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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Projects
PupsaveConfig-2.2.5
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emil

Joined: 10 Nov 2009
Posts: 618
Location: Austria

PostPosted: Fri 17 Dec 2010, 04:03    Post subject: savefile config  

Hello shinobar,

thanks lots for the savefileconfig implementation. I tested it yesterday with a frugal install and it worked flawless for me. I just want to share 2 thoughts that I have. Those are just ideas, no critics and I would like to know what you and maybe others think.

Firstly, would it be an idea to make a simpler "standard" interface and give the Option to call the detailed Menu as "expert" or "advanced".
The "standard" would just offer to create a standard savefile in the same directory of the lupy-511.sfs (I'm not sure about to handle Live CD Mode).
I think new users to puppy linux could be a bit overwhelmed with options and puppy specific terminology.

The second idea is about the Windows installation on NTFS. I had the windows installer discussed a bit on the Sage forum. The myth that Linux can't handle the NTFS filesystem properly seems persistent. Would it be possible that the savefileconfig recognises a premade "blank" savefile (lets say with name blank_savefile.img" and if it finds such a file offers the possibility to use it (rename and mke2fs ...). Then it would be possible that the windows installer creates all puppy files, sort of a "paranoid" mode.

thanks you again,
emil
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jemimah


Joined: 26 Aug 2009
Posts: 4309
Location: Tampa, FL

PostPosted: Sun 19 Dec 2010, 03:01    Post subject:  

Shinobar,

I've had a request for an option to automatically make a backup of the save file on shutdown (or startup, but I think shutdown is easier to implement).

Are you interested in coding this? Or will you merge my patches if I do it? I want to avoid having to patch the shutdown script every time you release an update. Smile
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shinobar


Joined: 28 May 2009
Posts: 2630
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Sun 19 Dec 2010, 03:34    Post subject: automatically make a backup of the save file  

jemimah wrote:
I've had a request for an option to automatically make a backup of the save file on shutdown (or startup, but I think shutdown is easier to implement).

Are you interested in coding this? Or will you merge my patches if I do it? I want to avoid having to patch the shutdown script every time you release an update. Smile

Fascinating idea.
We can find some trials on this forum, though i have never tried them yet.
I guess it is not so easy and needs another project.
If you or someone do some improvement on this theme i am willing to implement the code built in.

Some thought:
It may be implemented in /usr/sbin/snapmergepuppy, not in rc.shutdown.
EDIT: snapmergepuppy is effective only for PUPMODE=13.
The init or rc.shutdown is better place to support both PUPMODE=12/13 as jemimah says.
I guess the init at the boot up is good timing.

Some topics:

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Last edited by shinobar on Mon 20 Dec 2010, 01:56; edited 2 times in total
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jemimah


Joined: 26 Aug 2009
Posts: 4309
Location: Tampa, FL

PostPosted: Sun 19 Dec 2010, 04:17    Post subject:  

It needs to be in either the init script or the shutdown script because the save file must be unmounted before copying.

It should be as simple as "cp pupsave.2fs pupsave.2fs.bak" as long as you do it after the unmount. Most of the work is adding the configuration options.
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shinobar


Joined: 28 May 2009
Posts: 2630
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Sun 19 Dec 2010, 04:57    Post subject: automatic backup session  

jemimah wrote:
Most of the work is adding the configuration options.

Right, jemimah.
Where to save, how much space is allowed, how many old to keep, what frequency to be saved, ziped or unziped, we also need how to recover... etc..

I have no experience using similar system on Windows and do not know what options allowed on Windows... Confused

Well, will you jemimah or someone start new topic on the automatic backup/recover session?

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8-bit


Joined: 03 Apr 2007
Posts: 3368
Location: Oregon

PostPosted: Sun 19 Dec 2010, 22:30    Post subject:  

When you talk about incorporating a backup for pupsave's, why reinvent the wheel.
There is already Snap2 and Hotbackup.
I personally use Hotbackup that checks available space, allows one to choose drive/ partition/ directory etc. and even does a file system check of the backup file created.

Hot backup can be found here.
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jpeps

Joined: 31 May 2008
Posts: 3220

PostPosted: Sun 19 Dec 2010, 23:12    Post subject:  

IMHO automatic pupsave backups are a bad idea, other than the auto session backups now in effect. Often something like a broken cups isn't readily noticed, and the danger would be that the unbroken pupsave backup would be copied over. If anything, eliminating all automatic backups seems like a better idea.

Pupsaves shouldn't need to be backed up very often, unlike specific files or directories that might get backed up after every use.
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don570


Joined: 10 Mar 2010
Posts: 3282
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Mon 20 Dec 2010, 21:19    Post subject: correction of grammar  

I have some grammar tips:

'English' must be capitalized

Better to use 'want' than 'like'

'alphanumeric' is usually spelled as one word in North America

The word 'Click' sounds better than the word 'Press' even though
they mean the same thing.


Instead of 'Heavy encrypted' use 'Strong encryption' 'Heavy encryption'
or 'Heavily encrypted'

I corrected some windows with red ink that you should see
http://www.datafilehost.com/download-a130d865.html

_______________________________________________________



Have you thought about creating a history log file of previous
activity. It would be a professional feature!

Just click on an icon to bring up the log file.
It would list info like:

size of save file
where?
Name of file
filetype i.e. ext2
encryption
comments: (Why was it created)
Was it initial?
Time of composition of settings
Actual time of saving
Errors

____________________________________________
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shinobar


Joined: 28 May 2009
Posts: 2630
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Wed 22 Dec 2010, 23:02    Post subject: Fluppy 010
Subject description: built in the pupsaveconfig
 

Thanks don. I will fix them in next release.

BTW, pupsaveconfig-1.9.4 is now built in Fluppy 010 thanks to jemimah. Exclamation
You can test the pupsaveconfig really working.
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=56156

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Béèm


Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Posts: 11782
Location: Brussels IBM Thinkpad R40, 256MB, 20GB, WiFi ipw2100. Frugal Lin'N'Win

PostPosted: Thu 23 Dec 2010, 06:37    Post subject:  

I discovered indeed this pupsave gui in Fluppy 010.
Nice to have all entries to be filled in on one screen.

I use a minimal save size, 32MB, which isn't selectable, but I can change it by hand in the proper field to fill in.

However, I can't indicate to which partition I want to create the save file.
I alwasy set it to /mnt/sda2 which becomes /mnt/home then, but it went to /mnt/sda1 which I only use to boot from (Lin'N'Win method) I don't want my XP partition (/mnt/sda1) to be mounted all the time.
This is more annoying as it forces me to do moving the file by hand.

Could a partition selection be provided also?
(as is in the regular save dialogs)

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shinobar


Joined: 28 May 2009
Posts: 2630
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Thu 23 Dec 2010, 07:05    Post subject: partition selection  

Béèm wrote:

I alwasy set it to /mnt/sda2 which becomes /mnt/home then, but it went to /mnt/sda1 which I only use to boot from (Lin'N'Win method) I don't want my XP partition (/mnt/sda1) to be mounted all the time.
This is more annoying as it forces me to do moving the file by hand.

Could a partition selection be provided also?
(as is in the regular save dialogs)

Thanks for coming, Béèm.
Booting from sda1, savefile on same place, sda1, is recommended.
But you can change the partition by clicking 'Back' button.


Barry recently changed the dialog, but partition selection was not regular unless you boot off from CD.
Suppose frugal install in sda3, but the recent Barry's dialog offers sda1 as the default.
This is a trap for new comers.
Safest is the all puppy files in a same directory.
Of course expert as you have your choice, and the pupsaveconfig has the path.

By the way, why you cannot boot from sda2? It must be flexible if you are using grub4dos.

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Béèm


Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Posts: 11782
Location: Brussels IBM Thinkpad R40, 256MB, 20GB, WiFi ipw2100. Frugal Lin'N'Win

PostPosted: Thu 23 Dec 2010, 18:00    Post subject: Re: partition selection  

shinobar wrote:
Béèm wrote:

I alwasy set it to /mnt/sda2 which becomes /mnt/home then, but it went to /mnt/sda1 which I only use to boot from (Lin'N'Win method) I don't want my XP partition (/mnt/sda1) to be mounted all the time.
This is more annoying as it forces me to do moving the file by hand.

Could a partition selection be provided also?
(as is in the regular save dialogs)

Thanks for coming, Béèm.
Booting from sda1, savefile on same place, sda1, is recommended.
But you can change the partition by clicking 'Back' button.


Barry recently changed the dialog, but partition selection was not regular unless you boot off from CD.
Suppose frugal install in sda3, but the recent Barry's dialog offers sda1 as the default.
This is a trap for new comers.
Safest is the all puppy files in a same directory.
Of course expert as you have your choice, and the pupsaveconfig has the path.

By the way, why you cannot boot from sda2? It must be flexible if you are using grub4dos.
I use the Lin'N'Win method and there is lack of space on sda2. I test quite some puppy's.
Also since Barry changed his setup in initrd, I am not free anymore to put save files where I want. Up to that point they were in the root of a partition which became /mnt/home then. This gave me flexibility for testing which I don't have anymore.

I'll explore the back button.

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shinobar


Joined: 28 May 2009
Posts: 2630
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Thu 23 Dec 2010, 18:55    Post subject: Re: partition selection  

Béèm wrote:
I use the Lin'N'Win method and there is lack of space on sda2. I test quite some puppy's.

Then make directories for each puppy on sda1. I recommend all puppy files including save file in one directory. It is easy to manage.

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Béèm


Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Posts: 11782
Location: Brussels IBM Thinkpad R40, 256MB, 20GB, WiFi ipw2100. Frugal Lin'N'Win

PostPosted: Thu 23 Dec 2010, 19:13    Post subject: Re: partition selection  

shinobar wrote:
Béèm wrote:
I use the Lin'N'Win method and there is lack of space on sda2. I test quite some puppy's.

Then make directories for each puppy on sda1. I recommend all puppy files including save file in one directory. It is easy to manage.
On sda1 I have some 44 directories with puppy's.
The only purpose is to boot from, like from CD. When done sda1 should not be mounted for the sake of a save file as it is also my XP partition and I don't want to take risks for corruption.

Before the change Barry made, a save file could be in the root of any partition, which when mounted became /mnt/home.
In fact during the install process at second boot, the puppy sfs was copied to that partition automatically. Not any more.

It may be easier for noob's to have everything in one directory, but it gives less flexibility.

If everything of a pupy is in the same directory, how would one upgrade the save file f.e.?
Well the answer could be it's not recommended to upgrade a save file.
But people don't want to loose the investment they did before, so upgrading should be part of puppy. An aspect which is not very well handled I think.

Personally I don't need to upgrade as my application environment is outside the save file and available to any puppy I use/try. Just a little script to make the necessary links.

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jemimah


Joined: 26 Aug 2009
Posts: 4309
Location: Tampa, FL

PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec 2010, 02:05    Post subject:  

It seems heavy encryption does not work - I haven't tested light encryption yet.
It gives an error about an incorrect password when creating the save file. Both the GUI and Legacy scripts are broken.

Also it shouldn't let you create an encrypted save file with any filesystem execept ext2 - journaling apparently causes a problem with the encryption.
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