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 Forum index » House Training » Beginners Help ( Start Here)
My Criteria for Switching to (Puppy) Linux
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fmen

Joined: 07 May 2018
Posts: 39

PostPosted: Mon 07 May 2018, 10:54    Post subject:  My Criteria for Switching to (Puppy) Linux  

Hi, everyone. I am a new Puppy (Xenial) trial user and so far so good.
For me, to say a final goodbye to Windows requires some basic must-haves.
Here's my list:

1. Small foot-print - I've used the lite version of Win 7 for years (check)

2. Chrome or Chromium browser with basic addons (check)

3. Mouse Gestures - EasyStroke (check)

4. iPhone music management - Google play manager (check)

5. Torrent Client - Transission (check)

6. A good backgammon program - GnuBG (check)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

7. Printer configuration (Pantum 2500W) - so far unable to get it to work
with neither driver installation nor CUPS

8. AutoIt like scripting -trying bash+xdotool with minor success. Much more
complex than AutoIt. Cannot get Autokey to work.

9. Quick Launch like in Windows - exploring but not yet there yet.

10. Wine - if all else fails. So far not successful

11. Ability to uninstall programs I do not use, like Moon Browser, Paint etc. without repercussions (This is for later)


So basically, the only major issue for me so far is the printer. I could probably live without the rest, although the tinkerer in me definitely wants everything to work.

Last edited by fmen on Tue 08 May 2018, 10:06; edited 1 time in total
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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 2407
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Mon 07 May 2018, 13:23    Post subject: Re: My Criteria for Switching to Linux  

fmen wrote:

For me, to say a final goodbye to Windows requires some basic must-haves.
Here's my list:

7. Printer configuration (Pantum 2500W) - so far unable to get it to work
with neither driver installation nor CUPS

8. AutoIt like scripting -trying bash+xdotool with minor success. Much more
complex than AutoIt. Cannot get Autokey to work.

9. Quick Launch like in Windows - exploring but not yet there yet.

10. Wine - if all else fails. So far not successful

11. Ability to uninstall programs I do not use, like Moon Browser, Paint etc. without repercussions (This is for later)


So basically, the only major issue for me so far is the printer. I could probably live without the rest, although the tinkerer in me definitely wants everything to work.


Please start a separate thread for each those issues. It makes it easier to discuss, and easier to refer to when someone else has that issue.

For now, I'll just mention

9. Quick-launch on Linux is known as Suspend or Hibernate. [It launches quickly because it doesn't really shutdown]. Xenialpup probably already has it: Menu>Shutdown, Click the Icon at the bottom Left which looks like a G. If your GUI doesn't have it, install PupShutDown-3.0 http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=422134#422134

10. Regarding wine, as I said start a new thread. How did you install?

11. Ability to Uninstall. If you installed it by clicking a pet, or using Menu>Setup>Puppy Package Manager, you can uninstall it be using Puppy Package Manager, Click the Uninstall Tab. Scroll to unwanted application and click it.

Strongly recommend using SFSes for large (e.g. LibreOffice) or frequently updated applications (e.g. web-browsers). They aren't installed. They work sort-of like windows portables. Menu>Setup>SFS Load on the fly. You can try a new one without overwriting your old.

mikesLr

p.s. I assume you've done a Frugal install. If not, start from scratch. Or ask why.
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tallboy


Joined: 21 Sep 2010
Posts: 971
Location: Oslo, Norway

PostPosted: Mon 07 May 2018, 14:55    Post subject:  

Welcome to the forum, and to Linux, fmen. Very Happy
They say that 'Rome wasn't built in one day', and similarly, finding all the pieces in the Linux puzzle will take some time. I have never used Wndows myself, I came form Mac, but I think that it may not always be to your advantage to compare everything to a former OS. Linux have many advantages that are easy to miss, if you don't adjust your brain to the new setting. Embrace the change! Very Happy
May I suggest a dip into some Linux basics ?(and also reread them next year to discover what you missed first time... Laughing ) Take a look at the guides in The Linux Documentation Project - TLDP. You'll find them here: http://tldp.org/

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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 2407
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Mon 07 May 2018, 15:59    Post subject:  

Good idea, Tallboy, letting newbies know what's going on. On the other hand, I'm sort of partial to hazing. Knowing that the others have gone through the same painful experiences builds solidarity. Laughing

But, if (s)he insists on doing things the easy way, well, maybe follow the link from here: http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=989978#989978

mikesLr
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 10426
Location: Charleston S.C. USA

PostPosted: Mon 07 May 2018, 20:47    Post subject:  

Quote:
Ability to uninstall programs I do not use, like Moon Browser, Paint etc. without repercussions (This is for later)

If you are talking about programs that come installed in Puppy.
There is a way to UN-install them, but it is really not worth the effort.
They do not take up that much room.
If you actually try to use some of them, you would be surprised how often you may use them.
Some of them are default programs for doing things in Puppy.

I do not know what browser you like to use, but Palemoon is very similar to Firefox, but without the overhead, that Firefox seems to be full of, with the latest versions.
Palemoon is coded by people that left Firefox, because they did not like the direction it was going.

Programs provided in Puppy are there for good reasons.

You have to forget Windows and learn Linux, Puppy Linux.
Puppy does Linux the Puppy way.

We are Puppy!
Resistance is futile!

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I have found, in trying to help people, that the things they do not tell you, are usually the clue to solving the problem.
When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 2407
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Mon 07 May 2018, 23:10    Post subject:  

Hi fmen,

Having flipped thru 60+ channels and found nothing worth watching -- "The Voice" provides background noises, but I don't intent to vote-- I have some time to expand on what bigpup told you about removing built in applications.

He's absolutely right. It's not worth the effort. A Frugally installed Puppy "runs in RAM", reading into RAM some of the contents of what is on your storage media, creating "pointers" in RAM to where the rest can be found when needed. If you don't have mtpaint or Palemoon open, and open Menu>System>HTop System Process Viewer you'll see that no RAM is being used by those applications. So the only thing they are doing is occupying space in storage, and if you have a "newish" computer, not very much of that, either.

If it's just that they are on the Menu which you find annoying, they can be removed from the menu. I think Xenialpup has Menu>Utility>PupMenuEdit. But, if not, you'll find it in the Utility Subsection of the Additional Software Section of the Forum. Or you file-browse to /usr/share/applications, right-click the "desktop" file of an application and select "open in default text editor". You'll find a line which begins with Categories=. Just add a "Z" to the start of any terms on the right side of the = sign. Save the changes. Open a terminal and type "fixmenus". Puppy, not recognizing the categories, won't display the application on the menu. And you can reverse the process just as easily if you later find a use for the application.

If you really want to get rid of a builtin application, you must First open Menu>Setup>Remove Builtin Packages. Don't use this on any listed application unless you are certain you know all ways Puppy uses it. The process is not reversible, but doesn't remove anything from Storage. It just breaks the pointers I mentioned above so that Puppy can't find the application. After those pointers are broken, you have to Remaster Puppy: Menu>Setup>Remaster. Or one of the Remaster alternatives found in Additional Software. With the pointers broken, Remaster can't follow them to include the application. There are a couple things you can do wrong in remastering. Even if you get it right, it will take some time. Then you have to replace your old Puppy with your Remastered version. And only then will you have reduced Puppy's footprint on your storage media. And, not by much.

As bigpup said, its not really worth the effort.

By the way, that paint application you don't like. Well, while I rarely use mtpaint, itself, if you open Menu>Setup>Default Application Chooser, you may see that mtpaint -s could be your default Screenshot application. There are others, but I still prefer mtpaint. Just press the Print Scrn Key and see what happens. Somewhere on the forum is a pet which will enable you to add an icon/launcher to the taskbar. It's getting late so I'm not going to hunt for it now. But ask, and I'll upload another copy.

Don570 has posted a great deal of information on how to get the most out of mtpaint. Even though I may not know what an application does, by now I have sufficient confidence in Puppy Devs to believe that everything they've included has value.

mikesLr
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ozsouth

Joined: 01 Jan 2010
Posts: 322
Location: S.E Australia

PostPosted: Tue 08 May 2018, 00:01    Post subject:  

@fmen - the printer installer I found on the net gave people issues until they isolated the .deb files & installed them. Assuming you didn't do that, I've attached them - both 32 & 64 bit versions. Download files, remove '.false.gz' part & open appropriate one in rox-filer. Then cups should find the driver. (May have to run in terminal:- killall cupsd then cupsd).
Pantum-P2500-Series-2.6.i386.deb.false.gz
Description 
gz

 Download 
Filename  Pantum-P2500-Series-2.6.i386.deb.false.gz 
Filesize  193.9 KB 
Downloaded  11 Time(s) 
Pantum-P2500-Series-2.6.x86_64.deb.false.gz
Description 
gz

 Download 
Filename  Pantum-P2500-Series-2.6.x86_64.deb.false.gz 
Filesize  194.94 KB 
Downloaded  13 Time(s) 
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hamoudoudou


Joined: 24 Jul 2014
Posts: 858
Location: rabat

PostPosted: Tue 08 May 2018, 00:27    Post subject: Title should be 'Switching to Puppy Linux'..  

Title should be 'Switching to Puppy Linux'.. exactly.. should not it be ?
Windows Users switch to Puppy, but Linux Users too (not for the same reasons)
LXpup 18.05 Linux: many update their versions, some come from big Linux.. they intend to change Puppy, but after some time, more or less, depends on people, they will never leave puppy, so fast.
Windows users try, most of them will give up, boried by technocracy or lack of assistance, in their native countries.
Linux.jpg
 Description   LXpup18.05
 Filesize   14.47 KB
 Viewed   321 Time(s)

Linux.jpg

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fmen

Joined: 07 May 2018
Posts: 39

PostPosted: Tue 08 May 2018, 10:28    Post subject:  

Thank you one and all!
I appreciate the encouragement and the tons of information you have all provided.

I will indeed, start separate threads for the various issues I am currently having and will have. And will continue to read, read, read.

I am trying to adjust my brain to Linux as suggested, but shouldn't ignore 25 years of Windows experience. They did get quite a few things right.

Uninstalling some of the prepackaged apps that come with Puppy was never a priority. Now that I understand that doing so could cause some unintended glitches, it has made it even less important.

Thank you, ozsouth for posting the Pantum drivers with instructions. I may tap you for more information, once I attempt installation. Getting the wireless printer up and going is really the only major criteria that is left.

Again, thanks for the warm welcome.
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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 2407
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Tue 08 May 2018, 13:17    Post subject:  

I had the time to upload another copy of the mtpaintsnapshot pet. You'll find it and a short discussion at the current end of don570's tutorial on the use of mtpaint. http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=991180#991180.

mikesLr
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tallboy


Joined: 21 Sep 2010
Posts: 971
Location: Oslo, Norway

PostPosted: Tue 08 May 2018, 13:51    Post subject:  

hamoudoudou wrote:
...many update their versions, some come from big Linux...

How true. I have a 4Gb Debian on another PC, I hardly ever use it! There are not many tasks a compact Puppy cannot perform! Very Happy

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jafadmin

Joined: 19 Mar 2009
Posts: 786

PostPosted: Wed 09 May 2018, 12:37    Post subject:  

The main difference between the Linux world and the Windows world is printing.

Manufacturers write printer drivers for windows/macs, but largely ignore Linux/Unix. It has always been thus. Linux/Unix is considered a mainframe OS, and printer manufactures consider that too small a market to put much time and attention into.

So my approach both personally and professionally has been to buy printers that are supported on Linux/Unix, and not worry about windows. They all have windows drivers.

Here you go: https://www.openprinting.org/printers

I hope this helps.
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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 2407
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Wed 09 May 2018, 21:52    Post subject: Pantum 2500W Printer Driver -- advice still needed  

Hi fmen,

The only thing I know about printers is that Benjamin Franklin's big mouth precipitated the American Revolution. While in England attempting to smooth things over he let it slip that the Colonies had set up their own banking system [think of the delay and complexity if your only source of loans was the Bank of England six weeks round trip away by sailing ship]. The result was "The Stamp Act" -- not postage stamps, but stamps required to seal/validate all Bonds --then required if the lender had to bring suit to collect-- and stamps to provide proof that import taxes were paid. You know the rest of the story.

Regarding the Pantum 2500W Printer, this post almost provides useful information. https://askubuntu.com/questions/573839/how-can-i-install-a-pantum-2502w-laser-printer-on-ubuntu The thing is when you get to here on pantum's website, http://global.pantum.com/global/drive_tag/drive/ you plug in "p2500w" rather than "pantum 2500w" --without the quotes. That will take you to here, http://global.pantum.com/global/drive_tag/drive/?s=P2500w&taxonomy_name=drive_tag which links to here, http://global.pantum.com/global/drive/2500w/, where you can download the driver. I've spelled it out as I don't know if Pantum will allow you to go directly to the last webpage cited. Click on where it says Linux Powered before clicking Download.

The package is zipped: Right-click>UEXtract, dig thru folders and you'll find a tar.gz file. Again, Right-Click>UExtract. Digging into more folders you eventually see the files shown in the attached screen shot. Having done that perhaps the instructions from Ubuntu make sense.

The last post on the Ubuntu thread indicated that it ran under Xenial:

"A slight addition in 16.04 if you try to install the driver though software manager nothing happens, I opened a terminal and entered

sudo dpkg -i Pantum-P2500-Series-2.6.x86_64.deb
that fixed it Smile"

Puppies are less fastidious. Just Left-Click the deb and Puppy will offer to install it.

But as I said, I don't know much about printers. Perhaps someone who does can provide clearer instructions about what to do with the contents.

mikesLr

p.s. --I see I missed ozsouth's post. Embarassed Blame it on hamoudoudou. His Avatar seemed angry so I scanned down very quickly. Laughing I wouldn't have realized my mistake except I scanned again trying to determine whether you had the 32-bit or 64-bit Xenialpup. Sometimes 64-bit debs direct from Ubuntu can't be used directly as they write to folders Puppies don't read and have to be repackaged. This one, by the way, doesn't.
Contents of Pantum Printer Package.png
 Description   Contents of package after 2 UExtract operations
 Filesize   23.85 KB
 Viewed   192 Time(s)

Contents of Pantum Printer Package.png

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fmen

Joined: 07 May 2018
Posts: 39

PostPosted: Thu 10 May 2018, 07:11    Post subject:  

Great backstory, mikesir! That and your advice are greatly appreciated.

I managed to install the driver.

When attempting to print a test page from http://localhost:631/printers/Pantum_p2502W,
the only option available is to save the testpage.pdf to root but not to actually print. It will not print to the printer.

BTW, I would be glad to upload screenshots if I knew how. Is there a way to upload them directly to the forum or do I need an intermediary upload site?

Frank
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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 2407
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Thu 10 May 2018, 12:19    Post subject: Adding Screenshots  

Hi fman,

I'm running Xenialpup64, but think you'll find both Screeny and TAS on Menu>Graphics, and I've previously discussed mtpaintscreenshot. After you've taken the Screenshot save it someplace where you can find it. If you're running a web-browser as Spot, that will have to be in the /root/spot folder. (Optional) Right-click to rename the file.

The Forum has a limit as to the size of a file you can upload. Usually not a problem with a graphic. But while you can attach graphics with greater dimensions they will not display --viewer would have to open it in a tab/window-- if they are more than 640 pixels wide (I think 480 deep). mtpaint makes resizing easy. Image>Resize Canvas. Save.

Just below the screen for including text you'll find a GUI for adding files. First click Choose File, then File-browse to the file you want to upload. Click Open. Type something in the File Comment box. Click Add Attachment. That's it.

mikesLr
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