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 Forum index » House Training » Beginners Help ( Start Here)
Re-mastering puppy for Boinc grid computing
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Guest
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PostPosted: Tue 12 Jul 2005, 05:38    Post_subject:  Re-mastering puppy for Boinc grid computing  

I've been testdriveing puppy for a month now with great success. I like it and I think it has what I've been looking for in a live-CD for some time now.
I'm trying to make a Live CD to run Boinc (grid computing) from a cd w/o a HD. Being able to run from other medium is also an added plus for us, but for now I'm centering on the CD version.
I have DLed Puppy Linux and installed Boinc and let it run without a problem. I have also created some scripts to complement Boinc and added a different background and bookmarks within Mozilla( I've only tried the Mozilla version so far) that would be of benefit to Boinc users. I've also created desktop icon/shortcuts for non linux users of Boinc.
I would like to retain all of these changes in a remastered copy of Puppy, that I can share with others in the Boinc community.
I ran through the Puppy-Unleashed tutorial useing the defaults(Enter, Enter, Enter etc..) and ended up with a copy of puppy that wouldn't run X. I did get a command line and an error prior to that stateing the user_cram was none existant or couldn't be set up. I also got a lot of errors in the remastering part .
All of my screen captures where lost( my original puppy quit working after remastering). It appears to be a coincidence that it is now overfilled.. I'll try it again tomorrow nite and save them for you useing a fresh copy of puppy.

I'm not new to Linux but I'm not a god either. I have remastered various versions of Knoppix but Knoppix doesn't fill the bill that we at Boinc need. Nor does Morphix( another Knoppix variant). Being able to save data is important to us and most Knoppix versions are fat ...very fat. being able to run from an uncompressed image in RAM is much faster and very important to us( Members compete against each other for the # of work units crunched by our computers). We need a lean OS for speed to crunch scientific data. Of all the Live-CDs that I've tried over the years I think Puppy fits the bill better than any other. That's why I've come to you now.
I have run Boinc on Puppy Linux from CD for one month now with the same results as running Boinc on Mandrake 10.0 official on a HD on the same system.

The problem that I have now is in the re-mastering. I still need to remaster a default copy and get it to work. Then make changes before converting to ISO.

You guys have 2 different forums and many threads within. which forum/thread would you recommend I post this in?
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Lobster
Official Crustacean


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 15117
Location: Paradox Realm

PostPosted: Tue 12 Jul 2005, 07:06    Post_subject: Puppy on a supercomputer (do try this at home)  

Very interesting.
I have a feeling Flash will move this to cutting edge. I would certainly be interested in a Puppy grid for ASQ before we move to cell processors (available by the end of the year) and then quantum processors (10 years or less)

Another possibility is if you document how Boinc is available under Puppy it can be dotpupped - then we can also concentrate on getting a micro pup environment for Boinc

I would suggest that even the bare bones Puppy is still too big and wonder if Boinc will run on a command line Puppy? That just may not be what you require though . . .

I am not sure how Puppy Sourcer and unleashed will be improved but I am sure they wil be in 1.0.4. This will be available on or before 21 July 2005

What I suggest is you write private messages to some of our top Pups such as Bladehunter and John Murga who have created remastered Pups.

Also if others are working on Pups perhaps they can advise you too. Advice in public is a good idea . . .

Good luck

Smile

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BarryK
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Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 7047
Location: Perth, Western Australia

PostPosted: Tue 12 Jul 2005, 07:52    Post_subject:  

Adding extra packages in your Unleashed build may have made image.gz too big -- but you would have got an error message during the build process, that is, when running the createpuppy script.

image.gz has the initial ramdisk, which is all of /bin, /sbin, /lib, /var, etc., except for /usr.

For Pup 1.0.4 I have eased this situation by making the default ramdisk size of the kernel 12M, up from 11M.

But, if you did not get any error message during the building process, then I don't know what your problem is.

When you state that you just presssed ENTER to all questions, were you doing so with a pristine Unleashed, without your own additional packages?
-- if so, it should have worked.
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Flash
Official Dog Handler


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 11082
Location: Arizona USA

PostPosted: Tue 12 Jul 2005, 09:38    Post_subject: Re: Puppy on a supercomputer (do try this at home)  

Lobster wrote:
Very interesting.
I have a feeling Flash will move this to cutting edge.
OK, if you think that's where it belongs I'll leave it here for a day or two, then move it. Thanks for the suggestion. It's not always clear to me where a subject belongs.

Quote:
What I suggest is you write Private Messages to some of our top Pups such as Bladehunter and John Murga who have created remastered Pups.
If you do PM, please keep the rest of us posted. We're interested in your progress too.

Quote:
Also if others are working on Pups perhaps they can advise you too. Advice in public is a good idea . . .
Indeed, it's the reason for this forum.
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GuestToo
Puppy Master

Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 4078

PostPosted: Tue 12 Jul 2005, 15:26    Post_subject:  

i tried Unleashed 1.0.3 with just the default packages, downloaded straight from ibiblio, and it would not work because there was too much stuff in image.gz

this is probably an Unleashed bug

i think it was because the bash package was putting bash in /bin, but the Puppy 1.0.3 iso has bash in /usr/bin

i changed the bash package so that bash is put in /usr/bin, with a symlink in /bin, like the Puppy iso, and it worked ok

so Unleashed 1.0.3 will NOT create an iso from the defaults, unless Unleashed has been modified since i tried it
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GuestToo
Puppy Master

Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 4078

PostPosted: Tue 12 Jul 2005, 15:56    Post_subject:  

probably you should get a default Unleashed Puppy to work first ... fixing the bash package may be the problem

then you can decide what to do about the boinc package

it looks like it runs all in one self-contained dir ... which is also the working dir, so it needs to be writable and to be able to save data between boots

if you put the boinc dir in usr_cram.fs, it should be in /usr somewhere and automatically writable because of unionfs ... it sounds like it should be easy to get it to work
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terrorhertz

Joined: 19 Jun 2005
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Thu 14 Jul 2005, 04:10    Post_subject:  

My originall post listed me as Guest I must not have been logged in. But anyways My name is Terrorhertz and thanx for all the help.

>Adding extra packages in your Unleashed build may have made image.gz too big -- but >you would have got an error message during the build process, that is, when running >the createpuppy script.

>image.gz has the initial ramdisk, which is all of /bin, /sbin, /lib, /var, etc., except for /usr.


I remastered with the default unleashed puppy 1.0.3. I didn't add anything. just as the tutorial said. I wanted to see if it worked for me before i began makeing it worse on myself by adding things.

I did get an error that there wasn't enough room in image.gz(11.6 mb I think was the limit) and I got a list of packages that it couldn't add because of it. It then exited the script when I tried to copy and paste the errors for you guys. so I restarted from a formated partition and did it again. this time I still got the errors but it still made an ISO for me. I burned it to CD useing the setting from your site for GCombust. I'm more familiar with K3B.
The CD gets several errors and create /usr but it does drop me into a working commandline.

>For Pup 1.0.4 I have eased this situation by making the default ramdisk size of the kernel 12M, up from 11M.

I'll give the 1.0.4 a try then.

>i think it was because the bash package was putting bash in /bin, but the Puppy 1.0.3 i>so has bash in /usr/bin

>i changed the bash package so that bash is put in /usr/bin, with a symlink in /bin, like the >Puppy iso, and it worked ok

>so Unleashed 1.0.3 will NOT create an iso from the defaults, unless Unleashed has >been modified since i tried it
Sounds like that could also be my problem. I'll give that a try too.

>if you put the boinc dir in usr_cram.fs, it should be in /usr somewhere and automatically >writable because of unionfs ... it sounds like it should be easy to get it to work
On my running copy of Puppy I have installed Boinc into the /usr/boinc directory. It works fine there. But I was wondering if that was the best place for it when I go to remaster it... I think I read somewhere on the site that /usr runs from compressed whereas /bin runs uncompressed. Or did I missunderstand what I read? Is /usr just compressed on the disk then uncompressed into RAM dureing bootup?

Another question I have is can Puppy run without a harddrive installed? I noticed that it created pup001 on one of my Mandrake 10 EXT2 partitions.

>I would suggest that even the bare bones Puppy is still too big and wonder if Boinc will >run on a command line Puppy? That just may not be what you require though . . .
Boinc does run on commandline. there is a newr version that has a GUI but the GUI is an addon to the commandline client. Do you already have a commandline puppy? I had planned to make a commandline only disk aswell for those that are familiar with linux commandline for the ultimate efficiency. If you already have a commandline only Puppy that would save me some work later down the road when I get to it..


I'd like to thank everyone for the help. I'm sure I'll need more before it is over.!!!

Here is a link for the Boinc packages available.
http://boinc.berkeley.edu/download.php
I've gotten the 4.19 version to run on Puppy but the 4.43 wouldn't(4.43 has the GUI client)
once I get a default Puppy working , I'll make the Boinc Puppy. Then I'll try to make pup packages of Boinc. There are some other sites that have optimized Boinc for certain CPUs that have their own Boinc packages as well.

to save on cunfusion I havemainly 2 Puppy Linux's. 1 a running copy that I DLed from the site that from now on I'll refer to as my running copy and the failed(so far) copy that I'll call the remastered copy.
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terrorhertz

Joined: 19 Jun 2005
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Sat 16 Jul 2005, 05:56    Post_subject:  

SUCCESS. I got a working remastered Puppy. Thanx to all for the help and a special thanx to Guestoo:


Quote:
i think it was because the bash package was putting bash in /bin, but the Puppy 1.0.3 iso has bash in /usr/bin

i changed the bash package so that bash is put in /usr/bin, with a symlink in /bin, like the Puppy iso, and it worked ok


I copied the bash package from /bin to /usr/bin and then made a sym link to /bin. that lightened up the image file enough to work.
I did however this time have problems with Gcombust burning. so I copied the ISO to my mandrake home partition then burned it w/ K3Band it worked. I don;t use GCombust regulaly so I don't know why it didn't work when it did before.
My next step is to re-master with Boinc on the image.
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Lobster
Official Crustacean


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 15117
Location: Paradox Realm

PostPosted: Sat 16 Jul 2005, 06:26    Post_subject:  

Please let us know when the ISO is ready

Babbs (one of our Pupps) has some web space that may well be suitable for housing your ISO (and other puplets) - you can send a private message from this forum

this is stil being finalised with an official Chubby Puplet 1.0.4

- however it works out let us know and good luck

This link about using the processing power of graphic chips may be of interest
http://gamma.cs.unc.edu/GPUSORT/

Smile

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drj

Joined: 26 Jun 2005
Posts: 41

PostPosted: Sat 16 Jul 2005, 09:38    Post_subject:  

I posted a script to re-master a live-CD from HD installation, on HOW-TO session. it is intended to fit your situation. It is a bigger initial ramdisk (20MB) and should be working out-of-the-box
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