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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Projects » Localization Project
Spanish
Moderators: Lobster, MU, raffy
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CatmanDru

Joined: 07 Sep 2006
Posts: 91
Location: OR, USA

PostPosted: Sun 05 Nov 2006, 19:01    Post_subject:  

I'm sure there are many pro's and con's regarding Castillian vs Latin American, however having two Spanish varieties may be too divisive for Spanish Puppy at this point. I'm in favor of using Spanish that approaches a non-regional Spanish that would be generally understood by most Spanish speakers, and if it wasn't easily understood, then readers could consult the REA. I'm in favor of Spanish translators and readers deferring to the REA much as English writers and readers defer to the Oxford English Dictionary as a central authority.

It seems to me that in both Spanish and English the use of 'educated or formal' language, and the avoidance of regionalisms, ideoms (figures of speech), and slang produces a nearly non-regional language.

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iwigo

Joined: 08 Nov 2006
Posts: 63
Location: Burgos, Spain

PostPosted: Wed 08 Nov 2006, 15:41    Post_subject:  

Hello, im from Spain and i also speak English so i want to help in this project. Tell me what to do and i will do it.
Thanks
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GuestToo
Puppy Master

Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 4078

PostPosted: Wed 08 Nov 2006, 19:23    Post_subject:  

well, if anyone would like to translate my dotpup handler script, i just uploaded the .po file

de and fr are already done

http://www.murga.org/~puppy/viewtopic.php?t=12541
http://www.murga.org/~puppy/viewtopic.php?t=12540
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wow

Joined: 29 Jun 2006
Posts: 985
Location: Peru

PostPosted: Wed 08 Nov 2006, 21:06    Post_subject:  

Apparently there are more people interested in this project, but we are not organized yet, and if we continue this way we will not manage to advance in this. So, last monday I began to translate part of the software that not supports files .mo, they are the majority of utilities and wizards. Also, I'm looking for .mo files for the software included in Puppy 2.11(maybe 2.12), till now I have the translations for: Gaim, Leafpad, Xdialog, Make, gcc-3.3, gcc-3.4, xmms and the spanish version of firefox 2.0, though I do not know if I should include firefox, or only add the language packages for Seamokey. I would like that you suggest names for the icons of the pinboard, I have many doubts with this. (trash=Papelera de reciclaje/Basura?; home=home?/inicio?/etc)
If everything is ok I will have a .sfs for testing at the weekend.
What is absent now is to translate the documentation, work with the wiki and the add locales for the rest of applications.

Thanks and regards.
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sintot


Joined: 29 Oct 2006
Posts: 57
Location: Madrid

PostPosted: Wed 08 Nov 2006, 22:38    Post_subject: More mo files  

Hi:
I have also the mo files for geany, gqview, gftp , gslapt, slapt-get, LinNeighborHood, sweep and xfe.

I have downloaded mtpaint, but it's not working, the same as inkscapelite (but I rememeber inkscape did work)

wow, I can upload them here and you can include it in your sfs
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rarsa


Joined: 29 May 2005
Posts: 3053
Location: Kitchener, Ontario, Canada

PostPosted: Thu 09 Nov 2006, 11:54    Post_subject:  

There are several things that can be done:

1. I'd recommend only translating utilities and wizards that have been addapted to use "getttext". If the text gets translated inside the script maintenance will be a nightmare and will always be out of sync. To translate the wizards and utilities we have to coordinate closelly with Barry so we don't end up translating old versions.

2. Collect all the .mo files for known applications in a common repository. I don't think the forum is the appropriate repository.

Currently there are several repositories available:
- My recommendation would be to use the subversion repository. It is the best way to make sure we are in sync and to coordinate the work from multiple people as it tracks versions, changes, contributors, etc.

I can grant write access to the people that require it. Every body currently has read access.

- Alternativelly we could use any of the ftp sites donated by members.
The one I regularly use is the space donated by GermanPup.
MU, klhrevolutionary and some other people have also offered hosting space.

_________________
http://rarsa.blogspot.com Covering my eclectic thoughts
http://www.kwlug.org/blog/48 Covering my Linux How-to
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CatmanDru

Joined: 07 Sep 2006
Posts: 91
Location: OR, USA

PostPosted: Thu 09 Nov 2006, 14:44    Post_subject:  

deleted duplicate post
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wjaguar

Joined: 21 Jun 2006
Posts: 241

PostPosted: Thu 09 Nov 2006, 15:21    Post_subject: mtPaint  

mtPaint 3.02 has up-to-date Spanish translation, and other translations, while incomplete, also are somewhat improved. If an older version is used in Puppy, I suggest switching to 3.02 - version 3.10 is in alpha stage still. and won't be released very soon.
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CatmanDru

Joined: 07 Sep 2006
Posts: 91
Location: OR, USA

PostPosted: Thu 09 Nov 2006, 15:46    Post_subject:  

Maybe others already know this, but Debian and Ubuntu have Spanish translation sections and one thing they do is list possible words as translation candidates/choices. In my opinion, it seems reasonable, wise, and time-efficient to take guidance from the work they have already done, rather than start all over and decide those issues on our own, at least at this point. This would also produce some translation similarities and continuity in Puppy for users who are familiar with another distro.

Another, related, issue is the possible need for an accepted list of terms to be used in all of puppy. A concern is that applications, desktop, wiki, and documentation all refer to items by either 1) the same term, or 2) the two or three terms that may be used. Problems and confusion may be caused if the wiki says "click on home", but the desktop only has an icon that says "inicio", and an aplication calls the button something else. A workaround may be -- where space allows -- to state "click on the 'home or inicio' button".

Producing a list of accepted terms may not be too difficult. Most terms are easy; only a few are difficult or problematic. An alternative option is that Puppy could adopt a list from another distro. What do people think about this?

I vote for 'inicio' ('beginning' or 'starting point'). I have problems with the term (I would prefer 'hogar' = 'home'), but other distros use 'inicio' and at least it's in Spanish. People with limited education (6th grade?), and Non-English speaking 'Grandma Nontechie' will understand 'inicio' better than 'home'.

I think both 'trash' and 'basura' are good because they are short, but they don't hint at the recycling function of the button, therefore they are not very intuitive. 'Papelera de reciclaje' ('paper bin for recycling') is very explanatory but maybe long. Also the RAE seems to prefer 'reciclamiento' instead of 'reciclaje'. That would makes the term longer: 'Papelera de Reciclamiento', but if it's not too long, then it might be the best, because it is the most accurate, precise, and intuitive.

If a shorter option is needed how about just 'reciclar' (recycle) or 'reciclamiento' (recycling)?
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wow

Joined: 29 Jun 2006
Posts: 985
Location: Peru

PostPosted: Sat 11 Nov 2006, 03:30    Post_subject:  

rarsa wrote:
1. I'd recommend only translating utilities and wizards that have been addapted to use "getttext". If the text gets translated inside the script maintenance will be a nightmare and will always be out of sync. To translate the wizards and utilities we have to coordinate closelly with Barry so we don't end up translating old versions.

Yes, you're right. But I think this will take some time, so meanwhile I'm translating and testing wizards and other scripts. This is what I have working in spanish for Puppy 2.11:

Almost completed the pinboard apps:
-Seamonkey updated to 1.0.5 (html, browse, email and contacts icons)
-Gaim(chat icon)
-Gnumeric(calc icon)
-Abiword(word icon)
-Connect icon(Internet conection wizard)
-Setup icon(WizardWizard-almost all wizards translated)
-Install icon(and all scripts related)
-Trash icon
-PupZip icon (not XArchive)
-Lock icon

Another apps in the live-CD:
-gFTP
-puppyROX (yes, puppyRox not rox2.5)
-Xdialog
-make messages
-gcc messages
-mtpaint 3.01 shows spanish and english menues Confused maybe updating to the next version works correctly?

Extra things:
-Country localization(money, date/time/telephone format, etc) for es_AR, es_BO, es_CL, es_CO, es_CR, es_DO, es_EC, es_ES, es_GT, es_HN, es_MX, es_NI, es_PA, es_PE, es_PR, es_PY, es_SV, es_US, es_UY, es_VE.
-es.lang file for Puppymenu-translator (JWM menu taken from puppy-2.12beta)
-ROX options file, with common key shorcuts (F3->Find; F2->Rename; Ctrl+C->Copy; / -> Enter path/Path bar; Ctrl+N->New window; and much more in spanish)
-Clipart images

Now I'm having some problems, the sfs doesn't update seamonkey, scripts(pupget, input-wizard, etc), what can I do? dotpups only? sfs+dotpups?

Actual size of es_langpack_211.sfs 17 MB / unpacked size 49 MB / unpacked without seamonkey 6~7 MB.

CatmanDru wrote:

Maybe others already know this, but Debian and Ubuntu have Spanish translation sections and one thing they do is list possible words as translation candidates/choices. In my opinion, it seems reasonable, wise, and time-efficient to take guidance from the work they have already done, rather than start all over and decide those issues on our own, at least at this point. This would also produce some translation similarities and continuity in Puppy for users who are familiar with another distro.

Yes, there are many translation teams and some Debian and derivades langpacks. Seems easy take .mo files from that packages, but puppy is constantly updated, making a bit difficult complete the list from the beginning(I've already downloaded 2 spanish distros: Guadalinex and Archlinux, and I only have few .mo files matching with the software included in Puppy Rolling Eyes , so now I'm looking for sources)

sintot wrote:
Hi:
I have also the mo files for geany, gqview, gftp , gslapt, slapt-get, LinNeighborHood, sweep and xfe.

I have downloaded mtpaint, but it's not working, the same as inkscapelite (but I rememeber inkscape did work)

wow, I can upload them here and you can include it in your sfs

Please upload your files here ftp://ftp.servage.net/Localization-project/spanish/puppy-211/LC_MESSAGES you can use gFTP to do that.
If asks for user name and password type "puppy" for user and "linux" for password.

Webspace donated by Germanpup - up/down url: ftp://puppy:linux@ftp.servage.net/Localization-project/spanish/puppy-211/LC_MESSAGES
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wow

Joined: 29 Jun 2006
Posts: 985
Location: Peru

PostPosted: Sun 12 Nov 2006, 23:00    Post_subject:  

About standard spanish names for desktop icons KDE has these:

(snapshot from my currently puppy 109CE + spanish KDE)

Some problems related to accentuation:

With accents

Without


Temporal solution: do not use accentuation Sad

More screenshots:


1. Seamonkey 1.0.5 and JWMmenu
2. Spanish Rox showing keyboard shortcuts and pinboard
3. Abiword, Gnumeric, Gaim, Leafpad and X Server Chooser Wizard
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GuestToo
Puppy Master

Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 4078

PostPosted: Mon 13 Nov 2006, 00:19    Post_subject:  

try saving the script using utf-8 encoding

i had to put this line in my dotpup script to get it to display utf-8 characters:

export OUTPUT_CHARSET="utf-8"
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sintot


Joined: 29 Oct 2006
Posts: 57
Location: Madrid

PostPosted: Mon 13 Nov 2006, 15:19    Post_subject:  

Quote:
Please upload your files here ftp://ftp.servage.net/Localization-project/spanish/puppy-211/LC_MESSAGES you can use gFTP to do that.
If asks for user name and password type "puppy" for user and "linux" for password.

Webspace donated by Germanpup - up/down url: ftp://puppy:linux@ftp.servage.net/Localization-project/spanish/puppy-211/LC_MESSAGES


I've tried to upload files to that direction, but it's not working with gftp nor firefox (but it works in opera...). I'm behind a router. Does it matter?
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wjaguar

Joined: 21 Jun 2006
Posts: 241

PostPosted: Mon 13 Nov 2006, 15:57    Post_subject: mtPaint 3.02  

wow wrote:
-mtpaint 3.01 shows spanish and english menues Confused maybe updating to the next version works correctly?

Yes, this was one of things I fixed in the 3.02 release.
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wow

Joined: 29 Jun 2006
Posts: 985
Location: Peru

PostPosted: Mon 13 Nov 2006, 18:20    Post_subject:  

sintot wrote:

I've tried to upload files to that direction, but it's not working with gftp nor firefox (but it works in opera...). I'm behind a router. Does it matter?

Router? maybe, but if you have Winslows you can upload using MS Internet Explorer without problem Confused
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