Frugal install of 2.14 doesn't boot

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bruce73 · #1 Post by **bruce73** » Wed 28 Feb 2007, 04:28

Using the step-by-step instructions found here, I tried to do a frugal install of Puppy 2.14. I could get to the OS selection screen, but when I choose "Start Linux" the next screen throws this error: "Windows can't start: hal.dll is missing or corrupt". Pressing Enter brought me back to the selection screen again and I could boot into Windows no problem.

I remember from my Win98 days that the "missing hal.dll" error can be a false one, but I don't know why the system is even looking for it, as it should be booting Linux.

My laptop has MCE2005 installed, so don't know if that's a problem, since the method used is simply for XP, but I wouldn't think that would matter. Anyone else seen this and know how to deal with it?

Sit Heel Speak · #2 Post by **Sit Heel Speak** » Wed 28 Feb 2007, 08:04

Probably you're the only one who's ever tried that, so nobody can tell you what to do. What has worked for some, is to go to

https://sourceforge.net/projects/grub4dos

and download WinGrub and install that. Then, if it still doesn't boot, show us your c:\boot\grub\menu.lst file and tell us where you put vmlinuz, initrd.gz, and pup_2xx.sfs.

bruce73 · #3 Post by **bruce73** » Wed 28 Feb 2007, 14:17

Probably you're the only one who's ever tried that, so nobody can tell you what to do.

Not sure what you mean. Are you referring to this particular install method?

Thanks for the link.

ICPUG · #4 Post by **ICPUG** » Fri 02 Mar 2007, 00:50

Sit Heel Speak,

Don't make assumptions about what you don't know.

To say 'Probably Bruce is the only one to try the Lin'N'WinNewB method' is just casting doubt without any knowledge.

As the provider of that method I can assure you other people have tried it because they have contacted me to say so. Also it has been recommended by 'Rick Random' on this forum, for one.

Actually, the version of grub I use comes from the grub4dos project that you pointed to.

Maybe you use Wingrub. Fair enough - but don't cast doubts on something else just because you don't use it.

If you had done any web searching you would have found the missing/corrupt hal.dll problem is not specific to my method, any particular version of grub or even Puppy. It does seem to be more prevalent with Windows XP Service Pack 2 though.

ICPUG

gary101 · #5 Post by **gary101** » Fri 02 Mar 2007, 03:14

from memory, I think that I recall the hal.dll missing to be caused by a corrupt mbr.

If this is the case you can fix the mbr from the xp recovery console and then add a line to your boot ini to manually add the puppy to the start menu.

Might point you in the right direction if you google for the error

gary101 · #6 Post by **gary101** » Fri 02 Mar 2007, 04:07

Adding to the last post.....

hal.dll controls the hardware abstraction layer, there for the error is most likely in the mbr or as a result of a corrupt boot.ini

As part of the process is editing the boot.ini it is most likely that this is where your error is.

You will need to get into your boot.ini to check it, I am posting mine as an example of what it should be like. If you google boot.ini you should come across instructions for writing it from scratch according to your partitioning etc.

***Example boot.ini***
[boot loader]
timeout=30
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Professional" /noexecute=optin /fastdetect
c:\grldr="Start Linux"

*******************************

If you followed the instructions for the frugall install of puppy explicitly it did tell you to make a back up of boot.ini, if you did then all you have to do is restore your backup.

If after sorting your boot.ini out you still have problems, boot your windows install disk, go to the recovery console and use the command fixmbr

If you kept your fingers crossed as you hit enter you should now be able to boot back into windowz.

Gary

bruce73 · #7 Post by **bruce73** » Fri 02 Mar 2007, 17:52

Gary,

Thanks for the info. I did make a backup of the boot.ini, but, as stated originally, I have no problems booting into Windows. I only saw the hal.dll error when I tried to boot into Linux.

Your boot.ini file looks exactly like mine, with the exception that I had changed the timout to 10 and my OS is MCE2005. Otherwise everything else was the same.

I'm hesitant to run fixmbr as I have no problems with Windows and don't want to mess with anything unnecessarily just for this, as convenient as it might be.

I'll try re-installing this weekend and see if I get the same error. Perhaps I overlooked some mistake in syntax or something.

HairyWill · #8 Post by **HairyWill** » Fri 02 Mar 2007, 20:49

I use this boot method as well.
I particularly like the fact that I haven't had to mess around with the MBR. On a laptop with no floppy or optical drive the risk of having to use the XP recovery CD to fix a stuffed MBR is not something I want to contemplate.

Try posting your boot.ini and menu.lst for us to check, you may have missed something. It doesn't look like grub is starting at all but the following data may help to shead some light.
Tell us where you have saved initrd.gz, vmlinuz pup_214.sfs and zdrv_214.sfs.
Have you tried this install method before with a different version of puppy?
Have you translated the instructions properly from 2.13 to 2.14?

gary101 · #9 Post by **gary101** » Fri 02 Mar 2007, 20:55

Hi Bruce.

If you have no way of getting into the windows installation to edit the boot.ini
you can boot into the recovery console from your windows installation disk and run fixboot, this will write a new boot.ini that you will then have to edit for your puppy to run.

Fixboot info is here http://www.microsoft.com/resources/docu ... x?mfr=true

Keeping my fingers crossed

Gary

Sage · #10 Post by **Sage** » Fri 02 Mar 2007, 21:50

Saw the hal.ddl error for the first time ever, yesterday. It popped up when I tried to access my USB keyfob under a full installation of Knoppix 5.1.1.
The other USB devices were functioning normally and the entire OS, which is Debian, of course, was otherwise well-behaved. It booted normally. I had to fix the 'su' error, though.
Should one expect to find the hal.dll error spread across all distro? Comments?

gary101 · #11 Post by **gary101** » Fri 02 Mar 2007, 23:27

hal.dll is is a dynamic linked library file that is specific to micro$oft NT based operating systems eg win2000, XP

Hope that answers your question.

bruce73 · #12 Post by **bruce73** » Sat 03 Mar 2007, 03:38

gary101 wrote:If you have no way of getting into the windows installation to edit the boot.ini
you can boot into the recovery console from your windows installation disk and run fixboot, this will write a new boot.ini that you will then have to edit for your puppy to run.

Fixboot info is here http://www.microsoft.com/resources/docu ... x?mfr=true

Keeping my fingers crossed

Gary, again I will mention that I have no problem booting into Windows. When I got the hal.dll error, I simply hit "Enter" and it brought me back to the OS selection screen and I then chose Windows and it booted up normally. I have since backtracked, deleting all installation files written to C:\ and have restored the boot.ini to its original form. Everything is fine, vis-a-vis Windows. So you can uncross your fingers.

I don't have a missing or corrupt hal.dll file, that's my whole point. Something, somewhere is messed up with this dual-boot option and, most likely, I overlooked something in the editing of the files (although I checked and double-checked all syntax and everything looked right to me).

The idea of a dual-boot was merely a convenience for me. It's not worth messing around with MBRs, creating special partitions, etc. I was only asking if anyone else had seen something like this and knew the cause, mainly for academic reasons.

Thanks.

PaulBx1 · #13 Post by **PaulBx1** » Sat 03 Mar 2007, 05:25

It's possible one of your downloads was corrupted. Try again?

I've used ICPUG's recipe when I was using frugal install. Worked fine with Win 98.

After a while I found a way that is even simpler. I revised the BIOS order of boot device, to boot from CD first, then hard drive. I then boot Puppy from CD but I've copied the pupxxx.sfs file to hard drive to speed up the boot. When I want windows, I simply open the CD drawer first. When I want Puppy, I close the CD drawer with the Puppy CD in it of course.

At least for me, this is even simpler and more trouble free than the regular frugal install, and even faster.

Sage · #14 Post by **Sage** » Sat 03 Mar 2007, 07:07

That's the problem, gary! I have never, ever used any M$ - NT version on any of my machines; never believed it was any better - worse actually, since there's no DOS underneath to repair it! The USB keyfob is formatted with a FAT fs, but that'll be 12 or 16 - guessing. So why should any versions of any Linux start throwing up messages about hal.dll ??? [I'll ask this on the Knoppix Forum, as well.]. This phenomenon is brand new - could it be a kernel 'feature'?

gary101 · #15 Post by **gary101** » Sat 03 Mar 2007, 11:00

mce 2005 is an NT based OS, I am not sure why you should be seeing an hal.dll error when booting into linux, The only thing I can think is that it it because this process uses the windows bootloader first and for some reason it is still expecting to see the windows file.

I followed these instructions as well to see if I could reproduce the error but all I got was a kernel panic and unionfs fault when booting in to puppy.
Having played around I, like you, am not convinced that it is worth the trouble (at the moment) as I usually hard drive install anyway.

I have a feeling that if I had windows on a FAT32 partition all would be well but mine is installed to ntfs, I presume yours is as well.

I like the idea behind this type of install and hope that it can be perfected, Linux has always struggled a bit with NTFS partitions.

Sage · #16 Post by **Sage** » Sat 03 Mar 2007, 11:37

Despite what you read in magazines and see on M$ literature, it is possible to convert NTFS to FAT32. This is a really good idea, but FAT32 does need daily maintenance, of course.

pmshah · #17 Post by **pmshah** » Sat 03 Mar 2007, 20:37

I too have used the method suggested by ICPUG for installing Puppy on Win XP partition. It is NTFS. I defragged the volume using Vopt 8 to get clean space for Puppy.

I had to make one change though. I changed the order and default choice to Linux in stead of Windows as also the delay in win.ini to 10 seconds.

I am posting both the files here if it could be of any help.

boot.ini
====================
[boot loader]
timeout=10
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Professional" /noexecute=optin /fastdetect /noguiboot
C:\ = "Unidentified operating system on drive C."
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Safe Mode" /fastdetect /safeboot:minimal /sos /bootlog
c:\grldr="Start Puppy Linux 2.13"
===================================

menu.lst
######################################################
# GvR Sept 30th 2004
color black/cyan yellow/cyan
timeout=7
default=0

title Puppy Linux 2.13
kernel (hd0,1)/vmlinuz root=/dev/ram0
initrd (hd0,1)/initrd.gz
boot

title Default Boot on HD 0
rootnoverify (hd0,1)
chainloader +1
boot

######################################################

Incidentally I have empty disk space showing under this option so had to change the boot setting in menu.lst to (hd0,1) from the suggested (hd0,0) for the grub bootloader to function properly.

ICPUG · #18 Post by **ICPUG** » Tue 06 Mar 2007, 00:00

Thanks to all you guys for the comments and information.

I was VERY intrigued to find Sage getting a hal.dll problem when he doesn't use Windows NT. I've never heard of that before.

Bruce73's situation is a bit unique as well - it is usually booting to Windows that causes the problem. This is why I felt the problem was due to boot.ini.

Thanks to pmshah, on another thread, I have found that when Puppy 2.14 is used, I had to modify the menu.lst file slightly from my instructions for Puppy 2.13. I don't think this is the cause of Bruce73's problem, because I don't think the boot process gets that far, but you never know. I do think it might be the reason for gary101's kernel panic when he tried it though.

You will find details here:
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 066#102066

This hal.dll problem is certainly widespread. I have seen it mentioned on Ubuntu forums as well as from people dual booting Red Hat Linux.

I am trying to garner information on the boot process and boot.ini to try and gain a better understanding of the problem - but it may be a long process! Mr Gates certainly seems to have done something since service pack 2 to make it harder for other systems to coexist with Windows. This is where the problem really lies, I think.

ICPUG

Sage · #19 Post by **Sage** » Tue 06 Mar 2007, 07:17

Not necessarily, IC. As I said, I had nothing to do with Mr G. and his evil empire. Unless, of course, his henchmen have managed to infiltrate the kernel?! Linus and his team should be able to answer this one. I am not sufficiently skilled in the art to phrase a suitable question for him, but I'm sure you are.

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Frugal install of 2.14 doesn't boot

Frugal install of 2.14 doesn't boot