Hi everyone,
I'm using my old man's first 'modern' laptop (Dell Latitude PP01L, see specs here) as a media center in our livingroom. Over the years I've been using various official releases of Puppy Linux and it's been an incredible experience - sometimes the old laptop outperforms my daily driver rig, which has an i5-760 and 4GB RAM inside it - Puppy is truly an amazing OS.
The one issue I have with it, and most variants I've seen, is that I'm the only person in the family who knows how to operate it. To give you some background: my dad can handle Zorin OS (and Windows, of course) just fine, he can get by with Linux Mint and possibly Ubuntu, and he struggles here and there with Lubuntu but again, does fine overall. He's dealing with tech for a living, but I get that it may be overwhelming to get used to new OS's at some point in life.
My mom, on the other hand, is a complete technophobe, still struggling with Android after years of daily use, and while she could, say, enter Facebook by pressing "that globe icon" and then get to Facebook through the bookmark I created for her - she's struggling to start a movie or do anything independently.
So my question is, and I'm sorry for the long introduction: Is there any Puplet you consider extra-easy to use? I've considered taking a step back from Puppy and try Kodibuntu (XBMC OS), but I assume it would be a serious overkill for the laptop. Do you have any suggestion for a Puppy variant that is a bit more streamlined, not as overwhelming, and a bit cleaner to look at than the official releases? I'm talking about stuff like having less menu entries for what is essentially basic settings, a cleaner arrangement of shortcuts on the desktop (maybe big tiles, sort of like Windows 8 but of course minus the demanding graphics, or a dock?)
I hope I'm getting my requirements across, and I hope such thing exists. Thank you for your incredible operating systems and community and thanks for any help.
Ideal Pup for an ancient PC and a technophobic family?
Only tidy pups I ever saw were simple pup and 2.02 regression.... they helped me keep it tidy on linux...unfortunately they are circa 2005-2006 so not much use.
Want tidier...go into /usr/share/applicatioins and delete the crud.
Right click on desktop icons and do the same. You will lose nothing apart from the confusion.
Then remaster...done.... you will make what you need...no one else will...even my trim pups will not suit.
Most here want as much clutter as possible.... drive icons have some sort of male envy status I gather so clean simple pups are hard to find.
Not sure if you can resize the icons...check rox options via right click.
Otherwise look into say xfce...can resize icons and menus are standard linux so easy to keep tidy.
A launch bar might be suitable although i tent to like taskbar quick launchers so windows don't get in the way. xfce4 is a bit like windows before it became odd so its familiarity may help.
just my thoughts
mike
Want tidier...go into /usr/share/applicatioins and delete the crud.
Right click on desktop icons and do the same. You will lose nothing apart from the confusion.
Then remaster...done.... you will make what you need...no one else will...even my trim pups will not suit.
Most here want as much clutter as possible.... drive icons have some sort of male envy status I gather so clean simple pups are hard to find.
Not sure if you can resize the icons...check rox options via right click.
Otherwise look into say xfce...can resize icons and menus are standard linux so easy to keep tidy.
A launch bar might be suitable although i tent to like taskbar quick launchers so windows don't get in the way. xfce4 is a bit like windows before it became odd so its familiarity may help.
just my thoughts
mike
Hi Ido...
Honestly, I don't think you'll find what you're looking for with Puppy. Although I haven't seen all of them, I haven't really seen a version that fits what you're describing. Of the distributions I've worked with, Puppy is one of the more "technically challenging," requiring, in my opinion, a higher skill level from the user. Just my opinion.
I use Lubuntu 14.04 currently and I find it pretty simple and straightforward. No icons on the desktop unless you want them and a fairly basic "Start menu." I've also found it less buggy than Puppy. However, if you want to try and stick with Puppy, it might be possible to remove any of the unnecessary icons and menu entries or whatever else you might need.
Regards...
Honestly, I don't think you'll find what you're looking for with Puppy. Although I haven't seen all of them, I haven't really seen a version that fits what you're describing. Of the distributions I've worked with, Puppy is one of the more "technically challenging," requiring, in my opinion, a higher skill level from the user. Just my opinion.
I use Lubuntu 14.04 currently and I find it pretty simple and straightforward. No icons on the desktop unless you want them and a fairly basic "Start menu." I've also found it less buggy than Puppy. However, if you want to try and stick with Puppy, it might be possible to remove any of the unnecessary icons and menu entries or whatever else you might need.
Regards...
Our Lord and Savior [url=http://peacewithgod.jesus.net/]Jesus Christ[/url] loves and cares about you most of all!
PLEASE READ! You don't have to end up [url=http://www.spiritlessons.com/Documents/BillWiese_23MinutesInHell_Text.htm]here![/url]
PLEASE READ! You don't have to end up [url=http://www.spiritlessons.com/Documents/BillWiese_23MinutesInHell_Text.htm]here![/url]
I actually have a fairly decent idea for a Pup that would accomplish this, but I haven't the skills or motivation (and I have too many other casual projects as well) to actually see it through.
If someone out there actually wants to do the coding (etc) for me (lots of gtkdialog, and some wacky stuff besides) then I can do the artwork required (custom iconset) and explain the rest... if anyone's interested, PM me and I'll give you the lowdown...
If someone out there actually wants to do the coding (etc) for me (lots of gtkdialog, and some wacky stuff besides) then I can do the artwork required (custom iconset) and explain the rest... if anyone's interested, PM me and I'll give you the lowdown...
@ardvark, do you think Lubuntu will run on this PC? It's been hard for me to find a Linux that is not Puppy-based capable of running on it
@Everyone else, do you have any idea for a distro that fits closer to home as far as my requirements go, even if it's not Puppy based then?
And anyways Macpup looks...cute. I'll try that for now I guess
@Everyone else, do you have any idea for a distro that fits closer to home as far as my requirements go, even if it's not Puppy based then?
And anyways Macpup looks...cute. I'll try that for now I guess
Hi Ido,
I would look at Wary or 431. I also prefer a clean desktop; just right-click on any icon and select "remove item". The menus are another matter, but if the principal users' usual apps are on the desktop, they wouldn't have to use the menus often.
If I recall correctly, when you load or unload an sfs, all the icons will come crowding back on next boot. So if you take this route, back up /root/Choices/ROX-Filer/PuppyPin when you get it how you like it.
I would look at Wary or 431. I also prefer a clean desktop; just right-click on any icon and select "remove item". The menus are another matter, but if the principal users' usual apps are on the desktop, they wouldn't have to use the menus often.
If I recall correctly, when you load or unload an sfs, all the icons will come crowding back on next boot. So if you take this route, back up /root/Choices/ROX-Filer/PuppyPin when you get it how you like it.
I would not say there is much you can do with any modern OS for someone who can barely make it to "press the globe-y icon to see the internet." The closest one is maybe Apple OS, on the desktop. Otherwise, I think you have it right already -- Android or some other mobile OS. Made for the idiot masses 
My mom has reluctantly become somewhat comfy about her iPhone. She finds the cryptic in-app symbols quite frustrating, though (and to tell you the truth, so do I - an icon should not be so abstracted that it looks nothing like the action. that's called "heiroglyphics" ...)
Older folks prefer simplicity, and failing that, familiarity. Ergo, on the desktop, Windows.
My mom has reluctantly become somewhat comfy about her iPhone. She finds the cryptic in-app symbols quite frustrating, though (and to tell you the truth, so do I - an icon should not be so abstracted that it looks nothing like the action. that's called "heiroglyphics" ...)
Older folks prefer simplicity, and failing that, familiarity. Ergo, on the desktop, Windows.
Customize it yourself.
To fix up the menu, just go to usr/shared/applications. This directory has all the *.desktop files that create the menu. Just move all the ones you want to no longer appear to another directory. Run "fixmenus" from the terminal to refresh the menu or restart the X server.
Just right-click and choose remove for the extra desktop icons.
Just doing that should make it a lot simpler.
To fix up the menu, just go to usr/shared/applications. This directory has all the *.desktop files that create the menu. Just move all the ones you want to no longer appear to another directory. Run "fixmenus" from the terminal to refresh the menu or restart the X server.
Just right-click and choose remove for the extra desktop icons.
Just doing that should make it a lot simpler.
Re: Ideal Pup for an ancient PC and a technophobic family?
Hmm,...a P3 at 1 GHz...Ido Wolf wrote:...I'm using my old man's first 'modern' laptop (Dell Latitude PP01L,...
For a P3, the Puppy 4 series had some nice offerings. The "Deep Thought"-themed distro's were especially elegant. There was a version of puppy-420 with the Deep Thought theme and an -rt preempt kernel which ran wonderfully well on my P3-800.
It all depends on what you consider to constitute "easy to use." And that very much depends on how much screen real estate you have.Ido Wolf wrote:...my dad can handle Zorin OS (and Windows, of course) just fine, he can get by with Linux Mint and possibly Ubuntu, and he struggles here and there with Lubuntu but again, does fine overall...My mom, on the other hand, is a complete technophobe, still struggling with Android after years of daily use,...
...Is there any Puplet you consider extra-easy to use?...I'm talking about stuff like having less menu entries for what is essentially basic settings, a cleaner arrangement of shortcuts on the desktop (maybe big tiles, sort of like Windows 8 but of course minus the demanding graphics, or a dock?)...
For small-screen netbooks, the Puppy standard, a rox desktop with a very simply-labelled array of icons, a simple tray which can legibly show but three or four apps open at a time, makes sense.
If you have a decent-size, say for example 24" 16:9 monitor, like mine, then in my opinion "easy to use" has a different definition. Ease of use is here defined as
1. System health and status acquireable at a glance,
and
2. App launcher and partitions filemanager readily available no matter how many windows clutter the screen,
and
3. Every open app readily findable and focusable, a windows-list readily available.
Allow me to introduce for your consideration my own tweak-product of Quirky Unicorn 6.21, on which I book guest-reservations for my orbital time-share condo:
http://i58.tinypic.com/2pq81w1.png
Please do view it in Firefox, click on the picture, then close the f******g ad at bottom and click View Raw Image then click the magnifier to bring it to 100% zoom, and be sure to F11 or Maximize for full-screen view, so you can see all that's there.
The first big change was to ditch jwm for openbox. Openbox gives you a windows-list when you middle-click anywhere on the open desktop, and the full Puppy menu when you right-click anywhere on the open desktop. Also, you can see the contents of windows that you are dragging. The Gelb theme gives you edge- and corner-grab-handles wide enough to actually use. I also use compton-jj and transset-df for a modicum of transparency (look closely at gkrellm), but without the garish wigglies that a monstrosity like Compiz assaults the eyes with.
Next, I added my own desktop-drive-icons-via-wbar .pet, so that no matter what is covering the screen there is a reasonable likelihood that I can still find an icon to call up a rox-filer window of any partition with.
A Thunar-type file manager has its uses too, especially when I need to mass-transfer from one directory to another with a lot of overwrites, a task which rox does not handle well. That's why the "file" icon at upper left which starts not Thunar but rather the creme-de-la-creme, spacefm. xfe and Double Commander are also in my file managers submenu. It would be nice to also have David McClamrock's wish file rusher 2011, does anyone happen to have a copy?
As for the panel, at the top...it is lxpanel. Simply the best. Clicking on the red square at right on lxpanel, brings up pprocess to kill feisty out-of-control runaway apps.
And yet, I find the complete panoply of lxde to be...like a straightjacket. The window manager (openbox) and panel (lxpanel) of lxde I'll take, but leave me out of the rest of it.
Moving around to the top right...pwidgets supplies the calendar and process monitor..."tiger" theme.
The pwidgets analog clock (xonclock) face is Plainclock-144 with the colors reversed (using irfanview-390 under wine, but you could also do it in Gimp). Use Plainclock as-is if that spot on your background is light-colored.
gkrellm is immediately beneath the clock, letting me know at all times how heavily each of my 4 cores is working, and whether there are ridiculously many procs in play, and what each core's temperature is, and whether or not my power supply is putting out the correct voltages (peace of mind is a big part of ease of use, to my way of thinking), and whether or not I have a wifi connection at the moment, and how fast.
And when the desktop app icons are obscured by running app windows, I can start my favorite apps from the wbar launcher tray at the bottom.
Really, it's all that anyone could ask.
Except, I doubt it would run with acceptable speed on a P3. (my machine is an i5-3770k).
And...once in awhile, the desktop drive icons freeze up, and it takes anywhere from 30 to 60 seconds for a rox window to appear.
And, the analog clock doesn't always start where I left it last time. So each time I reboot I must find it, and drag it to its place atop the gkrellm stack...*after* the wifi starts up, for this displaces the gkrellm stack.
This desktop took enormous time and effort to obtain. Openbox and lxpanel had to be compiled from scratch, no existing .pet was compatible with Quirky Unicorn.
Oh yes I also have Infinality Ultimate font rendering on it too, simply the best.
You may have noticed two Google Chrome icons in the wbar launcher tray. One is version 38, the other is version 40 necessary for Netflix (notice the Netflix icon in the desktop icons array. One click starts Netflix.)
The biggest improvement I can think of to make to it would be to give it an rt smp preempt kernel, and then start loading it with multimedia apps like Puppy Studio 1337 v2 does.
But that won't happen because Puppy/Quirky has a relatively poor-quality package management system.
No, my next Linux will either carry Synaptic, or it will be a rolling-release such as Arch.
And that is why I am so thrilled to be playing now with DebianDog.
Ah, excuse me...Bell Flight 14, you now can land; see you on Aldebaran...
Last edited by Keisha on Fri 13 Feb 2015, 04:51, edited 2 times in total.
“A wise man can learn more from a foolish question than a fool can learn from a wise answer.†--Bruce Lee
Take a look at BrowserLinux, made from Lucid Pup, I believe: http://www.browserlinux.com
It's pretty simple. Has an old Firefox, which might need to be updated. I used to run it with a 700MHz processor and 256M RAM. You might have problems with a newer browser or playing flash video, running out of RAM.
It's pretty simple. Has an old Firefox, which might need to be updated. I used to run it with a 700MHz processor and 256M RAM. You might have problems with a newer browser or playing flash video, running out of RAM.
My apologies, I didn't think to check the specs of your laptop.Ido Wolf wrote:@ardvark, do you think Lubuntu will run on this PC? It's been hard for me to find a Linux that is not Puppy-based capable of running on it
No, you're right, Lubuntu (probably any version but especially 14.04,) would not run well, if at all, on your particular system. Apart from purchasing a newer system, I think your options are definitely limited. Try some of the other suggestions mentioned on this thread and see of they help.
Regards...
Rule one on this forum...never ask for opinions.... info overload 
Browserlinux ...might be a good option.
I have 2 pentium 3s here.... actually use slax6 with xfce4 desktop as default... and only used sfs files (and non of this weird desktop changing mentioned!!! is that really hapoening..I am missing so much of this stuiff) so menu is clean and a few icons only.
ram and flash ..10.0 and possibly 10.1 stream to /tmp...so if that has space you are ok. Either way swap space is a good idea if you don't have already.....either file or partition.
Otherwise customise yer fav pup.
By the way mad woman and 2 medium sized boys to pamper to...
mike
Browserlinux ...might be a good option.
I have 2 pentium 3s here.... actually use slax6 with xfce4 desktop as default... and only used sfs files (and non of this weird desktop changing mentioned!!! is that really hapoening..I am missing so much of this stuiff) so menu is clean and a few icons only.
ram and flash ..10.0 and possibly 10.1 stream to /tmp...so if that has space you are ok. Either way swap space is a good idea if you don't have already.....either file or partition.
Otherwise customise yer fav pup.
By the way mad woman and 2 medium sized boys to pamper to...
mike
Yes, Deep Thought 420, Puppy 431 or the 'Retro' Lupu 525 - 2.6.30.5v4.
Also, for most people who start with computer's for the first time - or just do not wish to get involved - why not customize the desktop icons so they don't look so strange and uninviting? Scan or photograph images which are familiar to them - large simple objects -such as a portrait image of someone they wish to Skype, or A familar DVD cover, etc. Then reduce the image down to midi-icon size (48x48) saved as a .PNG. Back up the original icons with an added 'backup' text - for instance, the home48.png will now be home48backup.png. Place the familiar resized images into the same folder, but use the original image names. The icons will show up on the desktop but with an easily recognized (for them) theme.
Also, for most people who start with computer's for the first time - or just do not wish to get involved - why not customize the desktop icons so they don't look so strange and uninviting? Scan or photograph images which are familiar to them - large simple objects -such as a portrait image of someone they wish to Skype, or A familar DVD cover, etc. Then reduce the image down to midi-icon size (48x48) saved as a .PNG. Back up the original icons with an added 'backup' text - for instance, the home48.png will now be home48backup.png. Place the familiar resized images into the same folder, but use the original image names. The icons will show up on the desktop but with an easily recognized (for them) theme.
Pizzasgood's Puppy-421-multiuser with the Deep Thought theme,
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=47409
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=47409
“A wise man can learn more from a foolish question than a fool can learn from a wise answer.†--Bruce Lee
Since Macpup was mentioned by the OP and My IBM 1000HZ P3 with 256MB ram flew OK on what I will post below. This was way before I sold it.
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=30252
On my Pansonic CF-48 with beefier specs. Well. I triple boot it with LightHouse 4.43, XP, and
http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions ... ost5236866
What the LightHouse Puppy looks like on that Panasonic.
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 706#802706
Like mikeb said
Good luck with it and Happy Trailz, Rok
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=30252
On my Pansonic CF-48 with beefier specs. Well. I triple boot it with LightHouse 4.43, XP, and
http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions ... ost5236866
What the LightHouse Puppy looks like on that Panasonic.
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 706#802706
Like mikeb said
It pretty much applies to thread like these.Rule one on this forum...never ask for opinions.... info overload Very Happy
Good luck with it and Happy Trailz, Rok