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 Forum index » House Training » Beginners Help ( Start Here)
Which Puppy Should I Use?
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PhPsdM

Joined: 07 Dec 2017
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Sun 10 Dec 2017, 16:48    Post subject:  Which Puppy Should I Use?
Subject description: I'm curious what I should be using Puppy-wise
 

So I've been really curious about what Puppy flavour or Puplet would be best for me. I've been doing lots of research and I think I understand how Puppy has been divided and dubbed. You've got your uPups which are based on Ubuntu, these include LucidPup (Lucid Lynx), PrecisePup (Precise Pangolin), Quirky Werewolf, TahrPup (Trusty Tahr), and now XenialPup (Xenial Xerus). You also have your sPups based on Slackware. Orginal Puppy which is now Wary and Racy. And finally, Quirky, the experimental Linux developed by Barry, and it's not officially a Puppy distro. But then you have fanmade distros, the most curious of which are XerusPup and ArtfulPup which are uPups as well, but I'm also quite curious about Fatdog, LighthousePup, and MacPup. I'm using an RV520 Samsung Laptop for my school that currently runs Windows 7 Premium, with 4 GB RAM and an Intel i3 inside. I've been using TahrPup and finally figured my way around it, but I have a corrupted save and am thinking of changing my OS. So would upgrading to XenialPup or ArtfulPup be a good idea, or should I stick to TahrPup or maybe even use a fanmade distro? I know this is a long post but I'm just really curious. Thanks for any advice and help in advance.

TL;DR
I use TahrPup but am thinking of upgrading to XenialPup or ArtfulPup or maybe a fanmade distro.
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ally


Joined: 19 May 2012
Posts: 1696
Location: lincoln, uk

PostPosted: Sun 10 Dec 2017, 17:17    Post subject:  

I found tahrpup extremely stable but am now using xenial which seems just as good

make sure you frugsl install, this will allow you to install many pups and try them, what suits me may not suit you

if possible create a dedicated partition for the pups, ext3 seems to be the safest

if you install on a windows partition you my have defrag problems

download a few and play, once you get used to installing it will only take around 30 seconds so very easy to try

have fun!

Smile
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 9882
Location: Charleston S.C. USA

PostPosted: Sun 10 Dec 2017, 18:06    Post subject:  

Welcome to Puppy land!

You already seem to have a good understanding of Puppy versions.

With your hardware, you could use any Puppy version.

What Puppy to use is really up to you.
Each version of Puppy is slightly different from another and they each offer their own set of features.
However, the newer the hardware the newer the Puppy you want to use.
Newer Linux kernels have the needed support drivers.
Precise, Wary, Quirky, or other older Puppies may not have all you want or need.

Tahrpup is a very good version of Puppy.
It has really been bug fixed and tweaked to just work.
That one is the best to first try.
Do try to be using the latest version.
Tahrpup 6.0.5 or 6.0.6.

The newest official Puppy is Xenialpup.
It is kind of the next version up from Tahrpup.
A lot of programs and core files updated.
Uses a newer Linux kernel.

The Slacko versions are the other official versions
It's next version Slacko 7.0 is still in beta stage of development. Bug fixing and tweaking.

Puppy derivatives.
basically versions of Puppy that someone has modified to have the programs and features they want Puppy to have. Use a different window manager, file manager, programs pre-installed, etc.....
Whatever they decide to do to it.
Usually they are based on an official Puppy version and they modify it.

Then there are the Puppy like versions.
Not official made using the Puppy build system Woof.
Fatdog is a good example.
Fatdog does a lot of stuff the fatdog way, but it still does stuff the Puppy way. Kind a of a mix of ideas.

Artfulpup is a good example of a new version of Puppy in development. It has been out for some time, but still being tested, bug fixed, and improved.
Someone new developing their idea of a Puppy version.

Get use to that with Puppy.
We the users of Puppy do most of the testing, and bug fixing. So, release a new version and let the users work it and find what is wrong.
Usually released as alpha, beta, then final release version.

Even finished Puppies get some updates as core software updates and changes come out.
That is why you see version numbering change.
Example:
Tahrpup 6.0
Tahrpup 6.0.2
Tahrpup 6.0.5
Tahrpup 6.0.6


Best advice I can give you is pick something to try.
See how it works.
Make sure to try the latest version.
The newer or newest versions of Puppy would be best for their updated support for running programs.

_________________
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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 2133
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Mon 11 Dec 2017, 12:55    Post subject: Which Pup depends on your computer & Interests  

Hi PhPsdM,

As bigpup suggested, the best course is to try several and see which works best for you. In deciding which to try, I'd factor in these considerations:

How often do you want to change your operating system? Your computer can handle 64-bit operating systems. 32-bit puppies run 'lighter--use less RAM & CPU*--' but the actual creators of Web-browsers (e.g. Mozilla publishes firefox, Puppy Devs/Builders restructure their work) have/may soon be dropping support of 32-bit versions.

Do you have a special computing interest such as Movie Production? Web-browsers, security fixes and your special interests are the only software which you should attempt to keep current. Most other 'updates/grades' just add more 'bells and whistles' you may not ever use. So older/lighter versions are usually sufficient; and if you install a 32-bit compatibility layer, even 32-bit applications may prove satisfactory.

There are far more applications created for 'Ubuntu-based' Puppies than for 'Slackware-based' Puppies. But on some computers Slackos provide better graphic and sound quality. I'd recommend trying one of the 64-bit Slackos to see if that's the case with your computer. I assume you are aware that Puppies with the designation "X" or "Lx" in their names are 'fanmade': employing a base Puppy's essentials, accessing the same repos, but subtituting xfce-thunar or Openbox-pcman + LxPanel for the traditional jwm-rox window-manager, filemanager combo.

Although Artfulpup is very nice, it is not based on one of Ubuntu's Long Term Support projects. My impression is that when Ubuntu Bionic Beaver -a LTS project-- has reached sufficient maturity, peebee will be turning his attention to that base.

Ubuntu's categorization of a version as LTS or not isn't as important to Puppy users as it is to Ubuntu users. For example, Lucid Lynx reached End-of-Life in 2012, while rerwin has recently published a new version of Lucid Revitalized with updated software and security patches. Still, when Ubuntu closes a versions repositories, no longer produces security patches, and independent software creators no longer build applications for it, keeping an operating system current becomes an increasingly difficult task.

Like Ally, I found Tahrpup very stable but now primarily use Xenialpup64, equally stable and perhaps slightly easier to 'flesh out'. Many independent software developers have published AppImages which, under Xenialpup64, you can simply download, click and run. Because Puppies are built as modules --separating the 'core' from the applications-- making it very easy to upgrade the 'core'-- I expect Xenialpups to remain secure and usable for many years.

Slackware takes a different approach than Ubuntu. It conservatively makes changes only when they are necessary or beneficial. Consequently, for Slackos, applications created five or more years ago often work OOTB, or with only slight changes.

Puppies are designed to run as Frugal Installs. That means nothing other than that they do not require an entire partition as they will run from a folder. There is nothing you can do with a Full install that you can't do with a Frugal install, and many of the advantages of a Frugal install are lost if you do a Full install. As a Frugal install rarely needs more than 4 Gbs of space --exclusive of SFSes, AppImages, and Wine-- there is no reason to just settle for one Puppy. That will make it easy to try out Bionic Puppy when it becomes available; but also, to run a 64-bit Puppy when you want to access the web, while booting into a 32-bit Puppy for other activities if you find such process satisfactory.

mikesLr

* On relatively new hardware, I find that it takes slightly longer for the newest 64-bit applications to open, and save datafiles, but no appreciable difference otherwise. But even the newest 64-bit applications employed under Puppy will run circles around anything under Windows.
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greengeek


Joined: 20 Jul 2010
Posts: 4799
Location: Republic of Novo Zelande

PostPosted: Thu 14 Dec 2017, 04:45    Post subject:  

Hi PhPsdM - congratulations - that is a very good summation of the puppy landscape.

You mentioned corrupt save files and I think you will have a better puppy experience if you can step away from using save files or save folders.

My reason? Because save files and save folders by their very nature capture everything you do each session. This could mean that you capture some malware or install (accidentally or deliberately) something that corrupts your operating system files.

If you do decide to eliminate the possibility of corrupting save files (or save folders) there are a number of methods for setting up your puppy in such a a way that it is "personalised" to your tastes. Puppy has multiple methods for creating a personalised or "remastered" operating system.

Once you have found a pup which suits your hardware, and whose behaviour and appearance you like, try to find threads relevant to that pup and asks questions about what is the best remaster method.

In general - the best advice is - boot the pristine pup, make as many personalised configuration changes are needed (also as few as possible) then delete web history or cache or profile (if you don't need them...) then remaster.
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nic007


Joined: 13 Nov 2011
Posts: 2246
Location: Cradle of Humankind

PostPosted: Thu 14 Dec 2017, 05:43    Post subject:  

Out of the box, I would say Tahr 6.0.5 unless you have the very latest hardware or extremely old hardware (I'm using it on a 12 year old laptop). I've been using Racy most of the time but to be honest Tahr is better (especially after fiddling with it to get the optimum settings I require). The builtin browser is "new" enough and VLC media player is more stable and has more options as mplayer in previous versions of Puppy. I haven't tried Xenial but the size is a turnoff for me for starters (50% larger than Tahr!!!!!!!).
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Mike Walsh


Joined: 28 Jun 2014
Posts: 3321
Location: King's Lynn, UK.

PostPosted: Thu 14 Dec 2017, 06:14    Post subject:  

greengeek wrote:
Hi PhPsdM - congratulations - that is a very good summation of the puppy landscape.

You mentioned corrupt save files and I think you will have a better puppy experience if you can step away from using save files or save folders.

My reason? Because save files and save folders by their very nature capture everything you do each session. This could mean that you capture some malware or install (accidentally or deliberately) something that corrupts your operating system files.

If you do decide to eliminate the possibility of corrupting save files (or save folders) there are a number of methods for setting up your puppy in such a a way that it is "personalised" to your tastes. Puppy has multiple methods for creating a personalised or "remastered" operating system.

Once you have found a pup which suits your hardware, and whose behaviour and appearance you like, try to find threads relevant to that pup and asks questions about what is the best remaster method.

In general - the best advice is - boot the pristine pup, make as many personalised configuration changes are needed (also as few as possible) then delete web history or cache or profile (if you don't need them...) then remaster.


Hi, GG.

Y'know, don't take this the wrong way; I know you're not the only one who advocates running in this manner, but......it seems an awfully complex, time-consuming way of doing things to have to re-master every single time you make the slightest change you want to keep.

Then again, if you're the kind of person who rarely, if ever, makes changes to their system, I guess it really doesn't make that much difference.

I know this much; re-mastering wouldn't work for me. No way. But.....'horses for courses'. One man's meat, and all that...!

@PhPsdM:- For me, there's just two to consider (especially with your hardware). Tahr and Xenial. Both extremely stable, and both with access to a huge range of software from the 'buntu repos.

Your choice, really.....though Xenial is perhaps the better bet, since it will be able to access the Xenial repos for longer. And although, as Mike says, 32-bit Pups'll run fast & light on 64-bit architecture, more & more app/program builders/creators are increasingly writing for 64-bit only.

The writing is 'on the wall' for 32-bit. But 32-bit Pups never lose support, the way mainstream distros do..!


Mike. Wink

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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 2133
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Thu 14 Dec 2017, 12:56    Post subject: Corrupted SaveFile  

Hi PhPsdM,

Regarding your corruption of a SaveFile, there's a couple thing you might want to consider in the future:

1) Don't select Linux Ext2 as its format unless you want to encrypt it -- a pretty useless action IMHO. [The Puppy Linux OSes are free. Most information is widely available. Sensitive information can be encrypted]. The Ext2 format is more easily corrupted that Ext3. Ext3 is journalized, writing more frequently than Ext2. Ext2 was recommended for USB-Keys because of the concern that after a number of writes to them they would wear out. The number, however, is in the 100,000 range. You're far more likely to loose a Key than corrupt it. And Hard-drives don't even have that limitation.

2) When possible, prefer SFSes and AppImages to installed pets as the use of these facilitate the following.

3) Start with a reasonably small SaveFile. Once you've made your initial settings (localizations, wifi settings, applications you'll never change) create a backup SaveFile or remaster. To create a backup SaveFile, just boot pfix=ram, then copy the SaveFile 3 levels deep: The first level is the root/top of a partition/drive; the second is a folder at the root/top level; the third a folder within a folder.

4) See this post about operating with the Automatic Save removed: http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=974066#974066, especially the parts about moving your "my-documents" folder to /mnt/home and only performing a manual Save immediately after a reboot.

Needless to say, (4) is how I operate. While it's possible that I've had greater success than the other Mike in remastering, I still find it troublesome. But g/g's post got me thinking. Except for the selection of web-browser SFSes and AppImages, and installing security patches, I rarely make any changes. So a remaster after building my base system followed by a small SaveFile just to handle the things which do change might be a good idea. Certainly, recreating such small SaveFile would be much easier than having to 'start from scratch'.

mikesLr
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snayak

Joined: 14 Sep 2011
Posts: 380

PostPosted: Mon 15 Jan 2018, 23:17    Post subject:  

Dear mikeslr,

I am interested to know this in a bit detailed.

Quote:
To create a backup SaveFile, just boot pfix=ram, then copy the SaveFile 3 levels deep: The first level is the root/top of a partition/drive; the second is a folder at the root/top level; the third a folder within a folder.


Kindly elaborate.

Sincerely,
Srinivas Nayak

_________________
[Precise 571 on AMD Athlon XP 2000+ with 512MB RAM]
[Fatdog 611 on Intel Pentium B960 with 4GB RAM]

Home: http://www.mathmeth.com/sn/
Blog: http://srinivas-nayak.blogspot.com/
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