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 Forum index » House Training » Beginners Help ( Start Here)
Thanks for all the help. Puppy won't run with battery power
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 10733
Location: Charleston S.C. USA

PostPosted: Wed 22 Mar 2017, 19:37    Post subject:  

You have a Windows only battery! Laughing

Sorry, I had to do it. Laughing

Seems the Dell computer and Dell battery talk to each other.
Never know what Dell and Windows agreed to Exclamation

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When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
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number77

Joined: 22 Oct 2010
Posts: 633

PostPosted: Thu 23 Mar 2017, 05:19    Post subject:  

bigpup wrote:
You have a Windows only battery! Laughing

Sorry, I had to do it. Laughing

Seems the Dell computer and Dell battery talk to each other.
Never know what Dell and Windows agreed to Exclamation

Its looking a bit like it. Any point in putting it in the bug section.
Its realy a decent laptop and I am stuck with bloatware. Lubuntu seemed as bloated.
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peterw

Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 297
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu 23 Mar 2017, 05:22    Post subject: Still thinking about the mystery  

Hi number 77

Bigpup's joke reminded me to look at the Dell Power Supply. Dell ones are unique and can cause issues. If you want to research this further this is a web site that gives a description.
http://www.laptop-junction.com/toast/content/inside-dell-ac-power-adapter-mystery-revealed

And rereading your comments I see that you:
"Yes I pull out the power plug from the psu."
Now that still leaves the extra wire acting as an aerial feeding into the motherboard chips. Could you pull the power cord out of the laptop itself to make sure that is not the case?
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number77

Joined: 22 Oct 2010
Posts: 633

PostPosted: Thu 23 Mar 2017, 12:26    Post subject:  

I always now test it by pulling out the psu plug from the back of the laptop so no aerial effect.
The link you gave is very interesting so I am trying to understand its implications. It does mention a motherboard chip.
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 10733
Location: Charleston S.C. USA

PostPosted: Thu 23 Mar 2017, 13:30    Post subject:  

Found this suggestion.

Quote:
leaving the AC Adapter power cord plugged in, pulling the battery for at least 20-30 seconds, and then replacing the battery, while still plugged in, somehow resets and is then able to be powered on. No other combination seems to work for me.


Some other suggestions from this web site:
http://ccm.net/forum/affich-43478-dell-d610-wont-power-up

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When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
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peterw

Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 297
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu 23 Mar 2017, 16:02    Post subject: Dell Power Supply  

Hi number77

A little bit of background information.
For many years (not sure about more recent machines) Dell have had unique items so that you had to buy their expensive offerings for replacement parts. I am sure that Dell would say that their system makes sure that the parts are the right quality, etc. In the case of laptop Power Supplies if you use a Universal one then it does not have the Dell communication chip and whilst it will allow you to power the laptop it will not allow you to charge the batteries and if it does not have the right Power Rating then I think it inhibits the laptops performance. Obviously, your Power Supply must be fine.
You can get none Dell Power Supplies with the right communication chip and programme because the replacement manufactures have analysed them and recreated the necessary electronics. It has been years since I read much about this but as I remember it was a device that fed in a serial data stream with voltage, power, etc information. This goes up a wire in the cable and into a receiver chip at the other end. If that chip goes wrong or the serial connection is damaged then the laptop will not work. I think I have read that sometimes the receiving chip inside the laptop has sent the wrong message int the laptop.
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number77

Joined: 22 Oct 2010
Posts: 633

PostPosted: Thu 23 Mar 2017, 16:50    Post subject:  

Thing is when I originally got the the laptop it had an original dell battery and dell charger and hung on puppy. I mistakenly bought a new battery and it still hangs.
The battery does charge so is communicating with the charger.
Fully charged and disconnected from the psu it hangs on puppy but not on windows, dont think the charger comes into it.
I did try pulling battery while on psu, no effect, it hangs on battery..
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jd7654

Joined: 06 Apr 2015
Posts: 257

PostPosted: Thu 23 Mar 2017, 17:12    Post subject:  

Which Puppy versions have you tried besides Tahr?

I previously suggested to try the older Slackware based Slacko 5.7, which works well and very compatible in my experience:
http://distro.ibiblio.org/puppylinux/puppy-slacko-5.7/
Also has the benefit of not being Ubuntu based which so far is where we see a problem.(Tahr, Lubuntu)

Also, some have reported that something simple like SliTaz which is independent, seemed to work where other Linux exhibited battery problems.
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number77

Joined: 22 Oct 2010
Posts: 633

PostPosted: Fri 24 Mar 2017, 06:01    Post subject:  

jd7654 wrote:
Which Puppy versions have you tried besides Tahr?

I previously suggested to try the older Slackware based Slacko 5.7, which works well and very compatible in my experience:
http://distro.ibiblio.org/puppylinux/puppy-slacko-5.7/
Also has the benefit of not being Ubuntu based which so far is where we see a problem.(Tahr, Lubuntu)

Also, some have reported that something simple like SliTaz which is independent, seemed to work where other Linux exhibited battery problems.

tahr 602 and 605, 431, 528, lubuntu and daphile a music server. I have slacko 5.7 but not sure I did try it so will.
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greengeek


Joined: 20 Jul 2010
Posts: 5093
Location: Republic of Novo Zelande

PostPosted: Fri 24 Mar 2017, 14:15    Post subject:  

Does the dell go into hibernation successfully (and recover successfully) when you close the laptop lid?

- Try it while both AC and battery are connected : shut the lid, wait 5 minutes, then open lid. What happens?
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greengeek


Joined: 20 Jul 2010
Posts: 5093
Location: Republic of Novo Zelande

PostPosted: Fri 24 Mar 2017, 14:38    Post subject:  

Also - could you try the following:
(apologies if you already tried it but I didnt see it in the thread so far...)

Boot Tahr with AC plugged in
Use shutdown menu to select "exit to prompt"
Wait 5 mins
Pull AC cord out of wall (not laptop)

What happens?
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number77

Joined: 22 Oct 2010
Posts: 633

PostPosted: Sat 25 Mar 2017, 14:19    Post subject:  

Tried all. It hangs.
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 10733
Location: Charleston S.C. USA

PostPosted: Sat 25 Mar 2017, 15:44    Post subject:  

Try this:

Get Puppy booted.
Go to menu->System->Boot Manager->Services

UN-select rc.acpi

Hit OK.

Reboot.

Make sure this ac.acpi is still UN-selected.

Now try just using the battery.

_________________
I have found, in trying to help people, that the things they do not tell you, are usually the clue to solving the problem.
When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
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Mike Walsh


Joined: 28 Jun 2014
Posts: 3925
Location: King's Lynn, UK.

PostPosted: Sat 25 Mar 2017, 16:33    Post subject: Re: Dell Power Supply  

peterw wrote:
Hi number77

A little bit of background information.
For many years (not sure about more recent machines) Dell have had unique items so that you had to buy their expensive offerings for replacement parts. I am sure that Dell would say that their system makes sure that the parts are the right quality, etc. In the case of laptop Power Supplies if you use a Universal one then it does not have the Dell communication chip and whilst it will allow you to power the laptop it will not allow you to charge the batteries and if it does not have the right Power Rating then I think it inhibits the laptops performance. Obviously, your Power Supply must be fine.
You can get none Dell Power Supplies with the right communication chip and programme because the replacement manufactures have analysed them and recreated the necessary electronics. It has been years since I read much about this but as I remember it was a device that fed in a serial data stream with voltage, power, etc information. This goes up a wire in the cable and into a receiver chip at the other end. If that chip goes wrong or the serial connection is damaged then the laptop will not work. I think I have read that sometimes the receiving chip inside the laptop has sent the wrong message int the laptop.


Hi, number 77.

I've got an ancient Inspiron lappie, an original 1100 from 2002. The first battery lasted 10 years; the power brick at that time was still working fine. The replacement battery pack was a 'generic' one from the Far East.

The power brick gave up the ghost around a year ago. I bought a 'Dell pattern' replacement, which had no problem charging the then 4-yr old battery.

6 months ago, the replacement battery pack also gave out. So I bought another 'generic' one, again from somewhere 'East of Suez', as we say here in the UK. It, too, works quite happily with the replacement power brick, and the laptop works fine just running on battery.

At the same time, I went through several frustrating weeks of the Inspiron thoroughly misbehaving itself, which was eventually traced to a dead CMOS battery. This was a rechargeable item, which by then had lasted just a hair shy of 14 years!

It was soldered direct to the motherboard, on the underside.....which necessitated a thorough strip-down to get at it. My soldering skills are mediocre at best, but I managed to get the thing replaced successfully. Since then, she's been as good as gold.

Have you ever checked or replaced said item on your machine? They can give rise to the most exasperating (and hard to diagnose) behaviour..!


Mike. Wink

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number77

Joined: 22 Oct 2010
Posts: 633

PostPosted: Sun 26 Mar 2017, 06:08    Post subject:  

bigpup wrote:
Try this:

Get Puppy booted.
Go to menu->System->Boot Manager->Services

UN-select rc.acpi

Hit OK.

Reboot.

Make sure this ac.acpi is still UN-selected.

Now try just using the battery.


Reboot gave no rc.acpi selected but it still hung.
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