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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Cutting edge
Fatdog2 64bit alpha1
Moderators: Flash, Ian, JohnMurga
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Sage

Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 4833
Location: GB

PostPosted: Wed 12 Aug 2009, 01:52    Post subject:  

Good news is that it worked flawlessly on one of my 754 s attached to my TFT telly. Boot up/loading was extremely slow but it got there in the end and it was quite quick then.
Notwithstanding, I once had a conversation with a technical editor of one of our magazines. He didn't like the concept of 64bit porting from 32bit, didn't see any value. He wanted stuff to be rewritten in 64bit. Somewhat of a more arduous task and not in immediate prospect, either for OS or apps.
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rexterd

Joined: 01 Oct 2008
Posts: 12

PostPosted: Wed 12 Aug 2009, 03:05    Post subject:  

#note, PUPSAVE has format: partition,f.s.-of-part.,path/name ex: hda3,ext2,/pup220/pup_save.2fs
#Insert the script below right after the line above on your init script [intrd.gz]
# Recommended usb install where directory /fatdog boot files resides
# syslinux.cfg should have append initrd=/fatdog/initrd.gz layerfs=aufs
#Puppy should load disk modules and search puppy_xxx.sfs
#To test if your aufs is working type on root (/) -> touch xx ; xx file should appear in the /aufs/rw also
#To layer any sfs file
#mount -t squashfs /mnt/sda3/wine.sfs /wine -o loop
#mount -o remount,append:/wine /
#mount -o remount,del:/wine /

#Start aufs root = umpisa -------------------------------------------------
if [ $LAYERFS = "aufs" ]; then
sfs="pup_112.sfs"
usbmedia="/tmpfs/usbmedia"
[ -d /tmpfs ] || mkdir -p /tmpfs /tmpfs/rootfs /tmpfs/usbmedia /tmpfs/aufs /tmpfs/aufs/rw /tmpfs/aufs/ro
mount -t tmpfs -o size=75% tmpfs /tmpfs/aufs/rw
usb=""
partitions=`fdisk -l | grep "^/dev" | sed 's/ */:/g' | cut -f 1,6 -d ":"`
echo $partitions

for i in $partitions; do
device=${i%:*}
id=${i#*:}
case $id in
b)
type="vfat"
usb="yes"
;;
83)
type="ext3"
;;
27)
type="Unknown"
;;
7)
type="HPFS/NTFS"
;;
*)
continue
;;
esac
done
if [ $usb = "yes" ]; then
mount -t $type $device $usbmedia
echo "Mounting $sfs..." >/dev/console
mount -t squashfs $usbmedia/fatdog/$sfs /tmpfs/aufs/ro
check_status 0
fi
if [ -d /proc/bus/usb ]; then
echo -n "Mounting /proc/bus/usb filessystem..."
/bin/mount -t usbfs usbfs /proc/bus/usb
check_status 0
fi
echo -n "Mounting root aufs...." >/dev/console
mount -t aufs -o br:/tmpfs/aufs/rw=rw:/tmpfs/aufs/ro=ro aufs /tmpfs/rootfs
sleep 1
check_status 0
mkdir -p /tmpfs/rootfs/aufs /tmpfs/rootfs/aufs/ro /tmpfs/rootfs/aufs/rw
mount -o move /tmpfs/aufs/rw /tmpfs/rootfs/aufs/rw
mount -o move /tmpfs/aufs/ro /tmpfs/rootfs/aufs/ro

echo -n "Switching rootfs...">/dev/console
check_status 0
exec switch_root /tmpfs/rootfs /sbin/init

echo -n "You should not be here Smile ..."
exec /bin/sh> /dev/console 2>&1
fi #LAYERFS aufs
#End aufs root = dito matatapos ------------------------------------------------
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davids45


Joined: 26 Nov 2006
Posts: 655
Location: Chatswood, NSW

PostPosted: Wed 12 Aug 2009, 20:47    Post subject:  

G'day kirk,
I have put FatDog 64bit a1 on my 64bit computer as a frugal.
Did not need to acpi=off to get it to run, unlike a lot of recent development Pups
But I got many irq messages across the screen during the set-up selections (keyboard, locale, video). The rest of the set-up info scrolled past too quickly to read.
The frugal with a save file runs quite well with what it's got. Network wizard was fine for wired & wireless connections.

Trying to add some existing Pets failed, a console giving shared library faults - "error while loading shared libraries; wrong ELF Class: ELFCLASS64".
Could you let me know what to do here - do I just need the 64 bit versions of the required libraries, and if so, where is a good place to look? Or do I need only 64 bit versions of any program I want to add to this FatDog?

I assume my existing collection of sfs files (3s and 4s) will also not run if loaded at boot (I did see the prompt for this but did not try adding any), for the same reason as the Pets wont. What version of sfs file is compatible with this 64 bit Pup - 3 or 4?

Thanks for this most interesting puplet,

David S.
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Sage

Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 4833
Location: GB

PostPosted: Thu 13 Aug 2009, 03:41    Post subject:  

d45 - have you misunderstood the nature of the beast?! You cannot use 32bit material on a 64bit machine without rebuilding (porting, in the jargon) and recompiling. That applies to everything. If you read carefully what kirk has told you, this is an arduous process and doesn't work in any straightforward manner for a whole bunch of stuff. We are grateful to k for his efforts which, although an interesting intellectual challenge, remains to be assessed as a worthwhile exercise.

But don't let me discourage you, kirk. Perhaps you have the time, energy and enthusiasm to rewrite Puppy in 64bit assembler?! [The author of Kolibri did it.] The prize for any masochist engaging on such a truly valuable process would be an endless stream of consultancies, loadsa cash, world domination, Nobel prizes and a massive headache if not incarceration in the local 'clinic'.
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kirk

Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 1437
Location: florida

PostPosted: Thu 13 Aug 2009, 12:48    Post subject:  

Most (maybe all) pet packages and SFS files that are not specifically made for Fatdog64, will not work. The exceptions would be scripts and binaries that are static. You could add 32bit libraries, but I wouldn't, it would be better to recompile the application.

There's not really any porting involved for most applications. Most are written in C and not processor specific. The compiler (gcc for us) takes care of converting C code into machine code. In this case the processor is x86 compatible as well.

As far as whether or not this has been a worthwhile exercise, that will depend on what you want it to do. For me it has. I wanted an OS that would allow me rip DVDs and render Flash video as quick as possible. DVDs rip about 20% faster and the 64bit Flash seems quite fast, though I can't quantify that. In the long run, maybe 5 or 6 years, 32bit processors will have all but died out and this will be direction we all go. Most computers sold over the past year or so are 64bit, though their owners may not know it, and they probably where delivered with 32bit OSs installed.
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davids45


Joined: 26 Nov 2006
Posts: 655
Location: Chatswood, NSW

PostPosted: Thu 13 Aug 2009, 21:40    Post subject:  

G'day kirk,

Thanks for clarifying the situation - it was pretty much as I expected.
A faster OS using the 64 bits but with few programs ready-to-use this OS for the "common man".

Out of interest, I ran the included hardware/benchmark program in my frugal FatDog64bit Pup and compared the results with the same benchmark program in a number of frugal Pups on the same partition.

64-bit Fatdog Frugal was significantly faster in a number but not all of the Benchmarks than the 'normal' Pups.

I noticed that the dual core Pups were not really benchmark-faster than the single core Pups, possibly because, according to the widget CPU bars, the dual core Pups used only one core for these benchmark tests. Perhaps we need better or more varied benchmark tests?

But I must try the 64 bit FatDog for HDTV watching and video/audio processing where it may be even better than the already good standard Puppies.

Thanks again for this obese canine,

David S.
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garcot

Joined: 11 Jul 2009
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Sun 23 Aug 2009, 21:26    Post subject:  

Hi Kirk,

I tried installing latest Nvidia 64bit driver (185.18.36) with its installer, it is crying too many missing or wrong libraries, the installer stops now and then and once I press OK, it continues, but again, finally installs totally depreciated driver, which fails to get loaded, the NVIDIA module properly and in the next book, X will not come up and system hangs.

Also, the monitor resolution slection screen is in b/w. and firefox pages are scrambled.

AMD 64 machine with 2GB ram and geforce 6150 nforce 630 g chipset.

Incidentally, everything works fine with Fatdog2 32 bit Beta 2.

Is it the because, i haven't not installed the pet package for "all fixes" that you posted little later?

I confirm, it is indeed much faster than the 32 bit couterparts though I couldn't do a benmark test.



Thanks
garcot
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Jim1911

Joined: 19 May 2008
Posts: 2457
Location: Texas, USA

PostPosted: Sun 23 Aug 2009, 23:02    Post subject:  

Hi kirk,

The package manager doesn't appear to be working. When trying to configure it specifically to show just pup 5 and T2 and doing update, it downloads some data, however it doesn't update anything. Also, when it's restarted nothing changes.

Thanks,
Jim
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kirk

Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 1437
Location: florida

PostPosted: Tue 25 Aug 2009, 12:09    Post subject:  

Garcot,

Some things to check. Make sure you have the 64bit devx file. Make sure you don't have any of the Fatdog2 32bit sfs files or save files getting loaded. I assume your using the installer from the Nvidia web site. It should try to build a kernel module. I did use this with the ATI installer. I looked at Nvidia's minimum software requirements for that driver, it looks like it should work. I don't have a Nvidia card to test. Possible problems:

* The Nvidia installer needs some 32bit libraries. Many 64bit Distros include a full set of 32bit libraries.

* Puppy/T2/Fatdog puts all the Xorg stuff in /usr/X11R7. Most do not do this anymore. ATI has problems with this, but Nvidia has not in the past.

* Maybe the latest Nvidia driver doesn't support Xorg 7.3 or 2.6.28 (though the readme says it does).

You might try a older Nvidia driver. Again, make sure you have the Fatdog2 64bit devx file and not the 32bit version.

Jim1911,

Yep, there's nothing to download with the package manager.
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Jim1911

Joined: 19 May 2008
Posts: 2457
Location: Texas, USA

PostPosted: Tue 25 Aug 2009, 21:48    Post subject:  

Hi Kirk,
Have you tried the new Google Chrome browser? They have a 64bit alpha version. It's the fastest browser, I've ever tried. I'm going to try it on Fatdog. Will report back on results. If interested, you can find it at http://dev.chromium.org/getting-involved/dev-channel
Jim
EDIT: Installed google-chrome-unstable_current_amd64.deb, it appeared to install Ok but without a menu entry. Running from a terminal shows an incorrect lib. I didn't try replacing it because I don't want to disable something else. It works great in Kubuntu, although flash and printing don't work.
# google-chrome
/usr/bin/google-chrome: error while loading shared libraries: libX11.so.6: wrong ELF class: ELFCLASS64
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kirk

Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 1437
Location: florida

PostPosted: Wed 26 Aug 2009, 08:45    Post subject:  

Quote:
# google-chrome
/usr/bin/google-chrome: error while loading shared libraries: libX11.so.6: wrong ELF class: ELFCLASS64


That means it's not really compiled for 64bit, it's looking for a 32bit library.
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garcot

Joined: 11 Jul 2009
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Thu 27 Aug 2009, 03:56    Post subject:  

include a full set of 32bit libraries.

* Puppy/T2/Fatdog puts all the Xorg stuff in /usr/X11R7. Most do not do this anymore. ATI has problems with this, but Nvidia has not in the past.

* Maybe the latest Nvidia driver doesn't support Xorg 7.3 or 2.6.28 (though the readme says it does).

You might try a older Nvidia driver. Again, make sure you have the Fatdog2 64bit devx file and not the 32bit version.

Yes, Kirk, ofcourse, 64bit devx files was used. I will try the older version of the installer and report back.

Thanks
Garcot[/quote]
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garcot

Joined: 11 Jul 2009
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Thu 27 Aug 2009, 03:58    Post subject:  

Repeated.
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archwndas

Joined: 24 Jun 2006
Posts: 75

PostPosted: Sun 30 Aug 2009, 06:01    Post subject: FatDog2 alpha1 64bit: Problems with intel 5300 agn wireless  

Dear all,
One million thanks is not enough for your 64bit Puppy efforts. I decided to join the battle at least as a tester and report back. I have an Intel 5300 agn wireless driver. Everything works fine with any other Linux distribution (Debian Lenny, Sabayon 4.2 etc.). The module loaded in the distributions I mentioned and in 64bit FatDog is

iwlagn

However no interface shows up when I type
#iwconfig, or
#ifconfig -a

Only the Ethernet card is recognized. Every time I tried to load and unload a module I get something like: "modules now should reside in /etc/modules.d/. So I moved the modprobe.conf there and strange messages disappeared. Any ideas what can I do to make my wireless device work properly? Any other useful information I could provide you with?

Once again, THANK you for fulfilling one of my constant dreams about Puppy. The remaining ones are: User accounts, Package manager(Debian).

Until later ...
Archwn.
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kirk

Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 1437
Location: florida

PostPosted: Sun 30 Aug 2009, 09:29    Post subject:  

archwndas,

Maybe the firmware required for you card is not loading. Open a terminal and type:

# dmesg | grep firmware

See if you have any messages about firmware not being found or loaded.

Puppy keeps most of the firmware in /lib/modules/all-firmware, when a module loads that requests firmware Puppy finds extracts the firmware tarball from /lib/modules/all-firmware/(iwlwifi.tar.gz in this case) and puts it in /lib/firmware.


I just checked and Debian has a much newer set of firmware for iwlagn module. You could try installing their package. Download:

http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/pool/non-free/f/firmware-nonfree/firmware-iwlwifi_0.17_all.deb

Then just click on the package to install, and then reboot. This package will install the firmware in /lib/firmware, so that will bypass the Puppy firmware loading stuff I mentioned above. Please do the "dmesg | grep firmware" first so we can know if things are working.
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