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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Additional Software (PETs, n' stuff) » Multimedia
pBurn 4.3.19
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B.K. Johnson

Joined: 12 Oct 2009
Posts: 768

PostPosted: Thu 07 May 2015, 20:23    Post subject:  

Hi All

While waiting for the tahr/ffmpeg issue to be resolved I booted up slacko-5.7. It had pburn-4.3.4 and used ffmpeg It worked but I found the process slow although the output was acceptable. Pardon me Zigbert if the latest update makes my comments below moot.

I settled on making a CD of 9 .mp3 files occupying 54MB. I got no help at all from pburn as to whether I'd be over or end up having lots of unused space. I still don't know for partview didn't display the CD details. I recall that in my other life, Windows CD making apps like Nero, Real Player and others used some algorithm to estimate the space each selection would take and interactively adjust the free space. pburn doesn't and couldn't because it assumes every burn is of the same type and simply keeps adding the amount of space the file occupies on disk. That graphic doesn't change when the user finally identifies that the mode is a Audio CD burn. Too late! pburn doesn't determine the kind of burn sufficiently early in the process. This needs a "re-think".

The interval between cuts seemed long. Maybe it is the standard but I would have loved to be able to adjust it. It also seemed to me that the volume was a shade lower than a straight compilation of mp3 tracks for computer play.
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tahrpup-6.0.2 PAE, slacko-5.7, frugal install, pupsave file, multi OS flashdrive, SYSLINUX boot, CPU-Dual E2140, 4GB RAM
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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 3407
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Thu 07 May 2015, 21:07    Post subject: ffmpeg libraries are only available in theory
Subject description: Suggest pBurn be modified to use libav etc.
 

Hi again B.K. Johnson,

Both Ubuntu and debian now employ what had been the libav fork. As Slackware is sometimes said to take a more conservative approach to changes, I added "Slackware" to my google search. The most recent posts that revealed were those on this Forum. Indeed, googling "ffmpeg source" reveals that ffmpeg.org now employs the libav libraries. It may be argued that Ubuntu and debian may have misrepresented that "ffmpeg was deprecated" when they first made that statement. But as of today, I have to wonder what distro is using it?

One of the objectives Barry K had in mind when he developed woof was to ease the burden of application development for Puppy by enabling the use of other distro's binaries. Precise, Raring, Tahr, Unicorn, and Vivid are all built from Ubuntu binaries. Wheezy is built from debian binaries. Almost every Pup first published within the last two years are remasters of these; the exceptions being Fatdog64, the Carolinas, Slacko, and Barry K's newest. With those possible exceptions, current Puppies do not natively use the ffmpeg's libraries.

Ffconvert, winff --see my post at http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=751674#751674-- and even ffmpeg, itself, all can be configured to use libav libraries.

I leave it to the experts as to whether a current version of ffmpeg using ffmpeg rather than libav libraries can even be compiled to work with recent Pups? and what complications doing so would present when the other multimedia applications native to those Ubuntu and debian based Pups expect the libav libraries to be present.

Perhaps I'm wrong. I'm just an explorer. I don't compile and have only a rudimentary knowledge of scripting. But is seems to me that the only benefit to be gained would appear to be the continued utility of the zigbert's fine applications. And I repeat fine. My experience has been that zigbert's creations have often been as good or better than analogous applications while utilizing fewer resources.

But that said, I strongly hope zigbert is interested in examining his creations with the possible goal of modifying them so that they can employ libav libraries at least as alternatives.

mikesLr
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SFR


Joined: 26 Oct 2011
Posts: 1737

PostPosted: Fri 08 May 2015, 11:59    Post subject:  

Hey Zigbert

When select all items in "Add data from here..." tree using Alt+A and add them to "...burn content of the list" tree, that includes also .. and in effect parent directories gets added as well.
Have a look at the screenshot - dirs like archive, aufs, etc, home, lib and so on.

This works for me, however I don't know the code as much as you do, so I'm not sure if it's the best way:
Code:
# diff -u func_org func
--- func_org   2015-05-08 16:54:01.033224803 +0200
+++ func   2015-05-08 16:56:53.073220047 +0200
@@ -676,6 +676,7 @@
 -add)
    #---
    if [ "$BUTTON" != "3" ] || [ "$CHOOSER" = ".." ]; then exit; fi
+   CHOOSER="${CHOOSER#..}"
    cut -d '|' -f 4 $WORKDIR/ls > $WORKDIR/tmp2
    if [ ! "$CHOOSER" ] && [ "$ADD" = "$(gettext 'Add selection') [$(gettext 'right click')]" ]; then #nothing is selected
       echo -n > $WORKDIR/tmp
#


Btw, multiple selection would be also useful in "...burn content of the list" tree.
Or at least a button to remove all entries at once.

Thanks &
Greetings!
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zigbert


Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 6595
Location: Valåmoen, Norway

PostPosted: Fri 08 May 2015, 13:32    Post subject:  

according to phoronix, ffmpeg is returning to Ubuntu (and maybe Debian)
https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTg0NDY
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTYxNjA

I see no reason to extend the poor pBurn-support of libav if this information is correct.

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zigbert


Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 6595
Location: Valåmoen, Norway

PostPosted: Fri 08 May 2015, 13:35    Post subject:  

SFR
I'll look at your report, but right now - no time.

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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 3407
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Fri 08 May 2015, 15:22    Post subject: ffmpeg isn't ffmpeg  

Hi zigbert,

This involves the problem of using "sloppy language" which has followed discussions concerning ffmpeg and avconv since the fork. Posts continued to talk about ffmpeg even when the applications were using libav libraries.

Now the maintainers of ffmpeg are themselves using libav libraries. https://www.ffmpeg.org/documentation.html, Scroll down to "Libraries Documentation", If you follow the Phoronix link to Ubuntu's Launchpad, you'll find that while the title is "ffmpeg package in Ubuntu" the libraries are libav.

I don't know what to make of Phoronix's debian discussion. The links from there lead to a 'bug report' and what seems to be an unofficial compilation of a "non-libav" ffmpeg. Phoronix says "The latest comment at the time of posting is calling for the FFmpeg Debian package to be uploaded to the "experimental" archive."

Perhaps I haven't searched long enough, but as of today's date --May 8, 2015-- I was unable to find anything which suggests that even that limited call was implemented.

As of today's date, the use of libav libraries is the standard in both Ubuntu and debian builds. A return to ffmpeg libraries remains speculative.

mikesLr
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B.K. Johnson

Joined: 12 Oct 2009
Posts: 768

PostPosted: Fri 08 May 2015, 16:37    Post subject:  

@zigbert
@666philb

Guys, please make it easy for me Wink .

The last version of pburn series 3 prresumably runs with ffmpeg.

pburn 3.7.18 was offered with tahrpup-6.0.2 OOTB but without ffmpeg.

The version of pburn in PPM (Tahr repository - think it is 4.0.5) can't be downloaded from PPM.

Since pburn-4.3.13 is gnerally workng can't a pet be made with the replacement for ffmpeg. I don't have a problem using the latest - as long as it works.

What do I have to do? Switch to another puppy or dust off my Windows XP and run Nero Crying or Very sad ?

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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 3407
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Fri 08 May 2015, 20:28    Post subject: Possible workaround for missing ffmpeg --BIG MAYBE !!!  

Hi B.K. Johnson,

Currently posting from Tahpup 6. I downloaded and --after extracting-- made a VERY CURSORY examination of the files in the pBurn 3.7.18.pet, which is the one built into Tahrpup.
usr/bin/pburn consists of a script to execute /usr/local/pburn/pburn. That file is a bash script and within /usr/local/pburn are a number of other bash scripts. I opened each in the geany. I DID NOT ATTEMPT TO FOLLOW THE LOGIC OF THE SCRIPTS as would be necessary to modify the application. I just searched each script to
(a) find out if any made specific call to libraries, themselves. None did.
(b) to locate how ffmpeg was used. My cursory examination suggested that ffmpeg was just being called as one would call a module without giving it any special arguments. [This is a tentative conclusion since, as aforesaid, I did not attempt to follow the logic of the scripts].

As I mentioned in a previous post, avconv was a fork from ffmpeg. It was taken by those who were already familiar with ffmpeg. Under such circumstance, there is a strong likelihood that avconv is more in the nature of a variation of ffmpeg than an application built "from scratch" to perform the same tasks as ffmpeg. If that's the case, it may be possible to fool pBurn into making calls to avconv when its script requires calls to ffmpeg

Caution 1: I have not tested this by attempting to burn an audio CD or copy/shrink a video DVD. I have no present reason to do either. It may not be necessary, but it may be prudent to backup your SaveFile if you are not running your Pup having followed jpeps' instructions to avoid Automatic Saves,

Caution 2: The following procedure makes a system-wide change. Every application which by default calls ffmpeg will "think it present" and be compelled to use avconv in its place; and if it can't such application may not work at all. [This is why it would be better to modify pBurn to use avconv as an alternative]. Before applying the following work-around, I recommend starting all multimedia applications and, if they provide an option to use avconv, set them to do so.

In Tahrpup 6 --and I believe every other Pup-- avconv is found at /usr/bin. Open rox and browse to /usr/bin.
Right-click an empty space and from the drop-down menu, select Windows>Terminal Here. A terminal will open. Create a symlink, named ffmpeg, to avconv. The code to type in the terminal is:

ln -s avconv ffmpeg

Press return.

Restart X in order for your OS to reload executables, including the file named ffmpeg.

If you start pBurn now, and click "Help>Dependency Check" from its top menu, pBurn will report that ffmpeg is "OK".

I am uncertain why pBurn even requires ffmpeg simply to burn audio or video files from some location to a CD/DVD. IIRC, I've used pBurn from Tahrpup to burn ISOs to CDs and DVDs. It would be entirely different story were we discussing pMusic or other "p"-applications which, I assume, employ audio and/or video libraries in order to play files. But if pBurn only tests for the presence of ffmpeg before it will run some modules, or if avconv is sufficiently like ffmpeg to be used by pBurn, then creating a symlink to avconv should work.

If you try this, let us know whether it works, and whether it generates problems with other applications.

mikesLr
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zigbert


Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 6595
Location: Valåmoen, Norway

PostPosted: Sat 09 May 2015, 04:51    Post subject:  

pBurn is using ffmpeg to convert audio/video files to correct format for CDDA, VCD or video-DVD. Ffmpeg has nothing to do with burning itself. You can burn/copy iso/data without ffmpeg.

Using avconv should work for basic stuff, but avconv has evolved from ffmpeg with its own command parameters, that obvious gives trouble... Since the big distros tends to use ffmpeg (at least for future releases), that is the logical 'lib' to support. Ffmpeg has also been supported by samsung by resources, and it seems to me that the development in ffmpeg is steady.

pBurn shows all executing commands (for burning and for pre-burning operation as ffmepg) in the advanced tab of the burn options dialog (what shows up after pressing the burn-button in the main window). This is handy for debugging, improvements and for spreading knowledge.

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zigbert


Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 6595
Location: Valåmoen, Norway

PostPosted: Sat 09 May 2015, 04:58    Post subject:  

I don't know why TahrPup isn't using generation 4 of pBurn, but it might be the case it requires cdrtools-3. - It does not support cdrkit anymore. I would recommend switching to pBurn 4 of one simple reason: Discs are compatible with Windows versions more recent that Windows 98.
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zigbert


Joined: 29 Mar 2006
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Location: Valåmoen, Norway

PostPosted: Sat 09 May 2015, 05:14    Post subject:  

SFR wrote:
When select all items in "Add data from here..." tree using Alt+A and add them to "...burn content of the list" tree, that includes also .. and in effect parent directories gets added as well.
Have a look at the screenshot - dirs like archive, aufs, etc, home, lib and so on.

This works for me, however I don't know the code as much as you do, so I'm not sure if it's the best way:
Code:
# diff -u func_org func
--- func_org   2015-05-08 16:54:01.033224803 +0200
+++ func   2015-05-08 16:56:53.073220047 +0200
@@ -676,6 +676,7 @@
 -add)
    #---
    if [ "$BUTTON" != "3" ] || [ "$CHOOSER" = ".." ]; then exit; fi
+   CHOOSER="${CHOOSER#..}"
    cut -d '|' -f 4 $WORKDIR/ls > $WORKDIR/tmp2
    if [ ! "$CHOOSER" ] && [ "$ADD" = "$(gettext 'Add selection') [$(gettext 'right click')]" ]; then #nothing is selected
       echo -n > $WORKDIR/tmp
#


Btw, multiple selection would be also useful in "...burn content of the list" tree.
Or at least a button to remove all entries at once.
Your fix is added. Thanks!

When it comes to multiselection in the burn-list, - I simply don't dare to do it. It would require a lot of work and testing, and pBurn is stable atm.

To clear the burn-list, choose 'New' from the 'File' menu

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zigbert


Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 6595
Location: Valåmoen, Norway

PostPosted: Sat 09 May 2015, 06:23    Post subject:  

Version 4.3.14
See main post

Changelog
- Bugfix: Add items (when all items is selected) includes parent dirs. (thanks to SFR)
- Bugfix: Import music playlist doesn't autoset correct burn-mode to Audio. (thanks to don570)

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B.K. Johnson

Joined: 12 Oct 2009
Posts: 768

PostPosted: Sat 09 May 2015, 20:53    Post subject:  

@mikeslr
I am extremely grateful for sticking with me on this one. I really appreciate it.

I already backed up my pupsave, save interval is set to 0 and Ask to Save/Not Save is active, so no harm is likely. Nevertheless I'll search for jpeps' instructions to avoid Automatic Saves, as you recommend.

Re Caution 2. don't think there is any need to worry. ffmpeg does not exist in tahrpup-6.0.2. If any of the media apps I use regularly needed it they would have barfed already. The only one I needed to check was ffconvert. The conversion failed I suspect because of missing ffmpeg - see screenshot.

I'll try setting up the symlink later tonight or in the morning and report on that. Report on success/failure with the burn will be on Monday as I wan't to buy some rewritables to try the audio CD burn.
You wrote:
Quote:
I am uncertain why pBurn even requires ffmpeg simply to burn audio or video files from some location to a CD/DVD. IIRC, I've used pBurn from Tahrpup to burn ISOs to CDs and DVDs.

I too have had success with ISOs to CDs and DVDs, The difference I think is that in burning an audio CD, the mp3, WAV, ogg etc have to be converted to an audio format (CD-DA) that is designed specifically for CD players. Not the same as computer audio file type.

B.K. Johnson
tahrpup-6.0.2 PAE, slacko-5.7, frugal install, pupsave file, multi OS flashdrive, SYSLINUX boot, CPU-Dual E2140, 4GB RAM
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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 3407
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Sun 10 May 2015, 15:33    Post subject: ffmpeg under Tahrpup continued  

Hi again B.K.Johnson,

After considering zigbert's clarification of the current status of ffmpeg under Tahrpup, I tried unsuccessfully to cobble together an application for Tahrpup using Trusty Tahr debs. I'll try again. But that is really a job for someone with the necessary expertise.
Regarding jpep's instructions, you'll find them here. http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=662326#662326, IIRC, Tahrpup & derivatives use shinobar's PupSaveConfig, so step 3 --editing /etc/rc.shutdown -- isn't necessary. But its best to double-check. After applying steps 1 & 2, Save and reboot. Then reboot or shutdown. If you don't receive a message "already saved" then all is well.
I couldn't find a way to configure ffconvert to use the avconv libraries either. That's one reason I installed winff. Instructions here: http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=91433&sid=1fd386e2df34b48a153512c23a271c0f

If the experimentation doesn't work, winff apparently enables a conversion of audio files to "WAV for CD". I don't know what that means. Nor do I have any idea how far that might get you toward creating an audio CD.

mikesLr
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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
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Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Mon 11 May 2015, 16:17    Post subject: Problem with TahrPup > Try VividPup  

Hi B.K. Johnson & All,

Thanks to zigbert pointing me in the right direction regarding Ubuntu's handling of ffmpeg, whatever else it may mean (or not) Ubuntu has officially returned to packaging ffmpeg in Vivid Vervet.
Using Vivid Vervet binaries, 666philb has packaged vividpup, albeit still at beta. http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=832286#832286

Among vividpups builtins are pBurn 3.7.18 and ffconvert 1.4.2, along with most of the libs used to provide functionality to ffmpeg. See accompanying screenshot. ffmpeg, itself, is not builtin. However, ffmpeg_2.5.4 and all the libs specified in the screenshot can be downloaded and installed via Puppy Package Manager.

Whether pburn can make use of vivid's ffmpeg, and whether vivid's ffmpeg debs can be packaged for use in Tahrpup remains to be seen.

Update: Switched into TahrPup as I didn't have PaDS installed in VividPup. PaDS is an application by Lazy Puppy which can combine pets and debs --in this case the aforementioned ffmpeg and its libraries debs-- into an SFS. Built an SFS and loaded it on the fly into Tahrpup. Restarted X to reload the system. Started pBurn and ran its dependency checker it Help Menu. pBurn reported that ffmpeg was "OK".
Having I have no audio files to burn to a CD, I decided to test the ffmpeg sfs by installing winff and attempting to convert a video clip from one format to another. It failed in both Vivid and Tahr complaining of "a" missing library. Opening a terminal at /usr/bin and entering the command "ldd ffmpeg >/root/missing-libs.txt" generated a report of about a dozen missing libs. Oddly, more were missing from Tahr than from Vivid. I'll try to hunt them down.
Obviously, as is often the case when trying to use applications built for Ubuntu in Puppy, the stated dependency list leaves out structures presumed to be present as part of the Ubuntu OS.

PPM was able to identify and download probably all debs relating to the missing libraries. The deb count is now up to 26, so I'll wait until I have a reasonable amount of time to concentrate on trying to build an SFS. After the SFS is built, I'll have to mount it and create symlinks as the available debs, in several cases, appear to contain newer libraries than those reflected as missing. I have to wonder if the effort is worth it. I've used the word probably as, while in most cases, a PPM search for "libXYZ" found such lib with a description indicating it related to ffmpeg, in a couple of instances I had to drop "lib" from the search term to find anything which might be relevant, and then guess which pertained. And, of course, even if those found were the right ones, trying to employ them may reveal other missing libraries.

PPM does have an option to download a deb and all its dependencies. The problem with using it is that Puppy isn't Ubuntu and PPM isn't Synaptic. "All dependencies" may include debs for modules Puppy doesn't need and/or files which will conflict with those Puppy requires.

As I said before, creating an ffmpeg application for Puppy is something best undertaken by experts having familiarity with both Puppy and ffmpeg. And the best way is probably to compile ffmpeg in Puppy along with its dependencies and libraries rather than to try to cobble together a bunch of Ubuntu debs.

mikesLr
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