Same machine, as a matter of fact both desktop & laptop is doing the same thing. I tried DVD on the desktop & CD on the laptop. Currently using LiveDVD Multisession 1.07 on the desktop with no problem. HD install on LT, but LiveCD Multi on LT worked fine (1.07).
I tried what you suggested, same thing - will not boot ( I have the HD disabled in the BIOS ) says to insert bootable media.
Seems to be an 2.02 issue for me as other versions worked fine. (1.07 at least ).
Live-CD not booting after 1st boot
Well, shoot. 
Try enabling the HD in your BIOS but put the optical drive before the HD in the boot sequence. That way if you have a bootable CD or DVD in the drive the BIOS will boot that. If not it will go on to try to boot from the HD.
Try enabling the HD in your BIOS but put the optical drive before the HD in the boot sequence. That way if you have a bootable CD or DVD in the drive the BIOS will boot that. If not it will go on to try to boot from the HD.
[url=http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=69321][color=blue]Puppy Help 101 - an interactive tutorial for Lupu 5.25[/color][/url]
Try using magiciso to burn iso image to cd. It works fine without any problem.
http://www.magiciso.com/
http://www.magiciso.com/
Any resolution on second boot issue?
I'm having the same problem. Can't boot multisession CD.
First shutdown, tell it to save to cd.
Get the errors mentioned in previous posts
and the CD ejects. If I stick it back in, it does
complete the write of the second session.
But the CD will no longer boot.
The drive is a Toshiba SD-R2312.
The multisession CD WILL boot just fine in my desktop
and three other laptops.
The multisession CD will NOT boot in a second laptop
with a Toshiba XM-1902 drive.
There appears to be a pattern here. Toshiba CD drives
don't seem to boot multisession CDs.
I went looking for CDROM flash updates without success.
Any further ideas on this subject? Workaround?
Thanks, mike
First shutdown, tell it to save to cd.
Get the errors mentioned in previous posts
and the CD ejects. If I stick it back in, it does
complete the write of the second session.
But the CD will no longer boot.
The drive is a Toshiba SD-R2312.
The multisession CD WILL boot just fine in my desktop
and three other laptops.
The multisession CD will NOT boot in a second laptop
with a Toshiba XM-1902 drive.
There appears to be a pattern here. Toshiba CD drives
don't seem to boot multisession CDs.
I went looking for CDROM flash updates without success.
Any further ideas on this subject? Workaround?
Thanks, mike
Firstly, is this an external or an internal drive? I've got an external drive, and I've never even been able to get puppy to boot from it. A lot of the Toshiba external drives seem to pretend to be a floppy disk for part of the bootup, and then change to being CD. Puppy tends to get all confuzzled when this happens as suddenly his files aren't where he expects them to be.
My guess would be that you need a more specific driver. Toshiba does some odd things with its drives, and generic drivers don't always seem to work. Beyond that I really can't think of much.
My guess would be that you need a more specific driver. Toshiba does some odd things with its drives, and generic drivers don't always seem to work. Beyond that I really can't think of much.
-
marksouth2000
- Posts: 622
- Joined: Wed 05 Apr 2006, 20:43
When multisession was being heavily tested in the early days of Puppy 2, it was believed that combo drives will not work with multisession, since they are detected as DVD drives.
My experience supports this, I have had multisession CD working with a pure CDRW drive, and multisession DVD working with a DVD+-RW drive, but never with a combo drive, it always refused to save to the CD and kept asking for me to insert the blank DVD (which would not have worked).
I have come round to preferring frugal install on a machine I own and using USB keys for highly portable systems, multisession lags behind these in certain crucial ways.
My experience supports this, I have had multisession CD working with a pure CDRW drive, and multisession DVD working with a DVD+-RW drive, but never with a combo drive, it always refused to save to the CD and kept asking for me to insert the blank DVD (which would not have worked).
I have come round to preferring frugal install on a machine I own and using USB keys for highly portable systems, multisession lags behind these in certain crucial ways.
multisession puppy issues
That's a shame.
I like the puppy distribution. I'm not a linux expert,
but I've experimented with enough different live versions
to appreciate the fact that Puppy just boots up and
(almost) everything works!!
But the single MOST IMPORTANT FEATURE of puppy is the
multisession capability.
It allows complete portability.
I can make small configuration changes that persist
across a reboot. I don't have anything on the hard drive.
Don't even need a hard drive.
Yes, there are workarounds. I currently use the Feather
distribution running in VirtualPC 2007 on an XP
laptop. Nice thing about Feather is that it's
compatible out of the box with the hardware abstraction
layer used by VPC2007. It talks seamlessly to the fake lan card
and XP takes care of translating that to the real wireless hardware.
Works fine, just isn't portable. I really like
the notion of everything being written back to the cd in Puppy.
But I digress...back to the multisession issues...
I'm not very smart and I've been messing with Puppy for all of three
days. There's no way I can solve the problems, but I might
be able to stimulate thought in someone who can.
I've read a bunch of conjecture here and elsewhere on the web
about the multisession problem. I'm not buying it;
and here's why.
I see two symptoms.
First problem is multisession boot.
I have several desktop and laptop systems with read only cd,
rw/cd, rw/dvd, readonlydvd/cdrw combo drives.
ALL of my systems work fine with the original distribution
while it's still single session.
After you write the second session is where things fall apart.
These do not work:
The Toshiba SD-R2312 1A06fw dvd-ROM/cdrw combo drive will NOT boot a multisession disk. (compaq Presario 900)
The Toshiba SM-1902B read only cd drive will NOT boot a multisession disk. (Dell Inspiron 7500)
The symptom is that the CD is ignored and the bios proceeds to boot
from the hard drive.
These work:
The Compal TSB24H1 Slim DVD-ROM/CD-RW combo drive WILL boot a multisession disk. (Compal CL-51)
The Teac CD-224D readonly cd WILL boot a multisession disk. (Toshiba Satellite 2545CDS)
The Liteon LTR-52327 CD-RW drive WILL boot a multisession disk. (Random desktop P450)
These are ALL internal drives. They all work fine with single-session disks.
This is a limited sample, but there appears to be a trend. Toshiba drives
won't boot multisession cd's. Would be interesting to see statistics from
a bigger sample of drives.
It's either the drive or the bios.
Puppy doesn't even get started, so it can't work around this.
I claim this is THE most important feature of Puppy.
If there are many drives that fail, somebody should take another look
at the architechture to see if there's an alternative that does work.
Keep the disk single session and find some other way to save the persistent data.
Once you hand off exectution to Puppy, it can do anything it wants with the
CD format.
Given the choice of a multisession disk that's compatible with other operating systems
but doesn't perform it's Puppy function, or an incompatible disk format that does
succeed in working puppy persistent storage, I'd vote for an incompatible
architecture that WORKS.
The second issue is writing to the CD.
I have tested two drives
The Toshiba SD-R2312 1A06fw dvd-ROM/cdrw combo drive
The Compal TSB24H1 Slim DVD-ROM/CD-RW combo drive
Both are internal laptop drives.
Both have the same write problem.
They spit out a bunch of error messages and eject the cd.
The error messages have been posted multiple times by others, but I can repeat them
if it matters.
If I poke the CD back in, sometimes more than once, they do continue
on and write a multisession disk that will boot properly in any of the
above drives that will boot a multisession disk.
Now for the weird stuff. I have a six session CD that I just wrote with the Compal
drive with the errors/eject issue. I booted that in the Liteon LTR-52327
then tried to save the session. The system locked up at "performing OPC"
for a while then ejected the cd with a "can't write disk error".
I'd left the compal system running.
I put the CD back into the Compal unit and exited saving session.
This time, it saved the session without complaining. ????
Then I put the CD back in the Liteon drive, booted windows and asked
Nero to write to the disk. Wrote flawlessly. I don't think the OPC error
was the fault of the liteon drive or the media.
Maybe there's a clue there?
Most of my experiments have been with HP 12X CD-RW media.
I did make one CDR disk and experienced exactly the same
multisession boot and write error message problems
with it.
Given that Puppy DOES have control of the write process, and can write the drive,
it should be able to understand the error conditions and work around them without
ejecting the cd in the process.
And I LOVE the completion screen: "Puppy has successfully saved your session...unless it didn't..."
That's really comforting. ;-(
I don't mean to be kicking the Puppy. It's a fine distribution. It would be nice if it's coolest feature and primary distinguishing characteristic
...persistent storage on the CD, (user multisession, but not necessarily using
the multisession cd paradigm)... worked on a wider range of drives...
specifically, the ones I have
mike
I like the puppy distribution. I'm not a linux expert,
but I've experimented with enough different live versions
to appreciate the fact that Puppy just boots up and
(almost) everything works!!
But the single MOST IMPORTANT FEATURE of puppy is the
multisession capability.
It allows complete portability.
I can make small configuration changes that persist
across a reboot. I don't have anything on the hard drive.
Don't even need a hard drive.
Yes, there are workarounds. I currently use the Feather
distribution running in VirtualPC 2007 on an XP
laptop. Nice thing about Feather is that it's
compatible out of the box with the hardware abstraction
layer used by VPC2007. It talks seamlessly to the fake lan card
and XP takes care of translating that to the real wireless hardware.
Works fine, just isn't portable. I really like
the notion of everything being written back to the cd in Puppy.
But I digress...back to the multisession issues...
I'm not very smart and I've been messing with Puppy for all of three
days. There's no way I can solve the problems, but I might
be able to stimulate thought in someone who can.
I've read a bunch of conjecture here and elsewhere on the web
about the multisession problem. I'm not buying it;
and here's why.
I see two symptoms.
First problem is multisession boot.
I have several desktop and laptop systems with read only cd,
rw/cd, rw/dvd, readonlydvd/cdrw combo drives.
ALL of my systems work fine with the original distribution
while it's still single session.
After you write the second session is where things fall apart.
These do not work:
The Toshiba SD-R2312 1A06fw dvd-ROM/cdrw combo drive will NOT boot a multisession disk. (compaq Presario 900)
The Toshiba SM-1902B read only cd drive will NOT boot a multisession disk. (Dell Inspiron 7500)
The symptom is that the CD is ignored and the bios proceeds to boot
from the hard drive.
These work:
The Compal TSB24H1 Slim DVD-ROM/CD-RW combo drive WILL boot a multisession disk. (Compal CL-51)
The Teac CD-224D readonly cd WILL boot a multisession disk. (Toshiba Satellite 2545CDS)
The Liteon LTR-52327 CD-RW drive WILL boot a multisession disk. (Random desktop P450)
These are ALL internal drives. They all work fine with single-session disks.
This is a limited sample, but there appears to be a trend. Toshiba drives
won't boot multisession cd's. Would be interesting to see statistics from
a bigger sample of drives.
It's either the drive or the bios.
Puppy doesn't even get started, so it can't work around this.
I claim this is THE most important feature of Puppy.
If there are many drives that fail, somebody should take another look
at the architechture to see if there's an alternative that does work.
Keep the disk single session and find some other way to save the persistent data.
Once you hand off exectution to Puppy, it can do anything it wants with the
CD format.
Given the choice of a multisession disk that's compatible with other operating systems
but doesn't perform it's Puppy function, or an incompatible disk format that does
succeed in working puppy persistent storage, I'd vote for an incompatible
architecture that WORKS.
The second issue is writing to the CD.
I have tested two drives
The Toshiba SD-R2312 1A06fw dvd-ROM/cdrw combo drive
The Compal TSB24H1 Slim DVD-ROM/CD-RW combo drive
Both are internal laptop drives.
Both have the same write problem.
They spit out a bunch of error messages and eject the cd.
The error messages have been posted multiple times by others, but I can repeat them
if it matters.
If I poke the CD back in, sometimes more than once, they do continue
on and write a multisession disk that will boot properly in any of the
above drives that will boot a multisession disk.
Now for the weird stuff. I have a six session CD that I just wrote with the Compal
drive with the errors/eject issue. I booted that in the Liteon LTR-52327
then tried to save the session. The system locked up at "performing OPC"
for a while then ejected the cd with a "can't write disk error".
I'd left the compal system running.
I put the CD back into the Compal unit and exited saving session.
This time, it saved the session without complaining. ????
Then I put the CD back in the Liteon drive, booted windows and asked
Nero to write to the disk. Wrote flawlessly. I don't think the OPC error
was the fault of the liteon drive or the media.
Maybe there's a clue there?
Most of my experiments have been with HP 12X CD-RW media.
I did make one CDR disk and experienced exactly the same
multisession boot and write error message problems
with it.
Given that Puppy DOES have control of the write process, and can write the drive,
it should be able to understand the error conditions and work around them without
ejecting the cd in the process.
And I LOVE the completion screen: "Puppy has successfully saved your session...unless it didn't..."
That's really comforting. ;-(
I don't mean to be kicking the Puppy. It's a fine distribution. It would be nice if it's coolest feature and primary distinguishing characteristic
...persistent storage on the CD, (user multisession, but not necessarily using
the multisession cd paradigm)... worked on a wider range of drives...
specifically, the ones I have
mike
My theory to explain why multisession works better in DVD than CD is that the multisession idea didn't occur to anyone until after the recordable CD was introduced. Multisession sort of grew as an ad-hoc addition to the original CD specification after that. Without a specification written for everyone to follow, different manufacturers implemented the idea in different and incompatible ways. Multisession was eventually included in the CD specification, but the legacy of its wild-west history is still with us. (Not unlike the Linux file "system" we're discussing here. 
)
The DVD specification was written after CD-R had been around for a while, and included the idea of multisession from the start. DVD drives and media should therefore be expected to work more reliably than CD for multisession use, and they do.
)The DVD specification was written after CD-R had been around for a while, and included the idea of multisession from the start. DVD drives and media should therefore be expected to work more reliably than CD for multisession use, and they do.
[url=http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=69321][color=blue]Puppy Help 101 - an interactive tutorial for Lupu 5.25[/color][/url]
-
marksouth2000
- Posts: 622
- Joined: Wed 05 Apr 2006, 20:43
And all that said, multisession CD still works pretty well, as long as you have a pure CD burner drive. It just doesn't work at all with combo drives, for the very simple reason that no one has yet figured out a reliable way of detecting that a drive is a combo drive. If anyone wants to improve multisession, that's the place to start. Find a way of autodetecting when the boot drive is a combo drive, or telling a boot Puppy CD from a boot Puppy DVD.
Searching the forum will show what has already been learnt about this subject (not much useful, to be honest, it's a tricky question).
Don't be diverted by the Linux filesystem hierarchy, that has nothing to do with whether multisession works or not!
Searching the forum will show what has already been learnt about this subject (not much useful, to be honest, it's a tricky question).
Don't be diverted by the Linux filesystem hierarchy, that has nothing to do with whether multisession works or not!
That may be rather hard to swallow !DVD drives and media should therefore be expected to work more reliably than CD for multisession use, and they do.
1 - The layers of a DVD disc are much thinner - Esp. the first protective coat
2 - NO rewrite optical disk is as reliable as burn once - dye vs physical - and - again > layer denstiies !
3 -The data density of DVD vs CD is much greater - the ONLY reason DVD is even comparable, and in much the same manner - of >
4 - Re write to write_once = Newer error correction Algos -
CONCEPTS for all..... existed long before it was possible.
5 - See physical structure of all & history timelines !
http://www.osta.org/technology/cdqa6.htm
My assertion that multisession works better on a DVD than on a CD is based on my own experience plus many reports in this forum of problems with multisession CDs, versus few reports of problems with DVDs (except for laptops.) It's possible that your experience was atypical.
If you measure the thickness of a DVD you will find it to be the same as that of a CD. The CD is a single sheet of polycarbonate with the data layer on its back, covered and protected only by a thin coat of lacquer. The data layer of a DVD is in the middle, sandwiched between and protected by equal thicknesses of polycarbonate top and bottom. This is definitely an improvement over a CD. Many of the CDs I have checked out of my local library won't play because they have been damaged by superficial scratches on the back that would not have affected the play of a DVD. In some cases a piece of the lacquer has come off for no apparent reason, rendering the CD unplayable..
Rewritable DVDs should hold their data for as long as write-only DVDs, based on the (few) accelerated testing reports I've seen. Can you can cite actual results that indicate different?
Surely you can't mean the DVD is inferior because it takes advantage of lessons learned since the CD was introduced?
If you measure the thickness of a DVD you will find it to be the same as that of a CD. The CD is a single sheet of polycarbonate with the data layer on its back, covered and protected only by a thin coat of lacquer. The data layer of a DVD is in the middle, sandwiched between and protected by equal thicknesses of polycarbonate top and bottom. This is definitely an improvement over a CD. Many of the CDs I have checked out of my local library won't play because they have been damaged by superficial scratches on the back that would not have affected the play of a DVD. In some cases a piece of the lacquer has come off for no apparent reason, rendering the CD unplayable..
Rewritable DVDs should hold their data for as long as write-only DVDs, based on the (few) accelerated testing reports I've seen. Can you can cite actual results that indicate different?
Surely you can't mean the DVD is inferior because it takes advantage of lessons learned since the CD was introduced?
http://www.io.com/~hcexres/textbook/finrepx4c.html
Like a lot ot things "thickness' of layers - denotes usability and reliance.
Prior to posting first reply. had just read very lengthy discourse
on optical technololgy - by the original team that was formed by Sony & Phillps to design the optical specifications.
Wherein they themselves stated - burn once due to inherent design - was best for data longevity, integrity.
Each problem must be addressed on own merits- just as one Puppy user may experience USB device glitches -
The underlying cause cannot be "blanket applied" as the same reason for others.
Nor will eventual 'cure" be applicable to all = Take each on own full background.
Variance in dye strata formulations - OEM SPECS- optical drive device versus media integrity - NOT all are equal !
http://forums.cnet.com/5208-10149_102-0 ... ID=1683716
http://www.edn.com/index.asp?layout=art ... d=CA313055
Please Don't quote out of context :
The problems are in battle for Market dominance vs present standards of optical compatibility to competition designs..
http://www.videoguys.com/DVDformat.html
BTW Blue-Ray technology & dvd-ram (or newest multi-capable drives)
Give enhanced data storage -
http://www.clir.org/PUBS/reports/pub121/contents.html
But for all practical purposes - it is less expensive to just use burn once CDrom for data storage (if capacity is sufficient)
If for no other reason - the media is more device compatible - ESP
if older drives are used - {the old Red-Herring RE burn speeds causing bad burns} -
Distribution or "upgrade versions change so often - storage requirements exceeding Appox one year - have obsoleted
many needs for most archival integrity considerations.
OTOH - Ability to intermix standards is paramount concern ...
= CDrom "burn once" media is still most likely to be usable on MOST read-only OR rewrite optical devices !
Like a lot ot things "thickness' of layers - denotes usability and reliance.
Above is just one reference -(w/possibly suspect credentials):One comment here, however, I'd recommend that you avoid "RW" media for permanent projects. It is not as stable as "R" media, and many, many people have found that a recorded "RW" disc "faded" over time and that the data (their recording) was lost. RW media is also both slower and more expensive (a LOT more expensive) the "R" media, so I think that the best advice is probably just to avoid it.
Prior to posting first reply. had just read very lengthy discourse
on optical technololgy - by the original team that was formed by Sony & Phillps to design the optical specifications.
Wherein they themselves stated - burn once due to inherent design - was best for data longevity, integrity.
Each problem must be addressed on own merits- just as one Puppy user may experience USB device glitches -
The underlying cause cannot be "blanket applied" as the same reason for others.
Nor will eventual 'cure" be applicable to all = Take each on own full background.
Variance in dye strata formulations - OEM SPECS- optical drive device versus media integrity - NOT all are equal !
http://forums.cnet.com/5208-10149_102-0 ... ID=1683716
http://www.edn.com/index.asp?layout=art ... d=CA313055
Please Don't quote out of context :
Theoretically and deferring to many studies to correlate - state that DVD technology is now supperior to CDrom -Surely you can't mean the DVD is inferior because
The problems are in battle for Market dominance vs present standards of optical compatibility to competition designs..
http://www.videoguys.com/DVDformat.html
BTW Blue-Ray technology & dvd-ram (or newest multi-capable drives)
Give enhanced data storage -
http://www.clir.org/PUBS/reports/pub121/contents.html
But for all practical purposes - it is less expensive to just use burn once CDrom for data storage (if capacity is sufficient)
If for no other reason - the media is more device compatible - ESP
if older drives are used - {the old Red-Herring RE burn speeds causing bad burns} -
Distribution or "upgrade versions change so often - storage requirements exceeding Appox one year - have obsoleted
many needs for most archival integrity considerations.
OTOH - Ability to intermix standards is paramount concern ...
= CDrom "burn once" media is still most likely to be usable on MOST read-only OR rewrite optical devices !
Let's not get diverted into a media discussion.
Insetad of wild conjecture, let's start from the observable symptoms
and take the logic one step at a time to see where it breaks down.
I have a puppy multisession boot cd that I created by booting a single session puppy boot cd and saving the state to the second session on shutdown. Compaq Presario 900 (906us), Toshiba SD-R3212.
I power up the same computer with the same cd in the drive.
The system spins up the CD, ratchets it around a while then boots to windows without any error messages. I get the same result whether I
use CD-R or CD-RW media.
My analysis is:
The bios went to the CD.
Bios found no bootable media.
Bios went to the second boot device, the hd, and booted windows.
If puppy never gets control, there's absolutely NOTHING that can
be done in the puppy software to fix this.
How can this be anything other than the CDDRIVE failure to report
bootable CD media and pointing the bios to the correct boot block
on the CD?
Just to be complete, I'll repeat what I said in an earlier post:
That same multisession media that failed to boot in the Toshiba drive
boots fine in my Compal TSB24H1 combo drive on a Compal C-51 lapotp
and in several other drives. That same media fails to boot in a different
Toshiba read-only CD drive XM-1902B.
I see only two possible solutions.
1)Get Toshiba to fix the firmware in their old obsolete drive(s)...yeah, like that'll happen.
2)Abandon the bootable multisession approach and switch to some other method
of storing the persistent data on the CD.
Shoot some holes in my theory
I have a second hypothesis:
This problem doesn't come up much and won't be fixed because
nobody actually uses it.
Once you get past the potential uses for diagnostics and data recovery,
does anybody really use a LIVE linux CD on a regular basis? If most people install it to the HD or use the HD for swap/persistent storage,
they'll never run into this issue.
mike
and take the logic one step at a time to see where it breaks down.
I have a puppy multisession boot cd that I created by booting a single session puppy boot cd and saving the state to the second session on shutdown. Compaq Presario 900 (906us), Toshiba SD-R3212.
I power up the same computer with the same cd in the drive.
The system spins up the CD, ratchets it around a while then boots to windows without any error messages. I get the same result whether I
use CD-R or CD-RW media.
My analysis is:
The bios went to the CD.
Bios found no bootable media.
Bios went to the second boot device, the hd, and booted windows.
If puppy never gets control, there's absolutely NOTHING that can
be done in the puppy software to fix this.
How can this be anything other than the CDDRIVE failure to report
bootable CD media and pointing the bios to the correct boot block
on the CD?
Just to be complete, I'll repeat what I said in an earlier post:
That same multisession media that failed to boot in the Toshiba drive
boots fine in my Compal TSB24H1 combo drive on a Compal C-51 lapotp
and in several other drives. That same media fails to boot in a different
Toshiba read-only CD drive XM-1902B.
I see only two possible solutions.
1)Get Toshiba to fix the firmware in their old obsolete drive(s)...yeah, like that'll happen.
2)Abandon the bootable multisession approach and switch to some other method
of storing the persistent data on the CD.
Shoot some holes in my theory
I have a second hypothesis:
This problem doesn't come up much and won't be fixed because
nobody actually uses it.
Once you get past the potential uses for diagnostics and data recovery,
does anybody really use a LIVE linux CD on a regular basis? If most people install it to the HD or use the HD for swap/persistent storage,
they'll never run into this issue.
mike
That was typical of older drives when media was burnt on one, read failed on another !
Media variances -
Device laser not as capable
Dirt or even fingerprint smudge (INNER tracks - reads opposite to old pressed vynil records)
Mfg supplied, Esp audio Cd's are pressed not burnt
Anything that affects reflective layers so laser cannot consistently/reliably read -
If optical device (the reader) cannot reliably interpret burnt dye stata at INITIAL lead-in tracks containing content structure -
BIOS cannot boot by way of finding Syslinux data !
Bios eventually stops trying- looks for any bootable media
(no error Msgs at hang) ?
I just recently had that happen - wPuppy live v2.12
The drive would spin up/down like an engine trying to accelerate,
then running out of gas -
Solution - although could not really see anything obvious - carefully cleaned disk & it works !
Solutions must be Con firmed or all is merely conjecture.
Media variances -
Device laser not as capable
Dirt or even fingerprint smudge (INNER tracks - reads opposite to old pressed vynil records)
Mfg supplied, Esp audio Cd's are pressed not burnt
Anything that affects reflective layers so laser cannot consistently/reliably read -
If optical device (the reader) cannot reliably interpret burnt dye stata at INITIAL lead-in tracks containing content structure -
BIOS cannot boot by way of finding Syslinux data !
Bios eventually stops trying- looks for any bootable media
(no error Msgs at hang) ?
I just recently had that happen - wPuppy live v2.12
The drive would spin up/down like an engine trying to accelerate,
then running out of gas -
Solution - although could not really see anything obvious - carefully cleaned disk & it works !
Solutions must be Con firmed or all is merely conjecture.
Spamme0, I couldn't disagree with you more, that multisession Puppy is a useless toy. It has some very attractive and useful advantages. For one, it greatly reduced the need for making backups against the day the hard drive crashes. For another, if security is a concern, the disk can be removed from the drive. With Blu-Ray drives sure to come down in price in the next few years, I can see multisession Blu-Ray disks replacing hard drives in many applications. For a third, nothing can be erased from a multisession CD or DVD, making it the logical the choice for applications where forensic analysis might be required (for instance your Congressman's email.)
I don't know of any way to save to a non-multisession CD. With DVDs, the specification was written to include the possibility of using them like a floppy.
I don't know of any way to save to a non-multisession CD. With DVDs, the specification was written to include the possibility of using them like a floppy.
Quoting
Spamme0, I couldn't disagree with you more, that multisession Puppy is a useless toy. It has some very attractive and useful advantages. For one, it greatly reduced the need for making backups against the day the hard drive crashes. For another, if security is a concern, the disk can be removed from the drive. With Blu-Ray drives sure to come down in price in the next few years, I can see multisession Blu-Ray disks replacing hard drives in many applications. For a third, nothing can be erased from a multisession CD or DVD, making it the logical the choice for applications where forensic analysis might be required (for instance your Congressman's email.)
I don't know of any way to save to a non-multisession CD. With DVDs, the specification was written to include the possibility of using them like a floppy.
end quote
OK, look at what I wrote and show me where I used either the
words "useless" or "toy". Sounds like you thunk that up on your own.
Put as much energy into making stuff better as you put into
jumping to conclusions and putting words in other's mouths
and progress will be more swifter.
And let's talk about future blue-ray technologies...and who can resist
a slam at congress...What? No religious references?
I don't know how it is where you are, but here, if you're
in an uncontrolled environment, you're probably using a laptop.
And around here, only the very latest laptops have DVD writers.
It takes a LOT less laptop to run a windows browser than to run live linux.
A VERY LOT LESS!!!
And I can build about a dozen throw-away windows laptops
for risky surfing for the cost of a laptop DVD writer upgrade.
Ok, Ok, you caught me exaggerating, I just don't know how to divide
the zero cost of a free laptop into the $80 or so it would take to
get a DVD burner and come up with a number you'd believe...
so I made one up, a dozen...
For at least some of us, and I'm not alone judging by the other posts
on the subject, Puppy is a very nice product that "tantalizingly
close to achieving it's promise".
If we can have a single file on a hard drive that linux interprets as
a rw filesystem, why the heck can't we have the same concept
applied to a cdrw? CD packet writing exists.
Progress is made by those who come up with clever ways to make stuff
work in spite of limitations.
The more I read about the issues, the more I think It can't or won't
be fixed for existing cd writer technology and the current architecture.
That's fine. I'll stick with
a throw-away windows laptop. Not a problem. I can handle disappointment. Development has to follow the wishes of the
developer and the majority of customers. I've never been accused
of being normal.
I can smell
the tar boiling and the chickens are being plucked...this may be my
last post before I'm run outa town.
I'll say it one more time. Puppy is the best overall live distribution
I've tried. I wish I could make it work.
mike
Spamme0, I couldn't disagree with you more, that multisession Puppy is a useless toy. It has some very attractive and useful advantages. For one, it greatly reduced the need for making backups against the day the hard drive crashes. For another, if security is a concern, the disk can be removed from the drive. With Blu-Ray drives sure to come down in price in the next few years, I can see multisession Blu-Ray disks replacing hard drives in many applications. For a third, nothing can be erased from a multisession CD or DVD, making it the logical the choice for applications where forensic analysis might be required (for instance your Congressman's email.)
I don't know of any way to save to a non-multisession CD. With DVDs, the specification was written to include the possibility of using them like a floppy.
end quote
OK, look at what I wrote and show me where I used either the
words "useless" or "toy". Sounds like you thunk that up on your own.
Put as much energy into making stuff better as you put into
jumping to conclusions and putting words in other's mouths
and progress will be more swifter.
And let's talk about future blue-ray technologies...and who can resist
a slam at congress...What? No religious references?
I don't know how it is where you are, but here, if you're
in an uncontrolled environment, you're probably using a laptop.
And around here, only the very latest laptops have DVD writers.
It takes a LOT less laptop to run a windows browser than to run live linux.
A VERY LOT LESS!!!
And I can build about a dozen throw-away windows laptops
for risky surfing for the cost of a laptop DVD writer upgrade.
Ok, Ok, you caught me exaggerating, I just don't know how to divide
the zero cost of a free laptop into the $80 or so it would take to
get a DVD burner and come up with a number you'd believe...
so I made one up, a dozen...
For at least some of us, and I'm not alone judging by the other posts
on the subject, Puppy is a very nice product that "tantalizingly
close to achieving it's promise".
If we can have a single file on a hard drive that linux interprets as
a rw filesystem, why the heck can't we have the same concept
applied to a cdrw? CD packet writing exists.
Progress is made by those who come up with clever ways to make stuff
work in spite of limitations.
The more I read about the issues, the more I think It can't or won't
be fixed for existing cd writer technology and the current architecture.
That's fine. I'll stick with
a throw-away windows laptop. Not a problem. I can handle disappointment. Development has to follow the wishes of the
developer and the majority of customers. I've never been accused
of being normal.
I can smell
the tar boiling and the chickens are being plucked...this may be my
last post before I'm run outa town.
I'll say it one more time. Puppy is the best overall live distribution
I've tried. I wish I could make it work.
mike
yes, this usually means that the bios does not see the disc as bootablespins up the CD, ratchets it around a while then boots to windows without any error messages
this can be because the iso did not download properly, or because the disc did not burn properly
or it can be because the disc is not reading properly when Puppy is booting
or it can be that the bios does not boot multisession discs properly ... some older bios's will not boot multisession discs
running Puppy from a multisession disc does require a lot of ram, because everything, the operating system and all data, is running in ram ... Puppy usually tries to run in ram, for speed and to free the cd/dvd drive for other purposes, but this requires more ram ... Puppy originally was not intended to be used on older hardware, the minimum amount of ram that Puppy would run in was about 128 megsIt takes a LOT less laptop to run a windows browser
experiments
I don't know why I bother reporting details; nobody reads 'em.
>yes, this usually means that the bios does not see the disc as bootable
>this can be because the iso did not download properly, or because the disc >did not burn properly
If the multisession disk boots in several other machines, can it be the problem that it was burned improperly?
>or it can be because the disc is not reading properly when Puppy is booting
If puppy were having a problem with the disk wouldn't the puppy
bootloader report the error? And how would puppy know to abort and pass control to windows?
While it's possible, I judge it illogical.
>or it can be that the bios does not boot multisession discs properly ... some >older bios's will not boot multisession discs
How would one determine this?
I have anecdotal evidence that Both my Toshiba drives fail to boot
multisession using Bios' from Dell and Compaq respectvely.
Short of ripping apart a "good" laptop and replacing the Toshiba drives...
My memory ain't what it used to be, but I can't recall ever seeing
a Toshiba-brand CD drive in a Toshiba-Brand laptop. Wonder if they
knew something
mike
>yes, this usually means that the bios does not see the disc as bootable
>this can be because the iso did not download properly, or because the disc >did not burn properly
If the multisession disk boots in several other machines, can it be the problem that it was burned improperly?
>or it can be because the disc is not reading properly when Puppy is booting
If puppy were having a problem with the disk wouldn't the puppy
bootloader report the error? And how would puppy know to abort and pass control to windows?
While it's possible, I judge it illogical.
>or it can be that the bios does not boot multisession discs properly ... some >older bios's will not boot multisession discs
How would one determine this?
I have anecdotal evidence that Both my Toshiba drives fail to boot
multisession using Bios' from Dell and Compaq respectvely.
Short of ripping apart a "good" laptop and replacing the Toshiba drives...
My memory ain't what it used to be, but I can't recall ever seeing
a Toshiba-brand CD drive in a Toshiba-Brand laptop. Wonder if they
knew something
mike
That may be so - but this indicates otherwise:
http://www.videodirect.com/toshiba/dvd- ... order.html
- Puppy probe scripts not detecting accurately -
- New user not yet aware of how Puppy configures-
- Prior posted resolutions buried -
- Far too many scattered Docs/Web links/ hastily posted help replies -
- Reliance on supplied "wizards" for "generic" Linux topics
Ultimately this will boil down to accuracy of Puppy's Optical location reporting;
Enabling Bios detection to boot scripted Syslinux
OR location of save files -as Cfg'd by user at logoff
YMMV
http://www.videodirect.com/toshiba/dvd- ... order.html
Exacerbated bySome CD-R/CD-RW discs may be incompatible due to laser pick-up and disc design.
- Puppy probe scripts not detecting accurately -
- New user not yet aware of how Puppy configures-
- Prior posted resolutions buried -
- Far too many scattered Docs/Web links/ hastily posted help replies -
- Reliance on supplied "wizards" for "generic" Linux topics
Ultimately this will boil down to accuracy of Puppy's Optical location reporting;
Enabling Bios detection to boot scripted Syslinux
OR location of save files -as Cfg'd by user at logoff
YMMV