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 Forum index » Taking the Puppy out for a walk » Misc
Cloud Computing, a Huge Step Backwards
Moderators: Flash, JohnMurga
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DaveS


Joined: 09 Oct 2008
Posts: 3726
Location: UK

PostPosted: Tue 03 May 2011, 13:23    Post subject:  

Ha Ha... this thread reads a bit like 'Paranoia Today', rightly I guess.
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OFC Dark Puppy

Joined: 24 Apr 2011
Posts: 30

PostPosted: Tue 03 May 2011, 20:39    Post subject:  

Puppyiso kind of hit the nail with the China story.

Truth is that many opressive governments have their hopes set on this because it means that many people will be out of luck when it comes to VPNs and proxies. Meaning they can't access outside information and are easier to control.

Also say goodbye to software companies. Cloud computing means nothing downloaded or installed. Basically meaning that you have to type online, draw online, and do everything online. I don't even want think about virus protections.

People have their heads up you know where. One has to understand that advertising is essentially manipulation. A company hires some actor to fool you into thinking a certain way with catchy slogans. They won't tell you the real risks involved. I mean their foolish definition of a free market has done nothing but rob people of choices and freedoms.

So to think that their new idea of giving you no control over your own data or free speech is somehow good for us and a better choice, is beyond laughable.

It reminds me of the old George Carlin stand up routine where he talked about how customer service really works. I won't say it here, I'll get muted for sure.
If your curious then watch his old stand up specials.
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Flash
Official Dog Handler


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 10691
Location: Arizona USA

PostPosted: Tue 03 May 2011, 22:03    Post subject:  

More Sony bad news: Sony Online also compromised (this goes beyond the PlayStation Network)
Quote:
The Sony hack story just gets worse and worse. Now, in addition to the 77 million PlayStation Network accounts that were compromised, Joystiq reports that Sony Online Entertainment was compromised as well, to the tune of another 24.6 million accounts.

In addition, Joystiq reports that more than 12,000 credit card numbers were stolen.

That means that if you’re a player of many popular PC online MMOs, your information has been stolen as well. SOE operates EverQuest, EverQuest II, PlanetSide, Star Wars Galaxies, Free Realms, Vanguard: Saga of Heroes, and DC Universe Online.

Apparently, this is not a separate penetration. Although Sony has long maintained that there entertainment systems were separated, criminals apparently managed to exfiltrate data from both networks.

Seems to me this is an example of what will happen if you trust the cloud.
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thane

Joined: 26 Mar 2009
Posts: 112
Location: Waipahu, Hawaii USA

PostPosted: Wed 04 May 2011, 16:35    Post subject:  

Maybe I'm lucky, but I live in a community where I can ride a bus or a taxi without being robbed. I can put my money in an FDIC-insured bank and be reasonably sure I'll be able to get to it. I can leave my clothes at a dry cleaners and they don't get stolen. There are lots of people who choose to use these services exclusively, rather than owning a car, having a safe at home, or doing their own dry cleaning.

What makes computing as a service different? I think it has more to do with the current absence of proper legal regulation/recourse on service providers than it does with the idea of computing as a service. I understand that cloud computing today has the problems you've stated. My response is that stricter regulation (rather than simply not using the cloud) is a better answer to these problems.

Last edited by thane on Wed 04 May 2011, 18:18; edited 1 time in total
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8-bit


Joined: 03 Apr 2007
Posts: 3287
Location: Oregon

PostPosted: Wed 04 May 2011, 17:00    Post subject:  

Want an example of Cloud for Puppy when the ISP drops some support of someone trying for a Puppy Cloud like experience?
go here.

So is that an example, or just a case of links not being updated by the maker of the site?
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mickee


Joined: 08 Feb 2011
Posts: 212
Location: Saskatoon SK Canada, Gateway 5300 Laptop, 600MHz Celeron, 384MB RAM, lucid puppy 5.2 (Full Install)

PostPosted: Wed 04 May 2011, 20:13    Post subject:  

8-bit wrote:
Want an example of Cloud for Puppy when the ISP drops some support of someone trying for a Puppy Cloud like experience?
go here.

So is that an example, or just a case of links not being updated by the maker of the site?


the idea is cool, but...

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OFC Dark Puppy

Joined: 24 Apr 2011
Posts: 30

PostPosted: Thu 05 May 2011, 19:24    Post subject:  

thane wrote:
Maybe I'm lucky, but I live in a community where I can ride a bus or a taxi without being robbed. I can put my money in an FDIC-insured bank and be reasonably sure I'll be able to get to it. I can leave my clothes at a dry cleaners and they don't get stolen. There are lots of people who choose to use these services exclusively, rather than owning a car, having a safe at home, or doing their own dry cleaning.

What makes computing as a service different? I think it has more to do with the current absence of proper legal regulation/recourse on service providers than it does with the idea of computing as a service. I understand that cloud computing today has the problems you've stated. My response is that stricter regulation (rather than simply not using the cloud) is a better answer to these problems.


Several things actually.

The first being that the internet blends together many communities.
The second being that that cloud operating system would completely useless offline.
Not everyone is privy to a broadband connection. What if someone needs to use dialup?

Another thing you've said is stricter regulation. More like de-regulation. You obviously don't follow techno politics.

Well I had to watch Julius Geinakowski (Or however you spell his name) from the FCC basically give over mobile and wired networks to Verizon and Google.

Saying, "here do whatever you want with them"

In a world without Net Neutrality, and I hope that the fights not over, but in a world without it, cloud is an even worse option.
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Cramps

Joined: 31 Mar 2011
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Tue 24 May 2011, 17:13    Post subject:  

I enjoyed reading this thread, giving a decent heads up to clouding as it is new to me, too. I first became familiar with it when I tried Panda Firewall for XP. I dropped it soon after due to it being too complicated and using dial up made clouding unrealistic. Earlier this week I saw an add for Windows Cloud something or other, so it is being pushed more. I certainly don't like the idea. I don't even like akonadi that is now being used in KDE4.
Cramps
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James C


Joined: 26 Mar 2009
Posts: 5453
Location: Kentucky

PostPosted: Wed 25 May 2011, 02:31    Post subject:  

Totally not interested in cloud computing.At all. Smile
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hanedal

Joined: 12 Jun 2011
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Sun 12 Jun 2011, 14:12    Post subject:  

Some interesting views here. I'm a novice to cloud computing - got kind of interested after Apple announced its launch of iCloud. Chanced upon this cloud computing seminar by Amazon on 27 June but it's going to be held in Seoul (and probably in Korean): http://aws.amazon.com/apac/seminars/2011/06/27/seoul/.
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sszindian


Joined: 24 Apr 2010
Posts: 578
Location: Pennsylvania U.S.

PostPosted: Mon 13 Jun 2011, 16:20    Post subject: Cloud - Online Programs - Whatever!!!  

Oh My... it must be the word itself (CLOUD) that has so many in disillusion!

To all who use Gmail, shop at Ebay, Amazon, use internet, read an online Newspaper, work on your online Banking and... You who VIEW THIS FORUM on your computer and post messages, guess what? 'You Are Using Cloud Computing' whether you realize it or not. 'Period!!!'

Cloud has 'Always' been used by everyone that owns a computer and goes online! The only thing that has changed is the NAME from 'Online Programs' to now... 'Cloud'. The only difference now is that Cloud is adding features that allow you to interact with a lot of different programs ONLINE without the need to install them on your personal PC, and to use many programs that you would would never be able to install on your PC and have them function at all.

If one can't understand this and you still don't like the name 'Cloud', just change the name to something you like and can maybe understand better!

>>>---Indian------>
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Cust0dian


Joined: 22 Oct 2010
Posts: 28
Location: Russian Federation, St. Petersburg

PostPosted: Mon 13 Jun 2011, 17:07    Post subject:  

Good point about thin clients. Yes, it's similar. The only thing is that there is no one server in the so called cloud. The data is sliced in a number of chunks and then sent to several servers, that might be on different continents. The person owning those servers son't be able to recover data simply because he doesn't have whole data.

It's like if you cut dollar in three pieces and send it over different post offices to different people. They won't be able to use that 1/3 dollar pieces, but they can send them over to you, and you'll be able to recover that dollar.

The next thing is that if anyone gets three envelopes and it's not you, then he will use your dollar. But you can lock every envelope with special key pair, then no one will able to unlock it except from you. It's called cryptography. You know who exactly sender is, you know who delivered envelope to you, you know that no one have altered what is in that envelope.

Cryptography is a very powerful thing which guarantees that your's is only your's, but can be stored in the open place.

"Cloud" isn't Internet. "Cloud" can be Freenet or Netsukuku. Because we are people. When we collaborate, great things are happen. You can see this with Puppy. We are community, or "legion" — and that's great, we must use it, not turn around from it because we don't understand it.

So, summing everything up before you got too bored:
"Cloud" — distributed storage space and computer power, that available as service, as if you own it as one machine, with, actually, enhanced security and availability. I can't find anything similar to this in the real world, but think of it as on-demand taxi, which is actually really big bus with bodyguards and armored windows. Oh, and with bar too. And you see only yourself inside it. Something like this. Smile
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sszindian


Joined: 24 Apr 2010
Posts: 578
Location: Pennsylvania U.S.

PostPosted: Wed 15 Jun 2011, 08:21    Post subject: Cloud's future?  

For those still skeptical of the Cloud... Have a look at what's currently happening and then report back here whether Cloud isn't better than what you have now and isn't the future of computing?


http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Computers-Promotions/Google-Chrome/pcmcat241800050013.c?id=pcmcat241800050013&DCMP=rdr5387

I doubt you can call this a Step Backwards!!!

>>>---Indian------>
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puppyluvr


Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 3145
Location: Chickasha Oklahoma

PostPosted: Wed 15 Jun 2011, 08:46    Post subject:  

Very Happy Gee...
All your programs, all your data..on a server...under someone elses control..
Big Brother would like that..
A step backwards in personal freedom...
Give up your individuality...
Join the Cloud...

No thanks....

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stu90


Joined: 25 Feb 2010
Posts: 1401
Location: England. Dell Inspiron 1501. Dpup

PostPosted: Wed 15 Jun 2011, 09:06    Post subject: Re: Cloud's future?  

sszindian wrote:
For those still skeptical of the Cloud... Have a look at what's currently happening and then report back here whether Cloud isn't better than what you have now and isn't the future of computing?


http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Computers-Promotions/Google-Chrome/pcmcat241800050013.c?id=pcmcat241800050013&DCMP=rdr5387

I doubt you can call this a Step Backwards!!!

>>>---Indian------>


Reading the blurb its hardly a step forward either considering you can do all this + more on a conventional laptop / notebook .

What happens if you don't have a wifi connection and are out of 3g signal range - Does the chromebook becomes a chrome brick?
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