Built-in microphone not working

Using applications, configuring, problems
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jojonouvo
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon 10 Mar 2008, 14:57

#21 Post by jojonouvo »

Ok, I have also booted from a live ubuntu Mint distro and got exactly the same behavior. No sound in the mic and same alsa mixer config. What can I do?

npierce
Posts: 858
Joined: Tue 29 Dec 2009, 01:40

#22 Post by npierce »

For some sound cards, alsamixer displays only the microphone capture switch in the Capture view, but displays the microphone gain control (and sometimes a microphone boost control) in the Playback view. For instance:
Image
Image
(Source: http://www.alsa-project.org/main/index. ... ardTesting)

That doesn't seem like a logical place for the microphone gain control, but that's how it is sometimes. So it might be useful to take another look at the Playback view. Remember that if you see little > symbols in the right margin of an alsamixer view (as in the above images), there are more controls off to the right, and you need to use your right arrow key to bring them into the view.

If you don't find the mic gain there, let's see just what controls you do have by running this command:

Code: Select all

amixer | gzip > amixer_out.gz
then attaching amixer_out.gz to your next post.

jojonouvo
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon 10 Mar 2008, 14:57

#23 Post by jojonouvo »

Npierce, what you described is the case for me but the mic level is already high and the mic boost is on .

This is the result of amixer:

Code: Select all

Simple mixer control 'Master',0
  Capabilities: pvolume pswitch pswitch-joined penum
  Playback channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Limits: Playback 0 - 31
  Mono:
  Front Left: Playback 23 [74%] [-12.00dB] [on]
  Front Right: Playback 23 [74%] [-12.00dB] [on]
Simple mixer control 'PCM',0
  Capabilities: pvolume pswitch pswitch-joined penum
  Playback channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Limits: Playback 0 - 31
  Mono:
  Front Left: Playback 24 [77%] [1.50dB] [on]
  Front Right: Playback 24 [77%] [1.50dB] [on]
Simple mixer control 'Surround',0
  Capabilities: pvolume pswitch penum
  Playback channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Limits: Playback 0 - 31
  Mono:
  Front Left: Playback 21 [68%] [-15.00dB] [on]
  Front Right: Playback 21 [68%] [-15.00dB] [on]
Simple mixer control 'Center',0
  Capabilities: pvolume pvolume-joined pswitch pswitch-joined penum
  Playback channels: Mono
  Limits: Playback 0 - 31
  Mono: Playback 31 [100%] [0.00dB] [off]
Simple mixer control 'LFE',0
  Capabilities: pvolume pvolume-joined pswitch pswitch-joined penum
  Playback channels: Mono
  Limits: Playback 0 - 31
  Mono: Playback 16 [52%] [-22.50dB] [on]
Simple mixer control 'Line',0
  Capabilities: pvolume pswitch pswitch-joined cswitch cswitch-exclusive penum
  Capture exclusive group: 0
  Playback channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Capture channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Limits: Playback 0 - 31
  Front Left: Playback 14 [45%] [-13.50dB] [on] Capture [off]
  Front Right: Playback 14 [45%] [-13.50dB] [on] Capture [off]
Simple mixer control 'CD',0
  Capabilities: pvolume pswitch pswitch-joined cswitch cswitch-exclusive penum
  Capture exclusive group: 0
  Playback channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Capture channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Limits: Playback 0 - 31
  Front Left: Playback 22 [71%] [-1.50dB] [on] Capture [off]
  Front Right: Playback 22 [71%] [-1.50dB] [on] Capture [off]
Simple mixer control 'Mic',0
  Capabilities: pvolume pvolume-joined pswitch pswitch-joined cswitch cswitch-exclusive penum
  Capture exclusive group: 0
  Playback channels: Mono
  Capture channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Limits: Playback 0 - 31
  Mono: Playback 31 [100%] [12.00dB] [on]
  Front Left: Capture [on]
  Front Right: Capture [on]
Simple mixer control 'Mic Boost (+20dB)',0
  Capabilities: pswitch pswitch-joined penum
  Playback channels: Mono
  Mono: Playback [on]
Simple mixer control 'Video',0
  Capabilities: cswitch cswitch-exclusive penum
  Capture exclusive group: 0
  Capture channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Front Left: Capture [off]
  Front Right: Capture [off]
Simple mixer control 'Phone',0
  Capabilities: cswitch cswitch-exclusive penum
  Capture exclusive group: 0
  Capture channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Front Left: Capture [off]
  Front Right: Capture [off]
Simple mixer control 'IEC958',0
  Capabilities: pswitch pswitch-joined penum
  Playback channels: Mono
  Mono: Playback [on]
Simple mixer control 'IEC958 Playback AC97-SPSA',0
  Capabilities: volume volume-joined penum
  Playback channels: Mono
  Capture channels: Mono
  Limits: 0 - 3
  Mono: 3 [100%]
Simple mixer control 'Beep',0
  Capabilities: pvolume pvolume-joined pswitch pswitch-joined penum
  Playback channels: Mono
  Limits: Playback 0 - 15
  Mono: Playback 0 [0%] [-45.00dB] [off]
Simple mixer control 'Aux',0
  Capabilities: cswitch cswitch-exclusive penum
  Capture exclusive group: 0
  Capture channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Front Left: Capture [off]
  Front Right: Capture [off]
Simple mixer control 'Capture',0
  Capabilities: cvolume cswitch cswitch-joined penum
  Capture channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Limits: Capture 0 - 15
  Front Left: Capture 15 [100%] [22.50dB] [on]
  Front Right: Capture 15 [100%] [22.50dB] [on]
Simple mixer control 'Mix',0
  Capabilities: cswitch cswitch-exclusive penum
  Capture exclusive group: 0
  Capture channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Front Left: Capture [off]
  Front Right: Capture [off]
Simple mixer control 'Mix Mono',0
  Capabilities: cswitch cswitch-exclusive penum
  Capture exclusive group: 0
  Capture channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Front Left: Capture [off]
  Front Right: Capture [off]
Simple mixer control 'External Amplifier',0
  Capabilities: pswitch pswitch-joined penum
  Playback channels: Mono
  Mono: Playback [on]

jojonouvo
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon 10 Mar 2008, 14:57

#24 Post by jojonouvo »

Oh maybe this is interesting, the previous owner of this benq laptop told me that when he got it with windows XP he still had to install some drivers to have the sound working..
I don't know how it works with puppy though, can you use drivers that i guess are created for winXP?

npierce
Posts: 858
Joined: Tue 29 Dec 2009, 01:40

#25 Post by npierce »

jojonouvo wrote:This is the result of amixer: . . .
I don't see anything unusual in your text output from amixer. There seem to be no controls related to the microphone input or capture that you didn't already see in alsamixer, and the controls seem to all be set appropriately. So no clues there.


I found an alsa-info.sh report on your make and model (although "S53", not "S53W"): alsa-info: BenQ Joybook S53 But I found no clues there either.


Looking around the Web, I see that you are certainly not alone with this problem. You've probably already found many posts from people with the same sound chip and even the same make and model of PC as you. (A sampling: tough problem with microphone, Joybook s53 microphone doesn't work . . .) No one ever finds a solution.

The latter of the above-mentioned posts mentions a certain symptom: changing the Surround slider also changes the Mic slider. Does this happen for you? If so, it would show beyond doubt that this problem was certainly a bug, and not a configuration problem.

jojonouvo wrote:. . . can you use drivers that i guess are created for winXP?
Although its fairly common to use network drivers designed for Windows with Linux, I am not aware of anyone doing something similar with sound drivers. Of course, anything is possible, but I suspect that it would be a very long road.

jojonouvo wrote:Or what if I use a different version of alsa? Or something else (jack, oss)?
I don't believe that JACK will talk to the hardware. As far as I know it only talks to OSS, or ALSA (or FFADO for FireWire hardware).

OSS is a possibility, but I'm not sure where you would look for a binary compatible with your kernel.

Although you can get the source code (OSS source download site)and compile it yourself, be aware that a prebuilt binary of OSS from 4Front Technologies is commercial software, with a commercial license. If you want to use it for more than one year, or if you want any support from them, you need to send 4Front Technologies 30 USD. Also, they don't list the 3.x.x Linux kernels. Perhaps their build for 2.6 Linux kernels would work, but wouldn't they want to make that clear on their web site if that is the case?

As for a different version of ALSA, that too is a possibility, but I wouldn't hold my breath. If there is an ALSA bug, it is probably in the driver, and the ALSA drivers are part of the kernel. So a newer kernel is more likely to help than an newer ALSA package.

Taking a quick look at the kernel history for the snd-intel8x0 and snd-hda-intel drivers, I didn't see any recent fixes that seemed to apply to your case.

I did see this: ALSA: hda - Fix auto-mic detection in Conexant codec-parser, but that was way back on 2011-May-23. Slacko 5.3.3 includes that fix, since its kernel is 3.1.10 (2012-Jan-18 ), so you've already tried that (assuming that the Slacko you tried was Slacko 5.3.3 or newer -- you just said that you "booted from a slacko", so if it was an older one, you should try 5.3.3).

jojonouvo wrote:Ok, I have also booted from a live ubuntu Mint distro. . .
What version of Mint? This makes it clear that this is not just a Puppy problem, but doesn't give us a clue about what ALSA or kernel versions were used. If it was Mint 12, it used the same ALSA version as Slacko 5.3.3 and an older kernel, so there would be no surprise that it failed. But if it was Mint 13, it has the newer ALSA 1.0.25, and the newer 3.2 kernel.


I did see this change, which is also an old one (2011-May-13), but verifies that using "model=auto", as recommended by darkcity, is a valid option: ALSA: hda - Add support of auto-parser to cxt5047 / CX20551 Waikiki. Looking at the source code I see that other "model=" options used with the cx20551 are "laptop", "laptop-hp", "laptop-eapd", and, if compiled with CONFIG_SND_DEBUG, "test". That doesn't mean that those options would work on your laptop, only that they work with some PC that also uses your sound chip. One of those models might be similar enough to your model to work with yours, or not. (If you decide to try them, remember to reboot after editing the file.) It is possible that the ALSA developers need to come up with another model option specifically designed for your PC.

It may be time for you to file a bug report with ALSA. But there is a bit of a problem. I've been trying to search ALSA's Bug Tracker for the past couple of days, to see if a similar bug has already been reported, but all I am getting are "Failed to Connect" messages from their server. Perhaps the server will be up again soon. One can only hope. (Does anyone know if that server is permanently dead?)

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greengeek
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Location: Republic of Novo Zelande

#26 Post by greengeek »

jojonuovo: what method are you using to assess whether or not the microphone is working? (are you watching vu meters needles or just listening for the recorded sound during playback?). I ask this because I had a lot of problems with Studio3.3 sound - it seemed to be because of the tight link with Jack. (I recommend you do your testing with Slacko and using mhwaveedit in record mode then if any useful answer is found, go back to try it on Studio 3.3). I had one crazy time where the mic did not seem to work unless I had headphones plugged into the headphone socket.

Also, one time I found that my mic controls were only properly displayed when I tabbed Alsamixer to show both Playback and Capture at the same time (ie: "ALL"). For some reason the individual Playback and Capture displays did not display all the mic controls. (Sorry I can't remember which version of alsa, or which puppy I had that problem with).

I don't have your model of laptop so can't really offer much help unfortunately. I just recommend doing your testing with some other fairly new puppies.

jojonouvo
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon 10 Mar 2008, 14:57

#27 Post by jojonouvo »

npierce, thanks a lot for collecting all the information!
The Slacko i tried was the latest as well as the mint 13.
I changed alsa.conf again but still no changes...

greengeek, I just listen to aplay and arecord to check the sound or with audacity. I checked now with your method with the same result.

Something to notice is that sound input is recognized using my guitar link usb interface, but i guess this is a different domain.

If I want to use the mic for skype, I seem to have 2 ways left:
- plugin a mic into the usb interface and routing the signal to skype through jack, oh but jack cannot see skype i think :(
- or using skype inside wine with the benq driver? I have no idea if you can do that?

Left is a dual boot with win XP, what do you suggest?

npierce
Posts: 858
Joined: Tue 29 Dec 2009, 01:40

#28 Post by npierce »

jojonouvo wrote:Something to notice is that sound input is recognized using my guitar link usb interface . . .
Oh good. I was thinking that it might be quicker to get up and running if you purchased a USB sound card, but I hate to suggest that someone should buy more hardware if they already have working hardware, just because a software issue gets in the way. But if you already have a USB sound input device then you shouldn't need to buy anything.
jojonouvo wrote:plugin a mic into the usb interface and routing the signal to skype through jack, oh but jack cannot see skype i think :(
I've never used JACK or Skype, so can't advise you on that. But I would think that you should be able to go straight to ALSA, without need of JACK.

With the guitar link connected, try this command to list capture devices:

Code: Select all

arecord -l
Along with your built-in sound card, you should also see something like this:

Code: Select all

card 1: default [USB Audio CODEC ], device 0: USB Audio [USB Audio]
If so, you should be able to go into alsamixer, press F6, and select your USB sound card. This will give you a different set of controls in the Playback and Capture screens.

I'm not sure how the output level of a guitar pickup compares to that of a microphone. If they aren't similar, the levels might not be ideal. But other than that, I would think it should work.

npierce
Posts: 858
Joined: Tue 29 Dec 2009, 01:40

#29 Post by npierce »

Should you not be able to get your microphone working with your guitar link (see previous post), and want to continue trying to get your Intel ICH6 / Conexant cx20551 card talking (or even if you did get it working with your guitar link but want to keep up the good ICH6 fight anyway), I have one other idea.

One thing that I've noticed while searching bug reports is that many people report mislabeled controls. That is, the control that should do something does nothing, but the desired result can be achieved by changing some control that should have nothing to do with it. Possibly you have already experimented with this, but if not it might be worth adjusting various controls while using arecord (with -V option) (or while using mhwaveedit, as suggested by greengeek).

(Oh, I hate to give advice like that -- trial and error -- adjust random controls. Ugh. But when it comes to ALSA, sometimes that is the quickest way to a solution. It shouldn't be this messy, but sometimes it is.)

(On an ASUS EeePC 1005 PE notebook, someone had to set the level of one channel of their stereo microphone to zero in order to get acceptable sound levels. (In alsamixer that would be done with the 'z' or 'c' key.) Perhaps the channels were wired out of phase?)

jojonouvo wrote:. . . thanks a lot for collecting all the information!
You're welcome. In case your eyes aren't tired yet :), here is some more - - -

For you, or anyone else who stumbles upon this thread with a similar problem, here is a short bibliography to help with troubleshooting:

First, straight from the horse's mouth: kernel.org documents - - -

Advanced Linux Sound Architecture - Driver: Configuration guide
MORE NOTES ON HD-AUDIO DRIVER by Takashi Iwai
List of models for models parameter (yours are under "Conexant 5047".)


Then from alsa-project.org - - -

SoundcardTesting
Help To Debug Intel HDA


And finally, from the folks at Ubuntu - - -

(These two are somewhat Ubuntu-specific; you will have to translate from the Ubuntu world to the real world.)

This one includes some hints for dealing with silent microphones:
Extra Hints to Get Sound Working

This section, on the same page as the above, deals with choosing and setting parameters (including "model=", which you have already tried):
Manually Specify Module Parameters


One important document missing from this bibliography is the cx20551 datasheet.

Sometimes I have had good luck digging up datasheets on sound chips, but the cx20551 datasheet eludes me. Today I searched again using its alias (former name?): Conexant 5047, but came up empty-handed again. It is hard to guess how everything connects inside your sound chip -- and what control ALSA might be ignoring -- without a nice block diagram to look at.


Anyway, sorry that I am not able to give you more specific advice. Of course, one of the frustrating things about troubleshooting sound problems is that there are so many different sound cards, but I only own three. So I'm limited to suggesting things to try, rather than giving you a tested solution.

jojonouvo
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon 10 Mar 2008, 14:57

#30 Post by jojonouvo »

Whoa, if I can't solve my problem I'm sure the information you're providing will help other people..

I tried changing the model paramater in alsa.conf but still nothing, time to give up...


So then I plugged the usb preamp and the guitar again. With jack on I can just connect input from usb to output from the card and hear the guitar. But without Jack it's silence again. Arecord -l gives this:
Subdevice #0: subdevice #0
card 2: default [USB Audio CODEC ], device 0: USB Audio [USB Audio]
Subdevices: 1/1
I can select the usb preamp in alsamixer but then I have a message saying that "this sound device does not have any capture control"! Another trick another challenge :x

npierce
Posts: 858
Joined: Tue 29 Dec 2009, 01:40

#31 Post by npierce »

jojonouvo wrote:With jack on I can just connect input from usb to output from the card and hear the guitar. But without Jack it's silence again. . . . I can select the usb preamp in alsamixer but then I have a message saying that "this sound device does not have any capture control"!
Oh dear. It seems like nothing is simple with ALSA.

I'm assuming that you can record the guitar via JACK. Have you tried the same with your microphone yet?

Perhaps you will be able to figure out how to get JACK to talk to Skype, or perhaps a JACK or Skype user will pop in here to suggest an idea. I've never used either program.

jojonouvo
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon 10 Mar 2008, 14:57

#32 Post by jojonouvo »

I haven't tried with a mic because the jack plugs don't have the same size but it would work the same for sure.
I'll resolve to get a smartphone.
Thanks again everyone for all the help.

firak
Posts: 175
Joined: Mon 14 Apr 2008, 14:07

#33 Post by firak »

I did not solve myeself a similar problem, whit normal vesion of puppy.
My workaround solution is:
install multy boot puppyes
try different ones
and I foun that puppy_racy_5.3 have the right drivers for my mic controller.
So when i need skipe conversation, i need to reboot.

(skipe for smarphone , is very appropriate for me also)

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