Major advance in Bluray multisession effort.

Discuss anything specific to using Puppy on a multi-session disk
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Flash
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#41 Post by Flash »

Oh no, I just discovered that Verbatim make a 7.5 GB mini BD-RE for $17 (each!) and a mini BD-R for $8.

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Ted Dog
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#42 Post by Ted Dog »

how about a tall stack of 50 mini's (DVDs)

http://www.amazon.com/Philips-Duplicato ... im_sbs_e_1

This is more temping... (plus I read online that someones wife made table lamps out of old cds.)

:roll:

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#43 Post by jamesbond »

Thanks Ted Dog for the testing, and mainly for the great breakthrough! :D

I looked at the source of cdrtools and confirm that -iso-level 4 actually enables large files too (and a bunch of other things - mostly iso-level 3 settings). The source is used in 620 is here: ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/cdrecord/alpha ... 13.tar.bz2 - I forgot to upload it to /source/c, but I already did now.
Ted Dog wrote:@jamesbond

Would you rewrite this line and the other to send warnings and error msgs to /tmp for debugging ms issues in the future.

Code: Select all

	! $GROWISOFS -root $archivepath "$SAVEFILE_MOUNT"/archive/* > /dev/null && save_ok=no	

code snippit from /usr/sbin/fatdog-save-multisession.sh
Yes, I will see what I can do.
Zigbert wrote:I don't get all your talk, so let me ask...
Ted already answered this, but let me put it in a different way:
As I understand it. setting isolevel to 4 (and removing -J) would improve the pBurn execution to be compatible with recent windows.
You either choose -iso-level 4 or -J (but not both). As Ted has stated, "-J" is a broken M$ extension (or abomination) of Rockridge. It is required for long filenames to be seen under Win95 and Win98 (perhaps Win2K too - didn't check, didn't test). Starting on Windows XP, Windows can also see long filenames written under ISO9660:1999 directory which is what -iso-level 4 uses. So effectively -iso-level 4 replaces -J unless you want to be downward compatible to Win95/98 (shudder!)
1.) Will it be compatible with windows 7/8 as well as XP?
Yes on Win XP and Win7, doesn't own Win8 to test, but I don't see why not.
2.) Are there any reasons for using isolevel 3?
Mainly to enable writing large files (file bigger than 4 GB), which iso-level 4 also does.
3.) Does this allow burning files over 4Gb?
Yes, both iso-level 3 and iso-level 4 does
4.) If so, could this replace UDF?
Yes and No. If you want to burn DVD Video (or probably Bluray video too) - you need UDF. If all you care is data, then yes.

UDF also supports multi-session, but as myself and Ted Dog painstakingly found, Linux tools don't support UDF.
When you try to write multisession to an UDF disc, strange things happen: if you mount the disc as "-t iso9660", you will see the files added in the new session. If you mount the disc as "-t udf", you will *NOT* see the new files.
So until this is fixed, use of UDF and multisession is mutually exclusive - you choose one or another but not both.

Sigmund, of special note, all these experiments are done under cdrtools. I'm not sure how they fare under cdrkit, but according to Ted who has done a lot of test, cdrkit may not be up to task for this. I haven't done the test under cdrkit so I can't say but I'll side with Ted on this.

cheers!
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zigbert
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#44 Post by zigbert »

Thank you guys for all input.
I will let it all sink in for some time, to think it through before making an updated pBurn.

As I see it right now:
- Replace isolevel 3 with isolevel 4, and remove the Joilet options. Do we need the Rockridge ???? Remove udf as well.
- Keep isolevel 1 for backward compatibility
- Depend on cdrtools ONLY
- burning video, filesystem settings are not available for user, so not any issue with udf here...

This would make it all easier for the user (Less options).


Any opinions?
Sigmund

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#45 Post by rcrsn51 »

zigbert wrote:Do we need the Rockridge ????
In my tests using "iso-level 4", I still need Rock Ridge to provide upper/lower case filenames, in Linux.

[Edit] Somehow, XP was able to see the full upper/lower case filenames. WITH iso-level 4 but WITHOUT Rock Ridge.
Last edited by rcrsn51 on Sat 04 May 2013, 22:06, edited 2 times in total.

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#46 Post by Ted Dog »

I think we need some long name support as Rockridge would. UDF would not really be needed from a data point of view. I found that a windows free software runs under wine that will be a workaround if any one wants to make true video player UDF video with in puppy. - :wink:

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#47 Post by Ted Dog »

ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/cdrecord/alpha ... 13.tar.bz2

Could someone make a pet of this package for 32bit? to see if we came reduplicate the success so far for the 32biters still left behind.

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#48 Post by rcrsn51 »

Ted Dog wrote:ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/cdrecord/alpha ... 13.tar.bz2. Could someone make a pet of this package for 32bit?
Slacko 5.5 has cdrtools 3.01a08. That should be a good testbed.
Last edited by rcrsn51 on Sun 05 May 2013, 02:12, edited 1 time in total.

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#49 Post by zigbert »

rcrsn51 wrote:
zigbert wrote:Do we need the Rockridge ????
In my tests using "iso-level 4", I still need Rock Ridge to provide upper/lower case filenames, in Linux.

[Edit] Somehow, XP was able to see the full upper/lower case filenames.
My intention is to keep Rockridge always for level 4 and never for level 1. Like that, there is no option for the user.


Sigmund

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#50 Post by jamesbond »

Ted Dog wrote:I think we need some long name support as Rockridge would. UDF would not really be needed from a data point of view. I found that a windows free software runs under wine that will be a workaround if any one wants to make true video player UDF video with in puppy. - :wink:
Yes, imgburn is a good one. It was one of my favorites when I was still addicted to Windows :)
zigbert wrote:
rcrsn51 wrote:
zigbert wrote:Do we need the Rockridge ????
In my tests using "iso-level 4", I still need Rock Ridge to provide upper/lower case filenames, in Linux.

[Edit] Somehow, XP was able to see the full upper/lower case filenames.
My intention is to keep Rockridge always for level 4 and never for level 1. Like that, there is no option for the user.
rcrsn51 is right. Rockridge is required not only for long filenames but also for other Unix stuff like permissions, more fine-grained timestamps, symlinks, etc.
My recommendation is to *always* enable rockridge (RR) no matter what iso-level you use. It does no harm for compatibility (those who don't understand RR simply ignore it or pretend that it doesn't exist), and the additional space taken is infinitesimal. Anyway, what feature do you plan to offer that makes use of "iso-level 1"?
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#51 Post by zigbert »

My recommendation is to *always* enable rockridge

Got it - thank you
Anyway, what feature do you plan to offer that makes use of "iso-level 1"?
I think pBUrn can use isolevel 4 by default, but isolevel 1 is most compatible with whatever os out there, I see it logical to give an extra option.

"Use 8.3 naming of files for backward compatibility"
- Ok, that sentence is awful, but still my intention :)

edit: what about
"Use old file-naming (8.3) to work on older systems."


Sigmund

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#52 Post by jamesbond »

zigbert wrote:I think pBUrn can use isolevel 4 by default, but isolevel 1 is most compatible with whatever os out there, I see it logical to give an extra option.
Agreed.
"Use 8.3 naming of files for backward compatibility"
- Ok, that sentence is awful, but still my intention :)

edit: what about
"Use old file-naming (8.3) to work on older systems."
How about:
"Rename files to comply with DOS 8.3 filename convention"? Googling for "DOS 8.3 filename convention" brings you straight to the Wikipedia article about it (or, if you can do it from gtkdialog, you may want to provide a URL link directly to that wikipedia page).

Alternatively:
"Most basic ISO 9660 specification (limited features but most compatible with all operating systems)"

cheers!
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Blu-ray testing attracts T-Storms

#53 Post by Ted Dog »

I went into town to download the new Fatdog64v621 at a family member with high-speed cable internet. Had a good simple supper with them, and when I got back, saw flashes of distant lightening. Like a magnet drawn to metal a megacell cloud started six counties over is heading my direction. Now a under a Severe Thunder Storm Warning and one eye is on the TV radar, and other on the burn time remaining....

gcmartin

#54 Post by gcmartin »

zigbert wrote:... As I see it right now:
- Replace isolevel 3 with isolevel 4, and remove the Joilet options. Do we need the Rockridge ???? Remove udf as well.
- Keep isolevel 1 for backward compatibility
- Depend on cdrtools ONLY
- burning video, filesystem settings are not available for user, so not any issue with udf here...

This would make it all easier for the user (Less options).


Any opinions?
Sigmund
Seems reasonable. And, as pointed out by @Rcrsn51 RR also maps.

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#55 Post by disciple »

Fwiw:

unless you want to be downward compatible with Win95/98 (shudder!)
this would make it all easier for the user (less options)

Options aren't hard if it is obvious what they are for (and perhaps any downsides) e.g. if an option has a label or tooltip saying "long filename support on win95/98" or something. And an option for downward compatibility with Win98 isn't such a bad idea when some of your users are still using machines from that era. Just the other day someone was asking here for help installing NT3 or something... ;)
Do you know a good gtkdialog program? Please post a link here

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Re: Blu-ray testing attracts T-Storms

#56 Post by Flash »

Ted Dog wrote:...when I got back, saw flashes of distant lightening. Like a magnet drawn to metal a megacell cloud started six counties over is heading my direction. Now a under a Severe Thunder Storm Warning and one eye is on the TV radar, and other on the burn time remaining....
Ted, did you make it under the wire? :lol:

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Re: Blu-ray testing attracts T-Storms

#57 Post by jamesbond »

Flash wrote:
Ted Dog wrote:...when I got back, saw flashes of distant lightening. Like a magnet drawn to metal a megacell cloud started six counties over is heading my direction. Now a under a Severe Thunder Storm Warning and one eye is on the TV radar, and other on the burn time remaining....
Ted, did you make it under the wire? :lol:
May be the storm affected the burn resulting in unworkable bluray ... :?

That being said, multisession save is now logged in /dev/initrd.err (this file is not persisted across reboots). If you want to see what's the result coming from the "final" multisession save at shutdown, instead of doing a real shutdown, type kill -3 1 instead. That will tell init to shutdown everything like real, but instead of powering off it will give you a console at the end, and you can inspect the result of the final save in /dev/initrd.err. From here, type /sbin/poweroff -f to poweroff, or /sbin/reboot -f to reboot. If you want to stay around in that console for longer, /bin/mount -t proc proc /proc might make it more comfortable otherwise you will have to prefix everything with the full path (e.g. /bin/ls etc).
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gcmartin

#58 Post by gcmartin »

I thought this might interest some. Apps-on-Blu-Ray

Interesting use for external Blu-Ray devices. Free tools for PC users, too.

Here to help

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#59 Post by Ted Dog »

I have a eye on external blu-ray for my new 64bit Netbook, but I think I'll make a remote save session first. seems easy enough. Almost the entire work is already in Fatdog64 multisession code. Came across how to feed a cdrecord burn stream to a remote burner. Network is faster than burn rate so it would work. :wink:

Yes I made it under the wire on the burns weeks ago. I Added md5sum check code to my burn/build scripts, was checking them just after a burn, but last night the weather people said storms tonight so I been skipping the 20min check to get done backing up a 500GB hybrid drive for reuse by now. Second to last one (18 discs) just completed. The final one is not maxed out so I'm looking for stuff to fill it.

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#60 Post by jamesbond »

Ted Dog wrote:Came across how to feed a cdrecord burn stream to a remote burner.
Interesting :D Care to share? :D Are you using netcat or something?
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