Lucid Puppy 5.1: first-run - non-english users

Message

mave · #1 Post by **mave** » Wed 11 Aug 2010, 12:59

Hi to the great Puppy-Team,

thanks for the 5.1 release of Lucid - wow!

Hmpf, still this one:

1. Booting and running in first-run.sh with default english (keyboard, language, local zone...)

2. "Language & Locale" (chooselocale) sets another LANG value right but NOT keyboard layout. As non-englisch user I have to go with

3. "Classic Configuration Experience" but this doesn't sets/changes LANG...

So not nice non-english users and for the people (I know) not familiar with this (Linux) using Puppy.

Need to change to shinobars way... ?

Thanks for Puppy!
Markus

playdayz · #2 Post by **playdayz** » Wed 11 Aug 2010, 14:46

1. Booting and running in first-run.sh with default english (keyboard, language, local zone...)

2. "Language & Locale" (chooselocale) sets another LANG value right but NOT keyboard layout. As non-englisch user I have to go with

3. "Classic Configuration Experience" but this doesn't sets/changes LANG...

Yes, to set Keyboard Layout you use Classic Configuration Experience, and then to set Language you use Language & Locale. This is quite well-tested--were you not able to set both?

mave · #3 Post by **mave** » Wed 11 Aug 2010, 17:32

Hi playdayz,

yes, I was able to do this but I hoped the team would take/include shinbars contrywizard or somethin similar. Why?

Look at Ubuntu: asking one language and timezone - that's it. Details, if neccessary later. And it works. Puppy's boot on desktop: firstrun showing only in english without (!) any infos about language, localisation, keyboard layout.

People here, especially coming from Windows, I should not show this Puppy, because they wondering about no infos and details and can't deal with this: why should I make a chooselocale, when choosing before my language (or vice versa)?

The first-run way of actually 5.1 will force irritation in running people in trouble while first contact with Puppy or Linux. Even more, if people don't know about localisations and keyboard layouts.

I think: 9 of 10 people need to have this way: setting language once - maybe de_DE

- of okay: keyboard layout and LANG etc. is set to a standard de_...

Actually nothing like this in 5.1. Yesterday I gave 5.1 to a friend with trouble on his PC: booting okay, language (typing) english. Using first-run-options, an we got a new xorg.conf turning off back light of the TFT monitor. Special thing, but this was going, because of IMO not easy understandable machanism at startup.

This ist not easy to explain to users not familiar with all these things... I mean.

Maybe we get another variant here at startup?

Cheers
Markus

playdayz · #4 Post by **playdayz** » Wed 11 Aug 2010, 20:40

yes, I was able to do this

I am glad you were able to set the computer as you needed. IMHO everyone will be able to set the computer as they need. As I understand, it people often use a different language and Keyboard--we have reports of that in the forum--therefore setting Language/Locale and Keyboard are two separate operations. We are the official Puppy 5.1 and we are consequently somewhat conservative--we use the code that has been well-tested and we make minimal changes and we test those very thoroughly. The code that sets Language/Locale and Keyboard Layout in 5.1 is very well-tested and it is functional in that everyone can get exactly what they need. There are no bugs in it and it does what it is designed to do. Making any larger change would have involved using untested code and changing the basic way that Puppy handles these things--which is something that would be in Barry's purview.

Lucid Puppy 5.1 is the most Language aware Puppy ever, with most of the main programs--word processor, media player, text editor, Spreadsheet, Quickpet, and several of the browsers--all language aware by default, and with Language packs available for Mtpaint and more to come. Furthermore, every user can achieve exactly the Language/Locale and Keyboard Layout that they need with well-tested, bug free software--as you found out yourself. Otherwise I would be concerned. Thanks.

dawg · #5 Post by **dawg** » Thu 12 Aug 2010, 11:46

I believe all that mave here is trying to suggest is you should make the selection of those options more comprehensible/obvious/clear - less obscure, and less of a hassle - so that it doesn't "scare" the non-English-speaking users (particularly beginners to Puppy) away unnecessarily.

#6 Post by **BÃ©Ã¨m** » Thu 12 Aug 2010, 11:56

This issue has been raised several times by me.
And in the case the Classic Configuration Experience failed and you have to revert to the command line, it is hell to type.

I still don't see the advantage for direct boot to the desktop unless only US people are considered.

But I am pretty sure there are more National Language Users (NLS) worldwide then there are US users.

So to please a minority a majority has to suffer.

So I still regret that the classical configuration, going through the setup steps is abandoned in Lucid (not in puppy nor quirky tho)

Apart from that, playdayz is right that lucid is very friendly to NLS application programs.

playdayz · #7 Post by **playdayz** » Thu 12 Aug 2010, 15:39

No I didn't fail to boot to the desktop. In this case by a mouse click the config can be done.

Good to hear that the big problem is solved. So let's hope that nobody has the problem anymore, then all is well.

This is what you said previously Béèm. I regard this as a hypothetical problem that should not occur versus the requests by many people to boot direclty to the desktop. The people who have requested that are not all U.S. people by any means.

pemasu · #8 Post by **pemasu** » Thu 12 Aug 2010, 17:15

I am used to revert back to xorgwizard for getting finnish keyboard working. After that I use flsynclient to get my laptop touchpad working as I want.
That is no problem.

If somebody needs help with these, I will help.

Lobster · #9 Post by **Lobster** » Fri 13 Aug 2010, 02:55

Most Puppy users are in the US.

Those with different language needs
are welcome to publicise how to set up
what was originally an English only
distro for their compatriots.

They can do this with web pages,
on the wiki, videos etc

Straight to desktop is great
Modified versions are great too

How easy is Puppy to set up?
You put a DVD in the drive and turn on
your computer.

Can straight to desktop be improved
in 5.2 with boot up options?
Of course.
Look forward to efforts to provide that script

mave · #10 Post by **mave** » Sat 21 Aug 2010, 14:36

...thougth starting this thread about something like this. Shows users at first time different language config and possibility changing at this point.

Cheers
Markus

P.S.: extra: this first-run is using a modified nls graphics-test...[/b]

esmourguit · #11 Post by **esmourguit** » Sat 21 Aug 2010, 18:21

Bonjour à tous,
If interested, here is the french file.
Cordialement

mave · #12 Post by **mave** » Sat 21 Aug 2010, 19:23

Hi esmourguit,

wow... this should only be a small smiling "motivation" for the Lucid team

. But you made fastly a french translation, ha!

And SORRY: this first-run version is using a modified graphics-test. I forgot the attachement. See above. Without, there are error message because of missing language files for graphics-test.

Aussi cordialement.

(old)Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

(old)Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

Lucid Puppy 5.1: first-run - non-english users

Lucid Puppy 5.1: first-run - non-english users

modified graphics_nls forgotten