New simple install & boot method - only 2 files needed.

[april]

OK Sorry I will go back and start again . I put the files on a CD not a stick so I have the wrong end of the stick I think.

[gcmartin]

I had reported earlier of the success in created Step 1 from the opening post. Then, 2GB stick was sacrificed as the Boot-manager (BM) and successfully tested.

My Step 2 follow-thru
Now, I am, 1st, reporting

1. to have taken a USB stick,
2. created a 10GB partition (ext4),
3. expanded the SFX file on the partition,
4. and in conjunction with the BM stick, I successfully booted the system as shown in the opening post of this thread.

Note: The /werewolf-7.4 folder is a mere 409MB on the 10GB partition.

Next, I am, 2nd, reporting

1. Moving the /werewolf-7.4 folder from the 10GB USB partition to a partition on the system's permanent internal drive,
2. and in conjunction with the BM stick, I successfully booted the system as shown in the opening post of this thread.

Note2: I suspect that it is possible, too, to merely expand the SFX to a any partition with space for the expanding files and the anticipated save-sessions.

Thanks @ETP for your demonstrating this effort to both developers and users in this community.

Wondering
Since the BM exist of a ISO9660 filesystem, the BM configuration is locked on that non-writable USB stick. As such, no additions or changes can be done to the system to allow additional distro boots by mods to the BM. I do understand the CSM requirement, though; still the inability to advance the system for addition tests and needs that would result from BM references, cannot be done.

[ETP]

Hi gc,

Thanks for your report. You should have found that writing the 5MB hybrid boot ISO takes less than 5 seconds and that the extraction of
the sfx file (left click) takes less than 3 minutes.
In addition the same simple code in isolinux.cfg has been used to boot with the extracted files held on either a hard disk partition or a USB stick.

Barry's use in init of code to quickly search for a single flag (Q_ID) has therefore eliminated the previous need to specify items such as:

UUID or PARTUUID
pmedia=
pupsfs=
pdev1=
psavemark=

The above is however not a complete list of Puppy boot codes that may be required and there is also the matter of kernel boot codes
such as "libata.force=noncq" to enable the use of fstrim with SSDs.

A second empty flag could possibly be added into which any other less frequently used Puppy boot codes such as acpi=off or p/qfix=nox could
be added by the user and parsed by init.

The other possibility which I would favour, is the use of a 16MB syslinux utility boot image similar to the one used in Rapid Pup V1.
That gives the user complete freedom to use any kernel boot codes or other Puppy boot codes that they may sometimes need.

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 567#832567

What is certain is that the current mass of Puppy boot codes and their various combinations whilst once fit for purpose have become
less so as it has become more common to deploy various elements of Puppy on different media/partitions.
Both new and seasoned members can find them something of a minefield.

Forum member gyro currently has a cutting edge thread with proposals to "Enhance boot params, pupsfs, zdrv, fdrv, adrv, ydrv, psave and Support UUID and partition Label".
That looks like great progress and is well worth a read.

At the end of the day it is up to the WoofCE coding "A" team as to what approach they opt to take and implement in code.
Do they improve upon what we already have or attempt a new approach to simplify matters?

[ETP]

New simple install & boot method - only 2 files needed. (Updated May 2018)

(Please read at least the first 2 posts in this thread for background information before proceeding)

It is hard to believe that almost 2 years have elapsed since my original post here.
IMHO Barry's Q_ID technique remains one of his best and most innovative creations that has the potential to greatly simplify the distribution
and initial boot method of Pups.

One thing that I omitted to point out in my previous posts is that the Q_ID flag contains a serial number that is unique to any given Pup.
The initrd.q held on the boot media contains that same number and searches all the available partitions on both fixed and removable drives until
it finds a Q_ID flag that contains that number. It then loads the main files from that partition.
Even with > 25 partitions that search only takes about 2 seconds.

The base files used in this (2018) proof of concept are from BarryK's Quirky Xerus64-8.5 k16.04.4 released 27th Feb 2018.
The 5MB hybrid boot ISO used in the original POC is replaced by a 16MB boot image that should be written to a SD card or USB stick.

The 1st File: ( 16MB boot image - boot_xerus64.img ) This task takes < 5 seconds.

This image file should be written to any old SD card or USB stick > 16MB using Window's Win32diskimager or Linux's dd command.
An old 2GB SD card is ideal and recommended.

If using dd the target must be unmounted. The code if the image is in your "Downloads" folder would be:

Code: Select all

dd if=/root/Downloads/boot_xerus64.img of=/dev/sdx && sync

Things to keep in mind:

If your card or stick is seen as sdc1 when plugged in, replace sdx in the above with sdc i.e. the device ID NOT the partition ID (sdc1)

dd will completely overwrite your card or USB stick: Any data on it will be lost so if you use this method you'll want to use it with a dedicated card or stick.

The card or stick should be placed at the top of your BIOS boot order.

The 2nd File: (Self_extract_xerus64-8.5.sfx) 528MB - (This task takes < 1 minute)

This compressed self extracting file (sfx) should be placed on an empty dedicated 8-10GB Linux HD/SSD/USB partition before left clicking it to extract the contents.
If using an SSD or USB stick, format the partition as f2fs. No flags need be set.
For this 2nd file, which contains the bulk of the files to be loaded into ZRAM the faster the device the better if a quick boot is required.
If available I would recommend a USB3 stick with a single f2fs partition.

The 1st file and the 2nd file, together with their MD5 sums plus 8 screenshots can be found in the 2018 folder here:

https://drive.google.com/folderview?id= ... sp=sharing

Final Thoughts:

1. At least 2GB of RAM is recommended with this method as everything is loaded into ZRAM.

2. Nothing has been removed from Barry's base Pup which is very well stocked and includes LibreOffice.

3. A few utilities have been added plus a highly tweaked version (settings & flags) of the latest Google Chrome - 66.0.3359.139 (Official Build) (64-bit)

4. If booted on a UEFI PC it must be in CSM mode with secure boot disabled.

5. The change to a boot image means that syslinux.cfg can easily be edited should any extra Quirky or kernel boot codes be needed.

6. Should you start by extracting the sfx onto a USB stick, the extracted files may be moved to a SSD or HD later if you so wish.

[quirkian2new]

hello ETP,

is it possible to extract the contents of the self-extracting-file onto NTFS partition or FAT32 partition ?

I have tried Quirky8.2 and put the "s.sfs" into initrd.q (However the resulting initrd.q is too large, i.e over 500 MB so it failed to boot)

thanks

[ETP]

Hi quirkian2new,

It is possible to extract the contents of the sfx file into the root of any partition that Linux can recognise which includes NTFS and FAT32.
If you have already extracted it onto a USB stick the folder "xerus64-8.5" can, with it's contents, simply be moved or copied over to a different partition.

Whilst a dedicated f2fs partition is IMHO ideal that partition need not even be empty. In my own case I have moved a copy of that folder between
different partitions on my second HD (SSD) one of which (sdb2) is a general purpose NTFS partition and contains a few GB of other files.
Another was sdb3 which is ext4 and contains Manjaro. Currently it resides in sdb10 which is an f2fs partition that also contains another Pup.

Once you have copied or moved the "xerus64-8.5" folder from it's original stick that stick should be unplugged and put to one side.
The original boot image card or stick is still used to boot from and requires no modification.

I do not recommend FAT32 as it is too slow which will become apparent when saving. NTFS is however on a par with non-jounaled ext4.

CAVEAT:

If you are contemplating using a Windows NTFS partition precautions MUST first be taken which vary depending on the Windows version.
Come back to me for details if that is the case.

[quirkian2new]

thanks, ETP,

extracted it onto a NTFS partition the folder "xerus64-8.5". this can work.

I cannot use keyboard however .

[ETP]

thanks, ETP,

extracted it onto a NTFS partition the folder "xerus64-8.5". this can work.

I cannot use keyboard however .

Hi quirkian2new,

Do you mean that the keyboard is not detected at all or that you get unexpected results when you press keys ?

If you are using a laptop did you turn off the numlock in QuickSetup so that the keyboard number overlay is not engaged ?

Do the log files accessible via PupSysinfo provide any clues ?

Have you tried the Mouse/keyboard wizard ?

[quirkian2new]

Hello ETP,

Yes, I got unexpected results when I pressed keys, for example when I pressed "m" , it came up with "0".

I remember that I have had similar issue when I tried another pupplet some time ago.

My laptop was a SONY VAIO and I think it was produced in year 2006....or so.

BTW, the same laptop keyboard works perfectly OK when I am using Quirky Xerus 8.2 of BarryK.

Thanks

[ETP]

Hi quirkian2new,

Barry normally issues Pups with the keyboard lock (In QuickSetup) turned off whilst I issue stuff with it turned on.
Just visit the menu item Setup/QuickSetup turn it off then reboot ensuring that you click on save.

With it on when using a netbook or laptop, the keyboard number overlay will result in the following:
U becomes 4
I becomes 5
O becomes 6
J becomes 1
K becomes 2
L becomes 3
M becomes 0

You can also toggle it off and on with the NumLock toggle button in the status tray but it should really be off when you boot up.

[april]

On google drive I could not get your files to download at all .
Couldn't you find a place that didn't rely on Microsoft?
Like Mega?

[technosaurus]

Hi quirkian2new,

Barry normally issues Pups with the keyboard lock (In QuickSetup) turned off whilst I issue stuff with it turned on.
Just visit the menu item Setup/QuickSetup turn it off then reboot ensuring that you click on save.

With it on when using a netbook or laptop, the keyboard number overlay will result in the following:
U becomes 4
I becomes 5
O becomes 6
J becomes 1
K becomes 2
L becomes 3
M becomes 0

You can also toggle it off and on with the NumLock toggle button in the status tray but it should really be off when you boot up.

Seriously? How is that a sane default?

[ETP]

@april,

I have double checked that my upload to Google Drive was good and suggest that you try again. Perhaps the Google
data centres in Taiwan & Singapore were having issues.
Failing that perhaps some kind forum member with a NZ mega account could mirror the files.
AU currently seems to sadly lack a Google data centre.

@technosaurus,

I concede that for the 50% of people who prefer it in the opposite state it makes no sense but the other 50% are probably sick of having to tick it.
The presence of the keyboard numlock tick box in Quick Setup allows for end users to exercise their hardware dependent choice.

The only sane thing here is the inclusion in the system tray of the indicator the shows the status of the numlock/overlay and a left mouse click on that toggles
the state. A laptop user could for example switch over to the embedded keypad if they were inputting loads of figures into a database or spreadsheet.

[ally]

they've been mirrored here:

http://archive.org/details/Puppy_Linux_Forum_Pets

[technosaurus]

@technosaurus,

I concede that for the 50% of people who prefer it in the opposite state it makes no sense but the other 50% are probably sick of having to tick it.
The presence of the keyboard numlock tick box in Quick Setup allows for end users to exercise their hardware dependent choice.

The only sane thing here is the inclusion in the system tray of the indicator the shows the status of the numlock/overlay and a left mouse click on that toggles
the state. A laptop user could for example switch over to the embedded keypad if they were inputting loads of figures into a database or spreadsheet.

People who want to override the BIOS default should set this in their BIOS. The ability for a user to easily override is fine, though pretty damn pointless since there is a key specific to that purpose and they are obviously planning to use the keyboard if they used it. I wish people would stop overriding user's preferred settings and requiring a workaround via a Rube Goldberg software implementation. Users have already exercised their choice in the BIOS (either by overriding or accepting the default) ... you are overriding that like an annoying Facebook policy update. ... Don't be like Facebook. The only sane thing is to respect the user's choice, not to override it and then make it necessary for them to jump through your hoops. Lots of people dual boot puppy/puplets and I'm confident that this would annoy most of them, especially if they specifically set it in their BIOS. If constantly checking the box is annoying, change the default in your BIOS (BIOS default should be the default BTW, not on or off... In other words do nothing)

[april]

they've been mirrored here:

http://archive.org/details/Puppy_Linux_Forum_Pets

:)

Thanks , I can see those but don't see the two files we are talking about?


Technosaurus
Chet Ramey
Any relation to Chet Atkins . One of the best guitar players I have ever heard until a recent bloke on the ABC whose name I have not learnt yet.
Oh damn You guys put your surname last don't you.

I always want my numblock ON! .....It deadens the nausea coming from the Government

[april]

@april,
I have double checked that my upload to Google Drive was good and suggest that you try again. Perhaps the Google
data centres in Taiwan & Singapore were having issues.
Failing that perhaps some kind forum member with a NZ mega account could mirror the files.
AU currently seems to sadly lack a Google data centre.

Well that site opens for me and I get the page below but nothing happens further . Cant see or download anything.
I commend Mega to you as a free site without the prying eyes and hoops of Google.

I have got to have another try at this and see if I can get something working .Will reread the previous summaries thanks.


Well I see it needs double clicks to get anything . I get the image file first and dd it onto my trial stick . That goes alright it seems but it wont load as a USB stick any more?
I let the machine boot from that and got up

Code: Select all

wee 0>find --set-root /grldr
wee 15> /grldr
wee 17.> -

Anyway I go download the sfx file to find it is massive ...500 Megabytes plus .
Nah... don't think this is useful to me in any way ABORT

[ETP]

Hi technosaurus,

It seems that you are harking back to the good old days of DOS when the numlock setting in the BIOS was respected by the OS.

In the case of Puppy and most mainstream Linux distros that is not the case so they provide alternate means of making one's choice.
(i.e. they ignore the state of the numlock setting in the BIOS)

The keyboard numlock tick-box provided by Barry within Quick Setup does not in my experience mirror the BIOS numlock state.
If it did it would be pre-populated with a tick as all of my boxes have it set to on. If users have made a choice within the BIOS it will be ignored.

This issue is a thorny one and some of the problems are well described in this 8 year old blog:
https://it.toolbox.com/blogs/locutus/wh ... nux-120309

The issue of users with alpha numeric login passwords is typically described in the following thread
which has a couple of screenshots showing the Linux Mint approach:
https://unix.stackexchange.com/question ... linux-mint

IMHO it makes sense for users to have only one port of call to exercise their choice but to provide a ready means
of easily toggling the state subsequently. There is no single correct answer. The addition of on-screen lock status
indicators is essential for wireless keyboards and laptops that frequently lack indicator leds.

[april]

So as a puppy user I get this self extracting file of 528 Megabytes containing barry's work and I'm thinking , well maybe there is a way for Puppy to open this .

After all this is a Puppy forum and we use Linux not Windows ,surely someone would not get in here and start promoting the use of Windows shit.

So how am I supposed to open this massive big download now?

You do not need 2 files ! Only one from below

http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=106460

[ETP]

@april

So as a puppy user I get this self extracting file of 528 Megabytes containing barry's work and I'm thinking , well maybe there is a way for Puppy to open this .
After all this is a Puppy forum and we use Linux not Windows ,surely someone would not get in here and start promoting the use of Windows shit.
So how am I supposed to open this massive big download now?

I suggest that you read the instructions again relating to the 2nd file & study the 8 screenshots provided one of which lists the extras added to the files taken
from Barry's base 415MB iso. http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 458#991458
This is not a full install as provided by his 541 MB xerus64-8.5-8gb.img.gz