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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Additional Software (PETs, n' stuff) » Package Collections / Repositories
Not much in Lucid Puppy 5's repositories
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drongo


Joined: 10 Dec 2005
Posts: 353
Location: UK

PostPosted: Sun 16 May 2010, 06:32    Post subject:  Not much in Lucid Puppy 5's repositories
Subject description: Where is all the good stuff?
 

Don't know where to put this, Additional Software seems as good as any other place.

I've been playing around with Lupu and reading various forum comments.

I did the upgrade to the repositories, I think WhoDo is right this probably needs to be mentioned in BIG LETTERS somewhere obvious to new users.

When I started poking around in the repositories I was surprised at how few applications were in there. The only time I have done this before is in SuSE and I was always surprised how long it would take for new versions of apps to appear after new SuSE releases. I know that Debian has extensive repositories and I believe Slackware has multiple repositories all over the place but I don't have any practical experience of Ubuntu until today.

Is that all there is? Do I need to add more repositories? Or is it just that Lucid Lynx is so new the repositories have not filled up yet?

May just be finger trouble or brain trouble of course. I looked for Frozen Bubble, VLC and Wireshark - none of these are particularly obscure. Although I guess most people never have a use for Wireshark, it is quite well-known.

Am I looking in the wrong place, too impatient, expecting too much of Ubuntu? (OK, I know they are concentrating on the desktop/office user, but I was expecting access to thousands of applications!)

Edited once for spelling @16:03 GMT 16 May 2010
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drongo


Joined: 10 Dec 2005
Posts: 353
Location: UK

PostPosted: Tue 18 May 2010, 02:25    Post subject:  

Not trying to bump my own thread here but over a hundred people have read it so I assume it is of some interest to others.

I had a quick look around the Lucid Lynx repositories yesterday and there appear to be a lot more applications in there than in the Lupu repos. I can think of at least four reasons for this.

There is a category mismatch between Puppy and Ubuntu so whole groups of apps are missed.

A lot of the Ubuntu stuff refers to Gnome, so is not relevant to a lighter windowing environment.

A lot of Ubuntu stuff seems to be low-level apps that may not be relevant for a whole heap of reasons I don't comprehend.

We only point to two Ubuntu repos by default. I have seen some posts on Ubuntu forums about not mixing repos. Why is this? The Universe repository seems to be the largest. Can any Ubuntu users explain the difference between Multiverse and Universe (and any other repo)? What are they used for, what do they contain? Can they be used at the same time? Are any not relevant to Puppy?

What am I missing here? On the rare occasion when I have dipped a toe into Debian/Slackware/SuSE repos there is tons of stuff. This doesn't seem to be the case with Lucid lynx and even less so with our cut-down view of Lucid's repos.

I think I'm looking for a "Puppy-user's guide to the Ubuntu repos". I'm pretty sure that typing that into Google won't yield anything useful or relevant.

Oh, by the way, Frozen Bubble is definitely in there. (Yes, I know it has huge Python or Perl dependencies or something - but is Puppy clever enough to weed out apps with huge dependencies?) I still haven't found Wireshark or VLC.
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abushcrafter


Joined: 30 Oct 2009
Posts: 1447
Location: England

PostPosted: Tue 18 May 2010, 06:29    Post subject:  

There ant any more proer repos the is only forums and the odd servers that host packages.
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/index.php?f=11
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drongo


Joined: 10 Dec 2005
Posts: 353
Location: UK

PostPosted: Tue 18 May 2010, 06:44    Post subject:  

Hi abushcrafter,

I know about Puppy's "work in progress" repositories and am quite happy with the way that works.

I thought the whole point of using Woof to build Debian/Ubuntu/Slackware/whatever was that we would be able to use other distro's repositories. A major structural problem with Puppy is that a few dedicated people have to recompile all the apps every time there is a new kernel version or other major change. Many reviews of Puppy mention the relative lack of apps.

But when I looked there the cupboard was bare! Almost.
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abushcrafter


Joined: 30 Oct 2009
Posts: 1447
Location: England

PostPosted: Tue 18 May 2010, 07:05    Post subject:  

drongo wrote:
I know about Puppy's "work in progress" repositories and am quite happy with the way that works.
My bad.

drongo wrote:
I thought the whole point of using Woof to build Debian/Ubuntu/Slackware/whatever was that we would be able to use other distro's repositories.
Yes that is a reason. However it is some way off to we have things like apt-get from distos that use that package system.

drongo wrote:
A major structural problem with Puppy is that a few dedicated people have to recompile all the apps every time there is a new kernel version or other major change.

That is true...
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James C


Joined: 26 Mar 2009
Posts: 5723
Location: Kentucky

PostPosted: Tue 18 May 2010, 21:17    Post subject:  

There are plenty of packages in the Lucid Puppy repositories......if you enable all 3 Ubuntu repositories, "main","multiverse" and "universe", and update the databases. Smile

HTH.
wireshark.png
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wireshark.png

vlc.png
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vlc.png

frozen bubble.png
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frozen bubble.png

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drongo


Joined: 10 Dec 2005
Posts: 353
Location: UK

PostPosted: Wed 19 May 2010, 01:54    Post subject:  

Thanks James C,

I did update the repositories but I obviously didn't add "universe". When I looked for information on the web for Ubuntu repositories I didn't see any posts saying "enable universe because that's where all the apps are". All I found were warnings about not mixing repositories. What does this mean? Do they mean don't mix repositories from different versions of Ubuntu? Or don't mix "multiverse" with "universe"?

I also haven't found an explanation for the terms main, multiverse and universe. I assume this has something to do with GPL code, code with restrictions, code which includes mediaplayers and other US/EU restricted apps?

I don't wish to be added to the list of moaning minnies complaining about Lupu because I actually think it's a great step forward for Puppy and is pretty polished for a first attempt. However, if all the good stuff is in "universe" I can't help wondering why it's not in there as a default repository. Is this to do with US/EU regulations?

Most Puppy variants include CD/DVD rippers so the distro may be on shaky ground anyway. (Although zigbert is in Norway where EU and US laws don't apply - so he's OK.)

Thanks again. Now I can work on my secret project - big, fat, bloated, slow as molasses Pup. Unlike anything seen before.
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zigbert


Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 5697
Location: Valåmoen, Norway

PostPosted: Wed 19 May 2010, 02:38    Post subject:  

Quote:
(Although zigbert is in Norway where EU and US laws don't apply - so he's OK.)
Laughing Laughing Laughing - Let's hope so
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Lobster
Official Crustacean


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 15117
Location: Paradox Realm

PostPosted: Wed 19 May 2010, 02:59    Post subject:  



Quickpet will add more software as it is compiled and updated.

We have a high degree of Ubuntu compatibility - but major programs still need to be tweaked for Puppy. This will now be easier because our kindly compilers will have an up-to-date
base . . .

So more ready made stuff will be available faster.
OpenOffice SFS and other SFS already work - so that is another route

The situation is not ideal but it is a potential improvement
and that potential will be made use of. Cool

Expect more compatibility and programs as Barry improves Woof
and more developers arrive and say things like:
'How do we develop stuff' (they use programming geek talk of course)

Also keep an eye out for when to press the Lucid Update button
which will offer more programs and patches etc

Remember just creating compatibility with Ubuntu or Slack or Debian
or making Puppy 64 bit got easier
but is still challenging (smart developers always required)

Puppy Lucid is a wonderful achievement Cool
http://puppylinux.org/wikka/LucidScreenshots

Puppy Runs

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mdev

Joined: 17 May 2010
Posts: 19
Location: Berlin

PostPosted: Wed 19 May 2010, 03:17    Post subject:  

Hi, here I can help a bit...

drongo wrote:
All I found were warnings about not mixing repositories. What does this mean? Do they mean don't mix repositories from different versions of Ubuntu? Or don't mix "multiverse" with "universe"?


It definitely means: don't mix repos from different Ubuntu or Debian versions. Of couse you can use both multiverse and universe.

drongo wrote:

I also haven't found an explanation for the terms main, multiverse and universe. I assume this has something to do with GPL code, code with restrictions, code which includes mediaplayers and other US/EU restricted apps?


Here is more info: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Repositories/Ubuntu

  • Main - Officially supported software.
  • Restricted - Supported software that is not available under a completely free license.
  • Universe - Community maintained software, i.e. not officially supported software.
  • Multiverse - Software that is not free.


drongo wrote:

Thanks again. Now I can work on my secret project - big, fat, bloated, slow as molasses Pup. Unlike anything seen before.


Yes, using the Ubuntu repos is a good way to get there Laughing
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drongo


Joined: 10 Dec 2005
Posts: 353
Location: UK

PostPosted: Wed 19 May 2010, 04:47    Post subject:  

Thanks mdev,

Where have you been lurking? Welcome to the kennels. See anything you like?
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mdev

Joined: 17 May 2010
Posts: 19
Location: Berlin

PostPosted: Thu 20 May 2010, 13:09    Post subject:  

Thanks for the welcome! I've been using Puppies as rescue systems for many years and now I'm trying to assemble one for productive use.

It is a wonderful achievement to have the Ubuntu repos in Lucid Puppy -- but after playing with it for some time it seems to me to be more of a proof of concept at the moment, many packages don't work and/or throw in dubious (e.g. debian-specific) dependencies. Still it is impressive that this blending of distributions is starting to work ...
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wilvi

Joined: 27 Sep 2008
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Thu 04 Oct 2012, 20:31    Post subject:  

I see that the problem with Ubuntu repos is still here in puppy 528. I mean: it's a bit frustrating to have great Ubuntu repos, but having the problem that
they are not usefull at all. Y tryed to install 3 programas without luck. It seems dependencies are installed and all ends o.k., but programs doesn't work. Maybe it could be better to not have Ubuntu's repos as an option, because they give Puppy an unstable,unpolished image. It's only an idea...
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sunburnt


Joined: 08 Jun 2005
Posts: 5016
Location: Arizona, U.S.A.

PostPosted: Sat 06 Oct 2012, 02:38    Post subject:  

I agree with dorongo that there`s not much in the way of apps.

I also agree with Lobster that the situation has improved, and it will show soon.

The trick is getting knowledgeable folks to compile more apps.
I`m a big fan of SFS files, I`d hope most apps. are made in both package types.
And SFS files of groups of like apps.: media, web, development, etc.

I`ve also suggested an add-on SFS of libraries, probably mostly media.
This would reduce the app. package sizes, media being the most popular.
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