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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Cutting edge
FrugalPup 17 - Puppy frugal installer.
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 13176
Location: S.C. USA

PostPosted: Fri 01 Nov 2019, 12:30    Post subject:  

That is always a problem to solve.

Need to provide some useful information about what the choice buttons would do, but what is too little or too much information. Is everyone understanding it?

Really, to find out what works.
Just try something and see how people use it.
Ask for some feedback on how FrugalPup was to use.

OH, I think we are doing that now Very Happy Laughing

Anyway, I think you are making FrugalPup be a much better program to use!!

Note:
In developing YaPi installer.
It had been released for some time, before someone posted about having problems translating some of the info statements, to other languages.
We had to do some adjustments to wording, so it would translate correctly, for complete understanding.
The person originally posting about problem, really did some good work, on helping with this.

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The things they do not tell you, are usually the clue to solving the problem.
When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
YaPI(any iso installer)
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foxpup


Joined: 29 Jul 2016
Posts: 993
Location: europa near northsea

PostPosted: Mon 04 Nov 2019, 06:59    Post subject: Secure Boot again  

rcrsn51 wrote:
I used frugalpup_13 to set up a UEFI flash drive. It had both .efi files.

I booted it on a machine with SecureBoot ON. But I got the same "failure to authenticate" error.

So I don't think that this is a one-size-fits-all solution to dealing with SecureBoot.
This intrigues me. With frugalpup_13 I can boot with Secure Boot ON, like bigpup.

Are you sure it boots from the USB, in other words from the 2 efi? And not from your HD for example?
You changed the boot order in the BIOS/EFI interface?
.
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gyro

Joined: 28 Oct 2008
Posts: 1703
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Sun 17 Nov 2019, 09:24    Post subject: FrugalPup v15r, StickPup v15r and DiskPup v15r - Puppy fruga  

FrugalPup v15r, StickPup v15r and DiskPup v15r - Puppy frugal installer.
This is a preview/beta version of FrugalPup v16 which will be released in conjuction with mio16...tar

It's a "proof of concept" for a Puppy installer that uses only a single boot loader, grub2.
More on grub2 later.

Download extra sfs, http://www.mediafire.com/folder/rdyc5lgzpeij1/frugalpup/frugalpup_15r.sfs (2.0 MiB).


Package new features:

1. Full support for locating the frugal install directory on an f2fs partition, including the vmlinuz and initrd.gz files.
(This is the first FrugalPup to do this.)

2. A new simple front-end, DiskPup.
Like StickPup, it's a minimalist single wizard that completely installs a single Puppy.
Unlike StickPup, it does not do any formating of any partitions, so it is suitable for installing to a HD as well as a stick.
It allows for the Pupy install location and the boot location to be on separate partitions, even different devices.
So it is useful for settingup a Puppy device with 2 partitions, a fat32 boot parititon and a Linux Puppy partition.

3. The interface of the bootentry utility has been modified to reflect the requirements of this Grub2 only FrugalPup.
Although it can still produce a grub4dos boot entry if you specify the "g4dos" parameter.
Run "bootentry -h" in a console to see it's updated usage help message.


FrugalPup GUI changes:

1. A new dialog to enable the specifying "pfix=" boot paramater to override the one generated by bootentry.

2. A new "Settings" dialog, to modify the config file.
The top part allows the choosing which "optional advanced dialogs" should be dislayed by the "Puppy" facility.
These are: "Separate save partition", "Kernel boot parameters" and "Pfix boot parmeter".
The defualt behaviour of FrugalPup is for all 3 of these dialogs to be disabled.
The bottom part provides text fields to edit the list of "Kennel boot parameters" shown in the "Puppy" facility,
and the "Kernel boot paramaters" used, without question, by both StickPup and DiskPup.

3. The "ISO" facility has been renamed "BootCD", to better reflect what it does.

4. Some improvements to the descriptive text in some dialogs, (more needs to be done here).


Grub2:

The Grub2 code included in "grub2-efi.tar.xz", "grub2-mbr.tar.xz" and "grub2-iso.tar.xz" has not been "borrowed" from anywhere.
It is compiled from the source in "grub-2.04.tar.gz" from https://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/grub/.
None of it is signed, so I'm fairly sure that it won't support "SecureBoot enabled".

I abandoned "borrowing" the consolidated debian grub2 efi code because it did not include the f2fs module.
Both the uefi and non-uefi codes work on the principle of a minimal "core" plus all modules.
So FrugalPup utilites always call the bootentry utility with the "fs" parameter to insert "insmod" commands for the appropriate fs-type module.

The directory structure is that produced by the grub2 utility "grub-install".
Except that the significant "grub.cfg" file is stored in the root of the partition, where it is easy to find.
i.e. click on the relavant partition icon on the desktop and it's right there.

Adding uefi booting to a fat32 partition, (which is the first partition of the device), is easy, even if you don't use any of these utilities,
use tar to extract "grub2-efi.tar.xz" into the root of the partition and then provide an appropriate "grub.cfg" file.

It would be a little easier if the grub2 package were installed in Puppy by default, so FrugalPup did not have to include it in "grub2-...tar.xz" files.
And the grub2 utilities such as "grub-install" and "grub-mkimage" could be utilised directly.
Hmm..., perhaps I should look at making a "grub-2.04.sfs".


gyro
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 13176
Location: S.C. USA

PostPosted: Tue 19 Nov 2019, 09:23    Post subject:  

Testing.
FrugalPup v15r
Did an install to a USB flash drive.
Installed Bionicpup64 8.0.
Booted with no problems to a working desktop.

When selecting option for boot loader.
Selected both.

This is booted on a Chromebook.
It has a cracked bios that is modified to be able to boot something other than Chrome OS.
The bios basically works like a old style bios, not UEFI.
The USB showed as a USB drive as boot device.
Seems like the both boot loader option worked for this computer.

Wonder if putting both boot loader setup files on this USB flash drive, would make it able to boot on any computer.
UEFI and old style bios. Idea

Tried the USB on a very new UEFI computer.
(Had to put UEFI in legacy mode to boot from the USB)
It showed two boot devices to select.
USB drive
USB UEFI drive
I assume that is because it has both boot loaders on it.

Tried to boot with each one.
Both booted OK.

_________________
The things they do not tell you, are usually the clue to solving the problem.
When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
YaPI(any iso installer)
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 13176
Location: S.C. USA

PostPosted: Tue 19 Nov 2019, 09:47    Post subject:  

Had problems getting a Puppy to boot from an internal eMMC.
FrugalPup was suggested to be used to do a Puppy install to a internal eMMC.
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=117322
Using FrugalPup made the install boot-able.
The last few posts in the topic tell you the results.

_________________
The things they do not tell you, are usually the clue to solving the problem.
When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
YaPI(any iso installer)
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gyro

Joined: 28 Oct 2008
Posts: 1703
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Tue 19 Nov 2019, 11:30    Post subject:  

bigpup wrote:
Tried the USB on a very new UEFI computer.
(Had to put UEFI in legacy mode to boot from the USB)
It showed two boot devices to select.
USB drive
USB UEFI drive
I assume that is because it has both boot loaders on it.

Tried to boot with each one.
Both booted OK.
The two devices provide boot as non-uefi and uefi, respectively.
You can tell the difference during the boot process, via the font of the display, this is most obvious for the console displays from the "init" script. During a uefi boot, these are quite small.

My desktop is a uefi machine with "SecureBoot" disabled and "CSM" enabled. My bios will display a non-uefi device even if I have installed only uefi on the usb stick, of course if I click on the non-uefi deivce the boot fails.

gyro
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gyro

Joined: 28 Oct 2008
Posts: 1703
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Tue 19 Nov 2019, 11:45    Post subject:  

bigpup wrote:
Had problems getting a Puppy to boot from an internal eMMC.
FrugalPup was suggested to be used to do a Puppy install to a internal eMMC.
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=117322
Using FrugalPup made the install boot-able.
The last few posts in the topic tell you the results.
Thanks for this.
FrugalPup is mostly agnostic to the device itself, it's much more focused on the fs-type of the partitions.
My only guess as to why FrugalPup might work on an eMMC device where other installers might not, is it always defines the partition containing 'vmlinuz' and 'initrd.gz' by the partitions UUID. This is done by it's 'bootentry' utility.

gyro
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gyro

Joined: 28 Oct 2008
Posts: 1703
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Sat 23 Nov 2019, 08:18    Post subject: A question  

The current FrugalPup has a "GParted" button that launches gparted.
It's there simply as a convenience thing, and I'm thinking of removing it in the next release, since it's not an actual part of the FrugalPup utility.

Does any one have a preference for it to remain?

gyro
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gyro

Joined: 28 Oct 2008
Posts: 1703
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Tue 26 Nov 2019, 06:19    Post subject: FrugalPup 15v - Puppy frugal installer,
Subject description: Now contains , StickPup 15v and DiskPup 15v.
 

This is a preview/beta version of FrugalPup 16 which will be released in conjuction with mio16...tar

It's a "proof of concept" for a Puppy installer that supports uefi "SecureBoot" using grub2 and a MOK.

Download extra sfs 'frugalpup_15v.sfs' from http://www.mediafire.com/folder/rdyc5lgzpeij1/frugalpup (2.5 MiB).


FrugalPup GUI changes:

1. The "GParted" button has gone.

2. The main screen now disappears when a facility button is clicked.
It then re-appears when the facility is finished.


Grub2:

"SecureBoot enabled" is supported by using a MOK (Machine Owner Key).
This means that verification fails the first time Puppy is booted on a particular machine,
but this launches a 'MokManager' which enables the enrolling of a MOK from the file '/ENROLL_THIS_KEY_IN_MOKMANAGER.cer' on the boot partition.
The MOK is stored in NVRAM, so once this is done on a machine, subsequent boots will proceed without interuption.
This is all achieved by borrowing 4 files from 'Super-UEFIinSecureBoot-Disk_minimal_v2.zip', downloaded from https://github.com/ValdikSS/Super-UEFIinSecureBoot-Disk site.
The 4 files are contained in 'grub2-sbm.tar.xz' (SecureBootMok).
Further information on the 'MokManager' screens is available on https://habr.com/en/post/446238/ ("Untrusted software first boot with shim.").

My compiled grub2 is still used, and still unsigned, it's now '/EFI/BOOT/grubx64_real.efi'.
The kernel and initrd.gz, remain unsigned.

Note: uefi booting with "SecureBoot" disabled, and non-uefi booting, work as before.

gyro
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gyro

Joined: 28 Oct 2008
Posts: 1703
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Tue 26 Nov 2019, 07:25    Post subject: FrugalPup 15v  

I forgot to mention a new feature:
The "source type" has a new option, "this".
Which is a simple way of selecting the install directory of the current running Puppy as the source directory.

gyro
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 13176
Location: S.C. USA

PostPosted: Tue 26 Nov 2019, 08:49    Post subject:  

Running in Xenialpup64 7.5

frugalpup_15v.sfs

On the fist window, none of the buttons work.
Exit one does work Laughing
capture23508.png
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capture23508.png


_________________
The things they do not tell you, are usually the clue to solving the problem.
When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
YaPI(any iso installer)
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gyro

Joined: 28 Oct 2008
Posts: 1703
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Wed 27 Nov 2019, 06:27    Post subject:  

bigpup wrote:
On the fist window, none of the buttons work.
Exit one does work Laughing
Sorry about that, my bad.
I managed to miss a file '/usr/local/mi-utils/kill-parent-yad' when creating the sfs file.

I've uploaded a fixed version.
Please download extra sfs 'frugalpup_15v.sfs' from http://www.mediafire.com/folder/rdyc5lgzpeij1/frugalpup (2.5 MiB).

@bigpup, Thanks for testing.

gyro

Last edited by gyro on Wed 27 Nov 2019, 06:56; edited 1 time in total
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gyro

Joined: 28 Oct 2008
Posts: 1703
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Wed 27 Nov 2019, 06:49    Post subject:  

FrugalPup 15w, StickPup 15w, DiskPup 15w and f2StickPup 15w - Puppy frugal installer.
This is another preview/beta version of FrugalPup 16 which will be released in conjuction with mio16...tar

Download extra sfs 'frugalpup_15w.sfs' from http://www.mediafire.com/folder/rdyc5lgzpeij1/frugalpup (2.5 MiB).

Changes:

1. New minimal frontend, 'f2StickPup', taking advantage of the new f2fs support.
This is like 'StickPup' except it formats the stick with a small fat32 partition and the remainder as an f2fs partition.
Grub2 is installed in the fat32 partition.
The sourced Puppy is installed in the f2fs partition.
This is a quick way to install a Puppy that can use a savefolder.

2. Some more improvements to descriptive text in some dialogs.
Particularly the initial dialogs in 'StickPup' and 'DiskPup'.

gyro
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gyro

Joined: 28 Oct 2008
Posts: 1703
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Sun 01 Dec 2019, 07:16    Post subject: FruglPup v16  

I think I will remove the "SecureBoot enabled" support currently in version 15v and version 15w, for version 16.
It's really "crippling" "SecureBoot" while appearing to support it.

And then try to implement full MOK support for version 17, i.e. where the user has to generate their own MOK if "SecureBoot" is enabled. And sign the stuff they want to boot, with their own key.

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foxpup


Joined: 29 Jul 2016
Posts: 993
Location: europa near northsea

PostPosted: Sun 01 Dec 2019, 07:58    Post subject: Secure Boot FYI  

FYI

I read and found out that Ubuntu has made grub2 efi's that will boot an unsigned kernel in Secure Boot.
The one you used in frugalpup<=13 from zilla-efi is from Bionic.
It is probably the last one Ubuntu has made that will boot unsigned kernels in Secure Boot.

As far as I know Ubuntu was the only distro that allowed unsigned kernels to boot in Secure Boot.
Fedora an debian certainly did not.
Ubuntu had good reasons and continued it for a long time, from QQ up to BB. But for some other reasons I cannot track down, they are getting more restrictive.
DD does not allow it anymore.
I would not be surprised that Microsoft is getting some hold on canonical.

Hmmm, I still like Secure Boot OFF best Wink
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