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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Projects
Puppy Personal Database
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gposil


Joined: 06 Apr 2009
Posts: 1305
Location: Stanthorpe (The Granite Belt), QLD, Australia

PostPosted: Thu 18 Jun 2009, 01:27    Post subject:  

Ok..0.6b is up...a few quick bug fixes to address some issues raised on 0.6a...more to come.

Please test the Custom Databases area....

A question was asked by Minnesota I think...what is the refresh button for...well PPDB was designed as a fully multi user database out of the box, so if someone else on your network is working on the same database as you at the same time, refresh will update your view incorporating any changes made by other users. I have specifically not locked the database, only used record locking...that is only single user can edit a record at a time...if you attempt to change a record that someone else is working on it will give a message to the effect that this record is locked until the other user finishes with it...hope that explains that little feature.

This is a long process, but it will be worth it...5981 lines of code and counting.... Smile

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DaveS


Joined: 09 Oct 2008
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PostPosted: Thu 18 Jun 2009, 03:57    Post subject:  

The record lock feature is vital to allow the database to grow. I use a huge database I built in Lotus Approach to run a large Optical Practice. In this situation, we can have several people accessing a single record because the patient is present in the practice and several staff members are updating the record at once, so record lock is vital to prevent data loss.
I have been looking forward to getting to grips with PPD, and it now looks feature rich enough to get to work on. For commercial application, it will need to be relational, but flat form is good for testing.
After switching to Linux, I needed to use OOBase, which is very competent, but a fine example of unintuitive! It took me a couple of months to builsd a reasonable accounting system, and most of that was spent figuring out the damn program. Java base also leads to slow performance.

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Minnesota

Joined: 11 Sep 2008
Posts: 313

PostPosted: Thu 18 Jun 2009, 09:55    Post subject: Questions
Subject description: Error reporting
 

Thanks for information on refresh, when I used it, nothing happened... or appeared to. You clarified.

Attached... first I defined an integer of 26 characters. I don't believe that is a valid integer. No error message. Attempted to enter data... and received an error. As a database may be defined days or weeks before use....wrong time for the error. Considering second example. Field defined for name as ten characters. NO error message when data entered over that number... simply truncation of the field.

MORE important question..... it appears that the define your own data base is a completely different format and "program". What are the plans for it...it should operator exactly the same as the PUPPY version.. same features same reports, same formats... only difference is the data fields are user defined.

Edit:
Forgot... when errors have occurred in several cases the option to CANCEL the operation.. is not really a cancel the operation it is KILL THE PROGRAM.. or exit entirely, requiring a restart from the menu.
no truncate Error.jpg
 Description   
 Filesize   47.38 KB
 Viewed   512 Time(s)

no truncate Error.jpg

Inter Define Error.jpg
 Description   
 Filesize   70.8 KB
 Viewed   514 Time(s)

Inter Define Error.jpg

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gposil


Joined: 06 Apr 2009
Posts: 1305
Location: Stanthorpe (The Granite Belt), QLD, Australia

PostPosted: Thu 18 Jun 2009, 10:33    Post subject:  

Hi Greg,

Minnesota said:
Quote:
it appears that the define your own data base is a completely different format and "program". What are the plans for it...it should operator exactly the same as the PUPPY version.. same features same reports, same formats... only difference is the data fields are user defined.


No it's exactly the same procedures...just in an earlier stage of development...quick and dirty for testing with no error checking or field validation as yet...that will come. Yes it will have the same features, in fact more(it has to) than the standard Puppy Personal Database.

BTW: The valid range for integers is -2,147,483,648 to 2,147,483,647. If I decide to go 64bit it will be -9,223,372,036,854,775,808 to 9,223,372,036,854,775,807. Oh, if you need numbers larger than integer, floating point can use 50+ significant digits...

The 0.6c release will have range checking and field type validation.

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Lobster
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Joined: 04 May 2005
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PostPosted: Sat 27 Jun 2009, 00:33    Post subject:  

Quote:
I'm working on a small personal database app for inclusion in Puppy, which is nearing completion, but I thought you'd like to have a look at a Personal Database where size is not a consideration...


Hi Guy and Puppy database aficionados

Barry seems unaware of the smaller database project
http://www.puppylinux.com/blog/?viewDetailed=00845
Is it nearing beta status?

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tlchost

Joined: 05 Aug 2007
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PostPosted: Sat 27 Jun 2009, 06:56    Post subject:  

Lobster wrote:

Barry seems unaware of the smaller database project
http://www.puppylinux.com/blog/?viewDetailed=00845
Is it nearing beta status?


It would appear to me that Barry may be missing the boat....this database project brings a new level of practical use to puppy....and it also allows folks to create and use information that can be easily shared between various applications on various OS.

But, my views are jaundiced....I'd rather be productive than tinker.

Oh well.

Thom
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Colonel Panic


Joined: 16 Sep 2006
Posts: 1529

PostPosted: Sun 28 Jun 2009, 05:00    Post subject:  

Also, don't forget Portabase, which is a simple program that will meet many people's needs for a flat file database program. WhoDo did sterling work in adapting it for Puppy.
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gposil


Joined: 06 Apr 2009
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Location: Stanthorpe (The Granite Belt), QLD, Australia

PostPosted: Sun 28 Jun 2009, 06:42    Post subject:  

After reflecting on BarryK's comments on PPDB, I have decided to suspend development of the lite version of PPDB in favour of the real DBMS...which will continue, whilst not in Puppy Spirit, it fills a need for a real database management system for Puppy users that don't want to go full blown SQL or OOBase.

BTW...I have ported PPDB over to c++ instead of pascal to see if I could garner any size benefit...yes about 20%...the unupxed binary is reduced in size to about 4.3Mb as opposed to 5.4Mb...but I am not going to get away from the fact that the database engine is roughly 3Mb and whatever front end you put on it is not going to save a great deal...If any one is interested in why I chose to use a real database engine instead of Sqlite or Berkley(BDB), the reasons are manifold, but include such considerations as multi-user and network operability which both Sqlite and BDB have problems with...I will outline the philosophy on an upcoming page on my website....

Thanks for your attention.

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muggins

Joined: 20 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Sun 28 Jun 2009, 07:02    Post subject:  

Hi gposil,

just curious whether you have a link to BarryK's comments on PPDB, and also what is the real database engine you've decided to use. (Sorry if this is mentioned in previous threads, but I missed this info.)
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Lobster
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Joined: 04 May 2005
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PostPosted: Sun 28 Jun 2009, 07:47    Post subject:  

Quote:
I will outline the philosophy on an upcoming page on my website....


I look forward to that Cool

Barry may be putting this sqlite database manager in Puppy 4.16 which
will be available soon
http://www.puppylinux.com/blog/?viewDetailed=00846

Is it possible/ feasible that the front end (which I rather like)
could still work with sqlite in some future incarnation?

I feel a little sad that we have lost the small DB Crying or Very sad
You say suspended - do you feel it may continue later?
I am encouraged by your efforts on the more comprehensive database Smile

Any ideas who is able to create a small DB in Genie?
m m m . . . maybe Nicolas has finished tweaking his excellent editor . . .

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BarryK
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Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 7082
Location: Perth, Western Australia

PostPosted: Sun 28 Jun 2009, 08:50    Post subject:  

Hi guys, I knew that my blog post would stir things up a bit.

I'm an electronic engineer, only know databases fairly superficially, but yes I do understand that multi-user/network usage is an important consideration, and I do recall reading that sqlite has problems in this area.

So, as I said in my blog, I have opted for SqliteManager (probably) for now but am open to being convinced that something bigger yet more capable is well worth it.

Ah yes, I remember where I read about the limitations of Sqlite. The author of Quisp mentioned it. Quisp is very interesting, and it was builtin to Puppy2, but noone took to it. Very easy to create web page frontends.

I did have an issue with compiling it, the author had it setup so the various modules compiled a main library statically, but they could be changed to have a single shared library.

Anyway we have a Quisp v1.28 PET package in the puppy-2 repo on ibiblio. It has a menu entry that brings up a demo web page.

The great thing about Quisp is the very small size.

http://quisp.sourceforge.net/qman/html/quisp_home.html

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gposil


Joined: 06 Apr 2009
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Location: Stanthorpe (The Granite Belt), QLD, Australia

PostPosted: Sun 28 Jun 2009, 23:57    Post subject: PPDB Soldiers On....  

I think I need to answer a few questions that have been posed, Muggins, I haven't made clear at any time what the db engine is apart from the fact that most are aware of the xbase wrappers used for direct dbf interaction. The underlying engine in PPDB is Interbase/Firebird and its full functionality has not been introduced as yet, as PPDB is not ready to go relational-client/server yet...but my plans are that it will...

I agree with Barry that the current stable of Puppy database functionality is fine for small and toy databases...below are a few reasons why I haven't pursued development in that area.

Sqlite.

. No data type integrity or enforcement
. Only handles field types of INTEGER, REAL, TEXT, BLOB
. Not multi-user in any real sense (at best multi-read).
. Cannot record-lock...locks entire database for editing by single user.
. Cannot use multiple integer type primary keys.
. SQLite does not allow the "similar links" switch, fulltext searching or database backup for active databases.
. It does not scale well either.

Berkley(BDB)

. Berkeley DB environments are not portable.
. It does not operate over a network at all.
. No SQL support or any other query language for that matter.
. No data typing.
. No table support

I hope this explains why I haven't used the Puppy tools available. As I said in a previous post PPDB development is ongoing, so for those interested, the feedback is important. I will go into further detail on my website as soon as I finish setting up the blog software.

For what it's worth, those who are interested in simple databases, Barry's addition of the SeaMonkey plugin for Sqlite is a welcome addition...there is a small Qt3 front end to Sqlite3 which is good also, if anyone wants that, I will post it.

Cheers

Guy

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gposil


Joined: 06 Apr 2009
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Location: Stanthorpe (The Granite Belt), QLD, Australia

PostPosted: Mon 29 Jun 2009, 00:46    Post subject: Blog up  

Ok blog is here http://www.gposil.com/blog
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Lobster
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PostPosted: Mon 29 Jun 2009, 00:54    Post subject:  

Quote:
Very easy to create web page frontends


Embarassed I played with Quisp quite a bit when it was introduced and could not make head nor tails of it . . .
Never came across anyone who ever used it.

Quote:
there is a small Qt3 front end to Sqlite3 which is good also, if anyone wants that, I will post it


Would like to look at that

This is my position on databases:
I would like one in Puppy.

Perhaps an analogy
I tend to download and use XaraLX
but when on occasion I am testing or using Puppy and need a structured drawing package Inkscape lite will allow that - it comes as a Puppy standard,
saves in SVG, that I can load into XaraLX when available . . .

If I create a database in Openoffice or the developing Puppy dbase and save it in a format that can be read from any Puppy, that would be fine.

Creation of data is one thing
but accessing that data is also important

I am looking forward to 4.16 and the new sql database (I went to the plug in site but it would not install - but Barry has tweaked it)

Just about to check the blog Smile

Thanks guys Smile

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gposil


Joined: 06 Apr 2009
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Location: Stanthorpe (The Granite Belt), QLD, Australia

PostPosted: Mon 29 Jun 2009, 01:31    Post subject:  

Lobster, here is the Sqlite front end I was talking about...

I think devx is required if you want to create databases...I always install devx anyway
sqlitebrowser-1.3.pet
Description  It requires qt3
pet

 Download 
Filename  sqlitebrowser-1.3.pet 
Filesize  221.91 KB 
Downloaded  344 Time(s) 

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