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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Additional Software (PETs, n' stuff) » Desktop
XFCE 4.12 for XenialPup 64bit
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Marv


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 911
Location: SW Wisconsin

PostPosted: Tue 26 Sep 2017, 10:24    Post subject:  

Morning battleshooter,

Stripped all my changes from my savefile, did the standard pre-update scrub on it and booted into r3 on the i5 laptop. All seems good. PupSysinfo, wcpufreq, mounting/Thunar, menu, suspend, DVD play/language etc. exercised. All good. Came up without retrovol in tray on this first boot. I am going to post this and do an X-restart/reboot and fiddle with timing a bit. Never did hear back from ally on that on his Lenovo 230 but I've seen it before on faster kit and this laptop may be on the edge. Nothing else noted yet. Only 8 cores Smile Tsk tsk. Having one core faster at any given time is more common than not. Somewhere there's a thread on that.

Back: Simple answer to Retrovol thing. Looking at the r3 main SFS, Retrovol is disabled. Wasn't in r2. Enabled it and it's up. Also udated the wcpufreq with intel_pstate speed capabilities and warning/instructions if any pstaters want to test http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=968664#968664

Thanks,

_________________
Pups currently in kennel Very Happy X-slacko 4.4 and X-tahr 2.0 for my users; LxPupSc,LxPupXenial & XFCE_XenialPup64 for me. All good pups indeed, and all running browsers, office etc. solely from SFS.
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magerlab

Joined: 08 Jul 2007
Posts: 737

PostPosted: Wed 27 Sep 2017, 01:34    Post subject:  

I always liked xfce4 so I installed your pet in XenialPup. Everything works fine. The only thing I miss is more xfce4-panel applets, especially xkb-layout plugin. Of course there's fbxkb that I am using, but xkb-layout plugin has more options. I tried to install this plugin from ubuntu's package, but it give me error message. If I try to install from puppy package manager it tries to install many dependencies( looks like it does not see that xfce4 is already installed.
Thank you
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battleshooter


Joined: 14 May 2008
Posts: 1352
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Wed 27 Sep 2017, 06:48    Post subject:  

Evening Marv,

Marv wrote:
Back: Simple answer to Retrovol thing. Looking at the r3 main SFS, Retrovol is disabled. Wasn't in r2. Enabled it and it's up.


Oops yeah, I thought with all the trouble with Retrovol I'd just chuck it out and use Xfce mixer instead. It worked well on my test machines, not sure why Xfce mixer didn't appear for you when Retrovol used to.

Marv wrote:
Only 8 cores Smile Tsk tsk. Having one core faster at any given time is more common than not. Somewhere there's a thread on that.


I'm almost ashamed to be seen with it given that Puppy's supposed to be for "low spec machines". Laughing But even now I have nice hardware, I still can't let Puppy go. It sure does make compiling a lot more fun though.

magerlab wrote:
I always liked xfce4 so I installed your pet in XenialPup. Everything works fine. The only thing I miss is more xfce4-panel applets, especially xkb-layout plugin


Another XFCE fan hah. I guess I am beginning to understand the need for XFCE to be an option in Woof. It seems to be the second most popular after JWM/Rox, but I guess naturally XFCE fans would gravitate to this thread.

I'm not 100% sure if this pet will do everything you need Magerlab, but I just downloaded without installing xfce4-xkb-plugin from the ppm so I could manually skip all the outsider XFCE dependencies.

xfce4-xkb-plugin_0.7.1-2.pet

If there are any other plugins, you could probably install them the same way, or just let me know, it's not very difficult to do for me.

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Marv


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 911
Location: SW Wisconsin

PostPosted: Wed 27 Sep 2017, 10:02    Post subject:  

battleshooter wrote:
Oops yeah, I thought with all the trouble with Retrovol I'd just chuck it out and use Xfce mixer instead. It worked well on my test machines, not sure why Xfce mixer didn't appear for you when Retrovol used to.
I'll have a look-about for Xfce mixer. I've run both in the past so once it appears I have no real preference one over the other.

An aside: Do you have a server box in your household? I am tussling with throughput issues and getting up the nerve and info to to post a question elsewhere on them. I just need the rough time to transfer a file (copy/paste with Thunar or PCManFM, not rsync or cli), 256Mb or so (I used a savefile) on XFCE-Xenialpup64 or LxPupSc 64b kernel) and time on the same transfer same hardware from X-Slacko or any true 32b pup. I ask because your hardware is very different from mine. It's a comparison only and I expect either small difference or an unexpected result.

Cheers,

_________________
Pups currently in kennel Very Happy X-slacko 4.4 and X-tahr 2.0 for my users; LxPupSc,LxPupXenial & XFCE_XenialPup64 for me. All good pups indeed, and all running browsers, office etc. solely from SFS.
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sc0ttman


Joined: 16 Sep 2009
Posts: 2548
Location: UK

PostPosted: Wed 27 Sep 2017, 10:56    Post subject:  

Another Xfce fan here.. So easy to set hotkeys, remove window decorations, auto-fullscreen/maximise certain apps, etc..
And the Whisker menu has a spotlight-esque search function, and can popup fullscreen, that is just lovely.

I have Xfce setup *almost* as a tiling, keyboard-only WM on my crappy little netbook.. Works a treat.. Fast too..

battleshooter wrote:
I'm almost ashamed to be seen with it given that Puppy's supposed to be for "low spec machines".

Lol me too .. But uni stuff needed x64 ...

I still love my old Dell Optiplex though..
One of about 20 PCs taken by some kid from a skip after they were needlessly dumped by the NHS...

He had a stack of them in his room.. 20 quid each, I took three Smile

battleshooter wrote:
It sure does make compiling a lot more fun though.

My brother can compile LibreOffice in about 3 mins on his FreeBSD setup, using an old i5 ..
He says ccache speeds things up massively for him.. I never used it though..

I will defo download this and test soon, I hope (like recent Slackos) it is one of the few Puppies that DOESN'T force my PC fans
to full speed... I hope it respects my BIOS/UEFI settings and keep them low/slow .. Most puppies dont Sad

.. and I like your website BTW Cool

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belham2

Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 1301

PostPosted: Wed 27 Sep 2017, 14:22    Post subject:  

battleshooter wrote:


Another XFCE fan hah. I guess I am beginning to understand the need for XFCE to be an option in Woof. It seems to be the second most popular after JWM/Rox, but I guess naturally XFCE fans would gravitate to this thread.



Lol, Battleshooter. you are sooooo diplomatic Wink


P.S. Still cranking on your XFCE on top of Barry's Easy.....have found some more gotchas (as Barry calls them), but not anything that isn't solvable with a little hunting down and then making corrections (usually in symlinks and desktop files). It's not your fault, it's the way Barry sets up Easy...just different, that's all. Otherwise, your pet is rock stable and hasn't crashed on me once Smile
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Marv


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 911
Location: SW Wisconsin

PostPosted: Thu 28 Sep 2017, 10:38    Post subject:  

Morning battleshooter,
Xfce mixer is there and fine, just wasn't installed in my custom panel. Coinflip between the two, Retrovol has it on the configuration flexibility and Xfce mixer on reliability as I see it.

I switch the Thunar custom 'Show Full Path' to 'Copy Full Path' as I do that quite a lot and it saves a click or two. Just pinched the command line from X-Slacko
Code:
echo -n %f | xclip -selection c

Installed XFCE-XenialPup64 r3 on my Bay Trail desktop. No problems seen on that somewhat different hardware as yet. That box runs as a samba server mostly and for testing. I am slowly getting some clarity on my throughput issues/question.

Cheers,

_________________
Pups currently in kennel Very Happy X-slacko 4.4 and X-tahr 2.0 for my users; LxPupSc,LxPupXenial & XFCE_XenialPup64 for me. All good pups indeed, and all running browsers, office etc. solely from SFS.
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belham2

Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 1301

PostPosted: Fri 29 Sep 2017, 06:42    Post subject:  

Hi Battleshooter and all,

Wanted to let you how know I solved the shutdown 'gotcha' issue I was having running this crazy-setup of mine with your great xfce.pet on top of Barry's experimental EasyLinux0.4. The pics below say it best, and since Barry included radky's PupControl by default, it works a treat (I cannot get XFCE's gui/shutdown to work no matter how I try). Anyhow, the upshot is: no more having to open a terminal to do shutdowns, logouts, restarting, etc. Wink
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Moat


Joined: 16 Jul 2013
Posts: 766
Location: Mid-mitten, USA

PostPosted: Fri 29 Sep 2017, 16:10    Post subject:  

belham2 wrote:
(I cannot get XFCE's gui/shutdown to work no matter how I try).


Yeah, it ("xfce4-shutdown-manager" - or something like that?) wouldn't work for me either (from Whisker Menu, the GUI pops up and "Logout" button works, but "Restart" and "Shutdown" are greyed out and non-functional) on the xfcexenial-R3.iso - but included in the app menu I stumbled upon Carolina's shutdown GUI (w/combobox)... which works!

Otherwise, the rest of the system looks/runs stellar, CPU quiet and very, very zippy so far (this 4.13.3 kernel seems to be a winner) - effortlessly running and connecting (Frisbee) from liveCD on this old 2-core Pentium Optiplex 380 desktop - great stuff again, Battleshooter! Cool I agree - it's neat to see the latest WoofCE changes/improvements, pleasantly dressed in the guise of Xfce...

Bob
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Billtoo


Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Posts: 3265
Location: Ontario Canada

PostPosted: Fri 29 Sep 2017, 17:03    Post subject: XFCE 4.12 for XenialPup 64bit  

Wanted to give your xfce4 pet a try so I installed it in my imac install of xenialpup64:

root# inxi -bw
System: Host: puppypc18301 Kernel: 4.9.51-x86_64 x86_64 (64 bit) Desktop: Xfce 4.12.4
Distro: xenialpup64 7.0.8.4
Machine: Device: desktop System: Apple product: iMac8 1 v: 1.0 serial: W8811GXLZE2
Mobo: Apple model: Mac-F226BEC8 v: PVT serial: 1
UEFI: Apple v: IM81.88Z.00C1.B00.0802091538 date: 02/09/08
CPU: Dual core Intel Core2 Duo E8135 (-MCP-) speed/max: 1600/2400 MHz
Graphics: Card: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD/ATI] RV610/M74 [Mobility Radeon HD 2400 XT]
Display Server: X.org 1.18.4 drivers: ati,radeon (unloaded: modesetting,fbdev,vesa)
tty size: 124x24 Advanced Data: N/A for root
Network: Card-1: Broadcom BCM4321 802.11a/b/g/n driver: b43-pci-bridge
Card-2: Marvell 88E8058 PCI-E Gigabit Ethernet Controller driver: sky2
Drives: HDD Total Size: 282.1GB (3.2% used)
Weather: Conditions: 52 F (11 C) - light showers rain Time: September 29, 4:46 PM EDT
Info: Processes: 204 Uptime: 5 min Memory: 281.4/3949.2MB Client: Shell (bash) inxi: 2.3.8
root#

After installing the pet I ran fixmenus in the terminal and restarted x, up popped xfce4.
I shutdown, (xenialpup64 is running from a uefi flash drive install on this imac), next boot xfce4 is back.
Haven't tested it much yet but good so far.
Thanks.
***************************************************************
I did another xfce4 install with a newer build of xenialpup64, this one is working well too.
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battleshooter


Joined: 14 May 2008
Posts: 1352
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Sat 30 Sep 2017, 07:35    Post subject:  

Marv wrote:
An aside: Do you have a server box in your household?


I'm supposed to be setting on up some time in the next month or so, but haven't gotten around to it yet. Are you finding you transfer times subpar?

Marv wrote:
I switch the Thunar custom 'Show Full Path' to 'Copy Full Path' as I do that quite a lot and it saves a click or two. Just pinched the command line from X-Slacko


Ah yes, Geoff included that in the final Carolina upgrade but I didn't take the Thunar actions from that version. Thanks for the reminder Marv, added it on for the next release.

sc0ttman wrote:
I still love my old Dell Optiplex though..

I will defo download this and test soon, I hope (like recent Slackos) it is one of the few Puppies that DOESN'T force my PC fans
to full speed... I hope it respects my BIOS/UEFI settings and keep them low/slow .. Most puppies dont Sad

.. and I like your website BTW Cool



Oh hah, my first dedicated Puppy machine was a Dell. A really old one though, so old it was beige Laughing

My cooling system has always been questionable so I can't say about the fans. What's more Puppy reports the temperature about 30c more than bios or Windows so I'm probably not the best to answer that.

And thanks hah. That website is a bit pointless right now though. I just signed up for the storage, but for some reason it doesn't like the iso uploads even though it accepted the first one. I'm just going to stick with Google Drive for now, less hassle

belham2 wrote:
Lol, Battleshooter. you are sooooo diplomatic Wink


If there have been fierce debates over this, I think I've actually missed it, wasn't aware.

Glad to hear the pet is behaving itself, quite remarkable, I didn't know it would be so compatible

Regarding the XFCE shutdown gui, it never works in Puppy as far as I know, as we don't use a login manager. That's why Carolina has the yad drop down dialog.

Moat wrote:
Yeah, it ("xfce4-shutdown-manager" - or something like that?) wouldn't work for me either (from Whisker Menu, the GUI pops up and "Logout" button works, but "Restart" and "Shutdown" are greyed out and non-functional) on the xfcexenial-R3.iso - but included in the app menu I stumbled upon Carolina's shutdown GUI (w/combobox)... which works!


Ahh, Whiskers must default to the Xfce logout dialog. I wonder if I should just remove it and symlink it to the Carolina dialog, or if I should just include Whiskers. Hmm.

billtoo wrote:
Haven't tested it much yet but good so far.


Sweet Bill, glad to know Xenial and XFCE is holding up! Thanks for the test report!

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Marv


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 911
Location: SW Wisconsin

PostPosted: Sat 30 Sep 2017, 23:56    Post subject:  

battleshooter wrote:
Marv wrote:
An aside: Do you have a server box in your household?


I'm supposed to be setting on up some time in the next month or so, but haven't gotten around to it yet. Are you finding you transfer times subpar?
Alright, here's what I'm chewing on. No matter what I do the forum seems intent on reformatting it so it's attached as a png.

Update: Got it through formatted. PNG removed.

Code:
All transfers from i5 laptop, wireless, to Bay Trail server, wired. 
Identical 256MB savefile transferred.  Identical directories to and from.
No other local traffic on local net. Tests done basically back-to-back.
Differences replicated at least 4 times on other pups and kernels.
cli used was rsync --progress <sourcefile>  <destinationdirectory>
FM in XFCE pups is Thunar, FM in LxPups is PcManFM, both use gvfs...
Rox-Filer drag/copy matches rsync times in all cases.  I haven't tried XFE, another non-gvfs FM yet.

Speeds and times:                                                   i5 to Bay Trail                          Bay Trail to i5

                                                                            rsync       filemanager               rsync       filemanager
                                                   
X-Slacko 4.4                 32b 4.1.31 kernel:      29 seconds      25 seconds          22 seconds      22 seconds 
LxPupSc 17.09.24        32b 4.9.13 kernel:      34 seconds      27 seconds          27 seconds      27 seconds 
LxXenialPup 17.06.1     32b 4.9.13 kernel:      33 seconds      33 seconds
LxPupSc 17.09.24        32b 4.9.13 kernel:      30 seconds      17 seconds          27 seconds      27 seconds
LxPupSc 17.09.24        64b 4.12.10 kernel:     30 seconds      11 seconds              NA              NA
XFCE-XenialPup64        64b 4.12.10 kernel:     26 seconds      13 seconds              NA              NA

LxPupSc 17.09.24        64b 4.13.0 kernel:      31 seconds      3 1/2 minutes           NA              NA
XFCE-XenialPup64        64b 4.13.0 kernel:      45 seconds      3 minutes                 NA              NA
LxPupSc 17.09.24        64b 4.13.3 kernel:      36 seconds      3+ minutes          27 seconds      3+ minutes
XFCE-XenialPup64        64b 4.13.3 kernel:      47 seconds      3 1/2 minutes       25 seconds      3+ minutes

_________________
Pups currently in kennel Very Happy X-slacko 4.4 and X-tahr 2.0 for my users; LxPupSc,LxPupXenial & XFCE_XenialPup64 for me. All good pups indeed, and all running browsers, office etc. solely from SFS.
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battleshooter


Joined: 14 May 2008
Posts: 1352
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Tue 03 Oct 2017, 20:40    Post subject:  

Wow what? Those are some huge time differences...4.13 seems to have a lot of negative changes hmm
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Marv


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 911
Location: SW Wisconsin

PostPosted: Tue 03 Oct 2017, 21:54    Post subject:  

battleshooter wrote:
Wow what? Those are some huge time differences...4.13 seems to have a lot of negative changes hmm
I'll say. it took a long time first to convince myself that they were real and then to sort out a lot of variables and get it boiled down to what you see above. I've tested a bit more, trying the newest gvfs and associated libs, YASSM vs straight gvfs-smb connections and the newest LxPupSc with the 4.13.4 64b kernel. The details are in the LxPupSc thread. I really think it is a gvfs-smb/kernel interaction but can neither prove it nor fix it. For now I can either use Rox-Filer or rsync for the big transfers or use the 4.12.10 64b kernel from LxPupSc 17.09.1T in either your pup or LxPupSc. Both work fine. I still have one windows box in the house so I would like to keep samba as the share server for now. Maybe 13 is just a bad number Confused

Update: I'd thought about this but just tried it. I used the 'copy to' custom command in Thunar, either stock or substituting rsync --progress for cp and transfer times to the mounted samba share are exactly what I'd expect, 27 seconds or so for a 256Mb savefile. So... I can do what I need from Thunar with not too many more clicks. I assume a custom rightclick in PcManFM would do the same.

_________________
Pups currently in kennel Very Happy X-slacko 4.4 and X-tahr 2.0 for my users; LxPupSc,LxPupXenial & XFCE_XenialPup64 for me. All good pups indeed, and all running browsers, office etc. solely from SFS.
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battleshooter


Joined: 14 May 2008
Posts: 1352
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Tue 03 Oct 2017, 22:30    Post subject:  

We could always try the 4.14 kernel, should be coming out about now and is supposed to be LTS. Seems like more big changes, particularly dropping in tree firmware
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