I agree with Lobster that the forum no longer works. Perhaps it has reached a critical point - maximum posts? maximum database size? who knows...
Perhaps a solution would be to keep this forum but make it read-only so the valuable information contained within it can be referenced, and a new empty forum (Puppy Forum II ?) started.
Suggestions for Forum Improvement
Yes we all suffer from the forum behavior these last month.
To extend on Wolfen's comment, the important info about KDE, OOo etc etc.. could be brought over to wikki pages maybe.
Also I experienced the closing of the developer forum and the Puppy2 forum. At that time I was anxious too about the info in there and access to it, but now some time later, I don't even think about those old posts anymore.
A new Puppy II forum could probably develop the same symptoms over time, but ala in the beginning it would be a relieve.
But it has always been my preference to use nntp based newsgroups in stead of this http based forums.
It couls be that nntp based newsgroups are more difficult to maintain, I don't know.
Anyhow, let's hope for a solution shortly.
To extend on Wolfen's comment, the important info about KDE, OOo etc etc.. could be brought over to wikki pages maybe.
Also I experienced the closing of the developer forum and the Puppy2 forum. At that time I was anxious too about the info in there and access to it, but now some time later, I don't even think about those old posts anymore.
A new Puppy II forum could probably develop the same symptoms over time, but ala in the beginning it would be a relieve.
But it has always been my preference to use nntp based newsgroups in stead of this http based forums.
It couls be that nntp based newsgroups are more difficult to maintain, I don't know.
Anyhow, let's hope for a solution shortly.
Puppy Linux 2.02 SMkey, KDE354mini, wine0.9.20, devx-qt-renamed.
Puppy Linux 2.10r1 SMkey, JWM, devx_qt_renamed_210, KDE355mini
Puppy Linux 2.10r1 SMkey, JWM, devx_qt_renamed_210, KDE355mini
one thing that should be done anyway, is to move all of the older dotpup packages from the forum to file servers (like MU's http://dotpups.de/dotpups/)
i don't know if the attachements are having any affect on the performance of the forum (there are over 3000 attachments) ... the attachments may not be a problem at all, but it is at least a possibility
i don't know if the attachements are having any affect on the performance of the forum (there are over 3000 attachments) ... the attachments may not be a problem at all, but it is at least a possibility
another alternative to forums is a mailing list
whether a mailing list would be useful or practical, it is easy to set one up
jmarsden has already set one up here:
http://www.freelists.org/list/puppy-devel
but it seems to have been abandoned ... anyway, there are no recent messages that are archived
jmarsden's email list had a specific goal of developing a Puppy base like Linux-From-Scratch, so that all the source code to compile all the compiled kernel and drivers and applications would be all in one place. I think that T2 has already done much the same thing
i think MU prefers a forum to an email list ... i think i would too
whether a mailing list would be useful or practical, it is easy to set one up
jmarsden has already set one up here:
http://www.freelists.org/list/puppy-devel
but it seems to have been abandoned ... anyway, there are no recent messages that are archived
jmarsden's email list had a specific goal of developing a Puppy base like Linux-From-Scratch, so that all the source code to compile all the compiled kernel and drivers and applications would be all in one place. I think that T2 has already done much the same thing
i think MU prefers a forum to an email list ... i think i would too
yes, I prefer a forum.
dotpups.de is running out of space, so we would have to use puptrix.org.
Is there a folder, where all dotpups could be downloaded from?
It would be good to save them in their original name.
wget saves them as "download.php?id=3085", so it is not good to be used in a script to download all
Mark
dotpups.de is running out of space, so we would have to use puptrix.org.
Is there a folder, where all dotpups could be downloaded from?
It would be good to save them in their original name.
wget saves them as "download.php?id=3085", so it is not good to be used in a script to download all
Mark
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marksouth2000
- Posts: 622
- Joined: Wed 05 Apr 2006, 20:43
I like the forum. Now, I'm far from the only one, but I've spent some time (a lot less than many others, admitteldy, but some time) answering questions and making suggestions etc on this forum. Put all of us together and it makes quite a useful resource. I think it would be a great loss to close it down.
That said, a newsgroup is a good idea, and that way one can get it archived at google groups, which makes finding stuff easier.
Cheers,
Mark
That said, a newsgroup is a good idea, and that way one can get it archived at google groups, which makes finding stuff easier.
Cheers,
Mark
No not a mailing list.GuestToo wrote:another alternative to forums is a mailing list
It charges the e-mail traffic of one's account and is not practical at all.
In order of preference:
1 - newsgroup
2 - forum
3 - mailing list.
In order of preference in the actual situation:
1 - a performant forum
2 - newsgroup
3 - maling list.
Puppy Linux 2.02 SMkey, KDE354mini, wine0.9.20, devx-qt-renamed.
Puppy Linux 2.10r1 SMkey, JWM, devx_qt_renamed_210, KDE355mini
Puppy Linux 2.10r1 SMkey, JWM, devx_qt_renamed_210, KDE355mini
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Pizzasgood
- Posts: 6183
- Joined: Wed 04 May 2005, 20:28
- Location: Knoxville, TN, USA
Actually, that's what this is. Before this one, we were using simpleforums.(Puppy Forum II ?)
I don't know if starting another forum is a solution though (unless it's different software/hardware that works better). This one's only been going for about a year and a half. So we'd have to start fresh yearly, assuming usage remains at the current level, which is not very likely. There must be a better solution.
On the other hand, it could help the documentation effort. If every year we started over, people would be more likely to put documentation in more stable areas. Also, during the "relearning process" when we start a fresh one, knowledge would re-surface and could be documented better.
As for attachments, it might be worth putting a sticky in the Announcements section explaining how to get an easy list of your attachments and some suggestions of where you could put them to get them off the server. I have maybe five still here that I plan to move when I get back to my dorm tonight (don't have the address for my site's ftp on-hand).
That's just my .5 cent (they used to make those...)
[size=75]Between depriving a man of one hour from his life and depriving him of his life there exists only a difference of degree. --Muad'Dib[/size]
[img]http://www.browserloadofcoolness.com/sig.png[/img]
[img]http://www.browserloadofcoolness.com/sig.png[/img]
Dollar cents or Euro cents, quite a differencePizzasgood wrote:Actually, that's what this is.(Puppy Forum II ?)There is some truth in there.On the other hand, it could help the documentation effort. If every year we started over, people would be more likely to put documentation in more stable areas. Also, during the "relearning process" when we start a fresh one, knowledge would re-surface and could be documented better.That would be great as I have not the faintest idea how to remove my attachment from the server.As for attachments, it might be worth putting a sticky in the Announcements section explaining how to get an easy list of your attachments and some suggestions of where you could put them to get them off the server. I have maybe five still here that I plan to move when I get back to my dorm tonight (don't have the address for my site's ftp on-hand).
That's just my .5 cent (they used to make those...)
Puppy Linux 2.02 SMkey, KDE354mini, wine0.9.20, devx-qt-renamed.
Puppy Linux 2.10r1 SMkey, JWM, devx_qt_renamed_210, KDE355mini
Puppy Linux 2.10r1 SMkey, JWM, devx_qt_renamed_210, KDE355mini
here is an archived page of one of Puppy's early forums
For a start, you can enter your forum name in the appropriate area of the forum search engine and get a list of every post you made to the forum.Pizzasgood wrote:...As for attachments, it might be worth putting a sticky in the Announcements section explaining how to get an easy list of your attachments and some suggestions of where you could put them to get them off the server...
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Pizzasgood
- Posts: 6183
- Joined: Wed 04 May 2005, 20:28
- Location: Knoxville, TN, USA
Yeah, and I'm going to search through all 1460 of them
Actually, you can also click "your posts" in the main-area of the forum (over to the right).
No, there's a better way. There is an attachment control panel, I just couldn't remember how to get there. I'm going to go post the method and stuff...
http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic ... 3783#73783
Actually, you can also click "your posts" in the main-area of the forum (over to the right).
No, there's a better way. There is an attachment control panel, I just couldn't remember how to get there. I'm going to go post the method and stuff...
http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic ... 3783#73783
[size=75]Between depriving a man of one hour from his life and depriving him of his life there exists only a difference of degree. --Muad'Dib[/size]
[img]http://www.browserloadofcoolness.com/sig.png[/img]
[img]http://www.browserloadofcoolness.com/sig.png[/img]
I made this suggestion elsewhere today but I'll admit it was a bit off target. This seems a better place.
The proliferation of Puppy derivatives and add-ons must be very confusing to the newbie. It also leads to many posts on the main forum which do not relate to Puppy but rather to those derivatives and add-ons.
Separate topics for each derivative and each add-on instead of just one topic for the entire bundle would surely be less confusing.
A sticky in each topic would describe exactly what each derivative or add-on does, something that is currently rather difficult to discover.
Another sticky would ask that anybody who has a problem first confirms that the base version of Puppy works on their hardware. At that point Barry can stop reading
The moderators could, humbly and with apologies, move posts from the main forum which they believed would be better handled in the specific topic and by the creator of that software.
Not something that can be done tomorrow but hopefully worth thinking about.
Geoff
The proliferation of Puppy derivatives and add-ons must be very confusing to the newbie. It also leads to many posts on the main forum which do not relate to Puppy but rather to those derivatives and add-ons.
Separate topics for each derivative and each add-on instead of just one topic for the entire bundle would surely be less confusing.
A sticky in each topic would describe exactly what each derivative or add-on does, something that is currently rather difficult to discover.
Another sticky would ask that anybody who has a problem first confirms that the base version of Puppy works on their hardware. At that point Barry can stop reading
The moderators could, humbly and with apologies, move posts from the main forum which they believed would be better handled in the specific topic and by the creator of that software.
Not something that can be done tomorrow but hopefully worth thinking about.
Geoff
I agree that people asking for help with their Puppy derivatives in this forum seem a little bit off-topic. There doesn't seem to be all that many of them as yet, but they could be a problem in the future. People who offer a customized Puppy might consider that, and make arrangements to support at least the custom bits.
It seems to me that too many stickies spoil a forum
so I try to keep their number to a minimum. I know, it's arbitrary. What can I say?
As for moving off-topic posts to a more appropriate thread, as far as I know, it can't be done. The phpBB forum software does allow posts to be split from a thread to form a new thread of their own. It doesn't allow for them to be added to an existing thread. I might point out that to use this power fairly, a moderator has to carefully read each and every post in every thread of the forums for which he is responsible.
It seems to me that too many stickies spoil a forum
so I try to keep their number to a minimum. I know, it's arbitrary. What can I say?As for moving off-topic posts to a more appropriate thread, as far as I know, it can't be done. The phpBB forum software does allow posts to be split from a thread to form a new thread of their own. It doesn't allow for them to be added to an existing thread. I might point out that to use this power fairly, a moderator has to carefully read each and every post in every thread of the forums for which he is responsible.
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Pizzasgood
- Posts: 6183
- Joined: Wed 04 May 2005, 20:28
- Location: Knoxville, TN, USA
One of the things with supporting a custom Puppy is that at least half the problems people have are general Puppy problems. Yes, it is somewhat the puplet's maintainer's responsibility, but having the posts in the general forum gives a much higher chance of getting an answer. That's because someone who doesn't use that puplet might see the problem and remember a solution. However, if it were another forum, that person would never see it. So, the maintainer would probably be the one who has to solve it. If he can't find the solution on his own, he's likely to make a post about it in the Puppy forum. However, a post could have been made there in the first place and saved much time.
Also, keeping them together means they are seen by the forum search (including the "Puppy Google Search"). That helps both sides. If a problem is seen in the puplet before the standard Puppy, Puppy users might find it.
This is especially relevant for smaller puplets that don't make huge changes. More complex ones might need their own if they generate a large number of posts that are not applicable to a standard Puppy (Pizzapup will fall into that category in the next version, if half my wish-list makes the cut).
Also, keeping them together means they are seen by the forum search (including the "Puppy Google Search"). That helps both sides. If a problem is seen in the puplet before the standard Puppy, Puppy users might find it.
This is especially relevant for smaller puplets that don't make huge changes. More complex ones might need their own if they generate a large number of posts that are not applicable to a standard Puppy (Pizzapup will fall into that category in the next version, if half my wish-list makes the cut).
[size=75]Between depriving a man of one hour from his life and depriving him of his life there exists only a difference of degree. --Muad'Dib[/size]
[img]http://www.browserloadofcoolness.com/sig.png[/img]
[img]http://www.browserloadofcoolness.com/sig.png[/img]
Carefully - ever so carefully - I'm not sure that I should but I'm raising my head above the parapet - I don't believe I started this but I sure threw a bomb into the middle of something 
please - I didn't know it was a bomb and I don't know what I threw it into 
First - I'm NOT suggesting that derivatives and add-ons should be banished from the forum. Just that it would be good if they each had their own topic. At the moment they all share one topic and it is primarily used for announcements.
Second - If this was done it would be much simpler for the creators of these add-ons and derivatives to find queries and reply to them. My suggestion that users be encouraged to test their hardware with the base version of Puppy before they post a problem would assist with this. This would help to resolve the point you make PG.
I accept the point that moderators can't move posts - pity. Maybe some clearer directions as to what should be posted into specific topics is needed.
I don't think I'm imagining it, I'm sure that the number of posts per day is increasing. Certainly the number of pages of new posts is increasing!
For the Puppy newcomer (and even worse, the Linux newbee) it must be getting increasingly difficult to make sense of it all.
I believe Puppy has three groups of users who may find their way into this forum and the forum must cater for all of them. Others will probably find more than three but the three I can think of are:-
(1) The computer nutters
who enjoy having a system that will run on almost anything (particularly cheap or better still free) and that they can play with and maybe contribute to.
(2) People who use computers for very specific purposes but can't spend bucket loads of money on specialised hardware and software. They develop and/or use many of the derivatives.
(3) Escapees from Windows who have been encouraged by a friend or relative to try something different and not spend a fortune on new hardware. Many (if not most) know nothing about computers at any level below the application software. It is this group, which is most in need of the information in the forum, which I'm concerned will be put off by the current forum. It is this group who should be the biggest group and the biggest fans (Puppy-lovers!).
Is there any merit in any of these comments?
Is it possible for any of these ideas to be implemented?
Now - I hope the shooting doesn't restart. I've survived the last 70 years, I don't want to die in a computer war
Geoff
please - I didn't know it was a bomb and I don't know what I threw it into First - I'm NOT suggesting that derivatives and add-ons should be banished from the forum. Just that it would be good if they each had their own topic. At the moment they all share one topic and it is primarily used for announcements.
Second - If this was done it would be much simpler for the creators of these add-ons and derivatives to find queries and reply to them. My suggestion that users be encouraged to test their hardware with the base version of Puppy before they post a problem would assist with this. This would help to resolve the point you make PG.
I accept the point that moderators can't move posts - pity. Maybe some clearer directions as to what should be posted into specific topics is needed.
I don't think I'm imagining it, I'm sure that the number of posts per day is increasing. Certainly the number of pages of new posts is increasing!
For the Puppy newcomer (and even worse, the Linux newbee) it must be getting increasingly difficult to make sense of it all.
I believe Puppy has three groups of users who may find their way into this forum and the forum must cater for all of them. Others will probably find more than three but the three I can think of are:-
(1) The computer nutters
who enjoy having a system that will run on almost anything (particularly cheap or better still free) and that they can play with and maybe contribute to.(2) People who use computers for very specific purposes but can't spend bucket loads of money on specialised hardware and software. They develop and/or use many of the derivatives.
(3) Escapees from Windows who have been encouraged by a friend or relative to try something different and not spend a fortune on new hardware. Many (if not most) know nothing about computers at any level below the application software. It is this group, which is most in need of the information in the forum, which I'm concerned will be put off by the current forum. It is this group who should be the biggest group and the biggest fans (Puppy-lovers!).
Is there any merit in any of these comments?
Is it possible for any of these ideas to be implemented?
Now - I hope the shooting doesn't restart. I've survived the last 70 years, I don't want to die in a computer war
Geoff