I wouldn't argue what's normal and not about what's involved in setting up an internet connection. That's very subjective. However, bigpup talk about "to test for connection" being part of it. Sure, you can set up a connection without testing whether that connection actually works. But that's not the Puppy way. Now you may have missed that I said about what is involved in "testing for connections" - please see here (page 2 of this thread). Happy to hear your feedback if you think that's not right.MochiMoppel wrote:Hmmm..I doubt that for setting up an internet connection it is a normal, let alone necessary procedure.bigpup wrote:Puppy pinging the Internet, to test for connection, is a normal function of connecting to the Internet.
So what do you think Puppy is doing it for?MochiMoppel wrote:I even doubt that Puppy is using it for this purpose, but I can be wrong.
You're not really suggesting that we fire chrome before launching PPM just to test the connection, are you? From my other post here, I saidMochiMoppel wrote:Just fire up your browser, download manager or whatever tool you intend to use and try. If the internet is down, they will tell you with a meaningful error message - if they are properly designed.
To add to that, I recall vaguely (but not sure myself) that the pinging was originally added exactly because of that: because directly doing the operation when the network was on certain invalid state caused exactly the problematic delays I said above.jamesbond wrote:And sometimes, just by doing the job directly (e.g. in PPM, instead of pinging ibiblio.org; just do wget ibiblio.org if what you want to do is just to grab its contents) can result in an annoying user experience where the operation will eventually fail but it takes a very long time to do so. By pinging, we can (sort of) test the network connection and if it is not sufficiently good enough, we can fail fast and tell the user about that.
I can even give you a direct example, which I reported in slacko64 thread: if you fire slacko64 in qemu, the "firstrun" dialogbox will not show up (I waited for 10 mins). Why? because it was trying to do wget to ibiblio.org (perhaps to test for updates?); and that wget was hanging thanks to qemu's weired networking. I can only get the firstrun dialog if I open a terminal and "killall wget". You may claim that qemu is not a real hardware - that's beside the point. The point is, there are certain network states that can cause problems to hang indefinitely or a very long time, before finally failing and giving up. Of course, pinging is *not* the only way to handle this; but this is what Woof-CE has for the moment. If you have a better way, as mavrothal always say, "patches are welcome".
How true. Past performance is not an indicator of future performance. Just because your still have a heart beat a second ago does not mean in the next second you will still have it. Yet many people buy stock based on their past performances. And most likely you're still alive to read this post too. So yes, just because you've successfully ping a server a second ago doesn't mean that the internet is still up a second later. But *chances are*, it is.MochiMoppel wrote:If you need to know if your internet is running then pinging can get get you this information, but only for the exact moment you ping. Can change any moment and when you then send a request to a site you *really* want to connect to, then this ping information is as old as yesterday's paper.
One man's delicacy is someone else's poison. So choose your poison carefullyMochiMoppel wrote:As far as I can see nobody claimed that this is needed. But so is most of the information on the "Interfaces" tab. It's only an info dialog. I personally couldn't care less about my external IP address.
E.g. those people who like to the peer-to-peer VOIP calls while behind NAT router, they need the external IP address information. And I know a few of regular puppy users who do exactly this. Just because it's not useful for you doesn't mean it's not useful for others.