Puppy Linux Discussion Forum Forum Index Puppy Linux Discussion Forum
Puppy HOME page : puppylinux.com
"THE" alternative forum : puppylinux.info
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

The time now is Wed 01 Oct 2014, 04:16
All times are UTC - 4
 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Cutting edge
Puppy Phone - VOIP using SIP
Moderators: Flash, Ian, JohnMurga
Post new topic   Reply to topic View previous topic :: View next topic
Page 2 of 38 [564 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, ..., 36, 37, 38 Next
Author Message
smokey01


Joined: 30 Dec 2006
Posts: 1821
Location: South Australia

PostPosted: Sat 20 Aug 2011, 18:11    Post subject:  

gcmartin wrote:
I have 2 questions which seem to be key for me
  • Why are we trying to change the name of PSIP. Why aren't we just calling it SIP? What up?

    It seems the name will remain as Psip.

  • If you do NOT have a server, where is the registration going to come from for the caller to contact the callee?


I suggested we remain with Psip, it appears lobster has agreed.
gcmartin wrote:

SIP is a protocol that is kinda similar to Internet. It relies on some authority who know where things are so that connections can traverse for an end to end tunnel for 2-way audio-video traffic.

For example: has this been used on a local LAN to get one telephony to connect to another? For a client to client operation, this will help anyone understand what is happening at which point you will begin to see why there is an Asterisk (and others that exist).

Apparently pjsua, the engine of Psip, is able to conduct peer to peer communications without a sip server. There are a number of people who would like this functionality including myself. I'm just having a few problems working out how to configure it. I understand if I was to put your IP address into my buddy's list I could see when you were online and I could call you. Of course this is more useful if you have a static IP address rather than dynamic one.
gcmartin wrote:

I do not have the skills for programing a STUN or any other NAT traversal techniques for getting past your router into the iNet to support audio communication connection services. But, before I step that far, I would most certainly insure that I can pick up a telephone on my LAN and talk to some other LAN user to insure that much of the system you envision is operating with the clarity you want.


Neither do I yet but I'm working on it.

With the current Psip I am able to communicate between my current network on 192.168.0.* without a sip server.

For example: on computer A, with an IP of 192.168.0.3, I can communicate with computer B, with an IP address of 192.168.0.4. This works very well. What I am trying to do is communicate with someone outside of my local network in the same manner.
gcmartin wrote:


Trying to help with this posting by providing a starting point for a roadmap to successful implementation.

If need, and there is some document which points me to doing this on the local LAN using the product your reference, please steer me so that I can get the 1st step for direct SIP to SIP communication going.


The pjsua manual can be read from the existing Psip under the help menu item or here http://www.pjsip.org/pjsua.htm

gcmartin wrote:

BTW aren't there some SIP to SIP or SIP to POTS implementations already available off-the-shelf?


Yes but they are all quite large. Psip is way under a Meg which fits better with the Puppy vision.

Psip sound quality is also brilliant. It's probably better than all of the rest I have tried.

It can also be used on dialup, try that with Skype.

Register an ekiga account here. https://www.ekiga.net/?page=register

Here is the list of changes that I am currently working on:

    Tidy up the menu system
    Remove and update redundant links
    Include a username along with the sip address in the buddy list
    Include the text-chat in main dialog instead of floating windows
    Peer to Peer communications


I don't know what lobster has in mind as we have not spoken at length about it yet.

If I was really skillful I would like build the entire GUI into the C code of pjsua.

It would be nice just to have two files, the main and the config file.

I hope that answers your questions.

Regards smokey

_________________
Puppy Software <-> Distros <-> Puppy Linux Tips
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website 
smokey01


Joined: 30 Dec 2006
Posts: 1821
Location: South Australia

PostPosted: Sat 20 Aug 2011, 20:01    Post subject:  

Some interesting reading here:
http://wiki.ekiga.org/index.php/Understanding_NAT/firewall_issues_with_SIP_clients_%28eg_ekiga%29#Direct_communication_by_bypassing_NAT

_________________
Puppy Software <-> Distros <-> Puppy Linux Tips
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website 
gcmartin

Joined: 14 Oct 2005
Posts: 4296
Location: Earth

PostPosted: Sat 20 Aug 2011, 23:46    Post subject:  

NAT traversal is done in your router. Contact your router vendor if you are unsure about how.

Hope this helps

_________________
Get ACTIVE Create Circles; Do those good things which benefit people's needs!
We are all related ... Its time to show that we know this!
3 Different Puppy Search Engine or use DogPile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
gcmartin

Joined: 14 Oct 2005
Posts: 4296
Location: Earth

PostPosted: Sat 20 Aug 2011, 23:56    Post subject:  

Could someone share a location of the steps to connect one user with another. Is this just audio or is it video as well.?
Can a single SIP user connect to a SIP telephone on the LAN?
Can a SIP user connect to a SIP device which can ring telephones in the home?
Can the SIP user connect to another SIP user via VPN?

The power of SIP is not how small it is...Its its functionality for audio communications to any/all SIP compliant devices. This is what attracts people to SIP clients....functionality! functionality!! functionality!!! and of course clarity.

One of is problems is that the specs has been TOO loose such that vendors would NOT create proprietary islands and platforms. That has been one of the major issues to date. The patents has stifled a lot of what was planned.

Thanks in advance

_________________
Get ACTIVE Create Circles; Do those good things which benefit people's needs!
We are all related ... Its time to show that we know this!
3 Different Puppy Search Engine or use DogPile

Last edited by gcmartin on Sun 21 Aug 2011, 13:50; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
Flash
Official Dog Handler


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 11081
Location: Arizona USA

PostPosted: Sun 21 Aug 2011, 00:11    Post subject:  

I don't understand why a router or NAT server doesn't seem to have the problems when I connect PSIP or another VOIP client to a server that it apparently has if I try to connect PSIP directly to another computer (with the NAT server or router between them.) If having a server between the two computers will make the NAT server or router happy, why not configure one of the servers that comes with Puppy to do the job, and then connect PSIP or whatever through it? I'm asking this in order to demonstrate that I am completely ignorant of anything to do with servers or VOIP. How hard can it be? Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
smokey01


Joined: 30 Dec 2006
Posts: 1821
Location: South Australia

PostPosted: Sun 21 Aug 2011, 03:20    Post subject:  

gcmartin wrote:
Could someone share a location of the steps to connect one user with another. Is this just audio or is it video as well.? Just audio
Can a single SIP user connect to a SIP telephone on the LAN? Yes
Can a SIP user connect to a SIP device which can ring telephones in the home? Yes but you need to connect through a sip server that has a gateway to the PSTN telephone network. This will cost a small fee.
Can the SIP user connect to another SIP user via VPN? Not sure

Thanks in advance

_________________
Puppy Software <-> Distros <-> Puppy Linux Tips
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website 
smokey01


Joined: 30 Dec 2006
Posts: 1821
Location: South Australia

PostPosted: Sun 21 Aug 2011, 03:29    Post subject:  

Flash wrote:
I don't understand why a router or NAT server doesn't seem to have the problems when I connect PSIP or another VOIP client to a server that it apparently has if I try to connect PSIP directly to another computer (with the NAT server or router between them.) If having a server between the two computers will make the NAT server or router happy, why not configure one of the servers that comes with Puppy to do the job, and then connect PSIP or whatever through it? I'm asking this in order to demonstrate that I am completely ignorant of anything to do with servers or VOIP. How hard can it be? Laughing


Flash if you go to this link https://www.ekiga.net/?page=register and register a sip account, say flash@ekiga.net and set up the account in Psip I will be able to call you. The problem with Psip at the moment it is not indicating when users are logged in. This worked perfectly fine with sipphone, another sip server. I'm not sure why this doesn't work at the ekiga sip server.

It is easy enough to connect through the sip server but it would be nice to connect without having to use a server, less dependencies.

Psip works perfectly fine as it is at the moment. We don't need to be connect to the same sip server either.

_________________
Puppy Software <-> Distros <-> Puppy Linux Tips
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website 
smokey01


Joined: 30 Dec 2006
Posts: 1821
Location: South Australia

PostPosted: Sun 21 Aug 2011, 03:54    Post subject:  

As I said earlier a number of the links are broken.

The help manual I created also seems to have disappeared.

I will attach a PDF version of help that should assist.

This is the link to the original thread when we first developed Psip.
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=212572#212572
Psip-Help.tar.gz
Description  Psip Help Manual
gz

 Download 
Filename  Psip-Help.tar.gz 
Filesize  137.95 KB 
Downloaded  570 Time(s) 

_________________
Puppy Software <-> Distros <-> Puppy Linux Tips
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website 
gcmartin

Joined: 14 Oct 2005
Posts: 4296
Location: Earth

PostPosted: Sun 21 Aug 2011, 09:21    Post subject:  

Here's some helpful pics which might help one visualize SIP

Little while ago, IBM made this to easily understand. Modeling SIP via architecture.

The Architecture includes a Gateway. Your non-server product must build all of that functionality into your product versus using a server to connect.

I think what you are trying to do is to have the freedom of NOT using someone else's server for SIP registration and SIP G/W services. Is that right?
But, this is going to require some very creative thought, designing a model, and building the model+client to match your objective.

Other options are, maybe, just build your own personal local PUPPY SIP Server_Gateway, or use OpenSER or Asterisk to do all the dirty work, easily. Locally,.Asterisk will run on a PUP. Others SIP Gateway_servers can be deployed in Puppy, too.

Or, here's a thought. Suppose the Puppy Community has set up its own SIP Server_Gateway somewhere on the internet; say "http://puppy-linux.org/SIPserver" to provide call connection services needs. And suppose, that each PUP which run a Puppy SIP client registers there. And, suppose, that each PUP SIP which registers uses some "new" Puppy client so that Server_Gateway processing was shared, this would created the world's largest telephony switch. It would become enormous for Puppy and would draw every person wanting to have voice-video connections into the Puppy Community environment ...directly or indirectly. Imagine how beneficial this could be.

Hope this helps

_________________
Get ACTIVE Create Circles; Do those good things which benefit people's needs!
We are all related ... Its time to show that we know this!
3 Different Puppy Search Engine or use DogPile

Last edited by gcmartin on Mon 22 Aug 2011, 02:13; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
Flash
Official Dog Handler


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 11081
Location: Arizona USA

PostPosted: Sun 21 Aug 2011, 23:20    Post subject:  

gcmartin wrote:
... just build your own personal local PUPPY SIP Server_Gateway, or use OpenSER or Asterisk to do all the dirty work, easily. Locally,.Asterisk will run on a PUP. Others SIP Gateway_servers can be deployed in Puppy, too.

In my ignorant way, I was attempting to suggest something like that, only the server would run on the same machine as the VOIP client. Perhaps the Hiawatha server which comes with most Puppys could be configured to satisfy whatever the router or NAT server requires, then a SIP client would run as a separate process (if that's the right terminology) that uses the Hiawatha server. Is it even possible to run a server and a client on the same machine? Seems like it ought to be.

Quote:
Or, here's a thought. Suppose the Puppy Community has set up its own SIP Server_Gateway. And suppose, that each PUP which run a Puppy SIP client registers there. And, suppose, that each PUP SIP which registers uses some "new" Puppy client so that Server_Gateway processing was shared, this would created the world's largest telephony switch. It would become enormous for Puppy and would draw every person wanting to have voice-video connections into the Puppy Community environment ...directly or indirectly. Imagine how beneficial this could be.

Hope this helps

I can see millions of people demanding help from the forum to get their VOIP working. Someone would have to come up with a really good GUI or wizard for configuring VOIP in Puppy. Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
smokey01


Joined: 30 Dec 2006
Posts: 1821
Location: South Australia

PostPosted: Mon 22 Aug 2011, 03:45    Post subject:  

I have spend the best part of the day updating Psip.

I have also done quite a bit of research to find a good SIP server that gives away free SIP accounts. My final decision was http://www.iptel.org

Psip seems to work very well with this server.

I have also updated the Psip help from the help menu. Be sure to have a read it has some useful information in it.

I have attached a single file called psip_gui which need to be copied to /usr/local/psip. I have zipped it up to make it upload compliant.

WARNING do back up your original psip_gui first. Just because it works here doesn't mean it's guaranteed to work for you.
psip-0.2.tar.gz
Description 
gz

 Download 
Filename  psip-0.2.tar.gz 
Filesize  2.25 KB 
Downloaded  572 Time(s) 

_________________
Puppy Software <-> Distros <-> Puppy Linux Tips
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website 
Caneri

Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 1580
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Mon 22 Aug 2011, 10:32    Post subject:  

Hi Grant,
I used your new psip-gui and all seems ok.

Psip doesn't seem to show anyone online but it may be that there is nobody online...dunno.

The old sipphone.com doesn't seem to work any longer.

Best,
Eric

EDIT: what is the latest version of psip?
I have PSIP 0.20

_________________
Be not afraid to grow slowly, only be afraid of standing still.
Chinese Proverb

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
gcmartin

Joined: 14 Oct 2005
Posts: 4296
Location: Earth

PostPosted: Mon 22 Aug 2011, 11:30    Post subject:  

Ah yes, IPTEL.
Edited: Note: All IP adapters or telephones must support STUN. (2009)

Did you notice their mention of the SIP Router Project? (latest project where the forks have agreed to combine their efforts)

If would be nice if they made it very, very easy to build a local SIP server for "calling" around on your LAN. To do it ourselves, we need
  1. dedicated PC with the following
    • 256-1GB RAM
    • 2 LAN NICs
    • adapter in the PC to route calls to Plain old telephones in your homes
  2. OS (distro)
    • Small PUP with DNSMASQ instead of DHCPD
    • SIP Router Project for local call management and connection services for SIP registration for calls outside of the home and to manage SIP calls inside the home
  3. Pictorial Instruction Manual
The above is a simplistic view of a system for running in the home or small location allow the use of internal home (line1+line2 = rj11 wiring OR line1-4 = rj45 wiring) and also allows for use of LAN connected IP phones or SIP PC clients (both wired/WiFi)

There are several "free" SIP-telephony servers available for doing this, OTB.

Biggest problem with this is that MOST newbies would NOT dare attempt this because the management issues are just beyond their reach and much too complex.

If this thread/community should undertake this effort, we must make it as easy and attractive as jumping into a "pool of naked beautiful people".

Hope this understanding helps

_________________
Get ACTIVE Create Circles; Do those good things which benefit people's needs!
We are all related ... Its time to show that we know this!
3 Different Puppy Search Engine or use DogPile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
Flash
Official Dog Handler


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 11081
Location: Arizona USA

PostPosted: Mon 22 Aug 2011, 15:32    Post subject:  

gcmartin wrote:
...It would be nice if they made it very, very easy to build a local SIP server for "calling" around on your LAN...

Perhaps I misunderstand, but Smokey01 seems to be saying he was able to connect computers directly, within his LAN, here, without needing a server. It seems that you're screwed if you try to connect two computers directly, with a router between them. Even so-called P2P applications seem to need the initial connection to be established by a server. Is that correct?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
gcmartin

Joined: 14 Oct 2005
Posts: 4296
Location: Earth

PostPosted: Mon 22 Aug 2011, 15:50    Post subject:  

Flash wrote:
... Perhaps I misunderstand, but Smokey01 seems to be saying he was able to connect computers directly, within his LAN, here, without needing a server. ...
Yes @Flash, you are correct, and I saw that too.

But, lets say you have several PC users on your LAN whose PC names are Jack, Dick, Jane and Jill. If you want to call either one of them from your PC called Flash, how do you do that?
  • Can I use their PC name
  • Can I use their SIP information
  • How would I use an IP address
  • What will happen on my PC should they happen to call me, Flash?
I think I may have already discussed the need for this with someone somewhere....EH.

This is one of the reason this thread's discussion about SIP peer-peer is wrestling with. In the past, this function for larger networks is done in the LAN's PBX (local SIP Registrar). But, in SIP peer-peer, all tables for how to talk must be maintained and kept consistent, constantly, somewhere, locally. That's what I am trying to piece together based on the little I know about the architecture. (and to be able to call yourself a "SIP" client, that has to be adherence to some base architecture.)

@Smokey01 you are helping us you provide guidance in PET use. Thanks as we progress.
Hope that shares what I was getting at.

_________________
Get ACTIVE Create Circles; Do those good things which benefit people's needs!
We are all related ... Its time to show that we know this!
3 Different Puppy Search Engine or use DogPile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
Display posts from previous:   Sort by:   
Page 2 of 38 [564 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, ..., 36, 37, 38 Next
Post new topic   Reply to topic View previous topic :: View next topic
 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Cutting edge
Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
[ Time: 0.1195s ][ Queries: 13 (0.0112s) ][ GZIP on ]