Puppy Linux Discussion Forum Forum Index Puppy Linux Discussion Forum
Puppy HOME page : puppylinux.com
"THE" alternative forum : puppylinux.info
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

The time now is Thu 22 Jun 2017, 08:17
All times are UTC - 4
 Forum index » House Training » Bugs ( Submit bugs )
Quirky SlaQ 8.1.6 x86_64 released
Moderators: Flash, Ian, JohnMurga
Post new topic   Reply to topic View previous topic :: View next topic
Page 6 of 8 [114 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 Next
Author Message
belham2

Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 731

PostPosted: Sun 15 Jan 2017, 07:49    Post subject:  

prehistoric wrote:
@belham2

Have you ever zeroed a 32 GB or larger flash drive? Believe me this takes a while. If you find that acceptable, what about my 128 GB drive?



Yes, and Yes, and even larger.......it's what beer and a night's sleep are for Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
prehistoric


Joined: 23 Oct 2007
Posts: 1656

PostPosted: Sun 15 Jan 2017, 08:07    Post subject:  

belham2 wrote:
prehistoric wrote:
@belham2

Have you ever zeroed a 32 GB or larger flash drive? Believe me this takes a while. If you find that acceptable, what about my 128 GB drive?



Yes, and Yes, and even larger.......it's what beer and a night's sleep are for Wink
You do realize that the vast majority of people will not accept this don't you? If this is required I'm afraid puppy will become even more a minority choice than it is now. Unnecessary writes also shorten the useful life of a drive.

What's more, I don't think this is necessary. Fix the GPT and expand the filesystem, and none of the previous use will matter.

Also, if you are trying to eliminate the possibility that earlier data can be recovered from the drive it is not adequate. I've had friends who have had flash memory used in industrial applications who found companies who specialize in recovering data from such media after they have been overwritten. Also happened with a photographer I know. He carries insurance against losing data on flash drives that pays for recovery.

Added: Here is one example of a recovery service. Before you tell me this does not apply, I think you need to find out how flash drives work. Writing over data does not do what it does on magnetic disks.

So, what do you think you are actually accomplishing with this proposed procedure?

Last edited by prehistoric on Sun 15 Jan 2017, 08:43; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
linuxcbon

Joined: 09 Aug 2007
Posts: 1132

PostPosted: Sun 15 Jan 2017, 08:34    Post subject:  

belham2 wrote:
It is flatout crazy that anyone who does a compressed image install using the dd command does not first do a complete dd wipe of that install device, whether they had GPT-related partitions previousy or not.


No. No. No. Smile The problem is NOT what was on the disk before.
The problem is sfdisk not calculating "empty space" correctly.
You should never need to "dd dev zero", except to erase the whole disk and it takes many many many minutes. That's never needed for installing iso to the disk.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
belham2

Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 731

PostPosted: Sun 15 Jan 2017, 09:07    Post subject:  

prehistoric wrote:
belham2 wrote:
prehistoric wrote:
@belham2

Have you ever zeroed a 32 GB or larger flash drive? Believe me this takes a while. If you find that acceptable, what about my 128 GB drive?



Yes, and Yes, and even larger.......it's what beer and a night's sleep are for Wink
You do realize that the vast majority of people will not accept this don't you? If this is required I'm afraid puppy will become even more a minority choice than it is now. Unnecessary writes also shorten the useful life of a drive.

What's more, I don't think this is necessary. Fix the GPT and expand the filesystem, and none of the previous use will matter.

Also, if you are trying to eliminate the possibility that earlier data can be recovered from the drive it is not adequate. I've had friends who have had flash memory used in industrial applications who found companies who specialize in recovering data from such media after they have been overwritten. Also happened with a photographer I know. He carries insurance against losing data on flash drives that pays for recovery.

So, what do you think you are actually accomplishing with this proposed procedure?


Listen, Prehistoric, Let's stop here. I am sorry I brought it up, and in fact, it was intended as an option for Barry, but of course others..well.... . Also, I try to stay reserved on the internet, but I work in the data security industry, 3+ decades now...we are NOT talking here about "securely" erasing drives and data on them. Don't mix and mash the discussion , trying to pull an apples to oranges comparison. I am not even sure if you know you are doing it. One thing I've learned over the decades of working securing databases & securing networks, is people, sometimes myself included, have trouble staying on point with "what" is being discussed and/or sorted out. Data recovery? Versus removing sectors on device sufficiently for home installs so partitioning schemes don't conflict? Two entirely diff subjects. Our objective with dd (for Barry's install's sakes) is not to securely, in totality, to wipe every bit off a drive. Also, we are NOT talking about attracting users to puppy or not, so please stop. Without Barry and the other creators, you and I and everyone else do not have anything to fuss over, period. I am not creating pups and their varities. Are you? Stop the childish insinuations. You, me and all the regulars here want the same thing; what is best for puppy. In essence, don't stand out in the sun and make the profound statement that it is warm out.

Enjoy the rest of your Sunday, prehistoric, and I do mean this sincerely. I hope you get your problems sorted out with Quirky....on every one & way (frugal + full) I've installed now, and it just hit 5 different (AMD+Intel, all diff storage mftrs) machines today. Plus a friend yesterday during the US football playoffs did his laptop, full install, with Quirkyslaq. A success. These installs are on two USBs, two HDs, and two SD cards, I guess it must be that we are only lucky that we do/did the things we did with dd commands before we installed and didn't run into the problems you and others did. [Edited: plz excuse the constant spelling/grammar errors...argh!)

Last edited by belham2 on Sun 15 Jan 2017, 09:19; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
belham2

Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 731

PostPosted: Sun 15 Jan 2017, 09:15    Post subject:  

linuxcbon wrote:
belham2 wrote:
It is flatout crazy that anyone who does a compressed image install using the dd command does not first do a complete dd wipe of that install device, whether they had GPT-related partitions previousy or not.


No. No. No. Smile The problem is NOT what was on the disk before.
The problem is sfdisk not calculating "empty space" correctly.
You should never need to "dd dev zero", except to erase the whole disk and it takes many many many minutes. That's never needed for installing iso to the disk.



linuxcbon, Wink

Did I ever tell you the story of GPT Ghosting?? Me no like Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
linuxcbon

Joined: 09 Aug 2007
Posts: 1132

PostPosted: Sun 15 Jan 2017, 09:19    Post subject:  

belham2 wrote:
linuxcbon, Wink
Did I ever tell you the story of GPT Ghosting?? Me no like Laughing

Hi belham,
sounds complicated...let's try not to complicate things and to find the bugs in puppy.
Cheers Smile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
belham2

Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 731

PostPosted: Sun 15 Jan 2017, 09:23    Post subject:  

linuxcbon wrote:
belham2 wrote:
linuxcbon, Wink
Did I ever tell you the story of GPT Ghosting?? Me no like Laughing

Hi belham,
sounds complicated...let's try not to complicate things and to find the bugs in puppy.
Cheers Smile


Agreed!

Hey, you think Barry might ever give your request consideration? I posted a few times about it, even stuck my necks out with a separate thread, but I know he is probably near his wits end with everything going on right now. Still, a barebones quirky?? Ooooh lala.... Very Happy
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
linuxcbon

Joined: 09 Aug 2007
Posts: 1132

PostPosted: Sun 15 Jan 2017, 09:41    Post subject:  

belham2 wrote:
Agreed!

Hey, you think Barry might ever give your request consideration? I posted a few times about it, even stuck my necks out with a separate thread, but I know he is probably near his wits end with everything going on right now. Still, a barebones quirky?? Ooooh lala.... Very Happy

I am sure he will keep his promise but he said he's very busy and he needs to rest (he is not as "young" as us)... So let's not pressure him too much. He needs to stay fit (like we do). Smile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
prehistoric


Joined: 23 Oct 2007
Posts: 1656

PostPosted: Sun 15 Jan 2017, 11:02    Post subject:  

belham2 wrote:
prehistoric wrote:
@belham2

Have you ever zeroed a 32 GB or larger flash drive? Believe me this takes a while. If you find that acceptable, what about my 128 GB drive?



Yes, and Yes, and even larger.......it's what beer and a night's sleep are for Wink


All joking aside, I repeat, what do you think this waste of time will accomplish?

Added: the talk about saving BarryK effort apparently missed my proposed workaround. If you reuse a flash drive, check it with Gparted, and if there is a report of a corrupted GPT, let Gparted correct this.

I'm waiting to hear that someone reusing a drive has tried this. It should not require a command that runs overnight.

Added later: I've given up waiting. I used the problem drive I created and the version of Gparted in SlaQ 8.1.6, (booted off a DVD. You don't want to run Gparted on your boot drive,) to fix the GPT and resize the partition. That drive now boots without problems, and shows 28 GB available to SlaQ. Unless I hear otherwise, I will declare that the workaround works, provided you use an up-to-date Gparted.

I'll leave the command-line magic to others. All that is necessary at this time is to add some words to the instructions.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
Sage

Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 5248
Location: GB

PostPosted: Mon 16 Jan 2017, 04:02    Post subject:  

Quote:
up-to-date Gparted

I dispute that, vide supra. Old ones still best!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
BarryK
Puppy Master


Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 8050
Location: Perth, Western Australia

PostPosted: Mon 16 Jan 2017, 08:21    Post subject:  

Quote:
@barry

Thanks and kudos for Slaq. This might actually trigger my final move to x64.
Besides the already reported "filesystem growing issue" that is the major issue I have with it...
Now to go after chromium and netflix! Anyone has the latest slack based pets for the latest chromium?

Thanks,
gcav


PS: Why drop F2FS? I did notice a slow-down at boot-time, compared to April 7.2.1 on T2.


f2fs, yes... unfortunately, the latest version requires selinux to be installed.
Also, it still doesn't have filesystem resizing.

Also, I read somewhere that the advantages of f2fs are minimal with flash sticks, as they have some write-leveling built into the hardware.

Also, ext4 has features that support some write-leveling.

So, it would seem that ext4-without-journal is now a reasonable choice.

Another thing, I have read that lifetimes of flash technology are improving, making limiing writes to the drive less of an issue.

So, I have dropped f2fs.
Regarding boot speed, I can't remember noticing a slowdown with SlaQ. But, running the latest Quirky Xerus 8.1.6 on my baby laptop, Asus E200HA, I noticed that it seems to boot very fast -- just a subjective observation.

Hmmm, just noticed something else. I am running Xerus 8.1.6 on my laptop, have it installed on the internal hard drive. At last bootup, I turned off touchpad tap, but now it is back on -- will need to find out why Flsynclient settings are not persisting.

It does trigger my memory. There was a problem with Flsynclient not remembering settings, it was necessary to use an older version.
It did write the settings to a file, but was unable to read that next time.
There would be something about this on the forum somewhere.

_________________
http://barryk.org/news/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website 
belham2

Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 731

PostPosted: Tue 17 Jan 2017, 11:26    Post subject:  Calling Barry: magic Q_ID numbers needed  

BarryK wrote:
Hmmmm.........



Barry, any chance you could either tell us (or me Wink ) how to get the darn 'Q_ID" magic number for the Q-ID file so my frugal installs can see the savefiles I create on the first time booting up? I think the #s are some mix of the ISO's date and also 4 digits after, from what I can see of my other two Quirkys needed 'Q-ID' files required for frugal boot + savefile loading:

Werewolf-7.4.........Q_ID = 201512101229 (boots and loads .sfs great)

Quirky8.0..............Q_ID = 201604210401 (boots and loads .sfs great)

QuirkySlaq8.16.....Q_ID = ???????????????? (boots pristine all the time and cannot see/load the .sfs previously created)

QuirkyXenial8.1.6..Q_ID = ???????????????? (same as QuirkySlaq)


Gracias!! It's kind of rough flying 'frugal' installs w/o the ability of Quirky seeing (and loading) the s.sfs created Wink




[UPDATE: Ok, discovered that the 'Q_ID' file is located in the initrd.q...stupid of me not to look there first Embarassed Or, if you're currently inside a quirky-live frugal install, look in /initrd/q_rw/rw/boot/initrd-tree (and copy it over to your frugal folder):
Here they are for Quirkyslaq8.1.6 & QuirkyXenial8.1.6:

QuirkySlaq8.1.6 = 201701111649

QuirkyXenial8.1.6 = 201701140115


With these, you can go to town with using a frugal install with savefile (or not, your choice) done upon exit. Sweet!! Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
belham2

Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 731

PostPosted: Tue 17 Jan 2017, 14:00    Post subject:  

Whoa, hold the crackers: even with the Q_ID file properly placed, Quirky Slaq 8.1.6 cannot load a savefile (assuming you are frugally installed & created one) on subsequent boots after savefile's 1st creation.

Does this have something to do with the errors linuxcbon noted in Xenial? I am seeing the same errors during boot of both Xenial & Quirky , though they will boot up to the live-desktop every time, they're throwing errors I've never seen before in Quirky boots. For the savefile, during the loading and layering, there is no hope of that previously created savefile being seen. It is like it doesn't exist, almost what Flash is describing in the Xenial 8.1.6 thread after he did a remaster. Hmmmmm........

Barry, where can I dig at this to fix it?? In the initrd.q initrd-tree?? Is there a script error in the loading process during init?? Or is something not being transferred/passed correctly after the savefile is created curing the first initial run of a live-session? I'm stumped.

(by the way, this same problem is also appearing in Quirky Xenial 8.1.6; anyone else seeing this?

Also want to ask: why is there no YAD in these two Quirkys (Slaq and Xenial)? Had to drag over YADs from other Quirky installs, made/makes it a bit of a pain when installing something like urxvtset package from PPM if there's no YAD by default in the OS).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
FeodorF


Joined: 07 Jul 2010
Posts: 215
Location: Heidelberg, Germany

PostPosted: Tue 17 Jan 2017, 20:32    Post subject: SlaQ-8.1.6-amd64.iso  

linuxcbon wrote:
Quirky SlaQ 8.1.6 x86_64

- jwmrc not correct. That's why startup programs (network tray, retrovol) don't appear in tray.

Code:
Generating /root/.icewm/menu...
mv: cannot move '/root/.icewm/menu' to a subdirectory of itself, '/root/.icewm/menu-previous'
Generating /root/.jwmrc...
mv: cannot move '/root/.jwmrc' to a subdirectory of itself, '/root/.jwmrc-previous'


Code:
# jwm -p   
JWM: warning: /root/.jwmrc[423]: close tag "Program" does not match open tag "?xml"


Solution to the problem:

edit /root/.jwmrc
delete all the lines starting from line number 414...
save it and restart the x server
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
FeodorF


Joined: 07 Jul 2010
Posts: 215
Location: Heidelberg, Germany

PostPosted: Tue 17 Jan 2017, 20:45    Post subject: mv-command does not work  

Wrong! Deleted
Last edited by FeodorF on Fri 20 Jan 2017, 11:13; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
Display posts from previous:   Sort by:   
Page 6 of 8 [114 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 Next
Post new topic   Reply to topic View previous topic :: View next topic
 Forum index » House Training » Bugs ( Submit bugs )
Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
[ Time: 0.0926s ][ Queries: 14 (0.0097s) ][ GZIP on ]