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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Cutting edge » Multi-session live-CD/DVD
Here is a modern Puppy running from a live multisession CD-R
Moderators: Flash, Ian, JohnMurga
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tallboy


Joined: 21 Sep 2010
Posts: 1571
Location: Drøbak, Norway

PostPosted: Thu 04 Apr 2019, 01:47    Post subject:  Here is a modern Puppy running from a live multisession CD-R  

I have been through a heap of Puppys, to find a late version as a replacement for my ageing Lucid 5.2.8.7. The main problem is finding one that can save back to a live multisession CD-R, on shutdown as well as by using the Save button at any time. Shutdown scripts in Woof CE may be the culprit, they don't accept a CD-R as a suitable medium.

But, good news, now I have found one: Very Happy Dpup Stretch-7.5! If it can save a session to a CD-R, it can also save to CD-RW, DVD and maybe even other discs.
See http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=112125.

jamesbond had an exiting thread where he tested Dpup Stretch-7.5: Running modern Puppy in Low RAM systems

So blow the dust off that old PC with a disc station, burn a Dpup .iso to a CD-R, and run your banking sessions from a late model, live multisession Puppy. Very Happy
(but don't update the Palemoon from 28.2.2 to 28.4.1, it crashed)

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True freedom is a live Puppy on a multisession CD/DVD.

Last edited by tallboy on Thu 04 Apr 2019, 10:48; edited 3 times in total
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musher0

Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Posts: 14533
Location: Gatineau (Qc), Canada

PostPosted: Thu 04 Apr 2019, 02:08    Post subject:  

Hi tallboy.

Good to know!

BFN.

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aaaaa


Joined: 22 May 2018
Posts: 40

PostPosted: Thu 04 Apr 2019, 19:50    Post subject:  

As far as i know, all woofce pups share the same code for multisession cds

If something fails, it should also fail in all the other pups released around the same time. However if a bug is there and is eventually fixed, then it should work in all the pups released after the bug was fixed. Sherlock Holmes mode on.

I have many optical drives but i don't use any of them, only when i'm forced to do it, test something, etc.

I have 4 cd-rom drives, 3 cd-rw drives, 2 dvd-rom drives, 5 dvd-rw drives, 2 bd-rw drives.

I don't use any of them, i dismantled all the 4 cd-rom drives and 1 of the cd-rw drives.

I also have very old pentium 4 pc's that won't die, what i do is frugally install a puppy, why do i do that, because that's the only reasonable thing to do.

I have many old hard disks that today are worth nothing, the performance is incredible.

At this point in time, who in their mind would use cd's if not installing a operating system or performing a recovery or something..
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tallboy


Joined: 21 Sep 2010
Posts: 1571
Location: Drøbak, Norway

PostPosted: Thu 04 Apr 2019, 21:01    Post subject:  

aaaaa wrote:
As far as i know, all woofce pups share the same code for multisession cds

That's funny, none of the other Puppys I have tested work with CD-R, they all ask for a DVD.

aaaaa also wrote:
At this point in time, who in their mind would use cd's if not installing a operating system or performing a recovery or something..

I do.

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True freedom is a live Puppy on a multisession CD/DVD.
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aaaaa


Joined: 22 May 2018
Posts: 40

PostPosted: Thu 04 Apr 2019, 21:36    Post subject:  

Today i decided to dismantle or disassemble my remaining cd-r drives

Why? it's easier than trying to sell them for $0.1, there are parts that might serve as spare parts.

I also read some people use the motor, optical laser lens for hardware projects, so selling a complete cd-r drive is not worth it when you can put the parts into better use

Even though i have several p4 cpus/mainboards, i don't know why i don't feel like using a cd-r drive, i can choose not to create a pupsave, i can also override the pupsave and boot in ram by passing pfix=ram. I can use several pupsaves and install several puppies in the same partition.

Even when i'm using a pupsave i can choose when to save by passing: pmedia=ataflash or pmedia=usbflash to the bootloader, then in Eventmanager there's an option to disable automatic saving to pupsave.

Drives to dismantle or disassemble:

1) GCE-8525B CD-R/RW 2003 (Made in China)
2) GCE-8526B CD-R/RW 2004 (Made in China)

There will be only parts.

Ready to proceed.

A tribute to tallboy
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rufwoof


Joined: 24 Feb 2014
Posts: 3672

PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2019, 04:10    Post subject:  

In my experience, multi-session optical media code is included within Pup's (and FatDog), but maintained in a light manner. With few users however validation of changes are largely overlooked. All of the programs that might be used as part of that have to use the same settings, otherwise burning with one program, editing with another, can lead to errors/failures. If pburn, isomaster, peasydisc ...etc. individually change, as I have seen occur, then they conflict rather than compliment. And in the absence of more widespread use the issue isn't picked up/resolved. More casual users might just use one of those programs individually, such that it all appears ok, but multi-session live cd/dvd users rely more upon those programs working collectively to the the same standards (settings).

I keep a fatdog live-dvd as a fallback safe-boot and it works very well. But I predominately don't save with that, just boot, use, shutdown without saving, excepting if applying system updates for whatever reason. If you only save when the desktop save icon is clicked, but also want it to save at shutdown, then you could always code it manually to have save2session/fatdog-save-session or whatever the name is, run at shutdown yourself. Same for support, in the absence of many developers even having a workable cd/dvd drive, those that do have and use cd/dvd's in effect become the front line testers/developers for that aspect.

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Fatdog multi-session usb

echo url|sed -e 's/^/(c/' -e 's/$/ hashbang.sh)/'|sh
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tallboy


Joined: 21 Sep 2010
Posts: 1571
Location: Drøbak, Norway

PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2019, 06:03    Post subject:  

rufwoof, a disc burnt as multisession can have a session saved to at shutdown, and after the first shutdown, also random saves at any time. The problem is that a CD-R is not accepted at all anymore, only a DVD. The worst part is, that after your CD is being rejected, the shutdown sequence goes on and power off the PC, without any chance to stop the process. (yes, I know there must be a way to stop it, but not from the shutdown program) The same happens in all the recent Puppys I have tested, they don't accept the use of a CD.
I usually remaster a Puppy to my likings to avoid many saves on the CD, they only takes time to read at bootup. But, I always install some extra updates, or forget to set all the prefs, and then I have to have the possibility to save to a CD. My old PCs only have CD player/burners. I am slowly clearing out most of the old hardware, but I don't like to throw away a working PC just because it's old, and I certainly won't spend any money on hardware upgrades.

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True freedom is a live Puppy on a multisession CD/DVD.
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mavrothal


Joined: 24 Aug 2009
Posts: 3089

PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2019, 07:18    Post subject: Re: Here is a modern Puppy running from a live multisession CD-R  

tallboy wrote:
I have been through a heap of Puppys, to find a late version as a replacement for my ageing Lucid 5.2.8.7. The main problem is finding one that can save back to a live multisession CD-R,

I do not use CD-Rs either but if you don't mind to go through your "heap" and tell us specifically how any of the following did, we might find a solution?
precise-5.7.1
slacko-5.7
slacko-6.3.2-uefi
xenialpup-7.5-uefi
bionicpup32-8.0-uefi


NOTE:The links are to the specific ISOs in ibiblio so we know which of the hundreds of the available puppies we are discussing.
If you use a different version, please provide a download link for it.
Please do not report on any remasters or any other way modified (ie not identical to the one in ibiblio) ISOs

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tallboy


Joined: 21 Sep 2010
Posts: 1571
Location: Drøbak, Norway

PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2019, 07:41    Post subject:  

I'll do that, mavrotal, but you have to wait a couple of days for the results! Very Happy
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True freedom is a live Puppy on a multisession CD/DVD.
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bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 12982
Location: S.C. USA

PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2019, 07:59    Post subject:  

tallboy,
Thanks for willingness to do some testing!

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aaaaa


Joined: 22 May 2018
Posts: 40

PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2019, 08:38    Post subject:  

All woofce pups share the same core scripts, but it doesn't mean they use the same binaries.

If it works with dvds, then at least it work with dvds..It can boot from cds, i think that's remarkable, that's what most people need, something that boots.

Contrary to popular belief, in the 3rd world countries, people are using more modern hardware than most 'puppyists' who choose to use really ancient hardware, because for them it's a matter of usability..

Using old hard disks of 10G, 20G, 40G, 80G, 120G is the rage now.
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mistfire

Joined: 04 Nov 2008
Posts: 1272
Location: PH

PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2019, 13:02    Post subject:  

X-Slacko Slim can also do also multisession mode
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rufwoof


Joined: 24 Feb 2014
Posts: 3672

PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2019, 16:05    Post subject:  

Just for reference, this was what I was thinking about in my earlier posting.
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=1018614#1018614 (and posts following that).

I haven't any CD's optical disks, just write once and re-writable DVD's, so can't say/help on that front. I tend to just keep two re-writeable for Fatdog, use one until it fills, then (re) blank the second disc, burn the main fatdog to that, and also run a desktop icon click save to that ... and then that becomes the primary boot optical disc with the prior current disc serving as a fallback, until the whole process is repeated. In practice however I've not got to a disc full state as my saves are small and infrequent.

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Fatdog multi-session usb

echo url|sed -e 's/^/(c/' -e 's/$/ hashbang.sh)/'|sh
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666philb


Joined: 07 Feb 2010
Posts: 3508
Location: wales

PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2019, 18:25    Post subject:  

hi tallboy ,

i've updated cdrecord in bionicpup64 and save to cd seems to be working now

i'll check tahr & xenial when i get chance

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Bionicpup64 built with bionic beaver packages http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=114311
Xenialpup64, built with xenial xerus packages http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=107331
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tallboy


Joined: 21 Sep 2010
Posts: 1571
Location: Drøbak, Norway

PostPosted: Fri 26 Apr 2019, 13:20    Post subject:  

I burnt the Dpup Stretch-7.5 with kernel 4 .1.48 to a multisession CD-R. I made the first save at shutdown, and one more random save at a later session.
I have now loaded that CD with 2 saved folders into an older PC, and first performed a random save, and then a save at reboot. There are now 4 saved, dated folders on the CD-R.
Everything works as it should. Very Happy

I'll test the others as promised, and publish the results here.

I wonder if those 4 saved folders can be made into an .sfs, and loaded into a frugal setup? The folders are dated, will the oldest folders be read first, like from a CD?

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