What do buttons next to Menu on jwm desktop do?

[paulh177]

Puppy 2.13
The two buttons next to the Menu button don't do anything.
I'm sure they were a feature of previous versions and I don't know how I managed to get them to reappear in my brand new install of 2.13.
How do I either
a) get rid of them
OR
b) make them work ?
thanks
paul

[amish]

the one with the down arrow is "show desktop" and the jwm function is no longer compatible with the version of rox filer (which displays file windows and icons on the desktop) in puppy 2.13: see also: http://puppydocblognode1.blogspot.com/2 ... ounds.html

the other icon with the > is for rxvt and there is no reason it shouldn't work? you should get an xterm-style terminal.

both buttons exist in /root/.jwmrc-tray

edit that file carefully, and you should be able to get rid of them. to see changes, click the menu, under "shutdown" or whatever, there should be the option to "restart jwm" or "restart wm"

!!!! failing that, restart xwin with ctrl-alt-backspace and enter "xwin" (no quotes) to get back to xwin.

[paulh177]

having done a bit more poking around, it turns out they are to be found in .jwmrc-tray rather that .jwmrc
so i'll have a hack at that and see what i can break

[paulh177]

hmmm that'll teach me to edit XML files without knowing the syntax ... oh well

[amish]

hmmm that'll teach me to edit XML files without knowing the syntax ... oh well

alienjeff would be laughing at me right now, we've debated whether the jwm config files have too much (confusing) leftover clutter in them. my stand is that it helps people see examples of things- it's useful, his stand is the other.

the way the file is, it's not that easy to mess up a lot, unless you do too much at once. you could make a copy of the file, but i kind of suspect you've got some <!-- --> tags messing you up.

those tags are used to comment a line, and removing them will uncomment a line. removing one might do nothing, or it might hide part of your file.

each tag must have a closing tag. find the tag without it's brother, remove it or replace the missing <one>like this</one> and you might be back in business. or have you fixed it yet?

[paulh177]

"back it up before you hack it up" is my motto (when I can be bothered) so it's back to where it started!
I guess it's these two lines that matter and I think <!-- --> are the comment tag pairs, but they seem asymmetric in this fragment

Code: Select all

<TrayButton popup="<!-- Show desktop" icon="showdesk16.xpm"><!-- showdesktop --></TrayButton>
<TrayButton popup="<!-- Open terminal" icon="mini-sh.xpm"><!-- exec:rxvt --></TrayButton>

I guess I can delete the "showdesktop" line but when I changed

Code: Select all

<TrayButton popup="<!-- Open terminal" icon="mini-sh.xpm"><!-- exec:rxvt --></TrayButton>

to

Code: Select all

<TrayButton popup="<!-- Open terminal" icon="mini-sh.xpm"><exec:rxvt></TrayButton>

it all went wrong & the menu button disappeared along with the taskbar ...

[trapster]

Here is my current .jwmrc-tray:

Code: Select all

<!-- Additional TrayButton attribute: label -->
<TrayButton label="Menu" icon="mini-dog.xpm"/>
<TrayButton popup="Show desktop" icon="showdesk16.xpm">showdesktop</TrayButton>
<!--	<TrayButton popup="Open terminal" icon="mini-sh.xpm">exec:rxvt</TrayButton> -->
<!--	<TrayButton popup="Open text editor" icon="mini-edit.xpm">exec:defaulttexteditor</TrayButton> -->

Note:
The "Open terminal" + "Open text editor" are both commented out with the <!-- ##### --> at the beginning and end of each line.

Though, I never have figured out why the first line didn't need to end with the closing bracket of </TrayButton> like all the other lines do.

[laika]

alienjeff would be laughing at me right now, we've debated whether the jwm config files have too much (confusing) leftover clutter in them. my stand is that it helps people see examples of things- it's useful, his stand is the other.

FWIW, i found those leftovers helpful as an example. and i think it was the rxvt-terminal that i uncommented to use in my tray.

[alienjeff]

I've removed the pre/post edited .jwmrc file in light of what Rarsa has detailed further down this thread in relation to preserving the function of pupget addons making it to the menu.

[paulh177]

Just to say I got a good night's sleep and had a nother look.
"showdesktop" is broken -- it blanks out to a grey screen.
rxvt button works though
thanks for the help

[alienjeff]

Paul:

This isn't a fix, but instead a cheap work-around to accomplish the same thing. Add an extra "virtual desktop" and don't use it as a workspace, but keep it clear for a faux-show desktop button.

-alienjeff

[rarsa]

Alienjeff,

(the following parragraph is not trying to justify clutter in the file, or the implementation that uses them. Just explaining why they are there)

Those commented out menu entries on the .jwmrc are used by the pupget installer. The pupget script uncomments entries as they get installed. That was the way Barry found to "insert" the menu entries where he wanted them to be after installation.

I'd recommend not to advise new users to remove the comments. If they do, when they install a pupget, the entry won't appear in the menu.

With XDG all that is no longer necessary.

I know you have some comptempt for XDG but, how else would you insert things in a menu without knowing before hand what is the menu structure? (with XDG you don't need to know the menu structure)

[alienjeff]

Thanks for the explanation, Rarsa.

There *has* to be a better way, yet I'm still unconvinced that XDG is the "Final Solution" ...

If those "commented out" lines were so important and integral to the inner workings of pupget, then there should have been a line in .jwmrc to appropriately warn users.

Yes, I know ... hindsight is always 20/20.

Again, thanks, brother.

[paulh177]

@alienjeff : i had already thought of that funnily enough but it seemed like a way to get confused when i forgot i was in a different desktop (i'm easily confused... )

to contribute to one aspect of the other discussion:

As a noob (to XML), while i find the cleaned version easier to look at to begin with, once i have my "eye in" for the code, i can start to screen out what I don't want to see; so i (like most humans i think ) have a builtin folding editor.

thanks for the help again. I'm even adding buttons now.
paul

[WhoDo]

With XDG all that is no longer necessary.

I know you have some comptempt for XDG but, how else would you insert things in a menu without knowing before hand what is the menu structure? (with XDG you don't need to know the menu structure)

Please forgive me hijacking the discussion here, but I'm afraid I don't understand XDG very well.

When I installed 2.14alpha as an upgrade, it had XDG menus by default but it didn't find ANY of the programs previously installed as dotpups.

Thinking I was doing something to help that situation, I ran the fixmenus script as suggested in another thread and the result was that my menus were "emptied out"! When I looked at my .jwmrc file and the Icewm equivalent all the entries were pointing to "null". All I could do to recover was replace the .jwmrc with a backup and refresh the Icewm menu file.

Clearly I don't understand the XDG system. If it can't put the existing dotpups back in the right place, even though they have been compiled using MU's dotpup wizard that asks for an XDG category, surely there must be a fundamental problem? Or am I just being obtuse? And where does pup2pet fit in here?

I really want XDG menus to work the way originally envisaged, but I also want them to be relatively idiot proof or I can't use them for my clients. Can you give me a clue as to what I've done wrong, please?

Cheers

[rarsa]

Please consider that this is an Alpha release. I am sure this will not be the final implementation of XDG.

I'd recommend reporting bugs to Barry's forum.

Regards.

[WhoDo]

I'll answer you in a PM to avoid hijacking the thread.

Thanks, mate. Much appreciated. Should have thought about a PM myself in the first place. Sorry.

Cheers

[alienjeff]

I really want XDG menus to work the way originally envisaged, but I also want them to be relatively idiot proof or I can't use them for my clients.

Clients? Thin clients as in spartan computer architecture, or clients as in human consumers of a service or product? RSVP, as inquiring minds want to know.

[WhoDo]

Clients? Thin clients as in spartan computer architecture, or clients as in human consumers of a service or product? RSVP, as inquiring minds want to know.

Human consumers of a free service and product.

A couple of days a week I supervise a Work for the Dole project, where we take donated computers, refurbish them, load them with Puppy and donate them in turn to people and organisations who cannot afford to buy them - community groups, refuges, disadvantaged schools, migrant resource centre, etc. Even the WfD participants, being unemployed, also qualify for a free PC so they can search for jobs online and write job applications, etc.

Our "clients" are usually either computer illiterate or only have limited exposure to Window$. They cannot afford to pay for support and we don't have the resources to solve all of their problems once the machine is in their hands. We have to make them as user-friendly, and idiot-proof, as possible. We'll fix their hardware for free, anytime, but user support is not part of our program.

Hope that makes things somewhat less cloudy, old mate!

Cheers

[alienjeff]

A noble effort, indeed, WhoDo. Thanks for the clarification and I tip my hat to you. Well done.