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 Forum index » Taking the Puppy out for a walk » Suggestions
Making financial contributions
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ravensrest


Joined: 22 Feb 2008
Posts: 321
Location: Hood Canal, WA

PostPosted: Thu 01 Dec 2011, 17:05    Post subject:  Making financial contributions
Subject description: Who to contribute to
 

Some of us would like to make financial contributions, however large or small, that could and would be used to promulgate the many fine projects underway within the Puppy community. A question immediately arises as to who or what the contribution should be made to in order to most effectively and efficiently move those projects forward. Mind you, this should not be looked at as a charitable contribution, but as as a stipend for ongoing work. I did drop a line to Barry asking his thoughts, and he seems somewhat uncertain too.

I would like to see a general discussion here. One might also ask if we should request a volunteer to collect any contributions and disseminate them according to some generally agreed upon criteria.

I have no idea of how much such contributions have amounted to in the past or what they might be in the future. If anyone has a feeling for the amount I would like to know it. Perhaps it is too small to be worth worrying about?

Please let us all know what you think, and don't be embarrassed to say "me" if you feel it is justified.
BS
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Lobster
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PostPosted: Thu 01 Dec 2011, 19:30    Post subject:  

Iguleder has mentioned that he would like to be a Puppy paid developer. I would recommend his efforts.
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ttuuxxx


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PostPosted: Thu 01 Dec 2011, 21:58    Post subject:  

you'll never get rich with puppy, lol after 4yrs of supporting puppy and about 10,400+hrs donated minimum, I've received around $130.00 in donations, lol or $0.0125 per hour, lol If puppy linux was a country, we would be worst off than lowest paid third world country, they would have to make a new lower class, maybe a 4th world country, lol Luckily I manage to find real work on a regular bases.
I'm not asking for donations what so ever, but this is a typical example of what people make, We the developers do what we do not for the money, but because we love what we do, and thats helping and fulfilling people's lives. Smile
ttuuxxx

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Lobster
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PostPosted: Fri 02 Dec 2011, 01:46    Post subject:  

"For I don't care too much for money, for money can't buy me love." - The Beatles

Quote:
We the developers do what we do not for the money, but because we love what we do, and thats helping and fulfilling people's lives.


St Ttuuxxx of Puppy has spoken wisely.

You should still be able to donate to Barry.
http://puppylinux.com/download/index.html
who has always insisted on spending more on Puppy than any reimbursement from well wishers.

Judge Dredd who runs this forum (sometimes*) has
financed out of his own pocket and with one ad
and is even getting 4 Raspberry pi for himself and needy developers
He has done good.
MU one of our earlier developers did manage to get a job for a while that allowed Puppy and database development.
Pizzasgod was also paid some tiny amount to do some customised Puppy.
My accumulation of booty is as follows:
    One almost deceased and dodgy USB key drive (forget donor - my apologies)
    A bog standard and very useful pci video card from Sage
    A Puppy T shirt from Caneri with my very own lobster on a 'sleeve'
    with a Canadian decal and tasteful Puppy Vincent logo

Thanks guys. Smile
It is a good thing I have a good stock of sardines
and live in a cave.
Iguleder is the only current developer (that I am aware of) who would like to be paid to develop. However the truth is you can not leash a volcano of ideas and perhaps you should not . . .
http://iguleder.wordpress.com/
Smokey has a manual you can print and pay for (or just download)
There is a Puppy commercial merchandise website somewhere

* John Murga makes us appreciate this forum by
carefully unplanned outages. Oh I am wikid to him . . . Laughing

Please ignore above and send all bribes to usual non existent other dimension Swiss bank account

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JohnMurga
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Joined: 04 May 2005
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PostPosted: Fri 02 Dec 2011, 01:57    Post subject:  

Hey

Lobster wrote:
* John Murga makes us appreciate this forum by
carefully unplanned outages. Oh I am wikid to him . . . Laughing

You want make me feel even worse than I already do ?

The last MAJOR outage (like this one), was at the end of 2005.

Just when you think everything works ... It breaks Sad

Cheers
JohnM
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disciple

Joined: 20 May 2006
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PostPosted: Fri 02 Dec 2011, 02:06    Post subject:  

Ttuuxxx,
I know a lot of guys here spend a lot of time supporting or developing for Puppy, but:

10400/4/365 = 7.12 hours every day, or
7.12*7/5 = 10 hours a day, 5 days a week, with no holidays.

1) Are you sure it is really that high? I thought you were one of the guys with a job and a wife and kids and whatnot...
2) Out of interest, how much of that is actually development? Developing what in particular?

Quote:
I'm not asking for donations what so ever, but this is a typical example of what people make.

Do you actually know that it is typical, or are you guessing?
I would have guessed that a lot of people (almost everyone?) make absolutely nothing, but Barry at least would have made quite a bit more than $130. I'm sure it would still be a tiny amount though.

Lobster: did Igueleder actually mean he wanted to be paid for a significant amount of time to work on puppy development? I can't really see that happening unless he had corporate backing, or a very generous patron.

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Lobster
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PostPosted: Fri 02 Dec 2011, 02:30    Post subject:  

Quote:
You want make me feel even worse than I already do ?


Sorry
My humour is too evil.
It actually upsets me that you feel guilty. Crying or Very sad
You are dong great John. Look at the support and appreciation.
Hear that. Cool

One of my family members recently felt responsible for all the suffering in the world. Now they are back on medication I am already making jokes that involve Jesus. I have the empathy of a mosquito . . .
Embarassed no I do not mean 'take the tablets' Embarassed
[ note to self - do not anger a judge carrying a gun]

Quote:
Lobster: did Igueleder actually mean he wanted to be paid for a significant amount of time to work on puppy development? I can't really see that happening unless he had corporate backing, or a very generous patron.


This was one of two conversations on IRC. Igu has probably forgotten the first. Basically he thought some sort of Puppy foundation to offer reimbursement for specific coding projects.
Igu is no bread head. All his efforts are free.

I better be quiet Rolling Eyes - not much chance of that . . . Embarassed

I am gonna do a pawed cast . . .

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James C


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PostPosted: Fri 02 Dec 2011, 02:46    Post subject:  

Barry K came up with a pretty workable idea
http://puppylinux.com/development/projects.htm

Quote:
We have many developers who do it just for the love of it. Many people of course have day jobs, and develop and test Puppy in the evenings and weekends, as an enjoyable hobby. Such people are generally not cash-strapped, but there are many Puppy enthusiasts who are unemployed, very low-income, or students. To this latter category in particular I would like to offer a little encouragement. I am definitely not offering commercial programming rates, just a token reward, that will be announced on my blog and the Puppy Forum. So, a "Puppy Linux Developer Award" will be a recognition of contribution, and something for the CV.
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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
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Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Fri 02 Dec 2011, 03:10    Post subject:  

disciple wrote:
Ttuuxxx,
I know a lot of guys here spend a lot of time supporting or developing for Puppy, but:

10400/4/365 = 7.12 hours every day, or
7.12*7/5 = 10 hours a day, 5 days a week, with no holidays.

1) Are you sure it is really that high? I thought you were one of the guys with a job and a wife and kids and whatnot...
2) Out of interest, how much of that is actually development? Developing what in particular?


Well its like building 2.14x for the first year and a half I was mostly at home spending around 80hrs a week min, sometimes even more usually 16hr days x 7 days a week, then when I am working 8hr days I usually spend around 6-8hrs a day on it so I just rounded up 8 hrs a day times 7 days =56hrs, times 52 weeks, times 4yrs doing this, plus I did roll about 5-6 woof builds, plus I had living water, fire hydrant, plus I did build a few series 4 updates, I also was on the last 4 ce build, and supplied 70% of the packages. plus I must of compiled well over 1000 apps on the forum, plus for the first 2 years I did supply help on the puppy chat, easily did I spend that much time on puppy, I also spend hundred of hours on configuring browsers like firepup, and building graphics icons from scratch and also compressed a lot of mimes and gtk/gnome icons etc. my wife works 24hr shifts and I hardly see her, she starts one day and comes home the next day mid morning, and goes back to work the next day. Anyways I wasn't asking for nothing, I was just stating that we do it for the love mostly and what others get out out of it.
Like today I've been building a new backend for the next CE edition.
I'm always busy in the background, Like 2.14X I compiled a new backend for gtk3 three complete times but I wasn't happy with it, so I never released it yet.

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emil

Joined: 10 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: Fri 02 Dec 2011, 03:39    Post subject:  

Things tend to drift away from the original posters question:

If people are willing to give financial support - where should it be directed too?

First adress would be Barry Kauler. I think most people are fine with the idea that he should receive this support and spend it the way he sees most appropriate.

However let me present another idea. Let some trusted members of the puppy community form a legal non profit entity (say e.g. Puppy Foundation).

There are some distinguished old puppians, and one could ask if they would be willing to form such a commity. Out of the top of my head:
Barry Kauler, playdayz, Lobster, John Murga, 01micko, shinobar, raffy, rcrsn51, tempestous, tuuxx - there are lots of candidates.
However formation of this group depends on the will and support of the project leaders, this can imho not be done "bottom up" - that would result in a nitpicking jealousy.

As the total amount of donations would be small and, like mentioned, the puppy project is a labor of love and dedication most work is unpayable. It would be damaging to have impression of a "2 class society" -i.e. some have access to funding - even the most feeble one - while others have not. As an example and warning I just think of the recent irrational events around former members and the bad energy they transmitted against this puppy community.

A possible solution is to sponsor only work on very few selected projects with are widely regarded as common problems (e.g. wifi support) in form of stipend, or to restrict to an award system. Instead of oscars there could be Puppies:

Puppy for best forum support
Puppy for best Puppy Artwork
Puppy for best new technology implementation
Lifetime achievement Puppy
....

In all those matters concerning money one has to take care that the wellminded spirit is not spoiled, so a portion of humor would be good (Lobster could present the awardies). One has to understand that possible advantages and additional possibilities for fundraising also imply additional work, responsibilies and exposure. I don't know if somebody is keen to do this job...

To sum it up, IMHO send all donations to Barry Kauler. If something else evolves it is fine as well (and could be fun - I'd like to see annual Lobsters Puppy awards).

Take care
emil
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technosaurus


Joined: 18 May 2008
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PostPosted: Fri 02 Dec 2011, 03:44    Post subject:  

Normally I wouldn't care, but as I am currently unemployed, if there _were_ "bounties" I would be Boba Fett right now.
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disciple

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PostPosted: Fri 02 Dec 2011, 03:49    Post subject:  

Quote:
A question immediately arises as to who or what the contribution should be made to in order to most effectively and efficiently move those projects forward.

I'm not really saying anything new, but it seems to me that:
1) if you want to support the general Puppy "infrastructure" you could give to Barry or someone who works with the internals of Puppy, or someone like Zigbert, who develops a number of Puppy's guis, or
2) if there are specific projects that you are thinking of, talk to their developers, obviously.

But unless your support was significant and ongoing, I doubt it would do much to move them forward faster than they would otherwise. (Please: any developers comment if this is wrong for your projects Wink).
So I guess the most effective ways would be:
3) if there are specific improvements that you would like to see, you could find someone to sponsor to do them.
4) if there aren't, contribute to Barry's "Puppy Linux Developer Awards".

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ttuuxxx


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PostPosted: Fri 02 Dec 2011, 05:47    Post subject:  

I would say give it to the person who needs it, technosaurus says he's unemployed well donate to him this time round, I'm unemployed right now but I don't need donations, I did save up during my last Job and I have a new part-time job lined-up already in the new year, working for the church I helped build, basically networking, graphics, building maintenance etc. They can only afford part-time but that works in fine with my wife's schedule and I'm going back to school part-time at night in Jan for carpentry.
ttuuxxx

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Iguleder


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PostPosted: Fri 02 Dec 2011, 12:51    Post subject:  

Lobster wrote:
Iguleder has mentioned that he would like to be a Puppy paid developer. I would recommend his efforts.


That's not true! Crying or Very sad

I develop for Puppy because I find it fun! I learn a lot and I like inventing cool stuff.

However, I've been thinking of putting a donation button on my site (btw - got a new one). I'm a very modest person and I promise you I am a honest man; I just don't have much money - I come from a poor family and I want a better future for me and the children I will have one day.

I will never sell my (or another's) FOSS work! Evil or Very Mad

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Lobster
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PostPosted: Fri 02 Dec 2011, 21:57    Post subject:  

Quote:
That's not true!


Then I must have misunderstood. Been talking to someone spoofing you. Language barrier. Dreaming. Making it up etc etc.

My humble apologies.

Personally I would not trust anything I say, unless verified by a full psychiatric board and a team of Buddhist lie detectors. Even then I would take it as extremely dubious.

Puppy
Truly Linux

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