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 Forum index » Taking the Puppy out for a walk » Misc
Does this forum need a Dog section?
Moderators: Flash, JohnMurga
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 12452
Location: S.C. USA

PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019, 11:58    Post subject:  Does this forum need a Dog section?
Subject description: Is it getting confusing with a mix of Puppy and Dog Versions?
 

First, Dog Versions are very good OS's and I am happy to see them being offered!

It is great that this forum is giving them a place to be offered, supported, and talked about, etc......

I think it is time to make a specific section of the forum for the Dogs.
A place you go to and nothing but Dogs and stuff about the Dogs is there. No Puppy stuff!

The rest of the forum stays strictly for Puppy Linux.

I am starting to see too much mixing of questions, info, support, etc..... between Puppy and Dogs.
It is starting to get confusing to follow and provide help.
Puppy is not a Dog and a Dog is not Puppy.
Dogs even have their own repository at ibiblio.org.
http://distro.ibiblio.org/fatdog/

This forum is divided into specific sections that does make it easier to find things. You can expect to go to a specific section and see stuff related to the title of that section.

Flash,
I would be willing to help with doing this Idea

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backi

Joined: 27 Feb 2011
Posts: 1726
Location: GERMANY

PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019, 13:02    Post subject:  

This would be a real good Solution ......Situation as it is now... is quite a bit confusing .
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ITSMERSH

Joined: 02 May 2018
Posts: 911

PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019, 13:57    Post subject:  

Hm, just wondering what the migration compact would have to offer on this issue?

Isn't separation almost a bad thingy?

Do we really need to separate the newcomers?

Just kidding - of course.

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s243a

Joined: 02 Sep 2014
Posts: 2037

PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019, 14:21    Post subject:  

I would have thought that the dogs would go in the "Puppy Derivatives " subforum. Currently though they seem to be posted in the "Puppy Projects Subforum". Maybe I misunderstand the point of the "puppy derivatives" sub forum.
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s243a

Joined: 02 Sep 2014
Posts: 2037

PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019, 14:23    Post subject:  

ITSMERSH wrote:
Hm, just wondering what the migration compact would have to offer on this issue?

Isn't separation almost a bad thingy?

Do we really need to separate the newcomers?

Just kidding - of course.


I thought that for something to be an official puppy it had to be built with woof. Consequently, I would have thought that any puppy built a different way (e.g. remastering) would go into the puppy derivatives sub forum.
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
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Location: S.C. USA

PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019, 14:33    Post subject:  

As I said, there is confusion Rolling Eyes
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rufwoof


Joined: 24 Feb 2014
Posts: 3342

PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019, 16:53    Post subject:  

When I highlighted the confusion months (and months) ago of having what is paramount to a Debian live-boot base distro's/derivatives intermixed into the Puppy forums, the consensus was ... Meh! So in the main I simply stopped offering help. Now, I have no puppy boots, just Fatdog (multi-session liveCD), Openbsd (main) and EasyOS (secondary frugal boot). As a general OS board it might be easier to just re-title the current forums?
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keniv

Joined: 06 Oct 2009
Posts: 550
Location: Scotland

PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019, 18:11    Post subject:  

I see myself as a user rather than being very knowledgeable like many here.
I use a number of older puppies and have also tried a number of dogs of which my favourite is bionic dog which I use regularly. I accept that they are different in many ways but in one particular way they are the same and that is you run as root. I have bionic dog, ubuntu, XP, lucid 5287 and even the i386 version of raspbian running on the same machine. I rarely run ubuntu other than to make changes to grub and update/upgrade. I find it easier to run as root in both the pups and dogs. I don't think it is necessary to separate them to achieve greater clarity in the forum although I would not object to them being in the puppy derivatives if it is thought this would help.

Regards,

Ken.
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dancytron

Joined: 18 Jul 2012
Posts: 1325

PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019, 18:25    Post subject:  

rufwoof wrote:
When I highlighted the confusion months (and months) ago of having what is paramount to a Debian live-boot base distro's/derivatives intermixed into the Puppy forums, the consensus was ... Meh! So in the main I simply stopped offering help. Now, I have no puppy boots, just Fatdog (multi-session liveCD), Openbsd (main) and EasyOS (secondary frugal boot). As a general OS board it might be easier to just re-title the current forums?


Once again with the revisionist history. By "highlight" you mean "sabotage" some threads you didn't like to make them unreadable.

By "meh" you mean you got temporarily banned for it.

See http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=1005643#1005643


http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=1005678#1005678
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rufwoof


Joined: 24 Feb 2014
Posts: 3342

PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019, 19:07    Post subject:  

dancytron wrote:
...
I saw and was angered back then by the confusion it had for new Puppy users to have a bunch of arrogant posting about non puppy's spread widely across (intermixed into) the puppy forums. Over that ... moved on (clearly you haven't - still Trolling).
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rufwoof


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PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019, 19:11    Post subject:  

Recent example http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=1019912#1019912
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ITSMERSH

Joined: 02 May 2018
Posts: 911

PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019, 19:14    Post subject:  

To me the forum section Puppy Derivatives is the right place for Puppies being remastered (no matter by script or manually) from an Original Puppy.

E.g. my LazY Puppy or L.A.S.S.I.E. which were remasters of Lucid and Precise.

Regarding to this understanding to me the forum section Puppy Projects is for those Original Puppies. I'm not sure if Scripts for Puppies will fit to this section in general. Though, some bigger Scripting Projects or something that Sits on Top of a Puppy might fit as well.

E.g. like my T.O.P.L.E.S.S. and N.E.M.E.S.I.S. stuff, That's why I'd put this into Puppy Projects.

In that sense I think Puppy Projects is fine for the Dogs.

The running as root factor is a good point in general - no matter where placed in the future.

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wiak

Joined: 11 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Thu 28 Feb 2019, 19:27    Post subject:  

I've never noticed forum members actually having any control whatsoever over the organisation of the forum so in that sense it seems irrelevant to suggest a Dog section - though maybe John Murga does pay attention behind the scenes, but perhaps such reorganisation would be complicated or not desired?

I note, from first post of this thread, that there is also a confusion in that there are two main types of Dog: FatDog and DebianDog (which include Ubuntu-based Dogs) - FatDog and DebianDog(s) are not related to each other at all. Per its website, FatDog was originally derived from Puppy but no longer is at all.

It is also clear to me that Dogs are not derived from Puppy. Debian/Ubuntu-based Dogs are specially configured Debian-live based system (i.e. they are not only derived from Debian/Ubuntu, they are pretty much fully-compatible with that source).

I personally thus feel, that if there is no dedicated, DebianDog section (and no dedicated FatDog section), then the Puppy-related Projects section is the nearest to appropriate that can be achieved. All these Dogs have (to some limited extent) tried to offer some of the look/feel and basic functionality of Pups, but they are not Pups and they are not derived from them.

EDIT: What would be good would be to have a sticky post in Projects section, explaining what FatDog is, what Debian/Ubuntu Dogs are, and also of course a summary of what actual Pups are: in each case providing a link to the websites for each of these projects. That is:

http://distro.ibiblio.org/fatdog/web/

https://debiandog.github.io/doglinux/

http://puppylinux.com

wiak
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fredx181


Joined: 11 Dec 2013
Posts: 4028
Location: holland

PostPosted: Fri 01 Mar 2019, 05:40    Post subject:  

wiak wrote:
EDIT: What would be good would be to have a sticky post in Projects section, explaining what FatDog is, what Debian/Ubuntu Dogs are, and also of course a summary of what actual Pups are: in each case providing a link to the websites for each of these projects. That is:
....
....


However a special "Dogs" section would be nice (to avoid confusion) but it has been mentioned earlier and apparently the moderators do not feel for that, but a sticky post in Projects section is a great idea.

Flash, can that be done ?

P.S.
bigpup wrote:
The rest of the forum stays strictly for Puppy Linux
.
I agree that there should be no posts about Dogs in other sections (e.g. Users section) only in the dedicated Dog topics.
(after all, the Dogs are sort of a guest in the Puppy forum Wink )

Fred

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BarryK
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Joined: 09 May 2005
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PostPosted: Fri 01 Mar 2019, 11:02    Post subject:  

wiak wrote:
I note, from first post of this thread, that there is also a confusion in that there are two main types of Dog: FatDog and DebianDog (which include Ubuntu-based Dogs) - FatDog and DebianDog(s) are not related to each other at all. Per its website, FatDog was originally derived from Puppy but no longer is at all.


FatDog was created by kirk and jamesbond, and was originally a fork of Puppy, using Puppy Unleashed, the precursor to Woof. That was many years ago, and it gradually deviated.

Yes, I have seen many posts where people are thinking that FatDog and the DebianDogs (and their kindred) are the same thing. They definitely are not.

As I have a Puppy-derivative, well, has it's origins in Puppy, named EasyOS, I am enforcing EasyOS posts to only be in the Puppy-derivatives section, and only in one specific thread.

I suggest that the other derivatives, especially those that are very different from Puppy, should be only in the Puppy derivatives section, and the moderators should enforce this.

Note, I did setup a forum just for EasyOS, but the Puppy Forum is such a great place to come and read about interesting happenings, I find that I come back here almost every day, and forget to look at my EasyOS forum.

The thing is, the cross-pollination of ideas in the Puppy Forum is great, so we shouldn't start banning all the derivatives, just keep them under control, clearly separated.

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