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How do I get Pulse Audio to work in BionicPup64?
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mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 2790
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Tue 06 Nov 2018, 21:11    Post subject:  

deleted. See post here: http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=1009260#1009260
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Mike Walsh


Joined: 28 Jun 2014
Posts: 4381
Location: King's Lynn, UK.

PostPosted: Tue 06 Nov 2018, 21:27    Post subject:  

@ Mike:-

Still doesn't explain why you had the problem.....and I didn't. We're both running the exact same package- same scripts & everything - and I'm not running any 'User utilities' at all.

Ah, hell. Who knows? One of life's little mysteries, eh?

Have a go at recording a Youtube vid, the way I described it here. I did it in Chrome, but it shouldn't make a scrap of difference if you want to use Quantum instead. As I understand it, this thing records the X-server's output (whatever it's displaying on the screen), regardless of the application involved. Which is, I believe, exactly what SSR also does; except sound - courtesy of ALSA - works in this one.

(BTW, I plugged the wrong term into the PPM's search box when tracking down 'libgiblib'. I should have simply entered 'giblib'; the item in question pops up straight away. It's the exact same item (version, too) that I obtained thru pkgs.org, as it happens.)


T'other Mike. Wink

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wiak

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
Posts: 996
Location: not Bulgaria

PostPosted: Tue 06 Nov 2018, 21:33    Post subject:  

Mike Walsh wrote:
@ Mike:-

Still doesn't explain why you had the problem.....and I didn't. We're both running the exact same package- same scripts & everything - and I'm not running any 'User utilities' at all.

Ah, hell. Who knows? One of life's little mysteries, eh?

Have a go at recording a Youtube vid, the way I described it here. I did it in Chrome, but it shouldn't make a scrap of difference if you want to use Quantum instead. As I understand it, this thing records the X-server's output (whatever it's displaying on the screen), regardless of the application involved. Which is, I believe, exactly what SSR also does; except sound - courtesy of ALSA - worksin this one.

(BTW, I plugged the wrong term into the PPM's search box when tracking down 'libgiblib'. I should have simply entered 'giblib'; the item in question pops up straight away. It's the exact same item (version, too) that I obtained thru pkgs.org anyway.)


T'other Mike. Wink


I can assure you Mike, if you have none of the listed Other User Utilities somewhere to be found on your system, wex will fail because of empty hbox /hbox code result; the wex script code 'needs' one of the Other User Utilities to be found or it will exit with error. Impossible, IMO, for yours to work with 'no' Other category user util on your system (unless you are using a modified wex script; not the exact one I provided).

Yes, it's giblib you need to search for not libgiblib.

wiak
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DustyPixel

Joined: 27 Jun 2016
Posts: 35

PostPosted: Tue 06 Nov 2018, 22:30    Post subject:  

Hello wiak -

I reinstalled weX 0.8.18 and pupradio, the configuration screen came up, I was able to choose my settings, recorded a short clip off You Tube, and it didn't save the file.
I did try using weX in Tahrpup this weekend and was able to record and save video files in it (no sound, though).
You wrote: 'or copy the permanent /etc/wex/wexrc file into /root/.wex/wexrc'
I did this after trying weX a few times. Restarted X and still no change, it's still not saving the videos.
I'm glad it's working in Xenialpup, at least. Sad
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wiak

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
Posts: 996
Location: not Bulgaria

PostPosted: Tue 06 Nov 2018, 23:47    Post subject:  

DustyPixel wrote:
Hello wiak -

I reinstalled weX 0.8.18 and pupradio, the configuration screen came up, I was able to choose my settings, recorded a short clip off You Tube, and it didn't save the file.


Ok, I'll move my attention to wex on BionicPup64. It's the Pup I'm most likely to want on my own system anyway. weX should end up working better on BionicPup64 than TahrPup since Bionic will have a newer ffmpeg available by default. I'll report back once I get round to that.

wiak
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DustyPixel

Joined: 27 Jun 2016
Posts: 35

PostPosted: Wed 07 Nov 2018, 00:20    Post subject:  

Hello wiak -

OK, thanks. If nothing else, I can always try it out with Xenialpup if it turns out that weX and Bionic just don't want to play nicely together.
I might as well ask you about Tahrpup and weX - does weX work well in it? It's been my preferred pup aside from Xenial before Bionic came along.
I'll keep trying with Bionicpup, at least for a couple more days.... Smile
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wiak

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
Posts: 996
Location: not Bulgaria

PostPosted: Wed 07 Nov 2018, 01:32    Post subject:  

DustyPixel wrote:

I might as well ask you about Tahrpup and weX - does weX work well in it?


I have tested weX on Tahrpup, but was long ago. As far as I recall, Tahrpup (by default at least) uses older ffmpeg which needs alterations to the weX plugins (code changes basically) to get it to even work. Even then, that older ffmpeg lacks new ffmpeg facilities that allow faster video capture and good audio sync. So, no, I don't think weX works particularly well with Tahrpup. However, the All-In-One wex package assembled by Mike Walsh should fix these issues since that packages includes a newer ffmpeg compiled by Fredx181 of DebianDog - so if you use that then TahrPup should be fine with the included weX.

EDIT: But I'm not sure if Mike has produced an All-In-1 for 64bits OS yet that contains a 64bit compiled newer ffmpeg. His previous production was for 32bit OS I believe (so would apply to TahrPup32). But only Mike can answer about that.

wiak
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Mike Walsh


Joined: 28 Jun 2014
Posts: 4381
Location: King's Lynn, UK.

PostPosted: Wed 07 Nov 2018, 06:06    Post subject:  

Wiak/Dusty:-

Once again, Will, thanks for the clarification.

When you said about 'user utilities', I assumed you were talking about the mechanism you have in WeX where you can set one of those utility buttons to start/run something else. I know I haven't done that. In the early days with WeX, I did that for running 'gifenc-sel', initially, but since re-doing the 'all-in-one' and adding a separate Menu entry for it, I don't now use the buttons in that way.

I definitely have many of those apps/progs/utilities installed in most of my Pups, though. I do like my software! So if it's simply a case of WeX 'finding' them, wherever they are on the system, then that explains it.

Gnome-MPlayer; MPV; VLC; I have all of those.....

----------------------------------------------

@ Dusty:-

The WeX 'all-in-one' I previously put together was, as Will says, for 32-bit Puppies. And yes; it works fine in every single one of mine.....including Tahrs 6.0.5/6.0.6.

Fred compiled a fairly recent 32-bit version of ffmpeg. He then combined this with WeX to create 'Wex-portable', and built it in the AppImage format (one that seems to work particularly well with Puppy). I then took the AppImage, combined it with the other utilities.....like Weav, and 'gifenc-sel', added multiple Menu entries, etc., and built the 'all-in-one'.

You can find the 32-bit 'all-in-one' here. That's a direct link to my GDrive.

Let us know how you get on with it, please. The more people who know about this, and use it, the better (I think..!)

------------------------------------

@ Both:- No, I haven't included a built-in 64-bit ffmpeg with the 64-bit 'all-in-one'. I don't really know what 'extras' Fred has in with his 32-bit version; all I know is that Puppy originals average out between 200-250 kb in size. Fred's is around 30 MB.


Mike. Wink

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DustyPixel

Joined: 27 Jun 2016
Posts: 35

PostPosted: Wed 07 Nov 2018, 14:12    Post subject:  

Hello Mike Walsh -

I installed your .pet package in Tahrpup, everything worked except......yep, no sound. I played the recorded video in VLC and selected Alsa for output. 'Automatic' didn't work either.
I tried the aac and mp3 settings for sound in the weX configuration screen, and used mp4 as the video format. Webcam was unchecked.
How exactly do you configure the settings when you use it? I mean, I understand how to use it, at least based on my SSR usage, but there must be something I'm missing.
On the plus side, weX does seem to record video more smoothly. SSR seems to need more tweaking to get past the slightly choppy 'walking on the moon' effect I've noticed in test recordings when configuring it.
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Mike Walsh


Joined: 28 Jun 2014
Posts: 4381
Location: King's Lynn, UK.

PostPosted: Wed 07 Nov 2018, 16:31    Post subject:  

@ DustyPixel:-

Now then, lass. Let's see if I can answer some of these for ya.

I'm back in Xenial64 ATM, but I've just spent the last hour or so experimenting in Tahrpup.....and have done a demo video of WeX running in Tahrpup 6.0.6.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7V0McHm_ks

Question; which Tahrpup are you using? The current 6.0.6, or the older 6.0.5? I don't know if it makes any difference; I nuked my original, years-old 6.0.5 around 12 months ago, and 'upgraded' to the newer 6.0.6. Point being, I can't test the older version any more.....though I don't think there were so many differences 'twixt the two.

I use:-

Video container - mp4
Audio codec - aac
Video codec - left on the x264 default setting

The important bit is to use the 'Mixer' button (bottom right corner), and experiment with the 'Capture' & 'PCM' sliders, keeping an eye on the yellow VU meter while you're doing so. You don't want it peaking at any more than 70-75%, tops.

Like I said in the vid, most of my Pups need the 'Mic Boost' off, but the 'Capture' slider well up the scale. Tahrpup seems to be different - at least on my hardware - and wants the opposite; 'Mic Boost' checked on, but the 'Capture' slider near the bottom. You can hear the result for yourself

The above settings do the trick for me.....but YMMV. All depends on the hardware, y'see.

--------------------------------------------------------------

The only thing I can suggest if you've not got sound is to check the Multiple Sound Card Wizard.....found inside the ALSA Sound Wizard, under Menu->Setup.

Have you got sound at all, system-wide? Check the second button in the ALSA Sound Wizard, and see if Puppy 'barks'..!

Silly question perhaps, but do you use external speakers, like me.....and are they turned on...?? You'd be amazed how often folks overlook the glaringly obvious....


Mike. Wink

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wiak

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
Posts: 996
Location: not Bulgaria

PostPosted: Wed 07 Nov 2018, 16:56    Post subject:  

DustyPixel wrote:
Webcam was unchecked.
How exactly do you configure the settings when you use it?.


Hi DustyPixel,

This really depends on your audio HW setup. Most systems just need bottom line config of weX to have following entries:

audiosystem: alsa

stereo: checked yes

audiodevice: plughw:0,0

webcam (when used): /dev/video0

I believe these are the defaults at first startup anyway. Of course, a few systems have their audio hardware set up differently and in rare cases it can be much more difficult to configure becase, for example, your audio system may be using an unusual device.

From a terminal (urxvt or whatever) you should be able to check your audio device(s) with command:

Code:
arecord --list-devices


For example on my system (which uses alsa underneath, but as it happens I also have pulseaudio running in background - though I tend to just record straight to alsa with weX):

Code:
root@xenial64:~# arecord --list-devices
**** List of CAPTURE Hardware Devices ****
card 0: Intel [HDA Intel], device 0: AD1984A Analog [AD1984A Analog]
  Subdevices: 1/1
  Subdevice #0: subdevice #0
card 0: Intel [HDA Intel], device 2: AD1984A Alt Analog [AD1984A Alt Analog]
  Subdevices: 1/1
  Subdevice #0: subdevice #0
root@xenial64:~#


In the above, my audio device is using 'card 0' and the subdevice number (#) is subdevice #0. Hence my referring to it as plughw:0,0 (plughw:card,subdevice). So you may be using card1, subdevice0 (plughw:1,0) or some other combination such as plughw:1,1

Occasionally, you shouldn't use plughw (which involves a buffer) but instead need to communicate with the audio hardware card,subdevice directly. If that is the case, instead of say plughw:0,0 it would be simply hw:0,0.

weX actually provides quick tooltip help as a reminder of above. Simply hover you mouse over the entry box called 'audiodevice' to see that.

If you are using working pulseaudio set up instead of the underlying alsa, weX should be set up with the following two relevant entries:

audiosystem: alsa
audiodevice: pulse

and as long as pulse recording underneath ok, then weX will work.

In very rare cases people still have audio card, device issues and have to tinker with an audio config file in directory /etc but I won't go into that since not so familiar with doing that.

Let me know if any of the above helps.

Oh, by the way, you can get much more card specific details using command:

Code:
arecord --list-pcms


I don't know the details of that though. You'd have to Google

wiak
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DustyPixel

Joined: 27 Jun 2016
Posts: 35

PostPosted: Wed 07 Nov 2018, 22:28    Post subject:  

Hello Mike Walsh -

Thank you for taking the time to make that video. It did help somewhat, the thing is when I play back the video the volume is low and I can hear ambient room noise that was picked up during the recording. This was from testing with the computers built in speakers and sound card.
I'm using Tahrpup 6.0.5 on a Laptop that is around 8 or 9 years old. I normally use an external USB sound card with earbuds plugged in. That's the main setup, but I do have a set of external speakers I use occasionally. I'm still using Alsa. and I do check for the test bark!
I tested weX with the built in computer speakers and card just to keep it simple. When I try using the external sound card it's a whole new can of worms because the Retrovol options for it are different.
Sometimes when I move the sliders in the mixer it looks like the volume levels are changing, but when I play the video there's still no sound. Still looking for the magic combination.

wiak - I checked the audio devices and tried plughw:0,0 and hw:0,0 as options for both the computers sound card and the external one - no improvement. I'm using Alsa only.
One odd thing I noticed is that when I use Bionicpup64 and use the You Tube downloader .pet the sound works perfectly - so I know Alsa works in recorded videos on this computer... I could just use that but I prefer to have a recorder that lets the user edit as they go, as opposed to having to record the entire video and edit it later.

Any suggestions on how to configure an external sound card to work with weX/Alsa?

I appreciate everyone's contributions to this thread so far - Mike Walsh, mikeslr, wiak, oui, bigpup, watchdog, mc ewanw, perdido, and Terry H. I also appreciate the patience of the two Mikes and wiak.

I'll work on this over the next few days- I've got other things to do so I'll be posting again later on in the week.
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wiak

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
Posts: 996
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PostPosted: Thu 08 Nov 2018, 03:03    Post subject:  

DustyPixel wrote:

wiak - I checked the audio devices and tried plughw:0,0 and hw:0,0 as options for both the computers sound card and the external one - no improvement. I'm using Alsa only.


But DustyPixel... it might be plughw:0,1 or plughw:1,0 or plughw:1,1 or hw:0,1 or hw:1,0 or hw:1,1.

That's why I gave you the command:

arecord --list-devices

to try; hoping that would guide you to what you sound card hardware actually is. It won't work if you don't use the exact correct card,subdevice number.

Also, yes of course, you will need to adjust the CAPTURE vomule controls via Retrovol (or Alsamixer). Capture volumes have nothing to do with Playback values and sometimes there is a software capture amplifier you may need to turn up (via either Retrovol or Alsamixer) in order to get sound recorded loud enough.

Occasionally, as I said, there can be more to it, and you also have to edit some sound-related config files in /etc directory (e.g. maybe cos usb related microphone or HDMI-related). The speakers are irrelevant when it comes to 'recording' settings - they are for playback - what is important is microphone; or if trying to simply record something coming out of the speakers, then it is the MIXER device you need to activate (in Retrovol or Alsamixer). Seems complicated, I know, but usually achievable as long as you correctly identify which card,subdevice number your system 'sees' your audio recording hardware as.

That's the problem with accessing sound card via ALSA directly - nothing is automatic then; though usually plughw:0,0 (but not on your machine it seems). Pulseaudio may find things a bit more automatically, in which case you just need to set audiodevice to 'pulse' (whilst) leaving audiosystem as 'alsa' (without the quotes of course).

wiak

NOTE: I'm still trying to download BionicPup64 iso. My internet download speed is only a few tens of kilobytes for some made reason (used to be MBytes!!!). So taking ages, but getting there slowly using wget -c command to help download over a couple of days...

Last edited by wiak on Thu 08 Nov 2018, 03:47; edited 1 time in total
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wiak

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PostPosted: Thu 08 Nov 2018, 03:22    Post subject:  

One other thing, DustyPixel.

The reason you are getting ambient pickup noise when trying to record from Mixer (i.e. from what you hear coming through the speakers whilst recording) is that you also have microphone recording activated in Retrovol (which you shouldn't). i.e. Before making such recordings(i.e. when you are trying to record from soundcard rather than internal microphone), first disable the microphone (in Retrovol or Alsamixer). When actually wanting to record from microphone - make sure you only turn up Capture gain controls (not Microphone volume gain controls on the Playback side of things - it's only the capture side of things that should be turned up till recording level is loud enough).

Summary: Don't confuse recording with playback. weX is for recording. mplayer, mpv, etc are for playback, so totally different volume controls are involved. Of course your alsa may be working fine for playback but not for recording if correct recording device not selected and recording capture controls not appropriately set up. Youtube downloader does not record, it simply downloads a pre-recorded video for playback.

But it seems that you have things at least partially working since you at least manage to hear things recorded - just disable mic whilst making direct from sound card (Capture side Mixer control) recording. Basically, you need to not use Capture Internal Mic, but rather Capture Stereo Mix (for Mixer). Unfortunately, different computers/hardware often name the controls somewhat differently... and some show more controls than others... trial and error is certainly part of the process for such reasons.

wiak

EDIT:

DustyPixel wrote:
Mike Walsh, mikeslr, wiak, oui, bigpup, watchdog, mc ewanw, perdido, and Terry H


By the way, wiak used to be the login for a group of people who worked together on projects. I, William, was part of that group and my individual login was mcewanw. I gave up mcewanw login for a while (since was retiring from programming) so lost access to the forum so used wiak login instead when my programming 'addiction' caused me to keep programming (for a while at least)... Flash fixed mcewanw for me again, but I tend to still use wiak login more. It is because I wrote the program weX that I maintain it, and explain how to use it, best as I can. I mainly use XenialDog (one of the Debian-based DebianDog systems), not so much Puppy these days, and weX is included in most DebianDog systems by default. However, for old times sakes, I always try to also produce dotpets of my programs for Pups, but these are more difficult for me to maintain and test since so many Pup variants and my not having them permanently installed usually.
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Mike Walsh


Joined: 28 Jun 2014
Posts: 4381
Location: King's Lynn, UK.

PostPosted: Thu 08 Nov 2018, 07:47    Post subject:  

@ DustyPixel:-

Dusty;

I, too, use an external USB sound card with my 15-yr old Dell Inspiron 1100 laptop. Not because the internal one doesn't work.....but for the simple reason that after years of plugging an external speaker system into the headphone socket, the socket is knackered; I can only get mono from it now, and it wiggles about.....it's quite 'loose'!

(One of these days I shall strip the old girl down & solder a new one in; whether that'll be before she simply expires of old age is anybody's guess. I find I have to summon up the enthusiasm to actually do things these days!)

If you want to use an external card, I find it works better if you keep a terminal open, running

Code:
alsamixer


....set to the external card, and adjust the controls from there. For me, at least, Retrovol doesn't seem to respond to my USB card, even when correctly selected. No idea why, but the stated method just 'works' for me. I have 4 worktops in the pager, and just leave alsamixer running in a spare one all the time I'm using it.

--------------------------

Will's quite right; I neglected to mention that you mustn't use the 'Microphone' slider.....you want that one right off, and un-checked. Sorry about that! Embarassed

I will re-iterate, however, that this whole process is one of experimentation, trying different combinations of levels with the 'Capture' (and if necessary, 'PCM' sliders) until you hit the combo that's just right for your hardware, and your personal comfort/satisfaction. We're all different.....and so's the hardware.


Mike. Wink

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