Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

sc0ttman · Joined: 16 Sep 2009 Posts: 2173 Location: UK

isn't the way to do this to mod Woof a bit, create a build a toolchain (chroot environment thing) and start compiling from source..? Barry does that with T2, I'm sure looking at things like ttylinux build scripts and others like will help make an arm supported woof...

pacer106 · Joined: 11 Jan 2011 Posts: 365

Hey lobster where did you get the raspberry part of the logo thats on the wikka page?

http://puppylinux.org/wikka/PARM

I am looking to do some artwork.

Iguleder · Posted: Thu 27 Oct 2011, 17:16 Post subject:

Time to share my thoughts about the subject.

I believe the best way for the ARM porting effort is same as the solution for the 64-bit Puppy problem.

Puppy relies on many binary packages (e.g Busybox, Bash) that were originally built on Puppy 2.x or 4.x and Barry kept using them in 4.3.1, which means they're still with us at 5.3.

I convinced Barry he should move all those to one repository, which is the "Packages-puppy-common-official" repository. My idea was to have just those annoying core packages there, but Barry put much more than that, mostly Wary packages that are compatible with most Puppies.

The fact these are binary packages means it's impossible to port Puppy to other architectures, since they aren't portable.

The solution for this problem is simple - automate the procedure needed to compile those. I wrote build scripts for most of those, which work with my package building tool, Builder. All I need to port Puppy to x86_64, theoretically, is a way to build 64-bit packages from a 32-bit Puppy.

What I'm doing now is something I've experimented already - a 32-bit Puppy with a 64-bit kernel (e.g a Puppy that can run both 32- and 64-bit stuff) that I can use to cross-compile all those packages for x86_64.

Similarly, I could build a cross-compiler that runs on x86 but produces ARM binaries. Once these are ready, I could use Woof to produce an ARM Puppy.

However, it's a 'lil bit more problematic - Woof has many executables and binary files. This is totally against any programming convention I'm aware of, but I won't criticize Barry's decisions.

The bottom line is that bootstrapping a new Puppy for another architecture requires four main things:
1) Replace all binaries in Woof with ones native to the new Puppy (well, except those used to build it - they need to match the machine Woof runs on)
2) Build that Puppy from a Puppy that can run its binaries, that's a Woof requirement.
3) All those crappy traditional packages.
4) A kernel.

Once we have all those, we can build some sane Puppy for ARM, x86_64 or any architecture, that has a compiler and everything needed to build the rest of it.

That's what I do with my current puplet, Guy Dog - it is built from Debian packages (I mean, just the base system) and all applications (and even more than that, even stuff like D-Bus and Bash) are built on top of it, automatically.

It shouldn't be that hard to port Puppy, but it's time to cut those ties between Puppy and x86.

Lobster · Posted: Thu 27 Oct 2011, 18:27 Post subject:

sc0ttman · Joined: 16 Sep 2009 Posts: 2173 Location: UK

I think checking out ttylinux might help here... it is based on build scripts and chroot .... libc, gcc, busybox et al can all be very easily built for arm, and the arm stuff is built from within its own toolchain (which you can build to your liking as well), as mentioned would be needed...

I have no knowledge of this sorta stuff really, but even I eventually got a working ARM based toolchain ready to go, inc busybox, gnutils, etc, etc ... I just don't have anything to test it on! (or the inclination to be honest, it's pretty 'barebones'!)

here is the build system: http://www.minimalinux.org/ttylinux/Download/ttylinux-src-mp8.tar.bz2

pacer106 · Joined: 11 Jan 2011 Posts: 365

Thanks for the logo lobster Smile

Next question where should I post finished work?

Lobster · Posted: Thu 27 Oct 2011, 19:34 Post subject:

Lobster · Posted: Thu 27 Oct 2011, 19:47 Post subject:

Lobster · Posted: Sat 29 Oct 2011, 11:21 Post subject:

Barry is looking at cross compiler toolchains
http://bkhome.org/blog/?viewDetailed=02575

. . . he could be turning raspberry Very Happy

Once we have our Puppy kennel [ . . . ahem . . .] kernel
We will have access to some amazing future browsers on cornflake packets (. . . OK far future . . .)

After Pi
we can select a touch screen tablet, which we can all afford

Raspberry Pi is very much an education project.
Puppy too is a continuous education, with many of us still learning how
to program or develop other skills.

I have always wanted a simple programming language such as
http://ifttt.com/
or better still real time programming which I believe some classified
projects may be using

Touch screens and pinching and expanding and moving
completely change the programing potential . . .
http://tmxxine.com/web/asq3/index.htm

BarryK · Posted: Sat 29 Oct 2011, 20:13 Post subject:

myman_05 · Joined: 07 Oct 2008 Posts: 27

Finally... Laughing

Lobster · Posted: Sun 30 Oct 2011, 00:59 Post subject:

Lobster · Posted: Fri 04 Nov 2011, 11:52 Post subject:

Got an email a few hours ago . . . Very Happy

Lobster · Posted: Tue 15 Nov 2011, 03:34 Post subject:

In the design of the Raspberry Pi board I found a Puppy

If I believed in such things it could only be a great omen Cool

For those of a more sensible build of mind . . .
Barry has a new ARM motherboard and will be developing Woof power with ARM shortly . . .
http://bkhome.org/blog/?viewDetailed=02596

nickec · Joined: 12 Jun 2011 Posts: 3

http://russelldavis.org/2011/09/10/virtualbox-vm-for-raspberrypi-development/

"Virtualbox is only x86 but inside the vm is qemu and scratchbox2 that emulate arm and allow you to build software for arm devices"