[Solved] Install 2.13 for dual-boot? How to save files?

[dogubit]

Spare system: 1.2GHz AMD, 256MB Ram, 30GB seagate HD, onboard intel audio/video/NIC, lucent pci modem, HD split into two partitions with XP Pro on one and nothing on the other, each in FAT 32.
Got Puppy 2.13 Live CD up and running fine, got online ok also.
My back ground: 9 years-CompTIA A+/Net+, know WinCrap inside and out and can build a computer out of tin cans if I needed to, don't know a thing about Unix/Linux, suck when it comes to command line.
Have done a lot of reading here and other place's, but so much of this with Linux seems way over my head, but I'm going to learn it!
After much reading I havent found and answer to question #1 that I understand or think I could pull off. Havent found the answer to question #2 at all, but could just be missing it.
Question # 1: Is there a simple way to install Puppy to my spare system on the empty partition that I could understand? Dual booted? If not how do you install it to the drive alone?
Question #2: when using Puppy Live (or installed on HD), How do you save files? Like txt, jpg, avi's.
With WinCrap you just right click and tell it what you want to do and where you want to put it, I haven't a clue how to do it in Linux.
Told ya they were stupid questions, but a guy has to start someplace right?
Thank you for any links of direction you may be able to offer, and if there all answered here someplace, I'm sorry for asking, but I coulden't find anything or anything I could understand.
Thanks also for just reading this.

[WhoDo]

Question # 1: Is there a simple way to install Puppy to my spare system on the empty partition that I could understand? Dual booted? If not how do you install it to the drive alone?

Yes. After booting from the LiveCD, use Start-Control Panel-Gparted to reformat your spare partition to ext2/ext3. If you want you can carve off a piece for a swap partition but you shouldn't really NEED it with 256Mb.

Mount the new partition using the "drives" icon from your LiveCD desktop and mount your LiveCD in its raw state using the same utility - click the Rox option to open a window if necessary.

Copy (drag and drop) vmlinuz, initrd.gz, pup_2xx.sfs and zdrv_2xx.sfs files from the CD window to the new partition window. Install complete. All you need to do now is to install Grub to dual boot, or put the appropriate commands in your Wincrap bootloader file.

Grub can be installed using Start-Control Panel-Grub bootloader config, but be sure to check the resulting /boot/grub/menu.lst file on your new partition for the correct commands. Search here for "booting multiple Puppies" and "dual boot with" for some useful commands.

Question #2: when using Puppy Live (or installed on HD), How do you save files? Like txt, jpg, avi's.
With WinCrap you just right click and tell it what you want to do and where you want to put it, I haven't a clue how to do it in Linux.

Drag and drop. X is an object-oriented environment, just like Window$, OR right click for the options menu, again just like Window$, and copy and paste. Remember that the copy of Puppy you are working on with the LiveCD is in RAM, so when you close it you'll need to save your session to a file, either on your multi-session CD or on a USB stick or hard drive, in order to keep it for the next boot. If you choose to save it to a file, Puppy creates a pup_save.2fs file that is remounted when you next boot. It's just like the old Window$ drive compression bag file, only faster and more reliable.

The only stupid question is the one you didn't ask, dogubit. Welcome to the kennels.

[muggins]

and, of course, if you've got a minimum of 256M ram & a DVD burner, you can burn a multisession DVD pup which will save everything back to your DVD, and you never need touch your hard disk.

[ndujoe1]

I would like to emphasize that there are NO stupid quesitons. We all attempt to help each other out from what we have learned from others :)

Joe

[Rickrandom]

I hope giving you more choices doesn't just cloud the issue but....

1. See http://www.icpug.org.uk/national/linnwi ... 4steps.htm

2. You can save files to Puppy, or to your Windows My Documents folder if you want to keep files readily accessible with whichever OS you boot. You need to mount the appropriate partition on the hard drive (MUT is the tool for that). Then you can navigate to the folder you want. You can also symlink (a sort of shortcut) from the default folders you see in Puppy to your Windows My Documents folder, so it's just one click to navigate there. (Unless XP Pro does something sneaky with the NTFS drive?)

[dogubit]

Thanks to each of you for your replys and the link/info. I guess working with something for the first times is just a bit daunting, but I'm gona get it.
Thanks for dealing with my question and I'm sure you will here more from me soon,lol. Thank you.

[muggins]

good point ndujoe1,

and we learn from our mistakes...so make as many mistakes as possible...to learn more!?

[dogubit]

Ok I did as WhoDo said about formating the other partition ("reformat your spare partition to ext2/ext3") and told it to do the (2) two actions and think I moved the 4 files to the partition, there in what looks like "hda5", and booting back into WinCrap the other partition is no longer shown (me thinks I read something about windows not seeing unix/linux partitions/file systems) So I'm thinking the format part is right. I then run the "Grub bootloader config" and try the "simple" setting, click OK and select the "safe choice" then "OK", but this is where I'm not having luck. It states that if "running the universal installer just except default entry, click OK button." I did that, but no joy, with nothing in the path box thats no wonder. It also ask "where do I want to put the GRUB files?" and speaks about them being put with the "Kernel" in the /boot directory, and then something about "Put the partition (/dev/hda2 ect.) in the box below" Well I put that (/dev/hda2 ect.) in the box and it tells me it's not a Linux partition.

When I look in "Media Utility Tool" booted from the Live CD, I see:

1 vfat 19478.8 mb [Rox] [Unmount] /mnt/hda1
I'm thinking this is where XP is.

and

5 ext3 19599.3mb [Rox] [Unmount] /mnt/hda5
The Linux partition?

I have put /dev/hda5 ect. in the box and get "not a Linux partition."
I have put (dev/hda5 ect.) in the box and get "not a Linux partition."
I have put dev/hda5 in the box and get "not a Linux partition."

I'm thinking the ( and ) are not to be put in, but I tried them anyway.

So I'm doing something wrong and need direction again please.
I also found my way to my "mnt/hda1/boot.ini and see:

[boot loader]
timeout=1
default-multi (0) disk (0) rdisk (0) partition (1) /WINDOWS

[operating systems]
multi (0) disk (0) rdisk (0) partition (1) /WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP
Professional" /fastdetect /NoExecute=OptIn

So I know nothing has been entered there. Can I just edit the Boot.ini file?
This system has nothing of value on it, it's just for testing and screwing up anyway. I do use it for testing Windows programs before I install them on clients systems, but if I screw it up it's no big deal. Not that I want to , but nothing to cry about if it happened.

Ok, gona post this and will go to bed and check back in the morning/noon time. Thanks again.

[AndrewD]

Hi Dogubit and all,

I'm stuck further down the track, so I think I can help up to a point. I'd value some help from the good people of this forum beyond that, as I can't find what I need elsewhere in the forum, though I'm sure it's there.

I'm reviving my wife's old laptop, a Packard Bell EasyNote+ 400MHz Celeron, 6GiB hard disk, 32Mb installed RAM and 128Mb DIMM recently added. It has a floppy drive and one USB port but no network card - to be purchased. The BIOS only recognises 97MB extended RAM, think I may need to upgrade the BIOS to recognise the rest. As a result, the Puppy 2.13 live CD creates a swapfile on the FAT32 Windows drive but runs fine.

I wanted to install to HD, so booted the live CD and used Control Panel -> Gparted to reduce the size of my Windows partition (/dev/hda1) and create a 2.8GiB ext2 formatted partition /dev/hda2.

I then used Setup -> Puppy Universal Installer rather than the manual method described by WhoDo. I think this will help dogubit. I selected IDE (ATA) Internal Hard Drive, then hda, then hda2. I chose a "Normal" install. After waiting for the files to copy, which is what dogubit did manually, I got a page telling me "If all went well, Puppy has been installed to hda2".

I think this is the point at which dogubit is stuck but the Universal installer script gives some more options. Configuring Grub is scary, so you can choose not to bother by booting from USB using syslinux. However, it does require your BIOS to support USB boot, and you to know how to do that - each BIOS is different but you should be able to work it out if you insert a memory key here, create the required files on it and then reboot, go back and play around in the BIOS. The disadvantage is you have to insert the USB stick every time you boot Puppy, even though puppy is on your hard disk. Not an elegant solution.

So, you need a boot program, and the master boot record (MBR) needs to know where to find it. Windows XP has its own boot program - it's that bit where you get to select Safe mode. It is possible to configure the Windows boot program to load Linux, and I have done it, but it's fiddly and frowned on by the open source community because if you ever deleted Windows (and most of the community think you should) then your machine would stop booting. So, Grub is the standard boot program from open source land, and it's great. There are many others - PartitionMagic uses the one from OS/2 and I actually use BootIT NG, but these are both paid-for programs. You will be happy with Grub, but you have to overwrite your existing MBR which points at the Windows boot loader. This is the option dogubit didn't choose because Grubconfig warned it was unsafe, however you have the perfect means of recovery in the unlikely event that anything goes wrong - a bootable Puppy CD!

So, back in Grubconfig (which is where the Puppy Universal Installer has landed you if you pressed Install Grub) you choose simple, then standard console for safety (you can change this later to get a graphical Grub, having got it working and backed up /boot/grub/menu.lst). Select the partition to install the grub boot program (will be prefilled with the right partition if you used Universal Installer) and on the next screen select MBR (possibly unsafe). Don't worry, as explained above you have the tools to recover. That's it, just exit out of the Universal installer if applicable - it gives you the option to go back and put Grub on a floppy as a belt and braces, but that's not an elegant long term solution just like the USB key isn't.

When you reboot (having removed the puppy CD) you should see a grub screen instead of the windows boot program. Windows will probably be the first grub option, then Linux. If you select Windows you will see the Windows boot program, if you select Linux, Puppy wlll boot.

SO...., I've got to that stage with a working hard-Puppy install but I want to go further and do a frugal install to get the speed of booting from HD but the speed of operation from working in RAM. I've created a third partition (hda4 bceause BootIT NG uses hda3) and formatted it ext3 this time. I chose "coexist" this time, even though Puppy has the partition to itself. The universal installer installs grub for me (in the superblock of the partition) but then leaves me on my own, simply saying I need to pass the PMEDIA=idehd parameter from menu.lst.

Here is my boot.lst:
# GRUB configuration file '/boot/grub/menu.lst'.
# generated by 'grubconfig'. Sat Jan 6 11:06:36 2007
#
# Start GRUB global section
#timeout 30
color light-gray/blue black/light-gray
# End GRUB global section
# Other bootable partition config begins
title Windows (on /dev/hda1)
rootnoverify (hd0,0)
makeactive
chainloader +1
# Other bootable partition config ends
# Linux bootable partition config begins
title Hard-Puppy Linux (on /dev/hda2)
root (hd0,1)
kernel /boot/vmlinuz root=/dev/hda2 ro vga=normal
# Linux bootable partition config ends
# Linux bootable partition config begins
title Hard-Puppy-Frugal (on /dev/hda4)
root (hd0,3)
kernel /vmlinuz root=/dev/ram0 ro vga=normal PMEDIA=idehd
# Linux bootable partition config ends
title Install GRUB to floppy disk (on /dev/fd0)
pause Insert a formatted floppy disk and press enter.
root (hd0,3)
setup (fd0)
pause Press enter to continue.
title Install GRUB to Linux partition (on /dev/hda4)
root (hd0,3)
setup (hd0,3)
pause Press enter to continue.
title - For help press 'c', then type: 'help'
root (hd0)
title - For usage examples, type: 'cat /boot/grub/usage.txt'
root (hd0)

Grub loads, and both Windows and Hard-Puppy work fine, but Hard-Puppy-Frugal fails after "Uncompressing Linux... Ok, booting the kernel." with the message "Kernel panic - not syncing: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on unknown-block(1,0)"

Help appreciated!

Thanks, Andrew

[Sit Heel Speak]

Add a line to the Frugal section so it looks like this:

Code: Select all

title Hard-Puppy-Frugal (on /dev/hda4)
root (hd0,3)
kernel /vmlinuz root=/dev/ram0 ro vga=normal PMEDIA=idehd
initrd /initrd.gz

You may-or-may-not need the line

Code: Select all

boot

after the initrd line, I don't think you do.

[AndrewD]

Thanks, that did the trick. Now I just have the problem of Puppy picking up the wrong partition to boot from - see this post:

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... ng&t=12860

Hopefully I'll be able to use the same solution.

Regards, Andrew

[Sit Heel Speak]

I've done further testing and discovered that the solution I give in that thread is not reliable. It works on only one of my four machines. Use WhoDo's "hide and unhide" solution in that thread instead, or if you know bash scripting then make a patch to init similar to Dougal's, at
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=14207

[dogubit]

Much thanks to all who replyed and a GoldStar to WhoDo and AndrewD.
WhoDo: you got me well into the game for formatting, but after some efforts could not get the GRUB setup to work. I did go back and redo my partition and format and don't know if it's ok , but I only opted to do the ext2 and not the ext3. If it's needed tell me so and I'll redo everything again.
AndrewD: you got me on my way with the GRUB, your approach with the install and GRUB worked fine with only one glitch. The way WhoDo had said to move files was ok, as on the way you said, it stated that the files were already there, but I did a compleat wipe and reinstall anyway to be sure. The glitch I had was with the file "vmlinaz", It was outside of the "/boot/grub" folder (that caused an error # 15 on selecting Linux boot) and I just made a copy of it and placed it into the "/grub" folder and restarted and GRUB came up fine and booted to Puppy when selected.
So for now I'm good, and thankful for the help I have receved from all and searching the Forum. Now I just have to learn to "Single Click" with the mouse,lol.
So now I guess I will have to find resorces for software, as my guess M$ configured software will not work with Linux, FireFox will be my first hunt and finding out if my 1GB Thumb Drive will work between Linux and M$. Much more reading to go, but this is the first distro of Linux I have felt good enough about to install and use.
Thanks to all of you and the developers/helpers of Puppy, I'm sure I'll be seeing more or your replys in the future.

PS: I edited my first topic post to [Solved] if that will not screw things up for the Forum search script, some good help for a newbe in this post and should be helpful to some others.

[WhoDo]

Now I just have to learn to "Single Click" with the mouse,lol.

If you really miss the double click, you can right click any desktop icon, select Rox Filer - Options - Pinboard and uncheck the "single click to open" check box.

So now I guess I will have to find resorces for software, as my guess M$ configured software will not work with Linux, FireFox will be my first hunt and finding out if my 1GB Thumb Drive will work between Linux and M$. Much more reading to go, but this is the first distro of Linux I have felt good enough about to install and use.

First thing you need is MU's excellent Puppy Software Installer (PSI). You can find that here by searching the forum. It will connect you with all the Puppy-compatible software you could possibly need, including Firefox.

On the subject of Firefox, there is a Linux-specific version called Swiftfox that is processor tuned. I'm using that and I get Firefox v2.0.1 compatibility with much better speed and no dropouts.

Many M$ programs will work if you download Wine from PSI. Wine is a Linux implementation of the Microsoft API (Application Programming Interface). Using Wine will allow you to run Microsoft Office and a host of other M$ programs under Puppy. I recommend Wine 0.9.17 as the most stable, but MU is working hard on a dotpup of v0.9.28 so that should be ready soon.

I can also thoroughly recommend MU's version of G2's Icewm window manager called Icewm-Ultra. There are enough themes there to make you feel right at home without the hassles that Window$ represents.

Hope that helps, and again welcome to the kennels!

Cheers

[DC]

two p's worth,

I'd only use the MS programmes that you have to. If there are Linux programmes that do the same job then the Linux will be better choice.
They are smaller (good for puppy), faster and any problems sorted out quicker.

Good example is Firefox vs IE. Would you really want to run IE under wine?

DC

[AndrewD]

Dogubit, sorry for the mistake about location of vmlinuz. I actually edited menu.lst to point it at / - you can see it in my listing, but I forgot to mention it. Either this or copying vmlinuz to /boot (which is what you did) works. Have we found a bug in the Puppy Universal Installer script?

SHS, thanks but I'd already realised that the hide/unhide bit was what I needed. Works a treat, and a reasonably elegant solution. Another reason for using GRUB rather than an inferior boot program! I will wean myself off BootIT eventually, but occasionally it's really useful to get to a partition tool in minimal time.

[ecomoney]

There is some good information here on booting

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=13551

Keep on working on it an persevering dogubit. Well done for seeking out something "better". You will not look back.