A vote for a modular use of Puppy Linux

For talk and support relating specifically to Puppy derivatives
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partsman
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#101 Post by partsman »

@RSH
I tried the StandAlone-RunScript-RoxApp-Dir.tar.gz
Very impressive :D
[color=red]Anyone can build a fast processor. The trick is to build a fast system. (Seymour Cray)[/color] :wink:

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inoxidabile
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#102 Post by inoxidabile »

partsman wrote:
inoxidabile wrote:Hi everybody!
Sorry, just a little question... Trying Lazy as live from usb.

Clicking on the top bar for internet it says that there isn't sfs for firefox.
Then it asks for download it, after accept this the download starts (from smokey01) and then it seems ok.
But after good download a message appears, saying that it isn't ok.

Then, with Puppy package manager I select firefox and in this way everything runs fine.
This kinda makes it sound like you have installed lazy puppy !
please read this and follow the instructions here :wink:
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 139#736139
Or maybe i miss understand you ? :oops:
I apologize, maybe I explained it in a bad way :oops:
I had Lazy on usb mem stick (2 gig), using unetbootin.
Then I run it as live only and nothing more.
One more point: after the install of firefox (using puppy package manager :) ) at shutdown it says "session not saved" but this is obvious, I didn't anything more than a quick try as live.

partsman
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#103 Post by partsman »

Hi all
Something that came to mind :
What happens if the file system on the partition becomes corrupt ?
like say xorg fails to start etc. booting in ram is not an option not sure about pfix=purge etc.
[color=red]Anyone can build a fast processor. The trick is to build a fast system. (Seymour Cray)[/color] :wink:

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mikeb
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#104 Post by mikeb »

If a partition becomes corrupted there will be more to deal with than the odd stubborn xorg.
No system is going to deal with hardware failure apart from keeping backups.

Pupsave failures on the other hand are software/system related which is why they tend to affect the same areas...eg xorg, desktop items. You are dealing with a writable file system encompassed in a writable filesystem which is not cleanly unmounted plus its doubly prone to power outage/bad shutdown problems too especially if a non journalled filesystem is utilised. Having no save or a sfs save system avoids those kinds of corruption leaving only the host partition health to deal with. The sfs save also gives a nice tidy file to keep as a backup.

mike

amigo
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#105 Post by amigo »

A normal linux system boots with / read-only so that even the rootdisk can be fscked before mounting read-write and continuing with init. If you have /boot on a separate partition, then it can also be fscked without problems and by only mounting read-write when needed it remains sane.

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RSH
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#106 Post by RSH »

inoxidabile wrote:Hi everybody!
Sorry, just a little question... Trying Lazy as live from usb.

Clicking on the top bar for internet it says that there isn't sfs for firefox.
Then it asks for download it, after accept this the download starts (from smokey01) and then it seems ok.
But after good download a message appears, saying that it isn't ok.

Then, with Puppy package manager I select firefox and in this way everything runs fine.
You do mean the message about different md5sum found.

This means not necessary the SFS wasn't ok. This is mostly a result of different dates of creating the RunScript and uploading the SFS Module (after editing it again without to create a new RunScript). The md5sum-file is stored inside the RunScript's directory and created only when creating a RunScript. Just try run the application again - should work, though!

However: please do post anything about issues in LazY Puppy in its thread. I'm trying to keep this here divided from LazY Puppy as far as possible - thanks.
mikeb wrote:Ok downloaded it, tried it but no sfs obtained perhaps the lack of DISTRO_FILE_PREFIX would be the reason.... something easily hacked or is there more to it?
partsman wrote:@RSH
I tried the StandAlone-RunScript-RoxApp-Dir.tar.gz
Very impressive
Ok, so it doesn't work for mikeb, but it does for partsman. :?

@mikeb

Can you give more informationon what you did and what you mean by: perhaps the lack of DISTRO_FILE_PREFIX would be the reason.
So just to clarify the use of sfs files and RSH script box are not the modular idea here "just a little extra bonus" am i right ?
RSHs-ScriptBox was just an addition to give anyone an easy start for testings. Actually it is a rough cut-down of the version that I'm using here - and turned it into EN for this (mine is DE only).

The Modular Concept is basically the use of SFS Modules, but refined/improved as they download, load and run the application by a RunScript - using sfs_load in cli mode only.

The SFS P.L.U.S. development toolkit is to be found inside the RSHs-ScriptBox in its directory Module.

1. LP3_SFS_PLUS_3.sfs
2. LP3_SFS_PLUS-3.9.3-install.pet

These two are needed to build/edit SFS Modules, create RunScripts, adding dependencies to SFS Modules and many more. just do a right-click onto a SFS Module or a directory and look at the options (most of them do start with SFS P.L.U.S. - I think).

Note: this version 3.9.3 can not create those StandAlone-RunScript-RoxApp-Dirs - this is new in my current version 3.9.4.

When it is version 4.0.x I will publish this as a release. This will include then (hopefully) a short guide to the use of it.
[b][url=http://lazy-puppy.weebly.com]LazY Puppy[/url][/b]
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mikeb
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#107 Post by mikeb »

No bootconfig or distrospecs or my-roxapps.... so cannot really join in with the testing here....guess my puppies are not so puppy after all ....

Worry not

mike

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sunburnt
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#108 Post by sunburnt »

Of course a partition fsck at boot could be done for Puppy ( Why hasn`t it? ).

Rather that a Save file, a Save partition would be a much better idea.
Puppy had an option for this, but I`m not sure if it`s still there.

A dir on a partition could be used also, and is a much simpler way of doing it.
But being as the whole partition would need to be fsck, a large partition would take awhile.

For folks that insist on WinBlows with NTFS partitions, a Save file is the only thing that`ll work.
.

gyro
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#109 Post by gyro »

sunburnt wrote:A dir on a partition could be used also, and is a much simpler way of doing it.
For those with frugal installs on a linux partition, using a "save directory" in place of a "save file" would be a very neat way to go.

gyro

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mikeb
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#110 Post by mikeb »

For those with frugal installs on a linux partition, using a "save directory" in place of a "save file" would be a very neat way to go.
Added this option several years ago and yes its works nicely. Was pretty simple and mainly involved the use of a bind mount.

I added it after using nimblex/slax's save folder option and having a full partition for temp storage is so much easier. Stilll have the same save folder created 5 years ago :)

I believe puppies pfix=fsck option does do partitions....since I have pups loading to ram along with the save I just manually fsck occasionally since nothing is mounted at boot though it could be automated in the rc.sysinit like for a full install rather than hacking the initrd.

archive/sfs save is no problem on ntfs....whether ntfs is a problem is another matter :D The improvements in hard drives seem to offset the weaknesses of FAT.

mike

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RSH
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#111 Post by RSH »

mikeb wrote:No bootconfig or distrospecs or my-roxapps.... so cannot really join in with the testing here....guess my puppies are not so puppy after all ....

Worry not

mike
Ok, I see.

Meanwhile I've had a look into a puppy 4.1.0, which doesn't come with DISTRO_SPECS, so I'm trying to create a function that will create a temporary DISTRO_SPECS file for the use of this.

Could you please post content of your file: /etc/rc.d/PUPSTATE (taken from the running OS)?

Thanks
[b][url=http://lazy-puppy.weebly.com]LazY Puppy[/url][/b]
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mikeb
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#112 Post by mikeb »

No need if it complicates what you are doing but here you are

Code: Select all

PUPMODE=6
PDEV1='hda3'
DEV1FS='ext2'
PUPSFS='pup_415.sfs'
PUPSAVE='ext2,hda3,/415_archive.sfs'
#these directories are unionfs layers in /initrd...
SAVE_LAYER=''
PUP_LAYER='/pup_ro2'
mike

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mikeb
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#113 Post by mikeb »

Actually scratch that... 4 won't work with sfs 4 .

Instead I ran my Lucid which behaved a bit better.
It gave an error message at first but then did download the program.... it then downloaded java. It mounted sda3 and created a modules folder and added the first sfs to it and mounted it to pup_ro4. The java sfs never did and I could not find it. So closer..

here are distrospecs (comments removed) , or whats left of it and the pupstate

Code: Select all

DISTRO_NAME='Lucid Puppy'
DISTRO_VERSION=525
DISTRO_MINOR_VERSION=00
DISTRO_BINARY_COMPAT='ubuntu'
DISTRO_FILE_PREFIX='lupu'
DISTRO_COMPAT_VERSION='lucid'
DISTRO_KERNEL_PET='linux_kernel-2.6.33.2-tickless_smp_patched-L3.pet'
DISTRO_IDSTRING='l525130426141631'
DISTRO_PUPPYSFS='pup_525.sfs'

Code: Select all

PUPMODE=6
PDEV1='sda3'
DEV1FS='ext2'
PUPSFS='pup_525.sfs'
PUPSAVE='ext2,sda3,/525_archive.sfs'
#these directories are unionfs layers in /initrd...
SAVE_LAYER=''
PUP_LAYER='/pup_ro2'
Out of interest i went back to 4 , activated the converted sfs to ram along with java 1u6 and the program ran ok from its menu entry albeit slowly which is not surprising.

Just as an aside I have mounted sfs over the internet but its not recommended :D... but less nuttily we have mounted sfs via the LAN/NFS and they run just fine.

mike

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RSH
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#114 Post by RSH »

It gave an error message at first but then did download the program.... it then downloaded java. It mounted sda3 and created a modules folder and added the first sfs to it and mounted it to pup_ro4. The java sfs never did and I could not find it.
PUPSAVE='ext2,sda3,/525_archive.sfs'
The use of 525_archive.sfs defined as the PUPSAVE of course was the reason for this. When a save file is in use, sfs_load tries to move/copy the SFS Modules. So, the java might have been copied to a black hole etc.pp.

When no save file is in use, sfs_load doesn't move the SFS Modules.

Oh, better saying here: lazy_sfs_load, because this one is used and it is modified to not to copy the SFS Module when no save file is in use.

I was not able to modify this also for the use of a save file - until now!

So, there are some good news.

The trick was: PSUBDIR has to be redirected inside of sfs_load to the directory used for the storage of the SFS Modules.

Also I have wrote a script, that will generate a temp DISTRO_SPECS if it is not existing.

Here is my DISTRO_SPECS (comments and LazY Puppy additions removed):

Code: Select all

DISTRO_NAME='LazY Puppy'
DISTRO_VERSION='300'
DISTRO_MINOR_VERSION=00
DISTRO_BINARY_COMPAT='ubuntu'
DISTRO_FILE_PREFIX='RSHsLP3'
DISTRO_COMPAT_VERSION='lucid'
DISTRO_KERNEL_PET='linux_kernel-2.6.33.2-tickless_smp_patched-L3.pet'
DISTRO_IDSTRING='R300131123060322'
DISTRO_PUPPYSFS='RSHsLP3_300.sfs'
DISTRO_ZDRVSFS='RSHsLP3_Extension.sfs'
and here is the generated temp DISTRO_SPECS (original moved to /root/Desktop):

Code: Select all

DISTRO_NAME='RSHsLP3 Puppy'
DISTRO_FILE_PREFIX='RSHsLP3'
DISTRO_VERSION='300'
DISTRO_PUPPYSFS='RSHsLP3_300.sfs'
DISTRO_ZDRVSFS='zR30026332.sfs'
DISTRO_KERNEL_PET='linux_kernel-2.6.33.2.pet'
DISTRO_IDSTRING='R300131125211432'
This is build by the use of data of /etc/rc.d/PUPSTATE.

I will now build two small SFS Modules just for doing some testings and to keep its download sizes small.

Also I will build squashfs 3 version files for this for doing some testings in older puppies.

The previous one (JWildFire & Java) is now removed.
[b][url=http://lazy-puppy.weebly.com]LazY Puppy[/url][/b]
[b][url=http://rshs-dna.weebly.com]RSH's DNA[/url][/b]
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mikeb
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#115 Post by mikeb »

Ok....

well I can test pfix=ram if that helps but i assume you want to deal with all the variations that are present in puppy though mine are a bit different I try to keep them as compatible as possible. There are pups from 2.14x through to current in common use so thats a large base to try and cover.. I have a variety up to and including Lucid.

I noticed you did not load sfs to ram ...is that intentional or just for testing?

mike

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RSH
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#116 Post by RSH »

I noticed you did not load sfs to ram ...is that intentional or just for testing?
Hm, don't know, what you mean.

The SFS Modules are loaded by sfs_load (modified version) in cli mode.

Can you explain a bit more what you do mean and also how you have noticed that the SFS is not loaded to RAM, please?
[b][url=http://lazy-puppy.weebly.com]LazY Puppy[/url][/b]
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mikeb
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#117 Post by mikeb »

Ok well the sfs was saved to a folder modules on sda3 and mounted from there. If loaded to ram I would expect to find it in /initrd/mnt/tmpfs or similar. I only mentioned it as loading to ram was mentioned in earlier posts so wondered if you intended to do so.

mike

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RSH
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#118 Post by RSH »

Ok.

So, if sda3 is your boot directory then it was intended to be saved in that directory and loaded from there.

If sda3 was the drive that you have had entered into the file download_dir_temp, then it was intended to be saved in that directory and loaded from there.

The RunScript uses this directory in its definitions.

Change these two entries:

Code: Select all

DISPLAYRUNOVERRIDE="Module"
DISPLAYRUNOVERRIDELPBPLOPT="true"
to false and it should download to the boot directory and loaded from there.

Though, I don't know if the SFS will load into RAM after this...

Attached a new Standalone RunScript RoxApp Directory for some testings. I could not test running it when booting from CD. Anything else seems to work - even if there is no DISTRO_SPECS file existing.

EDIT:

I did try to upload a version for SquashFS-3 files, but when trying to download I did get a 403 Error about wrong permissions. Don't know how to fix this for SquashFS-3 version files. So, currently no option to test this for older puppies.
Attachments
Standalone-RunScript-RoxApp-Directory-Again-Updated-Version.tar.gz
(49.97 KiB) Downloaded 387 times
Last edited by RSH on Tue 26 Nov 2013, 04:02, edited 1 time in total.
[b][url=http://lazy-puppy.weebly.com]LazY Puppy[/url][/b]
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RSH
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#119 Post by RSH »

Currently running from CD booting.

Above attached .tar.gz file again updated.

Seems to work fine also when booting from CD.

SFS Modules are now able to unload by right-click-option.

Dependent SFS Module unloads as well.

Over here, so far...
[b][url=http://lazy-puppy.weebly.com]LazY Puppy[/url][/b]
[b][url=http://rshs-dna.weebly.com]RSH's DNA[/url][/b]
[url=http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=91422][b]SARA B.[/b][/url]

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mikeb
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#120 Post by mikeb »

OK was having too much fun in windows but eventually reset to test in Lucid.

Ok seems like all worked and ran with save loaded.

Main file and dependency downloaded to modules on sda3 (was unmounted for test) ...they ran and gave the messages.
Both items appeared in the menu (under utility) and the right click unload option worked.

mike

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