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Xenialpup64 7.0.8.4
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James C


Joined: 26 Mar 2009
Posts: 6698
Location: Kentucky

PostPosted: Sat 02 Jul 2016, 01:25    Post subject:  

666philb wrote:
geany does have the split window plugin ... look in tools on the menu bar. the 'paste it ' plugin will also be added. I'll have a look at bluefish and see how it compares, but i do like geany and use it a lot.

xombrero is a browser that most people will hate Smile
palemoon covers a lot of bases ... size & functionality wise... the only other valid option would be a chrome based browser with the widevine plugin. this would add extra size buy also extra functionality like Amazon video.

mplayer v vlc ... I'm really hesitant to go back to mplayer as i always end up with audio video sync problems however powerful the computer.

as it's early days for xenialpup64 for the next build I'll add some of these alternative options to see what people think and see how it works myself. xenialpup32bit will be sticking to its defaults though as it's nearer release.



For what its worth, I vote for Palemoon,Geany and VLC. Smile
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oui

Joined: 20 May 2005
Posts: 3003
Location: near Woof (Germany) :-) Acer Laptop emachines 2 GB RAM AMD64. franco-/germanophone, +/- anglophone

PostPosted: Sat 02 Jul 2016, 04:49    Post subject:  

Hi

I can understand that each one has the right to find this or that (geany, palemoon, vlc, abiword etc., this to name only the last app's appearing in the user answers) better for him... it is the little difference making working at PC more ... or less effective. ok!

but reallity is:

puppy 64 bit becomes an ISO being just under 300 MB in alpha (and perhaps more in stabil?)...

and some users have after that to spend and loose a lot of time to remove those absolutely not needing apps to re-install some traditionally also puppy typical app's like mplayer or seamonkey...

it is nonsens to impose some software excepted if they are really some under the most tiny ones (leafpad, didiwiki, jwm, mhwaveedit, ayttm, mtpaint etc.: they are under the most tiny app's available each as binary for 32 as well as for 64 bit at the official depositories of Ubuntu)!

alone because of the size of the ISO we make that a lot of users of old hardware can't have some interest any more for our puppy' s (distrowatch ranking...)

pls use dotsfs for all other goodies that you will use! what is more simple?

pls install an adult and not a baby remastering app (LazY remaster: you can easily adapt all file names, select or not to includes the load sfs modules, if you want or not split the main sfs etc)! start one time with you options palemoon/seamonkey/firefox/chrome geany/bluefish/nothing_more vlc/mplayer/xine/etc ayttm/skype/or_one_oft_the_million_other). if you are experimented with puppy you have 20..30 minutes after the first download of the alpha a complete remastered Puppy fully adapted to YOUR needs!

impose app's is silly dilly and contraproductive...

last comment to the alpha:

quitting puppy as to offer the default value "NO" save file and not save file "YES": it is a great ruthlessness of our developers, about all developers, to impose the save file! users playing with puppy and not interesting to save somewhat for example made under that alpha version have to change the default EACH reboot (users using the save system have to to that ONLY ONCE!) else if they do 100 reboot with the trial system! it is not serious really!

kind regards


PS: the first start of that version was bad - no text under the icones, no text in the menu, no text in the little message windows... I did already comment that error for the 32 bit version, and people did only laugh... but it is yet in the next Rolling Eyes because not taking in consideration in the 32 bit version... my solution:

- exit jwm (if you can! it is not easy without texts for newbies...)
- restart jwm with

Code:
xwin jwm


in command line

- remaster (you have so or so to remaster to remove things like palemoon etc.!)

the problem seems to be definitively eliminated after that Wink
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LateAdopter

Joined: 27 May 2011
Posts: 249
Location: Reading UK

PostPosted: Sat 02 Jul 2016, 07:11    Post subject:  

Hello 666philb

A suggestion for your DOTconfig:

CONFIG_X86_MSR=y (currently =m)

The reason is that MSR is the intended method for Intel PSTATE to control processors with hardware power management. Sandybridge onwards, I think. PSTATE will fall back to alternative methods if MSR is not available.
I have not previously checked whether it mattered, because I had to build kernels for my Braswell N3150 and they had it =y. I have now compared xenialpup64 with your 4.6.3 kernel and with my 4.4.4 kernel that I have been using with tahrpup64.

Testing my worst case test video on MPV with YADIF 2x in software.
With your kernel it clocks up to about 1970MHz, not maximum turbo, and drops 68 frames in 5 minutes, including a couple of noticeable skips.
With my 4.4.4 kernel it clocks up to 2070MHz and drops 26 frames with no skips.

The clock speeds were measured with turbostat.

EDIT:
For my kernels I used the fatdog 3.18.7 kernel DOTconfig with the MSR=y change. It did have some other Intel related differences from other Puppy kernels at the time, but I don't think they were significant..

EDIT 2
It looks like it's a kernel 4.6 regression. I just built 4.6.3 using the same DOTconfig as for 4.4.4 and it performs the same as your 4.6.3. So maybe MSR doesn't matter after all.
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oui

Joined: 20 May 2005
Posts: 3003
Location: near Woof (Germany) :-) Acer Laptop emachines 2 GB RAM AMD64. franco-/germanophone, +/- anglophone

PostPosted: Sat 02 Jul 2016, 15:08    Post subject:  

James C wrote:
For what its worth, I vote for Palemoon,Geany and VLC. Smile


why are you so terribly enemy of dotsfs packages being better to preserve the freedom of users?
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666philb


Joined: 07 Feb 2010
Posts: 3094
Location: wales

PostPosted: Sat 02 Jul 2016, 15:16    Post subject:  

oui...

if i made xenial how you're asking, it would have no apps at all Smile

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oui

Joined: 20 May 2005
Posts: 3003
Location: near Woof (Germany) :-) Acer Laptop emachines 2 GB RAM AMD64. franco-/germanophone, +/- anglophone

PostPosted: Sat 02 Jul 2016, 15:29    Post subject:  

dear 666philb

i am also a SliTaz fan as long as SliTaz exists (it is only a bit, but a bit younger as Puppy so I am not SliTaz fan so long as I am Puppy fan ...).

the actual SliTaz base since Aleksej is the new developper (on LFS!)

is exactly that Idea

and?

SliTaz 64 bit (for 32 bit apps) is only about 50 MB thin

with a full operable 64 bit kernel...

included is only a full operable SliTaz own internet browser (TazWeb) AND midori. The upgrade to Xombrero (marvoulous Xombrero version, pls, try it but you must install to see the 2d and 3thd restart of Xombrero!) costs only a few bytes more, and ALL usual SliTaz tools are of course present (and for this reason TazWeb: the most tools are integrated in a browser management, TazPanel, one of the most modern managements of Linux!)

sfs-load is an important tool of Puppy since years, and, if, of course, present, no need more (excepted, or course, a good library of dotsfs!) Rolling Eyes !

kind regards
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 8955
Location: Charleston S.C. USA

PostPosted: Sat 02 Jul 2016, 17:10    Post subject:  

Some of what you suggest was tried with Lucid Puppy.
Mainly offered with no real web browser and you had to download and install from a list of browsers, to have a good working one.
It was a mixed discussion on who did and did not like it.

For most people, they liked the idea of having a complete, program full, operating system.
Install it to a USB flash, CD/DVD, Hard drive, whatever and it had everything you needed.

I can remember installing Windows 7 Evil or Very Mad Twisted Evil and it taking me several hours to get the drivers, support files, and programs I needed for just the hardware I had.
Just what do they put in 3GB plus of that thing Shocked

Install Puppy and it is generally all there. Whatever you want to do.
Is only 300mb or less of space. Too much? NO!!

I am sure, like Tahrpup, this version of Puppy will have Quickpet.
That will give you quick access to some good additional and useful programs.
But, you know, you do not need any of them to have a complete working and useful Puppy.

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I have found, in trying to help people, that the things they do not tell you, are usually the clue to solving the problem.
When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
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oui

Joined: 20 May 2005
Posts: 3003
Location: near Woof (Germany) :-) Acer Laptop emachines 2 GB RAM AMD64. franco-/germanophone, +/- anglophone

PostPosted: Sat 02 Jul 2016, 18:35    Post subject:  

I can't remember the installation of some Windows NT derivate as I never did use them on my own PC's Laughing .

But I can remember the use of the real Mozilla internet suite on Puppy 1.nn, probably 1.03 (?) and this browser did always be the companion of Puppy all the time with only little interruptions. It was a GREAT progress you can't estimate really well more than 10 y. later... Although we did be desirous to pack Puppy on a credit card CD of 50 MB we did resist to the temptation to change the full Mozilla suite against Opera!

At that time, it was very important to get a Puppy with all! In the first Puppy stable version (and all the precedent ones, I know and did use them daily!) it was not possible to save data or add app's or remaster themself the iso. Step by step only did appear those abilities. The last step, the possibility to load about an unlimited quantity of dotsfs did appear very late!

But, please realist, we have it know! You argumentation is a blind speech... We can load dotsfs, also small dotsfs where needing! We can load them using start scripts at booting time! I am an 70 y. old man but it seems for me, I am younger as young people! They are inhibited: they impose tradition where it is good for her argumentation and break the tradition where not according her feelings... What is that Twisted Evil ?

Old Puppyists using the ability of Mozilla/Seamonkey suite to manage all the email transactions and store them (as well as IRC)... they did feel pissed on as new Puppyists did begin to play with the unpleasant idea to live without the real Mozilla/Seamonkey suite because of their private data and habitudes. They were also accustomed to use mainly mplayer and not vlc. etc!

you refer to the tradition in your argumentation... but you don't hesitate a minute to disturb the Puppyists sticking to the old habits of Puppy! Hm, I think it is nonsens...

Yes, it is right, that Lucide did not force to use seamonkey or firefox or opera or chrome or chromium or iron etc... Yes, it is true, that the acceptance did be mixed! Why? Old Puppyists did stay avid to have their Seamonkey (and sometime to test the google browser beginning to be meet on unescapable places (smart phones). New Puppyist did find firefox smart, minimalist did prefer sometimes opera (comming from non free sector of the software), apple friends and google fans derivates from webkitt... This was the problem: Giving freedom, you have to respond to many choices and your depositories have to be acceded clearly and easily. I am not certain, that playing with frontend tools to download both dotpups or dotsfs are the best choice: That tool did be included in versions where the dependencies where not satisfied! You did have no browser... Some variant did not be present, etc. In my eyes, it is nonsens to make dotpups or dotsfs from Seamonkey: If the dependencies are all present, you install from Seamonkey site. The problem is more: nothing to help to add this package of third part correctly into the Puppy system (menu, /usr/local/bin, /root/.config/.../SentTo and OpenWith, /usr/share/applications: This tools doen't exist since today. It has to be used once (if you don't change your view on you system), not for all daily updates of Mozilla, and that is THE problem meet by a great number of Puppyists claiming for actualizations INTO the ISO... You know perfectly that.

The major problem (causing the most deception) is:

Puppy is not modular

but Puppy has no standards! Always a different Puppy disturbing you in your daily work.

I am now in the full install Lubuntu64 minimal (is the only the base: it is not minimal any more Wink ) 16.04 full install because I will use 64 bit, I will use a system not warming my PC (divers linux do that, including a lot of Puppys), with all the app's I will and need (excepted XVidCap, but I have equivalents, only not so good at XVidCap). And it is like a Puppy, including didiwiki, rox, ayttm, mHwaveEdit etc. all real goodies of Puppy, Seamonkey, etc. ... So I can preserve all my old Puppy habits!

I actually can not any more do that with the most real Puppy's and derivates, it is absurd!

But I would prefer a good Puppy and test and experiment with, because that, each new version hopping to meet a good real old Puppy with perfect updated software and libraries (this is the kick!)... Why would I really prefer a real Puppy?

The first Puppy were the pure discretion: Nothing more in the PC after shutdown! No risk of contamination, no risk of spying, etc. It was the probably the most interesting quality of Puppy: secure, discrete, and safe outside the actual session.

Don't forget: The Puppy world is split today:

- the two new ways of BK (forcing to install else if it is not a Quirky but a Puppy)
(if fully installed Puppy/Quirky become simply a directly competitor from
Lubuntu minimal, SliTaz, full installed mode, or NuTyx! Why Rolling Eyes ?)
- the Puppy's starting from ISO in old Puppy manner, this Xenialpup64 will follow this way and permits the frugal mode missing in two above ways from BK
- the "dog"s. I am happy about the dogs, it is a good way (for me as I have a good RAM 8 GB: I can install with apt-get and remaster and continue to start: I can pack and unpack those big *.sfs... But Ubuntu did claim divers small differences / don't permit divers small operations on the software although the base, the dogs are more only base as you can install more easily directly from ubuntu. And they are "heavy" in size for only a base).
Which place will get in the middle and far future each system in that competition as the Puppy community loose places in the ranking list?

It did re-become that first with the Arch Pup having no save file. A great but loosed progress of Puppy sacrificed only to enter a full hand of personally data and add permanent software (possible today loading dotsfs and naming them in the bootstart file... / remastering the system, it is easy and flexible with the optimized tools...)

I find that dilemma completely absurd!

Kind regards
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Pelo


Joined: 10 Sep 2011
Posts: 11912
Location: Mer méditerrannée (1 kms°)

PostPosted: Sun 03 Jul 2016, 00:25    Post subject: Movie DVDs don't play properly with VLC, (jerky), they play  

Movie DVDs don't play properly with VLC, (jerky), they play properly
That is to solve !
VLC has a problem, Gnome-Mplayer with Slacko.
Puppy passengers use DVDS, young passengers before sleeping, watching there movies. Exclamation
I remember main problem is to choose chapters..
If VLC does not work, make XineDVD as default.
We don't mind geeks easily repair and changes default apps. We want a ready for use Puppy, not to develop programs, but to watch DVDS Smile

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Pelo


Joined: 10 Sep 2011
Posts: 11912
Location: Mer méditerrannée (1 kms°)

PostPosted: Sun 03 Jul 2016, 00:37    Post subject: Check list :  

about default apps provided, test them before releasing the Puppy :
Check list :
You tube
Facebook
CD and DVDS
Pupsaves
Recording function.
VLC fails, several posts about that.
My Xenial 64 has a serious problem of screen, (latence) images don't appear immediately. Puppies 64 bits are slower than 32, until now !!! A Slacko version only uses one processor from the four available !
Do you want Puppy to keep a real OS for public or a training tool for students first age ?
OUI is zapping amoung Linux OS, searching the n-accessible star. He is back to Puppy, yes ! Finally, Puppy is the faster, and the best.. And everybody has a non garbled one at home, with Mplayer and DVDs working well.

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James C


Joined: 26 Mar 2009
Posts: 6698
Location: Kentucky

PostPosted: Sun 03 Jul 2016, 01:29    Post subject:  

Getting away from the annual "default Puppy apps" debate for a minute......

Attempted to boot Xenialpup64 on this box with a Nvidia GTX-750 card,booted to a prompt. Ran xorgwizard,chose nouveau,let xorg pick the resolution and a successful test recommended the correct 1920x1080 resolution.
The result was a frozen computer with a blinking cursor. Attempted 3 times before booting Tahr64.Which is working fine.

I'm assuming a kernel change would take care of it but figured I'd report it.


Code:
root# inxi -Fxx
System:    Host: puppypc14723 Kernel: 3.14.54 x86_64 (64 bit, gcc: 4.8.4) Desktop: JWM 2.3.4 dm: N/A Distro: tahrpup64 6.0.5
Machine:   Mobo: ASUSTeK model: M5A97 LE R2.0 version: Rev 1.xx serial: 140323665200131
           Bios: American Megatrends version: 2202 date: 12/12/2013
CPU:       Octa core AMD FX-8320 Eight-Core (-MCP-) cache: 16384 KB flags: (lm nx sse sse2 sse3 sse4_1 sse4_2 sse4a ssse3 svm) bmips: 56187.4
           Clock Speeds: 1: 1400.00 MHz 2: 3500.00 MHz 3: 1400.00 MHz 4: 1400.00 MHz 5: 1400.00 MHz 6: 1400.00 MHz 7: 1400.00 MHz 8: 1400.00 MHz
Graphics:  Card: NVIDIA GM107 [GeForce GTX 750] bus-ID: 01:00.0 chip-ID: 10de:1381
           X.org: 1.15.1 drivers: vesa FAILED: nouveau tty size: 68x23 Advanced Data: N/A for root
Audio:     Card-1: NVIDIA Device 0fbc driver: snd_hda_intel bus-ID: 01:00.1 chip-ID: 10de:0fbc Sound: ALSA ver: k3.14.54
           Card-2: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD/ATI] SBx00 Azalia (Intel HDA)
           driver: snd_hda_intel bus-ID: 00:14.2 chip-ID: 1002:4383
Network:   Card: Realtek RTL8111/8168/8411 PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet Controller
           driver: r8169 ver: 2.3LK-NAPI port: d000 bus-ID: 02:00.0 chip-ID: 10ec:8168
           IF: eth0 state: up speed: 100 Mbps duplex: full mac: 40:16:7e:b2:b8:be
Drives:    HDD Total Size: 1120.2GB (-)
           1: id: /dev/sda model: KINGSTON_SV300S3 size: 120.0GB serial: N/A
           2: id: /dev/sdb model: WDC_WD10EZEX size: 1000.2GB serial: N/A
Partition:
RAID:      System: supported: linear raid0 raid1 raid10 raid6 raid5 raid4
           No RAID devices detected - /proc/mdstat and md_mod kernel raid module present
           Unused Devices: none
Sensors:   None detected - is lm-sensors installed and configured?
Info:      Processes: 126 Uptime: 13 min Memory: 331.5/15931.0MB Runlevel: 5 Gcc sys: N/A
           Client: Shell (bash 4.3.42 running in urxvt) inxi: 1.9.17



Code:
root# free
             total         used         free       shared      buffers
Mem:      16313344       998792     15314552            0        89892
-/+ buffers:             908900     15404444
Swap:            0            0            0
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Pelo


Joined: 10 Sep 2011
Posts: 11912
Location: Mer méditerrannée (1 kms°)

PostPosted: Sun 03 Jul 2016, 03:11    Post subject: blinking cursor  

The result was a frozen computer with a blinking cursor
The same, but not only. 32bits un-installed waiting mechanical repair Xenialpup 64 ( i don't really need 64, it was for testing)
However i will try to post a snapshot, easier than to explain in english
gqrbled.png
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gqrbled.png


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Sailor Enceladus

Joined: 22 Feb 2016
Posts: 1196

PostPosted: Sun 03 Jul 2016, 09:12    Post subject:  

Xenialpup is beautiful! It definitely feels like a creative and fun distro, maybe even more than Tahr. Long live pac-man!
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watchdog

Joined: 28 Sep 2012
Posts: 1388
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Mon 04 Jul 2016, 00:17    Post subject:  

I have got encryption working using the losetup-FULL of tahr64:

http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=863214#863214
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watchdog

Joined: 28 Sep 2012
Posts: 1388
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Mon 04 Jul 2016, 05:02    Post subject:  

I cannot find in /root/.config/autostart netmon_wce.desktop. I have copied it from tahr64 and it now works.
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