Brexit Pup Stage 2 - Released 15th January 2018

For talk and support relating specifically to Puppy derivatives
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ETP
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Brexit Pup - Released 16th October 2017

#16 Post by ETP »

Hi musher0,
You read my mind!
Please see PM.
Regards ETP
[url=http://tinyurl.com/pxzq8o9][img]https://s17.postimg.cc/tl19y14y7/You_Tube_signature80px.png[/img][/url]
[url=http://tinyurl.com/kennels2/]Kennels[/url]

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Mike Walsh
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#17 Post by Mike Walsh »

Hey, musher0.

Sorry for last night's diatribe. I'd been struggling with Chrome 62 all day. trying to 'tame the beast', and bring it to heel. I was rather frustrated, to say the least, and getting more than a bit cheesed-off with Nanny Google's 'We know better than you' attitude.

I was taking a break, and just having a browse (as you do!), and came across ETP's thread, and.....well, the frustration just came boiling out onto the 'paper', as it were.

The <*rant*> is well & truly over, mon ami..!

@ETP:- Sorry for hijacking your thread, mate..... :oops: Eee, things were so much simpler back in the days of 'ChromeBook Pup', weren't they? :lol:


Mike. :wink:

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Re: Brexit Pup - Released 16th October 2017

#18 Post by musher0 »

ETP wrote:Hi musher0,
You read my mind!
Please see PM.
Got it, thanks.
musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
"You want it darker? We kill the flame." (L. Cohen)

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#19 Post by musher0 »

Mike Walsh wrote:Hey, musher0.

Sorry for last night's diatribe. I'd been struggling with Chrome 62 all day. trying to 'tame the beast', and bring it to heel. I was rather frustrated, to say the least, and getting more than a bit cheesed-off with Nanny Google's 'We know better than you' attitude.

I was taking a break, and just having a browse (as you do!), and came across ETP's thread, and.....well, the frustration just came boiling out onto the 'paper', as it were.

The <*rant*> is well & truly over, mon ami..!

@ETP:- Sorry for hijacking your thread, mate..... :oops: Eee, things were so much simpler back in the days of 'ChromeBook Pup', weren't they? :lol:

Mike. :wink:
No problem! :)

If you want to mumble and grumble some more about Chrome62, belham2
is dedicating a thread to it!

BFN.
musher0
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#20 Post by musher0 »

@ETP: Test report

Don't take any of the following personally! ;)

The ISO you provided installed and booted ok through grub4dos' menu.lst.

terminal font too wide (probably a fixed-width font is not specified in the
.Xdefaults or .Xresources files?). Still workable, though.

jwm cannot do full screen on my 1980x1080 monitor. jwm's idea of full
screen on my monitor is probably 1024x768, always starting from top left.
It's been that way since the new jwm version.

Which is why I installed wmii and pekwm from PPM (which works fine). It
turns out both of these WM's can do a "full" full screen with any window.

However computer froze when I tried to create the wmii menu. Of course
that may be caused by any number of things. I'll have to revisit that bug.

Execution of anything is as slow as molasses in winter with this 4.9 version
64-bit kernel.

Changing gtk and jwm themes, also font and font sizes, is ok.

Pupsave file created without a glitch.

I did not try the browser, but there was a valid ethernet connection (the
connection traybar icon was blinking every once and a while).

Superficially, French-Canadian localisation appears to be ok. I didn't write
anything of any length, though; more testing is needed.

Internet time sync also ok.

That's it for now. Have a great day!.

~~~~~~~~~~
PS. My hardware listing is attached.
Attachments
lshw.lst.zip
(866 Bytes) Downloaded 141 times
musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
"You want it darker? We kill the flame." (L. Cohen)

april

#21 Post by april »

So ETP Any answers on my queries?
Looks like a remake of Precise with 64 bit and a new dialog program

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ETP
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Brexit Pup - Released 16th October 2017

#22 Post by ETP »

April, I did reply at the bottom of the previous page but in the light of your comments together with musher0's comments
regarding his test on the WoofCE produced ISO used as a base for Brexit Pup, now intend to add a new recommendation
to the original post in this thread.

You have both found that this later kernel (k 4.9.15) runs like a sloth on mogadon on older hardware.
That does not bode well for Brexit's Internet TV features.

To avoid further disappointment I will suggest that Brexit requires a minimum of an i3 CPU or the AMD equivalent.
Thanks to you both for testing.
Regards ETP
[url=http://tinyurl.com/pxzq8o9][img]https://s17.postimg.cc/tl19y14y7/You_Tube_signature80px.png[/img][/url]
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#23 Post by musher0 »

@ETP

Thanks for the confirmation.

Do you think the speed issue could be solved by a 32-bit edition with, say,
a 4.1 kernel? Or is it a waste of time to even think about it?

TIA for any pointer.
musher0
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ETP
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Brexit Pup - Released 16th October 2017

#24 Post by ETP »

Hi musher0,

It seems to be the case that "Puppy" in general is slowing down with the newer kernels.

As an example I was shocked at just how much slower Barry's Quirky Xerus64 8.3 k 4.11.12 issued
in July 2017 was in comparison to to his Quirky Xerus64 8.0 Final k 4.4.7 issued April 2016.

The earlier Pup was faster running a full install from a USB2 stick than the later Pup installed on a USB3 stick.

They were full installs and of course you cannot get faster than running entirely in RAM.
Over the years I have also observed that for any given 64-bit hardware the 32-bit version of
any given Pup will in general out perform its 64-bit version.

We are currently between a rock and a hard place with browsers insisting on the latest kernels & security updates
which require faster machines and the need to keep Puppy running on old hardware.
To get back to your question:

Once you have a stick available you may want to try TV/PVR Pup V4 with your Turion 64X2 TL52.
That is a 32-bit Pup based on Xenial 7.0.4 with the k 4.1.31 (i686) kernel. It runs entirely in RAM.

In the release notes for that I recommended:
Whilst this is a 32-bit Pup it's HD features really require a quick 64-bit PC (i3 or above), DDR3 memory and a largish monitor.
A wired connection is also recommended together with an Internet connection download speed of at least 10Mbps.
That was to ensure that the BBC HD TV streams could be handled.
Outside of the UK that panel can be toggled off by an option on the desktop menu.
That will then give you something very similar to Brexit with OB plus vlc & kodi.
The latest Chromium pet for that is 60.0.3112.78 which I do not propose to update further.
Palemoon & Thunderbird are updatable to their latest versions.
Regards ETP
[url=http://tinyurl.com/pxzq8o9][img]https://s17.postimg.cc/tl19y14y7/You_Tube_signature80px.png[/img][/url]
[url=http://tinyurl.com/kennels2/]Kennels[/url]

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#25 Post by musher0 »

Thanks, EDP.

I might give your TV/PVR Pup a go when I have a minute. (I have a
translation to return Monday noon.)

Since you built this Brexit Pup, perhaps you know this:
is there a way to locate a 4.1 or even a 4.4 (ubuntu's original choice for
xenial) 32-bit kernel and swap it for 666philb's 4.9 in his 32-bit xenialPup?

I know that the 32-bit kernels are swappable without penalty for the
DPupStretch-7, but maybe it's the exception that confirms the rule?

For example, I switched my original 3.14 32-bit kernel (from late March)
with OscarTalks 4.4 kernel (from late Sept.) and then back to a 3.16.43
LTS kernel and this Dpup-7 kept humming happily. No glitches whatsoever.

Thanks in advance for any lead.

~~~~~~~~~~
In conclusion, if I may, a reaction to "Puppyists being caught between a
rock and a hard place because they have older computers trying to run
monster browsers", NOT to quote you verbatim!!!

-=> This may be a "business opportunity", so to speak, for the smaller
browsers, links2, NetSurf, qupzilla and the like, to fill the gap and show
their full capacities.
~~~~~~~~~~

Have a great day!
musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
"You want it darker? We kill the flame." (L. Cohen)

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ETP
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Brexit Pup - Released 16th October 2017

#26 Post by ETP »

@ musher0,

Sorry, but I am not familiar with swapping kernels. 666philb has of late been active
again on the forum and would be best placed to answer that question.
Perhaps you could send him a pm?
Regards ETP
[url=http://tinyurl.com/pxzq8o9][img]https://s17.postimg.cc/tl19y14y7/You_Tube_signature80px.png[/img][/url]
[url=http://tinyurl.com/kennels2/]Kennels[/url]

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Re: Brexit Pup - Released 16th October 2017

#27 Post by musher0 »

ETP wrote:@ musher0,

Sorry, but I am not familiar with swapping kernels. 666philb has of late been active
again on the forum and would be best placed to answer that question.
Perhaps you could send him a pm?
Has he? That's great news! Thanks. Will do.

BFN.
musher0
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#28 Post by musher0 »

Hello all.

A bit off-thread but still related:
a xenialPup-7.0.8 32-bits with kernel 4.1 is now available here:
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... ost#971619

BFN.
musher0
~~~~~~~~~~
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fredx181
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#29 Post by fredx181 »

Maybe it helps someone, I have extremely slow boot with any kernel 4.8 or higher on a HP compaq 6710b laptop and found solution here:
https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php ... 4#p1689914
Adding this to kernel boot command line solves the problem for me:

Code: Select all

video=SVIDEO-1:d
Seems like more older machines are affected by this kernel bug?

More reports:
https://bugs.archlinux.org/task/51703
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=98810

Fred

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#30 Post by musher0 »

I just tried it. Is your trick supposed to do anything. fredx?

I still have to wait 15 seconds fro deadbeef to run, whereas on the xenialPup with the
4.1 kernel 32 bits, similar wait is only 5 seconds.

On the xenialPup kernel 4.9 64 bits, it's also a 15 seconds wait for abiword, gnumeric,
geany, etc., the first time your riun them.

This is unreal.
musher0
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#31 Post by fredx181 »

Hi musher0, then the problem you have is different from mine.
Without the trick booting time for me is around 100 sec, (re)starting X is veeery slow also (and X crashing sometimes). All is normal for me if I boot with the video=... addition (boot time only 17 sec. then)

Fred

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pp4mnklinux
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Brexit Pup - Released 16th October 2017

#32 Post by pp4mnklinux »

HI:



Can u make an ISO file so it could be easy to install and test??

THANKs IN ADVANCE.
Distro: xenialpup64 7.5 XXL
Desktop Panel: JWM ~ FbBox 5.0

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ETP
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Brexit Pup - Released 16th October 2017

#33 Post by ETP »

Hi pp4mnklinux,

I do not intend to issue an ISO of Brexit Pup as I consider the issued image format to be superior.

If you wish to establish whether your hardware will handle the later 64-bit k 4.9.15 kernel you are
welcome to a copy of the WoofCE produced ISO & devx which were used as a base for Brexit Pup.

Musher0 found that to be slow in the extreme on his older hardware and IMHO these later kernels
require a minimum of an i3 CPU or the AMD equivalent.
They can be found here:

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/ ... sp=sharing

If that does not run well on your hardware neither will Brexit.
Last edited by ETP on Sat 28 Oct 2017, 09:28, edited 2 times in total.
Regards ETP
[url=http://tinyurl.com/pxzq8o9][img]https://s17.postimg.cc/tl19y14y7/You_Tube_signature80px.png[/img][/url]
[url=http://tinyurl.com/kennels2/]Kennels[/url]

april

#34 Post by april »

Actually a big part of the problems here seem to be your assumptions !
When I start Pale Moon for instance it immediately launches into a video broadcast which you don't realise is going on . So its madly downloading data behind the scenes that you may not even know about.

For anyone with a poor connection or limited download ability thats disasterous.
You have just assumed everyone is the same as you and they are not.

You need to turn off all these heavy downloads first

Then Palemoon is reasonable

Deadbeef comes up in 4 seconds for me with a 2core pentium chip
Abiword 4 secs
Geany 2 secs
Gnumeric 3 secs

Thats all with palemoon running in the background so I'm pretty happy with those.
I've had an issue with my MG2560 Cannon printer in that I need to get and position a .ppd file for it to print and even then it won't print the test pages in Precise 5.7.1 with the latest CUPS 2.5.5 but here it installed and worked so the ppd files must be fairly up to date

I like Pale moon now as I have also been able to install lastpass and adblock sucessfully

april

#35 Post by april »

I am having trouble with persistence.

This CBSN video insists on starting anyhow and how do I stop it?
The Lastpass and adblock addons that I carefully installed have gone on the next boot?Tried reinstalling and saving a couple of times just in case. No good

The bookmarks I installed were gone too?

That bloody warning alarm for no internet connection needs obliterating . As if we don't have enough noise pollution going on around us without you adding it here . How do I get it gone?

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