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nooby
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#21 Post by nooby »

You might be interested in what Big_Bass is working on :
Quote:
later I will use linux live scripts so that the live base will be 100% distro compatible with the big brother linux
this would allow any distro to be used (slackware ,debian,arch ....)

then use home made packages for the light experience
like the community custom built for puppy

why not just use a script to make a live cd
then any distro could be used
thats what the linux live scripts do !
Wow hope many Devs help him out so it get done
within my lifetime.

Is it a huge project I mean does it take many many "Man Hours" to accomplish?

To the name of Pussy.


I can personally accept the name but I know that many "sensitive" people would not like it. Some of these bark
at Puppy too.

Sickgut suggested? that it was "ego" that hold the Puppy
devs back.

I know that I am very self centered and maybe that
makes me all EGO even but I rather trust what IguLeder
wrote. Ooops I have forgot what he did actually say but the meaning was that Debian is not Puppy. Here we do only Puppy. Something like that. Yes I have used search

Another clue. I wrote at Linux Questions that Porteus (Slax Remixed Community version" where based on Slackware.

The Devs of Slackware got very upset and did not what to
help with Porteus in their threads over there.

I don't trust it has to do with ego or even EGO.

More like "Not our Brand name" a kind of solidarity with
one's own chosen Brand of Distros?

Haha Like when Christians don't want to mess with Amida Buddha. :)
I use Google Search on Puppy Forum
not an ideal solution though

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sickgut
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#22 Post by sickgut »

jpeps wrote:
jemimah wrote:
ttuuxxx wrote: and really that isn't what puppy is about, its about having a minimalistic operating system that can handle most everyday uses,

getting compiled apps there really is mostly for newbee's, they come with a lot of extra deps, kind of like gparted puppy static mmlibs vs Ubuntu shared libs, the Ubuntu package is around 3-4 times larger with all the same features, we get creative to reduce package sizes, where as Ubuntu anything goes, usually puppy packages are 10-300% smaller.
I have to agree with Ttuuxxx. Puppy stops being puppy if you add a bunch of lard to it. What makes Puppy great is the attention to resource usage that only Puppy devs can achieve. Combining Puppy with other distro's packages is like combining a monastery with a carnival.

(Not that the PPM doesn't need a bit of work)
Running apps from other distros would require having all the same resources. My preference is generally to do a fresh compile when I need something not already present...which isn't too often. I generally avoid gnome whenever possible.
the problem with all this is that newbies cant compile their own stuff etc.
and the small group of puppy devs simply cant add to a stable repo all the stuff that other major OSes have. And there is a new version of Puppy it seems every few months and therefore a new repo that needs working on.

Yes ive started with a base thats not Puppy, but i can be made to look and work the same, while retaining 100% compatibility with the debian repos. There is no reason that Pussy couldnt be changed to be indistinguishable from a normal Puppy to the user, while keeping its apt-get or synaptic debian compatibility. RAM use is no more (pussy uses less than Puppy) its no slower and if you consider the amount of dependencies etc in Pussy, its no larger than Puppy either.

I just dont know why we cant have the best of both worlds, and all Pussy needs is someone who knows about the various apps and scripts etc with the rox filer and JWM and Xorg etc that Puppy uses and we can port it to Pussy. I just dont know why its so blasphemous.

The last couple of years Puppy has bounced around, between ubuntu, debian, slackware in an incomplete fashion. You guys wouldnt have done this at all if you didnt already see the problems that im trying to address.
Take LUPU or LUCID for instance, Puppy was known by many as "just another ubuntu". The problem here was that Puppy was actively promoted as LUCID or whatever, having a tie to Ubuntu and many people used it and tried to install things from the Ubuntu repos and it doesnt work without hunting for missing deps, editing conf file etc. Just using Ubuntu or Debian or whatever packages means nothing at all if you dont run the same kernel and base system. So i jumped the gun in anticipation, why not just start with the base OS of say Debian, then try to make a Puppy around it?

I know those of you have concerns about once you have a Pussy then you install debian packages, these packages wont be as small as Puppy. For one thing we have a working compressed save file format and debian packages are all uniform, there is /doc /usr /etc ... whatever... its reasonably predictable to know what dirs you actually need. There is a catroll-panel function in Pussy to "clean up" your system and delete what you dont need. Also what would it be like if Puppy has its entire quickpet and most of its software repo installed? After all these are the only packages that can be added that have been slimmed, everything else you add that isnt in the puppy repos puppy users need to slim themselves. This is why we have 2 major versions of Pussy, the base and the Xtra, the Xtra is the equivelent of Puppy with absolutely everything installed. If you start with the Xtra edition, you are no worse off than if you had Puppy with most of its repo already installed. And if you want to upgrade from the base OS to the Xtra? its one file to download, one squash that does it all. Its like the entire repo in one file. Everything above and beyond that, what is not included in Puppy repos or Pussy Xtra is up to the user to slim or not to slim down, its no different with Pussy or Puppy. Pussy base and Pussy Xtra have been slimmed to a standard similar to Puppy.
Last edited by sickgut on Fri 13 Jan 2012, 11:24, edited 1 time in total.

tlchost
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#23 Post by tlchost »

sickgut wrote: I just dont know why its so blasphemous.
Because it is not the Way of The Puppy, Little Grasshopper.

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sickgut
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#24 Post by sickgut »

After messaging John Murga the guy who runs this forum (as if we didnt already know that) Pussy will stay on this forum. I just presumed because i was separating from Puppy and Pussy is no longer going to try to be a Puppy that Pussy had no place on a Puppy forum, but im told its ok.

so im leaving the puppy world to do pussy things but not going very far :)

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mavrothal
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PPM

#25 Post by mavrothal »

Well I do not know if this is the way of the puppy or not, but looks like a waste to keep compiling the same apps or being forced to change puppy to use one app because is only available for this puppy version.
I guess one of the reasons of the wider appeal of puppy5.2.x is its compatibility with ubuntu repos. Something that puppy5.3.x repeats with slackware repos. Pussy's appeal is not coincidental either. So package availability and consistence should not be overlooked.

PPM was built the way it is, back then because served certain needs for ONE or few highly similar puppies and puplets. But today there are 5 main stream puppies and countless pupplets, most of them not compatible with eachother. So I think PPM and pets should change a bit to fit the new reality.
I think that Puppy can have its own equally wide(?) repo if some kind of package auditing and tool-chane consistency is implemented. The puppy package management could easily be improved with minor investment (and a lot of knowledge...).

What it really needs is to add 2 new files in the pets, and PPM to check them and act accordingly.
One file should contain something like the ldd output for the included binaries eg `ldd --verbose binaries_in_pet >> petname.ldd' and the other the standard `petneme.files', that PPM generates (only after installation...).
The first file would be equivalent of "dependencies" while the second of "provides".

There are some more "dependencies" that may be more difficult to automate. The programs that scripts in the pet call upon and are not included in the pet (or listed as dependencies).
I guess that someone could search for the "exec" or "which" command in the scripts but I'm sure that a lot would be missed. Maybe someone has better ideas on how to "automate" this and append it in the dependencies file.

Anyway, having these 2 new files in the pet outside the tarbal, PPM could check before installation (the way it checks for size) and decide if additional files are needed, where to find them (assuming that a "provides" database is generated for every puppy-repo) and if preexisting files will be overwritten or updated.

If these 2 new files are not present or are empty, PPM could issue some scary warning, like "installing this package will brake your system".
This hopefully will deter installation of miss-formed packages and encourage compliance by pet developers.

As for consistency, I think that "agreeing" in every cycle on kernel, gcc and xorg versions should be sufficient and if not, PPM should at least be aware of this and act accordingly.

I'm sure that people can think and do better than that, but the general idea is that with well formed and audited packages Puppy would have nothing to envy from other distros. Most of the packages are already somewhere in this forum or some repo sites in and out of ibiblio. There are just hard to find and questionable to use.
This should improve somehow.


I do not know what sickgut will decide to do with pussy or puppy, but I would rather see him stay, and maybe work along these lines too.

Just my 2 c.

PS: Ooops sickgut decided already :wink:
== [url=http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html]Here is how to solve your[/url] [url=https://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/bugs.html]Linux problems fast[/url] ==

stu90

#26 Post by stu90 »

I agree with many of Sickgut's points - my secondary OS is Bodhi linux they have their own .bod packages that contain all dependencies for popular applications yet still retain apt-get / synaptic package manager to ubuntu repos.

If Puppy was built from say debain or slackware why couldn't we do the same - keeping a repo of .pets as optimized packages yet with the full compatibility of an established and well maintained repo to fallback on if x,y,x, package is not maintained in the puppy repo.

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#27 Post by big_bass »

saintless
Is really the name Pussy linux holding back the help of puppy developers?
SouthPaws wrote:
I wonder what would've happened if Pussy was just renamed... Shocked
ttuuxxx
I didn't get involved with your release well because I didn't like the name.
I had posted this but you ignored it to your own hurt
maybe you thought I wasn't trying to help you ? I was though .
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 9&start=26

I am being honest and frank with you
should I comment that the name you chose has a different meaning in
the USA and Canada if you are completely unaware
of the negative use of this term
ask someone else you would believe to PM you with more info I wont explain here
out of respect to others I wouldn't want to offend

I did try to warn you politely
but I guess you took it the wrong way

have you seen this I havent tried it but there may be some good ideas there
that could be used
http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=semplice

Joe

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saintless
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#28 Post by saintless »

big_bass wrote:I had posted this but you ignored it to your own hurt
maybe you thought I wasn't trying to help you ? I was though .
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 9&start=26
I wrote there was a discussion, Big_bass. It includes your opinion and also many others.
I don't see anything about helping Sickgut in the link you gave.
Just interesting project and poor choice of name I read there.

You find the project interesting and you don't like the name Pussy linux is one thing.
You didn't get involved with Pussy linux because you didn't like the name is something else.


And if you read more than 60 pages back in two threads about Pussy linux, you will not find the words you and Ttuuxxx wrote here.

Don't get me wrong, Big_bass. I respect you too much. Also Ttuuxxx and all linux developers. Your TXZ_Pup is on my computer since I found it.

I don't mind different name for Pussy linux. For me the name does not matter at all. I like the OS it self, not the name.

If Sickgut wants to change the name I will support his decision.

I just don't think it will make any difference even if he name it Puppy-cat linux. But maybe I'm wrong... It's only my opinion.

Best regards!

Toni


Edit:

big_bass wrote: have you seen this I havent tried it but there may be some good ideas there
that could be used
http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=semplice

Joe
Thanks for this link.

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RSH
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#29 Post by RSH »

BIG_BASS wrote:saintless
Quote:
Is really the name Pussy linux holding back the help of puppy developers?


Quote:
SouthPaws wrote:
I wonder what would've happened if Pussy was just renamed... Shocked


Quote:

ttuuxxx
I didn't get involved with your release well because I didn't like the name.


I had posted this but you ignored it to your own hurt
maybe you thought I wasn't trying to help you ? I was though .
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 9&start=26

I am being honest and frank with you
should I comment that the name you chose has a different meaning in
the USA and Canada if you are completely unaware
of the negative use of this term
ask someone else you would believe to PM you with more info I wont explain here
out of respect to others I wouldn't want to offend

I did try to warn you politely
but I guess you took it the wrong way

have you seen this I havent tried it but there may be some good ideas there
that could be used
http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=semplice

Joe
_________________

I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=57484
So, as i have read this, i have realized, there are other places on earth where "pussy" doesn't mean "kitten" but - you already know what...

Let me tell you a funny story from germany.

If we in germany do hear "pussy" we associate "muschi", wich means "pussy" as well.

Two or three Federal elections ago we have had a duel in tv between the candidates "Gerhard Schröder" and "Edmund Stoiber". At the end of this duel they were asked about their wife's lovely-named (nicknamed).

I am sure 99% of german people can not remember of what "Gerhard Schröder" has answered, but all do know, what "Edmund Stoiber" had said.

Attention, please,
Attention, please,
Attention, please:

He said: "MUSCHI"

And an entire nation doubled over with laughter when watching TV! :D :D :D

Can you imagine who has been the German Chancellor, after that?

I mean, it's a f.. double moral world out there. We should fight against this fdmw, i stand for that - but to shock people -intentionally or unintentionally- only should be and remain artistic expression of artists.

So, something to think:

Isn't puppy (no matter what distro or derivative) an artwork?

Aren't we all Artists?

A long time ago a famous german person (forgot the name, sorry) has had answered, asked about his work and getting his ideas: "Eigentlich bin ich nur ein kreativer Dieb." - which means: "I take it from everywhere and all, i am a creative 'thief'".

Aren't we all... ?

Greetings from Germany to all and everyone in the world

RSH

Do you want to use your brain? Puppy Linux!
[b][url=http://lazy-puppy.weebly.com]LazY Puppy[/url][/b]
[b][url=http://rshs-dna.weebly.com]RSH's DNA[/url][/b]
[url=http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=91422][b]SARA B.[/b][/url]

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#30 Post by jpeps »

saintless wrote:
I just don't think it will make any difference even if he name it Puppy-cat linux. But maybe I'm wrong... It's only my opinion.
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saintless....ask any elementary school kid if a name matters.

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saintless
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#31 Post by saintless »

Google search for Pussy linux:

[quote] 1. Puppy Linux Discussion Forum :: View topic - Pussy: potentially a Puppy with a perfect package manager - murga-linux.com
www.murga-linux.com/.../v... - Кеширана вер
Last edited by saintless on Sun 15 Jan 2012, 11:59, edited 2 times in total.

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Flash
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#32 Post by Flash »

I assumed the name was chosen to attract attention. So far, it hasn't attracted the wrong kind of attention to this forum. If it does, let me know and I'll deal with it.

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sickgut
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#33 Post by sickgut »

Flash wrote:I assumed the name was chosen to attract attention. So far, it hasn't attracted the wrong kind of attention to this forum. If it does, let me know and I'll deal with it.
and how will you deal with it? why dont you just do it now? i intend to attract whatever attention i see fit from the name of the linux distro that i founded.

Consider this:

What would happen if i called my distro "GayPuppy" or "Satanic Antichrist Witch Linux that harms small animals?"

If people here and you are so concerned about the wrong kind of attention, i may just make things difficult for you. If you googled GayPuppy or the other long named suggestion you will see alot more offensive material than if you google Pussy Linux. Gay porn is still porn. Even if due to political correctness gone wild and the emphasis on gay rights means that gay porn is more tolerated than heterosexual porn, its still porn.

What would happen if i did change my distro name to "GayPup"?
I would make such a fuss about it that the distro would probably be banned from here but I would have a defense, because if the distro was banned i could play the discrimination card. I would make a noise so loud about the forum not liking GayPup or the word Gay that it would definately attract the wrong attention.

What if i changed the name to: "Satanic Antichrist Witch Linux that harms small animals?"
Its the same scenario. Yes it would attract attention to the forum, and you would have to live with it because, if it was banned from here then I would play the discrimination against my free choice of religion so loud that it would attract the wrong kind of attention to the forum.

The point im trying to make is that i dont care about your political correctness and how it shuns the name of my distro. But if you make it an issue then i will too because hey.... im 100% behind my distro and im committed and ill do whatever is best for my distro and creating a scene like that in an over defensive move would actually generate more interest in the distro. Either way its win win for Pussy or GayPup or Witch Linux or whatever.

The name Pussy isnt hurting anything so dont pretend it is or will.

*i have nothing against gays, infact if i was to name my distro GayPup, this would be a pro gay move. I have nothing against witches and if i named my distro Witch Linux this is a pro witch move. So please dont make out that im against either groups.

Political correctness goes both ways. Its fashionable for political correctness to favor minority groups that have previously not been tolerated well. Dont make me whip out Hitler Linux just for the fun of it. Please do not flame my political views, political correctness demands that im tolerated and treated with respect no matter what personal choices i make.

See how annoying it is when someone plays the political correctness.... lets try not to offend anybody.... mentality?

im annoyed because i called the distro Pussy because its similar to the other 4 legged animal Puppy. The wallpaper has picture of a cat. Everything is labeled as Meow and other cat related words. How is this related to anything else? Its people who are on the political correctness bandwagon shouting that Pussy can mean other things that are offensive in other countries so ill have nothing to do with it unless you change the name.

Its fantastic how people will choose to support a distro not because of technical features or how it works but because of the name. Hey here is an idea, how about you rename the /etc dir of Puppy to "super cute anime baby dog" and replace all the files listed in whatever file manager you use with brightly coloured icons instead and call the OS Nice Cuter Slick Puppy Android if the name is so important. Im sorry but i cannot even relate to the argument of i dont like the name so i wont look at your OS. The closest i can identify with that in my mind is something like:

"Ill never use the linux command 'grep' because i dont like the name, i prefer to hobble along with 'find'"

Why is there a file in /bin called cat? Maybe you should rename it to Puppy, and your OS will get more popular?

the Pussy name was only supposed to be temporary as I intended to make Pussy into a Puppy, and so it would eventually be called Puppy. or the basic idea would be adopted by puppy devs and the Pussy OS would die after giving birth to a new superior race of dogs. Pussy has gotten so Popular that its here to stay and i really dont care if anyone here likes the name or not. Infact i dont want my OS in the hands of developers who believe the name is more important than the OS itself. I think this is how things like MS Windows get so messed up or Ubuntu turns from something really good to useless.

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#34 Post by jpeps »

....oh well...time to move on.

gcmartin

The NAME is simply an label for product offering

#35 Post by gcmartin »

Somehow, many (mostly Christians and others) feel that a word or a reference is intolerable. Thus should be destroyed. (This comment is NOT a religious attack for I am Christian. I am expressing an idea.)

I don't think the majority of this community, being of worldly backgrounds, "care" about the the label that the distro owner is using. Speaking for myself ONLY, I been moved/swayed/affected/misguided/raped/cheated or any of that by the product (or its label, for that fact.

It, to me, is simple; another of the list of Linux offerings that seemingly has used a RAM basis for putting things on a desktop for user use.

Maybe most of us could stop and simple accept the product, while understanding that the product is much more important in what it advances than its label.

This is just a simple viewpoint from a simple mind to the "simply users". I favor no one and offer this as a middle ground view.

We're all (I think) interested n the advancement of Puppy Linux (why else are we here). And many that do come here bring ideas and have asked questions that have inspired all of us. We need all the fresh inspirational efforts we can muster to advance Puppy. It is maturing and its happening rather rapidly. How many have notice the size of the PCs that our community is using now? The developers, this year, are going to take advantage of that for useful purposes as this RAM based OS continues its trek. Inspiration for the advancement of Puppy Linux in the "Puppy Linux Discussion Forum'! We need it all coming from anyone and everyone.

Let's not let a label, any label, stop our inspirational juices from breeding in this Puppyland. Further, I sure, if a forum discussion need be opened on the topic of "allowed words", hopefully,
  1. it can be done and manage in such a way that it doesn't disturb those already Grandfathered (i.e. Pussy, Slacko, Puppy, Fatdog, LightHouse, etc)
  2. while managing some "allowed" list of names for the future....if necessary.
Should this approach be undertaken we should insure that it doesn't take on the disruptive arguments we have seen in the America....Hopefully.

Hope this helps

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#36 Post by MinHundHettePerro »

.
Last edited by MinHundHettePerro on Sat 14 Jan 2012, 10:47, edited 1 time in total.
[color=green]Celeron 2.8 GHz, 1 GB, i82845, many ptns, modes 12, 13
Dual Xeon 3.2 GHz, 1 GB, nvidia quadro nvs 285[/color]
Slackos & 214X, ... and Q6xx
[color=darkred]Nämen, vaf....[/color] [color=green]ln -s /dev/null MHHP[/color]

jpeps
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#37 Post by jpeps »

Google search "mouse"

Code: Select all

Modest Mouse
www.modestmousemusic.com/
Official site at Epic Records includes news, sound files, biography, and tour dates.
Mouse (computing) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

n.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mouse_(computing)
In computing, a mouse is a pointing device that functions by detecting two-dimensional motion relative to its supporting surface. Physically, a mouse consists of ...
Naming - Early mice - Variants - Connectivity and communication ...
Mouse - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mouse
A mouse (plural: mice) is a small mammal belonging to the order of rodents. The best known mouse species is the common house mouse (Mus musculus). ...
House mouse - Mouse (computing) - Mousetrap - Genetically modified mouse
Shopping results for mouse
Apple Magic Mouse - Mouse - Wireless - Bluetooth
364
$55
er...MinHundHettePerro, notice any difference?

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MinHundHettePerro
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#38 Post by MinHundHettePerro »

.
Last edited by MinHundHettePerro on Sat 14 Jan 2012, 10:48, edited 1 time in total.
[color=green]Celeron 2.8 GHz, 1 GB, i82845, many ptns, modes 12, 13
Dual Xeon 3.2 GHz, 1 GB, nvidia quadro nvs 285[/color]
Slackos & 214X, ... and Q6xx
[color=darkred]Nämen, vaf....[/color] [color=green]ln -s /dev/null MHHP[/color]

jpeps
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#39 Post by jpeps »

MinHundHettePerro wrote:
As I said: In my country, and my language, ...

You'd have to translate mouse into Swedish and then go searching the net (preferably not googling, ey) - or I could, of course, delete any attempt at trying to tell anecdotes altogether ...............
MinHundHettePerro, I think you've nailed it. How about "fitta linux" ?

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Amgine
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#40 Post by Amgine »

sickgut wrote:
Flash wrote:I assumed the name was chosen to attract attention. So far, it hasn't attracted the wrong kind of attention to this forum. If it does, let me know and I'll deal with it.
and how will you deal with it? why dont you just do it now? i intend to attract whatever attention i see fit from the name of the linux distro that i founded.
:shock: Wow the first thing I thought of was a Cat!

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