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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Hardware » Networking
Samba & LAN giving problems since changing ISPs.....
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Mike Walsh


Joined: 28 Jun 2014
Posts: 2752
Location: King's Lynn, UK.

PostPosted: Tue 19 Jan 2016, 17:39    Post subject:  Samba & LAN giving problems since changing ISPs.....
Subject description: Networking woes...
 

Evening, all. Got a little bit of a poser here, and I'm hoping more knowledgeable heads may be able to advise.

If you look at the diagram at the foot of this post, this is the layout for my home LAN. Quite simple; just two machines, a printer, and of course, the router.

The Dell laptop runs XP and X-Slacko 2.3.2. The 'big' Compaq desktop runs XP, and four Pups (Tahrpup 6.03; 'Chromebook' Pup - based on Precise 5.7.1; the classic Slacko 570, and, again, X-Slacko 2.3.2 - 'cos I love 570, and it's even better with the XFCE desktop).

All four Pups on the Compaq run Samba, and X-Slacko on the Dell does too. This is so that no matter which Pup is running on the Compaq, I can use the Dell to link into the main file system on the PC.....including access to the various external hard drives & printer, etc.

Until yesterday, we'd been with British Telecom since time out of mind, really. Their pricing is getting absolutely ridiculous, so for the first time ever, we've switched.....to TalkTalk (formerly Tiscali, now a sub-division of Carphone Warehouse). This means getting a new router. The ones supplied by UK ISP's are not at all bad; there's nowhere near as big a market for separate routers in this country as there is in, say, the States.

Anyway; to the problem. Normally, the Compaq can see & access shares on the Dell lappie, and access the router settings. The Dell will see & access shares on the Compaq, print to the printer via the network, and access the router settings.

Since changing over yesterday, things have altered slightly. The Compaq can still see & access the Dell.....but it cannot access the router for some reason.

The Dell, on the other hand, can access the router, can still print to the printer via the network.....but now can't see, or access shares on the Compaq. I've restarted Samba several times on both the Compaq and the Dell, but this hasn't made any difference. None of the Samba settings have changed in any way.

I'm suspecting the new router is the culprit, or at any rate, something not quite right with the ethernet connection; although, since printing works fine, and internet access works great, I'm guessing some of the default settings may need a bit of tweaking to set them up correctly.....but this is where I come unstuck. Networking is one of the very few areas I understand imperfectly, if at all.....and I really don't want to muck things up so they won't work. I'm fairly computer savvy, but I could do with some clear, simple suggestions as to what to try here..!

Any suggestion or ideas on this matter will be, as usual, much appreciated.


Mike. Wink
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gcmartin

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PostPosted: Tue 19 Jan 2016, 19:09    Post subject:  

Modems connect your network to any ISP (the internet). Many ISPs of today offer a wireless modem-router as a feature of their service. Usually when an ISP is changed, they send out their own modem. This provides a pathway from your home to the ISP's internet services.
  • Did the new ISP do so?
  • If so, did you merely replace the old modem with the new?

Some ISP offer a device which is a combination modem-router. Thus one-half of the device connects to the ISP while the other connects and services your home LAN.
  • Do you get one of these "combination" modem-router?
  • If not, then your diagram should show how your picture's router connects to the internet via the new ISP.
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Mike Walsh


Joined: 28 Jun 2014
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Location: King's Lynn, UK.

PostPosted: Tue 19 Jan 2016, 20:03    Post subject:  

Hi, gc.

Yep; when we switched over, I disconnected the old BT router (which acts as an internet portal, and a LAN access point), and replaced it with the one supplied by our new ISP, TalkTalk. This acts in precisely the same way.

Interestingly, I've now discovered the new router shows an additional entry if you go into 'Network Connections' in XP. I now have an entry for an 'Internet Gateway'.....which we didn't have with the BT router (which, by the way, was a far more advanced piece of kit).

What's the purpose of this? It appears to be able to let multiple machines 'share' a single broadband connection.....but isn't that what a router is supposed to do anyway?

As I say, internet access between the Compaq and the router is working perfectly.....and the Dell lappie is able to print remotely, via the LAN; yet at the same time, it just won't see the 'shares' on the Compaq any longer. One is getting a teensy bit 'miffed'..!

Any recommendations? The diagram is merely something I knocked together to illustrate the layout; I'm one of these individuals who gets a better idea with a diagram, rather than somebody trying to describe things to me.....I'm not that good at picturing things in my head, I'm afraid!


Mike. Wink

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gcmartin

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PostPosted: Tue 19 Jan 2016, 20:57    Post subject:  

OK, your router is (and was) a combination modem and router built into a single unit.

One part of that unit connects to the ISP (the internet) while the other part supports operations on your LAN and is the pathway (gateway) to the modem side to the internet.

Now, your new unit also will service ANY LAN device (wired/wireless) that is in your home via its router component. The requirement is that any home device MUST ask for his/her credentials to be given from your router. In a wireless environment where a password is required, this is a good example. When you give the password, the router will pass credentials to the wireless device so that it can navigate the local network. Similarly (but without a password requirement) a wired unit will ask and it will receive credentials so that it can navigate the local network.

Now that you understand that, the next issue is to try and determine how your devices are behaving with this new modem-router. Particularly why the credentialing which use to work from the old unit are not working coming from this new unit.

Is there any possibility that you have done something with firewalls? And I assume both PCs can access the internet from either of its operating systems (Linux & Windows); True or False?

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Mike Walsh


Joined: 28 Jun 2014
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PostPosted: Wed 20 Jan 2016, 06:25    Post subject:  

Morning, gc.

Absolutely nothing has been changed, on either machine, before or after the ISP change and router swap. In other words, they changed us over, and I swapped routers. The only thing that changed was the wi-fi password.....and that's now been reset back to my original password that I know off the top of my head!

(And before you say it, yes; I am aware it's not a good idea to use the same password for too long. I usually change it every 6 months or so.)

Both machines can happily access the internet from either OS. The Pups are using the standard firewall as they always have done; the Win XP installs use Comodo's free Firewall (which I've used for several years).

But to re-iterate the point, gc, the only thing that's changed is the ISP & router. The state of the machines & O/Ss is identical now to how it was a few days ago prior to the switchover. In that respect, nothing has changed.


Mike. Wink

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perdido


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PostPosted: Wed 20 Jan 2016, 13:23    Post subject:  

Quote:
Any suggestion or ideas on this matter will be, as usual, much appreciated.


I have read and re-read this thread and do not see the brand/model of the new router mentioned, and just a mention of the brand (BT?) of the old router, not that I am any good at troubleshooting network issues and that info may not be critical here?

Back to lurk mode zzzzzzzzzz

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gcmartin

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PostPosted: Wed 20 Jan 2016, 14:12    Post subject:  

Have you returned the old modem yet?

Reason: If not, it can be used to see the old routing tables used by the PC's versus how the routing tables look now.

If you have, not to fret. Every router provided by any ISP "is a firewall!"

So what you had/have is a firewall backed by another firewall on each PC. So even if you turn off your PC firewalls you STILL have protection. to the info on your LAN units. That being said, start by turning off the PC firewalls and try to route to the services that are currently missing. (As I understand, the missing service is ability to see folders from one PC to the next. Accessing your printer and internet is fine.)

Let us know if this fixes the problem. If so, then we can drill down on the firewall setups. In any event, we can go further.

BTW: Are you using static IPs on your LAN OR are you allowing each PC to request its IP from your router?

Hope this helps

P.S. I am not sure what you mean about your password issue. Is that in some way related to this problem?

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greengeek


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PostPosted: Wed 20 Jan 2016, 15:00    Post subject: Re: Samba & LAN giving problems since changing ISPs.....
Subject description: Networking woes...
 

Mike Walsh wrote:
The Compaq can still see & access the Dell.....but it cannot access the router for some reason.

The Dell, on the other hand, can access the router, can still print to the printer via the network.....but now can't see, or access shares on the Compaq.
Hi Mike - can you just clarify what you mean by "compaq...cannot access the router" - do you mean that you cannot get access to the administrator functions of the router by entering it's IP address into a browser?

Also - Are all of your PCs set for auto dhcp or do you have any of them set for static IP?
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Mike Walsh


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PostPosted: Wed 20 Jan 2016, 19:32    Post subject:  

Evening all.

Access is a wee bit fragmented at the moment! The new router (which is actually a Huawei HG633, supplied by the ISP), appears to be faulty.....as it is switching on and off completely at random. We've reported this to the ISP, and have requested a replacement; this will be with us in 3-5 working days.

------------------------------------------------------------

@gc, greengeek;

Each O/S is set to auto DHCP; this has never proved to be a problem in the past.

-------------------------------------------------------------

@gc;

You misunderstand me about the password.....it's not a problem. All I meant was that, naturally, with a new router, it's supplied with a different default password. This has been changed back to the one I'm currently familiar with.

The Epson Stylus SX 218 printer is USB only, permanently connected to the Compaq, and accessed solely through CUPS shared printer access. Works perfectly.

-------------------------------------------------------------

@greengeek;

The Compaq can access the router.....for all of about 5 seconds!.....then it returns me to the login page again. It does this over and over again, ad infinitum.....it won't remain in the settings for more than a matter of seconds. (?!)

The Dell laptop, on the other hand, accesses the router settings quite happily, and remains there after logging-on. (??)

EDIT (Thursday, 00.55 hrs): No idea what's been happening with all these random shutdowns and re-boots (firmware updating, perhaps? I don't really want to hazard a guess as to that..!), but the Compaq will now access the router settings as it should.....staying there after log-in. One problem fixed!


---------------------------------------------------------------

@perdido;

As I stated at the top of this post, the new router is a Huawei HG633; the old one is a British Telecom Infinity HomeHub5.

--------------------------------------------------------------

@Everybody;

Since the router appears to be faulty, I think I'd rather wait until the new one turns up, install that, and see whether it behaves itself. If the problems stated in this thread still persist, I intend to return here and seek assistance. Until the problem with the random shut-downs is resolved, I don't in all honesty see that we can accomplish much more for the moment.

Thanks, everybody, for your interest. Watch this space.....!


Mike. Wink

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Last edited by Mike Walsh on Wed 20 Jan 2016, 21:07; edited 3 times in total
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gcmartin

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PostPosted: Wed 20 Jan 2016, 20:56    Post subject:  

Ah! You have been in touch with your ISP. Good. BTW: Did your ISP have you move the PC's wire to a different plug?

When it arrives, please answer the other questions I ask, should the problems persist. I would envision that they should disappear. Thanks for answering the DHCP questions for us.

And is your printer that is USB connected to your Compaq, a wireless printer or USB only?

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Mike Walsh


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PostPosted: Wed 20 Jan 2016, 21:05    Post subject:  

@gc;

See above post for answer to your last query. I was editing when your last post came through.


Mike. Wink

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Mike Walsh


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PostPosted: Wed 20 Jan 2016, 21:40    Post subject:  

@gc;

One other point; to expand upon my statement about the HomeHub5 being a 'far more advanced piece of kit', have a read of this.....you'll see what I mean!

http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/networks/wireless-routers/1402896/bt-home-hub-5-review-the-fast-router-for-bt-broadband

The interesting stuff is on page 2.


Mike. Wink

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Mike Walsh


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PostPosted: Thu 21 Jan 2016, 14:03    Post subject:  

Well, that was quick.

Only explained the router was faulty to the call centre yesterday.....and the new one turned up today! So; I've swapped them over; touch wood, the new one appears to be behaving itself. Early days yet, though; the first one behaved itself for the first 18 hours or so.....

We'll see what happens. Haven't had a chance to check file-sharing yet; I'm in the middle of cooking dinner.

Watch this space.


Mike. Wink

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Mike Walsh


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PostPosted: Sun 24 Jan 2016, 09:22    Post subject:  

We have success..!

The new router is still behaving itself flawlessly. I've figured out one thing which was bugging me; TalkTalk's instruction booklet for the router is a bit on the basic side (doesn't tell you any of the technical details at all; I think it's been written for your average Joe Public.....who just wants to connect and be done with it!)

There'a row of lights along the top, which wink & flash at various times, depending on what the router's doing. All very pretty! See 1st diagram below.

The 2nd diagram shows night-time display. It's pretty obvious what's going on, although I'm a little bit bemused as to why wireless still shows, even though ethernet doesn't! The point being that the 'manual' specifically states that if any red lights are showing, something is wrong...

You can see Joe Public, less 'savvy' than most of us on here, getting worried that his nice new router has gone 'down the Swannee...'

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As for the firewall, well.....I've sussed that one out, too. For some reason, the Compaq's firewall got re-written somewhere along the way, and wasn't allowing the Samba-TNG port connection requests through from the Dell. So I've re-run the Firewall wizard; re-set the Samba-TNG exceptions .....and everything's behaving itself again. The Dell can once again see, and access, shares on the 'big' Compaq. Which was the major stumbling-block for me.

Sorted!


Mike. Wink
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rcrsn51


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PostPosted: Sun 24 Jan 2016, 09:37    Post subject:  

Mike Walsh wrote:
As for the firewall, well.....

This is why you should stop using a firewall on local machines. You are behind a router - the headaches caused by a local firewall are not worth the protection that you think it provides.

Quote:
Absolutely nothing has been changed, on either machine, before or after the ISP change and router swap

Really? Wink
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