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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Derivatives
EasyOS version 2.2.11, February 21, 2020
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BarryK
Puppy Master


Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 9237
Location: Perth, Western Australia

PostPosted: Sat 18 Jan 2020, 22:37    Post subject:  

Just a heads-up: I am almost ready to release the next version.

The xorgwizard has bugs, want to investigate that. And a replacement for 'ddcprobe' utility in xorgwizard -- it can hang, or it can fail, with certain video hardware.

Waiting on arrival of usb audio "card", to finish off sound hardware profiling.

Currently running kernel 5.4.12, will bump if a later version comes out before the next release of Easy.

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zygo

Joined: 08 Apr 2006
Posts: 241
Location: UK

PostPosted: Sun 19 Jan 2020, 02:11    Post subject: xvkbd  

Barry,

After selecting a foreign lang in xvkbd, the virtual keyboard, a virtual key appears with the lang name on it eg Rus. After setting focus to leafpad (which is fine with Russian) and clicking a letter, the wrong letter is printed and xvkbd immediately reverts back to English. Also, thereafter xlock has larger letters when ulocking -- which I prefer actually.

I find it handy to have pupzip in the ROX context menu -> open with...

Thanks
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jamesbond

Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 3455
Location: The Blue Marble

PostPosted: Sun 19 Jan 2020, 03:22    Post subject:  

BarryK wrote:
If you don't have any alsa configuration at all, no asound.conf, nothing to affect snd module parameters, etc., will alsa always default to using card 0 and device 0 for sound output? and ctrl 0?

On this machine, with "options snd-hda-intel id=HDMI index=1" applied
Code:
# cat /proc/asound/cards
 0 [PCH            ]: HDA-Intel - HDA Intel PCH
                      HDA Intel PCH at 0xb3814000 irq 49
 1 [HDMI           ]: HDA-Intel - HDA Intel HDMI
                      HDA Intel HDMI at 0xb3810000 irq 53

"PCH" is the analog sound.

Without it:
Code:
# cat /proc/asound/cards
 0 [HDMI           ]: HDA-Intel - HDA Intel HDMI
                      HDA Intel HDMI at 0xb3810000 irq 53
 1 [PCH            ]: HDA-Intel - HDA Intel PCH
                      HDA Intel PCH at 0xb3814000 irq 49

This is coming from a machine with this devices. (Note the devices are different from the one in my previous post, but the points I want to discuss is still the same).
Code:
# lspci -d ::0403
00:03.0 Audio device: Intel Corporation Haswell-ULT HD Audio Controller (rev 09)
00:1b.0 Audio device: Intel Corporation 8 Series HD Audio Controller (rev 04)

Without the modprobe option, we don't know which one of these PCI devices become card 0, and which one becomes card 1 - it depends on which device is recognised first by the kernel, but for my case, the HDMI is consistently detected as card 0.

If you don't have any /etc/asound.conf, then hw:0 is your default device; this corresponds to card 0. Most of the time I don't have anything attached to the HDMI port so I hear nothing.

With /etc/asound.conf, you can easily set the default device to hw:1 (which is card 1) and problem is "solved". Yes, solved except that certain programs that dont't use ALSA but use OSS, will always use card 0, so they won't make any sound. It is also, that if you accidentally remove /etc/asound.conf (or $HOME/.asoundrc, same thing), then ALSA suddenly reverts to hw:0 as default and you have no sound.

Now, with the modprobe options, you are swapping the definition of card 0/card 1 below the ALSA layer. With this, the analog audio becomes card 0, and HDMI becomes card 1. This, without any /etc/asound.conf, hw:0 is the default and you have nice sound coming out from your analog speaker. OSS programs will also work nicely.

Of course, in this situation, you can always reverse the situation again with /etc/asound.conf too to swap the default device to card 1 for HDMI if you want to use it.

Quote:
Also, there doesn't seem to be any utility that will return the current default card, device and ctrl numbers. I suppose it is possible to find that info in /sys/sound?


As above, there are two meaning of "default" card, ALSA "default" (hw:0) and "system default" (=card 0). You can change the ALSA default by editing /etc/asound.conf, but if there is nothing else, ALSA default is __always__ hw:0. Otherwise, if you have /etc/asound.conf, the default is defined using the line "pcm.!default" line.

"system default" is whatever gets loaded as "card 0", which you can find out from /proc/asound/cards, and you can change this by using the modprobe line.

So you can set the defaults in two different ways.

Bonus:
If you want to associate the device listed by "lspci -d ::0403" with the cards listed in /proc/asound/cards, you can find them in "/sys/class/sound/card0/device/uevent" (replace card0 with card1, card2, etc as needed). The PCI_SLOT_NAME will be the same as the device ID you get from lspci.

For example, in this machine, with the modprobe options applied (so card 0 is the analog output)
Code:
# cat /sys/class/sound/card0/device/uevent
DRIVER=snd_hda_intel
PCI_CLASS=40300
PCI_ID=8086:9C20
PCI_SUBSYS_ID=104D:90BE
PCI_SLOT_NAME=0000:00:1b.0
MODALIAS=pci:v00008086d00009C20sv0000104Dsd000090BEbc04sc03i00

So my analog card, which is currently set as "card 0", is actually the "Intel Corporation 8 Series HD Audio Controller", the second device listed in "lspci". As it is further in the PCI device tree that the other card (which is HDMI), without any modprobe options it would have become the second card (card 1) instead.

I hope this clarifies everything.

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lvds


Joined: 23 Jan 2007
Posts: 320
Location: Near the window

PostPosted: Sun 19 Jan 2020, 07:53    Post subject:  

BarryK wrote:
Just a heads-up: I am almost ready to release the next version.

The xorgwizard has bugs, want to investigate that. And a replacement for 'ddcprobe' utility in xorgwizard -- it can hang, or it can fail, with certain video hardware.

Waiting on arrival of usb audio "card", to finish off sound hardware profiling.

Currently running kernel 5.4.12, will bump if a later version comes out before the next release of Easy.


It would be great to have a tool so the user could click in a window to select its own desktop manager (JWM, XFCE, KDE, the standard packages published we get doing apt-get install xfce or apt-get install kde for exemple ) and then the program install the new desktop and remove the previous desktop so to gain as much place as possible. Then the user can remaster its own operating system. We need something as Easy as possible for this in EasyOS Smile

Also have a look at Xfe file manager, it comes a text editor, an archive manager and an image viewer, all integrated in one, and it seems to be more efficient than having the current tools available in EasyOS by now. It seems to be more in the "EasyOS philosophy" and is good looking.

Kind regards,
Laurent.
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scsijon

Joined: 23 May 2007
Posts: 1581
Location: the australian mallee

PostPosted: Sun 19 Jan 2020, 16:29    Post subject:  

lvds wrote:
It would be great to have a tool so the user could click in a window to select its own desktop manager (JWM, XFCE, KDE, the standard packages published we get doing apt-get install xfce or apt-get install kde for exemple ) and then the program install the new desktop and remove the previous desktop so to gain as much place as possible. Then the user can remaster its own operating system. We need something as Easy as possible for this in EasyOS Smile

Also have a look at Xfe file manager, it comes a text editor, an archive manager and an image viewer, all integrated in one, and it seems to be more efficient than having the current tools available in EasyOS by now. It seems to be more in the "EasyOS philosophy" and is good looking.

Kind regards,
Laurent.


Back in the old puppy days we could start whatever desktops we wanted once they were set as the default one, I had three at one point. Most of it couild be still there, although as EasyOS is not Puppy a lot of it became redundant and could be gone as barry has cleaned up code. It was as simple as starting to the # prompt (not automatically going straight into the desktop) and typing xwin 'whatever desktop you want to load' (xwin qwm for example). This both started the selected desktop up and set it as the default desktop for auto-starting next time, so when you rebooted or after shutdown and started your system next time, it would start in the desktop you had last selected. Changing back to jwm was as simple as doing the same thing and starting with 'xwin jwm'.

Your only problems may be that "some" of easyos has been setup specifically for jwm, it will be up to you to modify or create suitable scripts and extension package conponents to run them (such as containers) in your desktop, you can't expect BarryK to create them as it's not in his default system and therefore not his responsability.

I'm not saying not to do it, but one of the woof-ce puppy's may be a better choice for what you want to do (at least to learn how to add another complete desktop first) as the functions should be all there still, and have a look at the puppy 3 and 4 series, which I know had what was required to multi-desktop. It wasn't rocket-science, just new and additions into existing scripts and the required additional packages. I seem to remember there was even a how-to in one of the 4's for puppians to add their own to play with (,may be in the woof-ce-legacy branch still).
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ras

Joined: 30 Oct 2019
Posts: 32

PostPosted: Sun 19 Jan 2020, 21:11    Post subject: version control  

Easy Remaster works for me, (only tested once a while back, though).

I am guessing that it would not play nice with Easy Version Control, or at least the release version control feature.

BTW, I have come to see Easy Version Control as one of the best and most defining features of the new paradigm.

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BarryK
Puppy Master


Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 9237
Location: Perth, Western Australia

PostPosted: Mon 20 Jan 2020, 12:22    Post subject:  

lvds wrote:
BarryK wrote:
Just a heads-up: I am almost ready to release the next version.

The xorgwizard has bugs, want to investigate that. And a replacement for 'ddcprobe' utility in xorgwizard -- it can hang, or it can fail, with certain video hardware.

Waiting on arrival of usb audio "card", to finish off sound hardware profiling.

Currently running kernel 5.4.12, will bump if a later version comes out before the next release of Easy.


It would be great to have a tool so the user could click in a window to select its own desktop manager (JWM, XFCE, KDE, the standard packages published we get doing apt-get install xfce or apt-get install kde for exemple ) and then the program install the new desktop and remove the previous desktop so to gain as much place as possible. Then the user can remaster its own operating system. We need something as Easy as possible for this in EasyOS Smile

Also have a look at Xfe file manager, it comes a text editor, an archive manager and an image viewer, all integrated in one, and it seems to be more efficient than having the current tools available in EasyOS by now. It seems to be more in the "EasyOS philosophy" and is good looking.

Kind regards,
Laurent.


The basic concept from Puppy should still work. There is /etc/windowmanager, to start whatever windowmanager you want to use. For xfce, you can edit that file, or run "xwin xfce" which will cause that file to be edited.

You would have to look at one of the xfce-based pups to see where to go from there. There would be a script, /usr/bin/xfce.

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BarryK
Puppy Master


Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 9237
Location: Perth, Western Australia

PostPosted: Mon 20 Jan 2020, 12:25    Post subject: Re: version control  

ras wrote:
Easy Remaster works for me, (only tested once a while back, though).

I am guessing that it would not play nice with Easy Version Control, or at least the release version control feature.

BTW, I have come to see Easy Version Control as one of the best and most defining features of the new paradigm.


You could make it play nice with Easy Version Control. I have written onto my to-do list, to write a how-to remaster, that will cover details like that.

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BarryK
Puppy Master


Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 9237
Location: Perth, Western Australia

PostPosted: Wed 22 Jan 2020, 09:06    Post subject:  

Here it is, Easy Buster 2.2.5:

https://bkhome.org/news/202001/easyos-version-225-released.html

One difference that you might notice at first bootup: there is an attempt to use the native resolution of the monitor, whereas previously it might have defaulted to a lower resolution.

It suits me, I am using a 1080p TV with my HP desktop PC. But, if you have a 4K monitor, perhaps the resolution will be too high?

...a quick way to change it to whatever you want ---well, you can do it when QuickSetup window displays -- but also you can edit /etc/X11/xorg.conf -- you will see the resolution in there, in a couple of places, just change to what you want and restart X.

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scsijon

Joined: 23 May 2007
Posts: 1581
Location: the australian mallee

PostPosted: Wed 22 Jan 2020, 10:49    Post subject:  

BarryK wrote:
Here it is, Easy Buster 2.2.5:

https://bkhome.org/news/202001/easyos-version-225-released.html

One difference that you might notice at first bootup: there is an attempt to use the native resolution of the monitor, whereas previously it might have defaulted to a lower resolution.

It suits me, I am using a 1080p TV with my HP desktop PC. But, if you have a 4K monitor, perhaps the resolution will be too high?

...a quick way to change it to whatever you want ---well, you can do it when QuickSetup window displays -- but also you can edit /etc/X11/xorg.conf -- you will see the resolution in there, in a couple of places, just change to what you want and restart X.


i've a 3k monitor 16:10 ratio i'll try it on that's caused trouble in native in the past, and the devx is where please or do we use 2.2.3's?
EDIT1:
-The monitor seems to be working ok except for the intensity level, had to turn the gama down to -9 to get something that wasn't too bright, may turn down further yet, not sure it's down enough yet;
-Getting an error message when using petget relating to petget line 386 - error was :no such process;
-I installed xine (xine-ui v0.99.10) via petget, all 15 dep's and base installed ok and it works well, uses libxine2;
-2.2.5 is going well with autochanging screens for the video's too, a nice change from the older series where I ocassionally had to reset it when it tried to make a 4:3 appear as a 16:9 or 16:10 by stretching it out;
- cpu temp is up a little bit more than expected, however it's running fast and smooth so no real complaints yet;
- Only thing left is ?where do I channge the keyboards key-repeat rate? I need to slow that down a bit else i'm double character typing and having to cleanup before sending.
I'll do a second edit after further testing tonight on another workstation.
EDIT2:
yeah, had to drop gama down further to -15, even -9 hurt eyes after a time and on second system was just as bad, just need to find where to change the keyboard repeat rate, the rest seems ok, will test further when i have the devx installed.

Last edited by scsijon on Thu 23 Jan 2020, 08:10; edited 2 times in total
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Sage

Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 5521
Location: GB

PostPosted: Wed 22 Jan 2020, 10:58    Post subject:  

2.2.5: no issues, many thanks.
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Billtoo


Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Posts: 3710
Location: Ontario Canada

PostPosted: Wed 22 Jan 2020, 12:29    Post subject: EasyOS Buster 2.2.5, January 22, 2020  

New install of 2.2.5 to a 16gb flash drive with easydd:

Computer
Processor 2x Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU E8400 @ 3.00GHz
Memory 4039MB (226MB used)
Machine Type Physical machine
Operating System Easy Buster64

Display
Resolution 1920x1080 pixels
OpenGL Renderer AMD OLAND (DRM 2.50.0, 5.4.12, LLVM 7.0.1)
X11 Vendor The X.Org Foundation

OpenGL
Vendor X.Org
Renderer AMD OLAND (DRM 2.50.0, 5.4.12, LLVM 7.0.1)
Version 4.5 (Compatibility Profile) Mesa 18.3.6
Direct Rendering Y_es

I'm using a 32" TV as a monitor, the cable has a dvi connector on one end and
an hdmi connector on the other.
Sound works but I had to use alsamixer called up from the multiple sound card
wizard to adjust the volume.
I will connect another cable later (hdmi both ends) and see if it will use
the monitors speaker.

That's it so far.

Edit:

I changed cables and tried to use the monitor speaker but it didn't work,
wishful thinking I guess but still have sound with analog setting using the new
cable.
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Sage

Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 5521
Location: GB

PostPosted: Wed 22 Jan 2020, 16:02    Post subject:  

Guess you know, billt, that there are two entirely different DVI cable specs. But of those that are supposed to be the same, not all are wired the same, and, worse, can't tell. Similarly with HDMI - not all are correctly wired. Use the little green socket on your PC and a superb amp with quality speakers. Stay analogue for proper sound unless you've got professional studio lab quality 24bit digital. Chuck that BT cr*p outa da fenster. Get a record player and recycle your vinyl....
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rwishlaw

Joined: 02 Apr 2009
Posts: 21

PostPosted: Wed 22 Jan 2020, 18:20    Post subject: Where is DevX 2.2.5?  

Where is DevX 2.2.5?
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Billtoo


Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Posts: 3710
Location: Ontario Canada

PostPosted: Wed 22 Jan 2020, 20:52    Post subject: EasyOS Buster 2.2.5, January 22, 2020  

New install of 2.2.5 to a 32gb sandisk flash drive for my Acer desktop pc.

Computer
Processor 4x Intel(R) Core(TM) i3 CPU 540 @ 3.07GHz
Memory 6022MB (435MB used)
Machine Type Physical machine
Operating System Easy Buster64

Display
Resolution 1920x1080 pixels
OpenGL Renderer Mesa DRI Intel(R) Ironlake Desktop
X11 Vendor The X.Org Foundation

OpenGL
Vendor Intel Open Source Technology Center
Renderer Mesa DRI Intel(R) Ironlake Desktop
Version 2.1 Mesa 18.3.6
Direct Rendering Y_es

Operating System
Version
Kernel Linux 5.4.12 (x86_64)

This was installed from 2.2.3 which was running on an sdhc card to a better
quality sandisk flash drive (if that makes a difference)
Sound works from a pair of speakers plugged into the headphone jack.

Thanks.
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