Puppy Linux Discussion Forum Forum Index Puppy Linux Discussion Forum
Puppy HOME page : puppylinux.com
"THE" alternative forum : puppylinux.info
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

The time now is Mon 18 Nov 2019, 10:41
All times are UTC - 4
 Forum index » House Training » Beginners Help ( Start Here)
Is Puppy good for main system?
Moderators: Flash, Ian, JohnMurga
Post new topic   Reply to topic View previous topic :: View next topic
Page 1 of 2 [20 Posts]   Goto page: 1, 2 Next
Author Message
MyTaserPuss

Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Sat 02 Nov 2019, 11:55    Post subject:  Is Puppy good for main system?  

Hi pet owners,

I didn't get search results in the forum:

Do they use Puppy as a main system for daily use and why? Just healthy curiosity.

PUrr purr!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 12853
Location: S.C. USA

PostPosted: Sat 02 Nov 2019, 12:16    Post subject:  

Depends on what you do with computer.
For general use. Puppy versions have everything you need already installed.

If you need to use a specific program.
As long as there is a Linux version, you should be able to run it in Puppy.

Even Window only programs can be run in Puppy by using Wine.
Well. most will run OK.
Wine is constantly being improved to make more and more Window only programs run 100%.
Wine is a Linux program, that emulates Windows, so a Windows program, thinks it is running in Windows.

Wine can run a lot of older games made for windows, but really Windows is better for very new, high end gaming.
However, Linux support for high end gaming is getting better.
Gaming is all I ever use Windows 10 to do.
Everything else I do in Puppy Linux.

We are Puppy!
Resistance is futile!
You can overcome the dark force!

_________________
The things they do not tell you, are usually the clue to solving the problem.
When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
YaPI(any iso installer) http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=107601
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
rockedge


Joined: 11 Apr 2012
Posts: 1281
Location: Connecticut, United States

PostPosted: Sat 02 Nov 2019, 14:26    Post subject:  

I've used Puppy:

Lucid 5.2.8
Raring 3.9.9.2
Tahr 6.05
Xenial
Bionic

with the last 3 either as 32 or 64 bit. All of them have been my main system for daily use and work developing software. I began experimenting with Puppy version 4.3.1 and as Lucid came out I switched over to using Puppy Linux 90%, Windows XP through to 10 8% and Apple stuff 2% of the time.

Welcome to the Kennel and I can say try out several flavors and I think you will find what you seek.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website 
HerrBert

Joined: 03 Nov 2016
Posts: 100
Location: NRW, Germany

PostPosted: Sat 02 Nov 2019, 15:17    Post subject:  

Quote:
Do they use Puppy as a main system for daily use and why? Just healthy curiosity.

...moved to puppy back in 2015.

There are very few progs i missed (irfanview and mp3directcut), but fortunatally they can be run with wine. So it is possible to use puppy as main OS (depending on your "needs")
WHY?
Because it works, it is reliable, it is tiny and fast, it does not annoy with updates, I would refuse to say "it does what you want", but it can do more you want than Win ever allowed you to do...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
LNSmith


Joined: 28 Mar 2013
Posts: 65
Location: Lake Macquarie, NSW, Australia

PostPosted: Sat 02 Nov 2019, 17:27    Post subject: Puppy as main (operating) system software?
Subject description: My experience.
 

Hello HerrBert:

Yes, Puppy Linux is my main system. It runs efficiently on hardware that will drag Windows to it's knees. (I believe our western culture has to be frugal and reduce consumption of EVERYTHING - resources, energy ....) I run a P4 (mostly) that consumes less power than later CPUs.

I use Windows for some specialized programs - Irfanview, TinyCAD - that's about it. Haven't tried Wine yet. Soon, soon ... I keep saying this ...

For web-browsing, mail, text-editing & co - I use uPupBB or (just as desirable) Tahr-Pup 6.0.6 (or 6.0.5 for no PAE hardware).

It took me some weeks to understand some subtle differences between Windows and Puppy. If you are patient and learn the various commands in bash (the terminal command-line interpreter) you will find commands such as fschk, cp, md, rd (and so on) vy useful. If you use dd (the duplicate command) be sure to read (and understand) the operation and syntax well. Very well. dd is useful, powerful and dangerous in the hands of the careless. I have had good success with dd. I do NOT speak from a sad experience, just understanding the words of others.

There are two aspects of Puppy Linux that are unique.
(1) The ability to boot (and run) from a "live" CD/Thumb-drive in conjunction with the OS running in RAM. This ability allows Puppy to boot and run cooperatively with (at least) Windows XP. I can't speak about later versions of Windows. This capability allows Puppy to exist in "parallel" with (at least) XP (and probably later versions of Windows). You will be able to access *.pdf files (etc - created in Windows) using The Puppy OS. This is so obvious that few mention this essential point.

(1a) A word of warning. Beware of Abi-word. Comment about Abi (on this forum) show it is not a popular package. Nothing to do with the OS - just that word-processor.

(2) A second advantage of Puppy: Again - the ability to boot from a live Thumb drive. You can carry all your work with you - anywhere and (provided the PC you want to use will boot "the thumb") you can work from a very compact device.

(3) A third advantage of Puppy. Again - the ability to boot without installing some grand "super-computer-like" OS. Just install Puppy to a thumb-drive and you're good to go.

(4) Some gotchas! The mammoth user-base of Windows suggest a more polished product. Yes, there are some features in Windows where the brass-work is shinier. That's my view. The size of the use-base and the money available to pay a commercial developer are apparent in places. In other places the careful design seen in Linux has been taken up in Windows. (After all - no commercial software coder worth his salt would not recognize a useful feature and copy it (or just 'borrow' most of the code) and so Linux has some very nifty features too.

(5) A few words about Spot and the browser. When I use a browser in Linux i run as user "spot". Spot is not the administrator. This causes some grief (and double shuffling) when down-loading files from the net. In my opinion the additional security is worth the effort. Eliminating a virus takes effort. Spot is a good dog! Good boy spot!

(6) Speed. Puupy Linux runs fast. You don't have the dead-weight of a virus checker barking at your ankles. This is gggrrr-eat mate! Woof! On my P4 "Light" starts in 8 seconds.

(7) Some "kicks" for Puppy: There are many "distros" available for "da-Puppy" - Lucid Puppy, Tahr-Puppy, uPupBB, The Slack-Pup, Stretch-Puppy and so on. This dissipation of energy over a number of distros is, in my view, a major draw-back for Puppy. A magnifying glass works best when the focus is brought to a single point. Software is like a magnifying glass in that sense.

My reply to your "Q" is long.
I hope it is helpful.

Leslie - (in Australia where my district is currently blanketed with smoke from a bush-fire 250km to the north. Smog/smoke over such an area for one week is rare - perhaps without precedent. Some people say that we live in on a planet where climate-change is a natural phenomena. There is no comparable epoch in the last ten million years where the climate has changed over such a short period - perhaps two decades. Are we entering a new era?)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
ras

Joined: 30 Oct 2019
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Sat 02 Nov 2019, 18:33    Post subject:  

HerrBert wrote:
........ and why?
Because it works, it is reliable, it is tiny and fast, it does not annoy with updates, I would refuse to say "it does what you want", but it can do more you want than Win ever allowed you to do...



I would second that, and also add simplicity as a big plus.

the Unix philosophy of "one app for one job" rolled together with a simple gui
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
ozsouth

Joined: 01 Jan 2010
Posts: 584
Location: S.E Australia

PostPosted: Sat 02 Nov 2019, 18:44    Post subject:  

I don't have 'win' on my main laptop. I use Puppy ScPup64 19.01 with my customisations, everyday. I just surf the net, do documents with wps-office & simple audio/video/picture editing, & occasional software packages for Puppy. I could use chrome for netflix etc. Not into gaming aside from simple stuff Puppy has.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
Mike Walsh


Joined: 28 Jun 2014
Posts: 5551
Location: King's Lynn, UK.

PostPosted: Sat 02 Nov 2019, 19:23    Post subject:  

@ MyTaserPuss:-

I kicked XP off my hard drive shortly after EOL, and jumped feet-first into the Linux ecosystem. Used Ubuntu for 6 months, discovered Puppy soon after, and have been 'Puppy-only' for the last 5 years.

Pup does everything I could possibly want it to, including watch NetFlix, and run my old Windoze graphics apps under WINE.....along with an elderly copy of Photoshop CS2, which works very well indeed.

Puppy is easily capable of being your 'daily driver'. It's like anything; what you get out of it is directly proportional to the effort you're prepared to put into it.....

And Puppy is very easy to get on with.


Mike. Wink

_________________
MY 'PUPPY' PACKAGES


Last edited by Mike Walsh on Sat 02 Nov 2019, 20:53; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
mikeslr


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 3484
Location: 500 seconds from Sol

PostPosted: Sat 02 Nov 2019, 20:02    Post subject:  

Hi MyTaserPuss,

Welcome to the kennels. Smile

Several months ago, my desktop having refused to power on, I purchased a refurbished computer which came with Windows 7. In shopping for a computer I looked for posts indicating that Ubuntu ran without problems. It's been several years since I've used anything other than Puppy Linux as my primary operating system. If a computer can run Ubuntu, it can run Puppies. And now having 2 terabytes of hard-drive (one which came with the computer, the other salvaged from its predecessor) I installed LinuxMint. Except to setup Windows 7 and LinuxMint, I haven't booted into either.

As bigpup said, "Depends on what you do with computer." And has been already said several times on this thread, many Windows programs will run under Wine. Dragon Naturally Speaking is one which, depending on the version, may run under Wine under Ubuntu. But not under Puppy. Hence my continued interest in other Operating Systems. Maybe someday I'll put my versions of Dragon Naturally Speaking to use.

One forum member, a professional musician, has developed several applications used in his craft. Another created a Puppy that provides a full music studio. One forum member uses Puppy to write novels. Several have used Puppies to create youtube videos. On the other hand, one experienced and well respected forum member posted that when he creates videos he boots into (I think) LinuxMint.

For those activities which all of us engage in, there is nothing which compares to Puppy for its combination of efficiency and ease of use. That efficiency, however, comes with a price. A Puppy Out-of-the-Box may not have builtin the 'infra-structure' found in more resource demanding operating systems; and obtaining the 'infra-structure' required by some applications may prove difficult to impossible. Take some time to peruse the "Additional Software Section", both for the wealth of applications the posts indicate Puppies have been able to run, and the few which remain problematic. As you do that, keep in mind that often when one application could not be used an alternative was usually available.

The purpose of any operating system is accomplish real life tasks. If you are task-oriented, but flexible in how you accomplish it, Puppies can do almost anything.

There are, however, over 5000 Puppies. Don't panic. Shocked Unless you have some really odd-ball computer, one of the most recent 18 (or so) versions will more than satisfy your expectations. We, on the Forum, are here to assist you in getting the most out of the equipment you have. [You, having joined the Forum, have volunteered to do the same as and when you feel up to that task. Laughing ]

If you provide us with details about your computer --make, model, RAM-- what projects you have in mind, and any computer-specific hardware which may help or hinder such projects, we'll be more than happy to (a) recommend specific Puppies; and (b) hold your hand should it be necessary for us to we walk you thru anything you might have to do beyond installing the Puppy and either clicking a "pet" to install it, or SFS-Load an application in SFS format.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
ally


Joined: 19 May 2012
Posts: 1927
Location: lincoln, uk

PostPosted: Sun 03 Nov 2019, 07:41    Post subject:  

I've used puppy as my daily driver since ~ 2004

I still have a windows install for the occasional need

the only software addition of note in megatools for batch downloading from mega sites, otherwise it's standard apps

Smile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website 
HerrBert

Joined: 03 Nov 2016
Posts: 100
Location: NRW, Germany

PostPosted: Sun 03 Nov 2019, 13:33    Post subject: Re: Puppy as main (operating) system software?
Subject description: My experience.
 

LNSmith wrote:
Hello HerrBert:

I'll redirect your post to the OP Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
MyTaserPuss

Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Sun 03 Nov 2019, 15:36    Post subject:  

It seems fair to do a complete x-ray:

I am not native English. I have been using Linux for a long time. I don't need Windows at least for now and I'm disenchanted with the main distributions because they don't meet what they sell.

I use an old desktop machine of more than 10 years, with dual AMD 64-bit 2.6 GHz and 3 GB of RAM on a conventional hdd. Reading, browsing and sending emails are my main use. Remote banking, tax payment and purchases. Sometimes online music and non-hd videos. Rarely some programming. For fun.

I can run any of the main distributions and adjust to my taste, not so for the less demanding machines of the family. And I always try to use the same distribution for everything to make administration easier. I am worried about pointless obsolescence for the sake of the seller.

In summary, I have my doubts with Puppy: If it is a one-goal project to develop a live system. I am looking for a hdd installation that is lightweight and secure. With a good community support, non-toxic hitting the chest. A long distance distribution that does not disappear with the start of a new day.

I ran BionicPup and I'm not sure how non-root users start or how security updates are handled if any. It is the first time I run Puppy and I have a lot to investigate.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
oui

Joined: 20 May 2005
Posts: 3494
Location: near Woof (Germany) :-) - 3 PC's: DELL SX280 750 MB Pentium4, Acer emachines 2 GB AMD64. DELL XPS15

PostPosted: Sun 03 Nov 2019, 17:14    Post subject:  

MyTaserPuss wrote:
It seems fair to do a complete x-ray:

I am not native English. I have been using Linux for a long time. I don't need Windows at least for now and I'm disenchanted with the main distributions because they don't meet what they sell.

I use an old desktop machine of more than 10 years, with dual AMD 64-bit 2.6 GHz and 3 GB of RAM on a conventional hdd. Reading, browsing and sending emails are my main use. Remote banking, tax payment and purchases. Sometimes online music and non-hd videos. Rarely some programming. For fun.

I can run any of the main distributions and adjust to my taste, not so for the less demanding machines of the family. And I always try to use the same distribution for everything to make administration easier. I am worried about pointless obsolescence for the sake of the seller.

In summary, I have my doubts with Puppy: If it is a one-goal project to develop a live system. I am looking for a hdd installation that is lightweight and secure. With a good community support, non-toxic hitting the chest. A long distance distribution that does not disappear with the start of a new day.

I ran BionicPup and I'm not sure how non-root users start or how security updates are handled if any. It is the first time I run Puppy and I have a lot to investigate.


And? What is your new question?

My opinion for the first question in the title of the topic:

Used as recommanded (frugal) is Puppy really designed as a main fast and more secure system as other Linux and a lot more than Windows...

It includes all average app's for average people and is highly portable (else without or on different hardware)!

It is easy to add more and satisfy about all needs excepted perhaps:

- wine
- geo and sat application needing considerable dependencies
- python as the python world is today to split and you will meet there analogue unsatisfied dependency problem or have to install double what is in contradiction with the puppy design (but you can do as Puppy can operate with complex and leveled tree systems)
- some kind of development
- you definitively need a version totally in some difficult foreign language (old persons, children, isolate persons in a foreign language environment, etc.)

enjoy it!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
bigpup


Joined: 11 Oct 2009
Posts: 12853
Location: S.C. USA

PostPosted: Sun 03 Nov 2019, 20:08    Post subject:  

Quote:
I ran BionicPup and I'm not sure how non-root users start or how security updates are handled if any. It is the first time I run Puppy and I have a lot to investigate.

Stop thinking constant updating is something needed.
Stop thinking running as a not root user is any better than running as root.
Puppy Linux is a single user OS and you run as root.
Except for spot user, for running browsers as Spot.
Browsers are really where the bad stuff is going to, most likely, get into the OS.

Quote:
About root, spot and finn

This is a short explanation of why users run as the administrator (root) in Puppy Linux, and/or use the non-root spot and finn accounts.
root, spot, finn

In a nutshell, root login gives you total access to everything, whereas a non-root login gives you restricted access (that is configurable for each user by the administrator).
Puppy is not a multi-user system as are most other Linux distributions, in which there is a root login plus any number of non-root login accounts.
Puppy on the other-hand, has root, plus just two non-root logins, named spot and finn.
root

There are two main objections to running as root: firstly, that you might accidentally do something dumb, such as delete important files, secondly that if someone gains access to your computer, either remotely via the Internet/network, or locally, they will be at root-level and able to do much more damage than if they gained access as a non-root user.
Doing something dumb

In the case of accidentally wiping important files, which files are important to you? Your own personal files and data of course, which regardless of whether you are logged in as your non-root account, or logged-in as root, you are just as prone to doing the same dumb thing.
That is, your personal files, settings, applications, are all owned by the non-root user, and can just as easily be deleted by the non-root user as can be deleted by the administrator.
In other words, this argument against running as root is itself dumb. At least in respect to the safety of your own files.

Where the "doing something dumb" argument is valid is in a multi-user system, where the administrator could accidentally delete or otherwise compromise another user's files. However, Puppy is not multi-user.

With regard to system files, they can easily be restored, in fact Puppy makes this easy as the entire system is in one Squashfs file.
Remote access as root

What are you afraid of? Someone getting at your personal files and data, especially such things as identification and login/password data. Much of this is on your computer, and if you run a distro in which you login as a non-root user, are in files owned by your non-root account, meaning they are accessable equally by someone breaking in as non-root user or as root.

However, there are two scenarios in which running as root has a security risk, only one of which applies to Puppy.

Firstly, if you login non-root, you could bump up to root-level to perform certain operations such as keep a file of usernames and passwords. There are some applications also that use secret files owned by root, that non-root users are not supposed to read. Thus, anyone gaining access as root, can read all of those files.

A note on the side about the above paragraph: major distros such as Ubuntu allow the first user account to bump up to root just by prefixing commands with "sudo" or "su", without requiring root password, which makes the whole protection mechanism a joke. Considering that most Ubuntu users are using this first login account as their regular login.

Secondly, in a multi-user environment, the enemy may be another user. You would never have users logging in as root in that scenario. But, I repeat, Puppy is not multi-user.

Note, Puppy allows multiple session save-files, which are usually managed by one user for different usage profiles. However, this can also cater for different users, even with optional password protection on a save-file, however this is only intended to be used in a "friendly" local environment. It is a very light-weight alternative to a multi-user system.

Puppy supposes a "friendly" local environment, and the main threat is from someone gaining access to your computer via the network ports while you are online.
Which is highly unlikely in Puppy, due to the firewall, minimal daemons (with network capability disabled). But, the concern is still there...
spot

This brings us to 'spot', which is a classical name for a dog. But, spot is not a normal user, you don't login as user spot. Instead, you bootup in the normal way as the root user, but you can choose to run some Internet applications as the restricted user spot.
This means that you have unfettered access to your local system, all the benefits of root, no hassles with file/directory ownerships and permissions, no restrictions on access to all hardware.
But, you can run, for example, SeaMonkey (browser, Composer, mail&news, IRC-chat suite), as spot. The home directory for spot is /home/spot, and SeaMonkey will only be able to (normally) edit/create/write files inside /home/spot.

With spot, you have the best of both worlds. Freedom in your local system, a restricted user for Internet access.

running as spot -- you can choose your level of web-browsing danger, via the Login and Security Manager in the System menu.
A fork of Puppy, FatDog64, features all Internet applications running as spot.
finn

finn is another name for a dog, and is a full non-root login account, as you would get in any other Linux distro. With one peculiarity, it's home directory is /root (which may indeed seem very peculiar to you, but there is a reason for it!). As with other distros, you would use 'su' or 'sudo' to perform administrator activities.

finn always requires administrator password to perform administrator-level operations.

finn is offered as an option at the first shutdown of Puppy, when you are creating a save-file for the session. If you opt for finn, at next bootup you will be automatically logged in as finn. Note though, finn is not quite mature, so not yet recommended to be used.
Final note

Puppy is designed for people who know what they are doing and what they want, and they want to do it with the least hassles. They also want exclusive use of their computer, or maybe will share with a trusted person. If you want to put a small child in front of your computer and let them wreak havoc, Puppy is not recommended, but then, they could wreak havoc regardless of operating system.
At least with Puppy, you can rescue an old PC, install Puppy, and let him/her do whatever. It is affordable for each user to have their own separate hardware.


Puppy Linux can and should be installed to anything as a frugal install. Frugal is just the name, it is still a complete install.
The core Puppy files and programs are loaded as read only.
A save file or folder is used to store any changes, anything added, settings, etc.....
Only thing that can go bad is the save.
But we know, you know, to make a good backup of the save, for security.

_________________
The things they do not tell you, are usually the clue to solving the problem.
When I was a kid I wanted to be older.... This is not what I expected Shocked
YaPI(any iso installer) http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=107601
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
peterw

Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 373
Location: UK

PostPosted: Mon 04 Nov 2019, 03:56    Post subject: Puppy for everyday use  

I like and use Puppies and it relation Fatdog for much of my activity. Puppy has features that make it very useful and the ease of installation means that you can try it and work with it in many scenarios. However, I and our household are not exclusively Puppy. Sometimes other Distros or OS do specific jobs that Puppy cannot easily do. Instances for me follow:

1. I have a Media Centre with MythTV loaded and for me setting that up with Puppy would have been very time consuming; if possible.
2. If you want a simple reliable system that does much of what you need, can be used by family members (my wife in my case) without them needing constant support and for which you can avoid paying for an MS OS then Chromebooks are excellent. They can be picked up very cheaply but they have a limited life in terms of updates (which are not too intrusive). When the updates stop or earlier (if you want) you can switch them over to run Puppy or any other Linux Distro.
3. I was bought a SatNav and unfortunately it can only be updated via a Windows OS or Mac OS and that is why I have a hard drive with Windows on that I occasionallly put in a PC to do the update.

Basically, you use what works for you. I sometimes wonder why people use Windows, but can fully appreciate that people use what they are familiar with and don't like to change.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message 
Display posts from previous:   Sort by:   
Page 1 of 2 [20 Posts]   Goto page: 1, 2 Next
Post new topic   Reply to topic View previous topic :: View next topic
 Forum index » House Training » Beginners Help ( Start Here)
Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
[ Time: 0.1157s ][ Queries: 11 (0.0193s) ][ GZIP on ]