaster itself is "updated"2.14. I still miss it because v4.12(Puppyluvr's wings-wine version) is kind of heavy for my P2 with 128MB. It works great on my P4 but for P2, it is a little heavy.

I am thinking about reinstalling older version but worried about outdating.
Especially WINE thing.

Since you are working on 2.14R to update, I expect all my worries will be resolved.

I have some wish list. Wether they are possible or not, please read the list.

1) size : less than 100MB (for older machines)
2) WINE installed
3) Broader number of sfs acceptance : not just 3 20 or 40 something
4) nicer look : smaller, more professional looking icons, nicer theme.

AND I don't think the followings are absolutely necessary
1) Barebone version : the packages for updated 2.14R would be hard to find.
2) Any resource sucking background tasks (See PULP for that)
3) Bloated softwares(eg OO)
4) conky and widget stuff.

I've heard that there is a version replacing heavier apps with lighter ones such as "Puppigen Antiguo" in Puppylinux.org site.

I never downloaded but that is a good idea.

Updating old version is a good news for old computer owners but so so news for latest powerful hardware owners. So please keep that in mind.

Thank you for reading.

John S
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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
Posts: 10730
Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sat 23 May 2009, 00:17    Post subject:  

puppyiso wrote:
Hello, ttuuxxx

It is a great news that you are working on updating 2 series.

I am one of those people want that happen. Finally someone started "doing" rather than just "talking"

Sorry that I can only "talk"

The 2.14 Remaster itself is "updated"2.14. I still miss it because v4.12(Puppyluvr's wings-wine version) is kind of heavy for my P2 with 128MB. It works great on my P4 but for P2, it is a little heavy.

I am thinking about reinstalling older version but worried about outdating.
Especially WINE thing.

Since you are working on 2.14R to update, I expect all my worries will be resolved.

I have some wish list. Wether they are possible or not, please read the list.

1) size : less than 100MB (for older machines)(I"m aiming for 100MB, But keep in mind that users want CUPS and the base is around 90MB to start with before adding CUPS, which could add around 7MB or so,So I'll make it under 110MB maybe 100MB, I Have no Idea what to call it? maybe puppy 2.14.1CE, lol Ecomoney says he's going to continue 2.14CE it but really, I don't think he will, Plus I don't think he would go to depths that I'm trying to reach for retro users. )
2) WINE installed (wine wouldn't be installed by default to large, But I'll test the backend and make sure that it could be compiled, before signing off this release)
3) Broader number of sfs acceptance : not just 3 20 or 40 something (can someone find a how to link? and I'll include it. )
4) nicer look : smaller, more professional looking icons, nicer theme.(100% Yes Smile and the latest Rox also. I'll reuse the pacakage I made for Upup and recompile it Smile )

AND I don't think the followings are absolutely necessary
1) Barebone version : the packages for updated 2.14R would be hard to find. (they never make a unleashed so I could maybe if time permits make a reduced version)
2) Any resource sucking background tasks (See PULP for that) (I might make a startup folder and have things like CUPS startup in it so if you don't use printing you could simply delete it and stop it from running on bootup)
3) Bloated softwares(eg OO) (never crossed my mind, Its in the repo if users want it, Once again too large)
4) conky and widget stuff. (never liked widgets other than the first 10 minutes of playing with a new toy, They provide easy how to installs at the Windget Thread, )

I've heard that there is a version replacing heavier apps with lighter ones such as "Puppigen Antiguo" in Puppylinux.org site. (Not really too worried about that, its pretty lite to start with, The only heavy apps I'm considering is kill Gxine and maybe add Gnome Media player, but that could added 4-8MB I'll have to see which libs its needs, I made a package for Upup and was really happy with the media player, fullscreen in jwm, plays windows media etc, Also I was thinking about Gimp, I really would like to include the latest Gimp, I guess I'll have to just see the size results before doing any large applications)

I never downloaded but that is a good idea.

Updating old version is a good news for old computer owners but so so news for latest powerful hardware owners. So please keep that in mind. (my hardware is the latest "Powerful Hardware" but ehen I'm finished I wouldn't have any issues of using this for my Main Media/TV/Movie/Music Pc Smile )

Thank you for reading.

John S


If we get some dedicated testers, I might look into compiling the latest Alsa. but That would be last on the list after it was ready for final release, due to the fact it could really messup the build.

Any other newer applications you might like? Like pdvdslab etc?
Also If someone could find out a fix for the menu layout that would be great. I've spent hours on it and came close, but Figured better to move on.
Also I dislike that they moved /usr/local/lib/X11/pixmaps and /usr/local/lib/X11/mini-icons. I just don't understand why to alter default things like menu layout and icon locations, man that gets me, Thats the only thing that turns 2.14R from a great release to a so,so release. Well thats how I feel, every time I open the menu I have read each label, where as all the other puppies go I know each location, what a pain!
ttuuxxx
I also dislike that

_________________
http://audio.online-convert.com/ <-- excellent site
http://samples.mplayerhq.hu/A-codecs/ <-- Codec Test Files
http://html5games.com/ <-- excellent HTML5 games Smile


Last edited by ttuuxxx on Sat 23 May 2009, 00:26; edited 1 time in total
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Jim1911

Joined: 19 May 2008
Posts: 2445
Location: Texas, USA

PostPosted: Sat 23 May 2009, 00:22    Post subject:  

ttuuxxx,

Quote:
Well guys I've been posting packages for Upup (puppy 5) and haven't had any real testers, I've asked and well zip, So I'm putting my packages on hold for a bit for Upup,


Barry's already included some of your packages for the new "5" http://distro.ibiblio.org/pub/linux/distributions/puppylinux/pet_packages-5/ so there should be more new testers.
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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
Posts: 10730
Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sat 23 May 2009, 00:46    Post subject:  

Jim1911 wrote:
ttuuxxx,

Quote:
Well guys I've been posting packages for Upup (puppy 5) and haven't had any real testers, I've asked and well zip, So I'm putting my packages on hold for a bit for Upup,


Barry's already included some of your packages for the new "5" http://distro.ibiblio.org/pub/linux/distributions/puppylinux/pet_packages-5/ so there should be more new testers.


yes but they should be tested before the repo, When You build a lrge package like gimp or even better Seamonkey like a 500MB working folder, I can't wait and keep that folder open for weeks for people to test it, It takes too much resources. So I delete it, and if it could be a simple fix, then excellent I could change it, but it takes around 4hrs just to compile and setup Seamonkey, So I don't want to wait like 1-2 weeks before getting a error report from someone, Or get someone like ecomoney with his rant and rage etc. If things are going to flow nicely, we need testers to find the bugs asap, fix the bugs and if our backend is broken then fix that also, Like I found out about 2 series and the devx, like how old is 2 series and why hasn't the compiler been fixed before this for things like CUPS? Anyways its not your fault, I'm just saying is that developers/packagers need more dedicated help then they are getting. Like the Rox 2.9 package for UPUP, its a really great Rox version, took well over a week to build because of how the new Rox version works, because its a different system than the older ones, Barry even reverted to a older Rox version for Upup, because he had a error, I fixed that error, It was really frustrating to work out, but it still hasn't had any real testing. Anyways Back to 2.14.1R Smile Thanks for the update Smile
ttuuxxx

_________________
http://audio.online-convert.com/ <-- excellent site
http://samples.mplayerhq.hu/A-codecs/ <-- Codec Test Files
http://html5games.com/ <-- excellent HTML5 games Smile

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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
Posts: 10730
Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sat 23 May 2009, 01:43    Post subject:  

Here's the gcc patch for anyone wanting to compile gcc 3.4 for earlier puppies, I'm posting it here just if the site where I downloaded from removes the patch, we'll have a copy on the forum to revert back to, might also make a nice series 2 repo sources file, I included a simple how to also for others who might want to try and build something on 2 series. Smile probably would be good for series 1 also, since series 1 and earlier series 2 are almost the same.

ps
This is where the patch came from
http://www.trl.ibm.com/projects/security/ssp/
ttuuxxx
gcc-3.4.4-patch-series2.tar.gz
Description 
gz

 Download 
Filename  gcc-3.4.4-patch-series2.tar.gz 
Filesize  33.17 KB 
Downloaded  1130 Time(s) 

_________________
http://audio.online-convert.com/ <-- excellent site
http://samples.mplayerhq.hu/A-codecs/ <-- Codec Test Files
http://html5games.com/ <-- excellent HTML5 games Smile

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puppyiso


Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Posts: 595

PostPosted: Sat 23 May 2009, 11:21    Post subject:  

ttuuxxx,

Thank you very much for answering.

I get the idea where you are up to and what you are cooking.

Considering many Linux users are Windows refugees like myself, they have one or two favorite apps keeping them to use windows like it or not.

I will never be without Photoshop and Max. I do know I can not bring Max to Linux world. But installing Maya linux version will do. If I can't, I have to install K3D which is possible when Barry completes UPup using Ubuntu package.

The point is that wine is a bridge between W and L. Even if not included, it would be very nice to have an option to install on the new 2.14.

You know, like power lock option when you buy a new car.

WINE welcomes Windows refugees open arms.

And about the expanded sfs acceptance, I have seen a post by MU and he mentioned to download modified initrz file enabling more sfs.

Lighthouse puppy cn take 40, if I remember correctly.

I will check again the post.

If overall size is a problem, how about using ChoicePup approach?

ChoicePup maximizes the concept of sfs and expels even the basic apps such as abiword.

Other extreame example is TinyCore. But I don't think that much modular way is always necessary.

I welcome a new 2.14 project because my P2 is slugguish with 4.12retro.

Installing old version is putting myself behind the times.

Like you lived in a new apartment and now move to old house.

You should do some remodeling before moving in.

1) Fresh paint and photo frames = wallpapers and icons.

2) Replace and moving the furniture = updated apps

3) Replacing squeaky floor, leaking roof, clean out the furnace = bug fix

4) Throw out the old tacky furniture and junk = trimm down the fat

Mow the lawn and repair the drive way = speed up booting sequence.

Then the house is ready for a new life.

For a puppy, I mean old dog, gets face lift at least got Botox shots.

Inject him with steroid then he is not only look young but will act young.

ttuuxxx, you are doing a great favor for the Puppy people wanting to get facelift with steroid shot.

I am one of them.

John S

Last edited by puppyiso on Sun 24 May 2009, 00:19; edited 1 time in total
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puppyiso


Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Posts: 595

PostPosted: Sat 23 May 2009, 23:27    Post subject:  

I have found an old 2.13 (yes, 13 which is my feared number) barelypup. Weighting only 31MB. For me, the smaller, the better.

puppy-213-barelypup0.2.iso 06-Oct-2007 00:00 31M

This can be found @ http://puppylinux.ca/puppyfiles/custom/

Also have found an old wine sfs for 2.01.
wine0915_201.sfs 12-May-2009 04:56 10M

I thought this is a good mix and match.

But, there is no startup manager. I cannot load the wine sfs.

Not only that, being a barebone type, no adequate network driver is found when I autoprobe the driver in network wizard.

See the attached image.

Are there any quick fix for these problems?

I am just curious about easy cop out (cop out is an expression mostly used in the US. Since this is a noun, I think it should be one word "copout" but just to make it clear I separated ) before I have to use 71MB version 201.

I simply thought this can be remastered as 41MB Drunken 213 Neo (WINE included) but wasn't that easy.

Any solutions?

John S
213barebone network failure.png
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Filesize  176.7 KB 
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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
Posts: 10730
Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sat 23 May 2009, 23:57    Post subject:  

I would load up series 4, click on sfs so it opens up and then copy the sfs files into a folder then make the folder into a pet dir2pet foldername etc
then boot up 213 and install it and remaster it. also You might want to install a updated network manager from series 2, looks like that one broken. and see if that works. later on and I mean way later on, I'll have a look at that little pup, I totally forgot about it Smile could have some fun playing with it.
ttuuxxx

_________________
http://audio.online-convert.com/ <-- excellent site
http://samples.mplayerhq.hu/A-codecs/ <-- Codec Test Files
http://html5games.com/ <-- excellent HTML5 games Smile


Last edited by ttuuxxx on Sun 24 May 2009, 00:15; edited 1 time in total
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puppyiso


Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Posts: 595

PostPosted: Sun 24 May 2009, 00:10    Post subject:  

Thank you, ttuuxxx.

Sounds difficult but I will try to follow your instructions. I will enjoy every step of it.

Thanks a lot.

John
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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
Posts: 10730
Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sun 24 May 2009, 09:55    Post subject:  

Well today was good, I managed to workout the menus, now they are the same layout of a regular puppy Smile
I also changed the icons, and mimes today and figured out how to change rox's navigation to the newer gtk2 look Smile I did one step better, I put rox's new main icons in usr/local/lib/X11/mini-icons now anybody can change the default look of rox's naivation or GTK2 in general just by changing a few icons, I was thinking of reworking the icon switcher just for that and figured well, not this time round, lol its complicated enough to remember all the changes.
now 2.14.1R looks as good as 4.12 and even better due to the newer icons and mimes:)
I also compiled xmms for it, I figured why not since 2.14.1.r has gtk 1.2 also, I would be out of my mind not to include it Smile xmms is 699kb pet but I haven't stripped it, just made it as small as possible with only a could of tiny extra plugins, like wma format and volume normalizer, those things are really handy.
Tomorrow morning I'll try to put it all together and see what happens:)
Tonight I'll just finish messing around with the icons. If all works well tomorrow and it actually boots, I'll start on the other Cups parts. and other application updates.
ttuuxxx

_________________
http://audio.online-convert.com/ <-- excellent site
http://samples.mplayerhq.hu/A-codecs/ <-- Codec Test Files
http://html5games.com/ <-- excellent HTML5 games Smile

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puppyiso


Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Posts: 595

PostPosted: Mon 25 May 2009, 10:42    Post subject:  

ttuuxxx, forget about the 2.13. I think that is missing necessary driver for the network. To make it smaller, whoever made that, had to delete some drivers and that's probably what happened.

I met even worse one, 2.01r.-barebone And had more trouble than I imagined.
Many non executing menus not to mention No reboot. I had to CTL+ALT+back shift to get out.

There were no pet files available and I spent considerable amount of time just to download needed PUP files.

Many PUP files did not work. Themes got all mixed up. Task bar disappeared. Couldn't change the background image. Then all of sudden screen background became a solid color.

When themes changed, icons disappeared.

I had hell of time to clean up the mass.

Do you know why I am telling you all this?

I want to tell you that I thank you for your effort to update the 2 series.

You are actually doing something and posting the "journey".

I have tried very basic modification and learned something.

I appreciate your effort.


John S
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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
Posts: 10730
Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Tue 26 May 2009, 06:54    Post subject:  

Hi guys well its starting to come together, first I made a pup_214R.sfs image then I made the iso by using 4 series commands and well it hung like 2.15ce, then I started thinking maybe its a squash file thing or something like that, Sooooooooo I took the sfs file and made a regular remaster using the puppy built in script for it, and then when everything is in the folder and its ready to create the iso image I deleted the 289MB pup_214R.sfs iso image that it made of my system, and replaced it with th e edited version and boom it made a 96MB iso not bad, so then I quickly tested and it booted to the desktop, it was missing a usr/lib/gtk system link so the icons weren't working but it worked, wow excellent, now I'm going to make the link and reburn it and start testing Smile
I can finally see the light at the end of the 214R tunnel Smile
ttuuxxx

_________________
http://audio.online-convert.com/ <-- excellent site
http://samples.mplayerhq.hu/A-codecs/ <-- Codec Test Files
http://html5games.com/ <-- excellent HTML5 games Smile

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reckrhodes

Joined: 30 May 2007
Posts: 116

PostPosted: Tue 26 May 2009, 07:20    Post subject:  

Hi everyone!

Hope that load_sfs and unload_sfs scripts will be included/updated in this projects (updating 2 series).

Load_sfs has been included in Puppy 4.2.1 and jrb's choicepup.

These scripts are very useful also especially in loading the sfs compiled files including the devx file. (without rebooting)

Goodluck to everyone and to ttuuxxx.

Eric
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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
Posts: 10730
Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Tue 26 May 2009, 07:36    Post subject:  

Hi Eric can you please find the link to thread and I'll include it, I'm trying to stay focussed on this build right now, So much i have to remember, man my heads going to explode, lol Thanks
ttuuxxx

_________________
http://audio.online-convert.com/ <-- excellent site
http://samples.mplayerhq.hu/A-codecs/ <-- Codec Test Files
http://html5games.com/ <-- excellent HTML5 games Smile

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reckrhodes

Joined: 30 May 2007
Posts: 116

PostPosted: Tue 26 May 2009, 08:02    Post subject:  

Thank you ttuuxxx.

This is I think the original thread

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?search_id=1234381002&t=37913

I copied the scripts. Here it is.
load-unload.tar.gz
Description  This was originally made by jcoder24 with the support of other puppians
gz

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Filename  load-unload.tar.gz 
Filesize  1.93 KB 
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