How to replace Mozilla 1.8x beta with stable Mozilla 1.7x?

[Bruce B]

For me I just put mozilla in another partition where any Linux OS could use it.

The more I think about it. If a person wants to install Mozilla inside pup001, it might be easiest to install it in the old mozilla-1.8b1.4 directory.

So what if the directory name doesn't match the actual version, everything else will.

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If you still have problems with it not finding libraries check the lib path.

echo $LD_LIBRARY_PATH

Make sure the LD_LIBRARY_PATH is properly symlinked. This probably won't be a problem when the other symlink is fixed. In any event that's one thing to look for if it complains about not finding a lib file you know is there.

Or of course you could edit the path itself with a direct location. Frankly, I think Mozilla can find its own files without the library path. Probably it is in the path for the apps that depend on its library files.

The main thing is getting Mozilla to find itself. From there it can run on its own relative paths.

[Glitchman]

After several deletions, re-installs, and back and forth, Puppy was beginning to act rather strangely. It would completely hang on deleting the mozilla directory, and all the desktop icons would vanish. Exiting to a prompt would temporarily fix things, but then ROX would freeze if I would attempt to browse the /usr/lib/ directory. So to play it safe, I deleted pup001 inside of Windows 95 and started over.

Disregarding the Mozilla team's suggestions about installing over an existing installation, I decided to take this approach this time, since I was doing everything to the T last time (including checking the environment variables MOZILLA_FIVE_HOME & LD_LIBRARY_PATH.) So I installed Mozilla 1.7.11 to /usr/lib/mozilla1.8b1.4/ this time to avoid some hassles. It prompted me to remove the existing Mozilla installation, so I allowed it to do so.

Now I can launch Mozilla from the same mozstart icon on the desktop, but it still maintains its weird glitches that I pointed out last time. That is, it still has the generic red X icon in the upper left corner, full-screen mode still does not function properly, and the fonts are still weird.

Can it really be this difficult to make a stable version of Mozilla work, like it used to in Puppy 1.01 (or whenever it last bundled a stable Mozilla)? Does anyone else notice the same glitches that I encounter, or is there still something that I am missing?

[Guest]

Here is what I just did. Seeing how much trouble you were having with symlinks and etc.

I decided to test the overwrite theory about putting it in /usr/lib/mozilla-1.8b1.4

Steps involved.

* Downloaded and extracted Mozilla (the same version you are using).

* Installed a fresh brandnew Puppy.

* deleted /root/.mozilla

* ran mozilla's install program and directed it to install in /usr/lib/mozilla

note: /usr/lib/mozilla is not a directory rather a symlink to /usr/lib/mozilla-1.8b1.4, but the install program liked it better when installed via the symlink, bossy thing that it is. It warned me of an existing version and gave me a choice to delete the files and I let it delete the files. It then installed Mozilla 1.7.11 without a hitch.

Doing it this way the symlinks don't need to be revisited or reworked. The enviromnent variable is true.

The menu items work as well as the command line.

> Can it really be this difficult to make a stable version of Mozilla work, like it used to in Puppy 1.01 (or whenever it last bundled a stable Mozilla)? Does anyone else notice the same glitches that I encounter, or is there still something that I am missing?

I think your computer came down with a severe case of tinkeritus.

The symlinking process seems to be a tough one for you, I consider it your obstaclel. You otherwise have everything it takes to make this go right.

I've just done the actual testing for you and it works fine. You don't have to fix a single symlink.

Start from scratch, forget the Opera install, follow the procedure I outlined and please report back success. The procedure I just did is too simple to mess up. You will not need to do any more or less that what I've outlined.

[Bruce B]

The above post was written by me with the new Mozilla I freshly installed. I forgot to remember that because it is a fresh install it doesn't automatically log me in

[Glitchman]

I started over again, and followed what you said. Like last time, I can launch Mozilla 1.7.11 from mozstart on the desktop, but it still has the same glitches: red X in the upper-left corner, no full-screen capability, and weird fonts.

I decided to shut down, but received a nice segmentation fault. My computer is still trying to unmount hdb as we speak. I will re-burn Puppy from scratch, just to be safe.

I take it that you do not get the same glitches? (red X, no full-screen, weird fonts.)

[Guest]

> I take it that you do not get the same glitches? (red X, no full-screen, weird fonts.)

That is correct. Pretty straight forward, no bizarre work arounds. Nothing along the lines of the replies in this thread. I was expecting a success report.

Here is a screen shot

http://tinypic.com/ay7m12.jpg

[Glitchman]

Just to be sure, I tried both the standard Puppy 1.04 and the chubby Puppy 1.04. Both have the same glitches when I install Mozilla 1.7.11. That is, the generic red X icon in the upper left corner, no full-screen capability, and weird fonts. It appears that I am the only one encountering these glitches. *sigh*

Thanks for being patient with me. I just wish I could find the culprit of this problem. At least I can control the behavior of images, though at a price. I guess it's as close to success as I'll get. Thanks again for trying.

[GuestToo]

i find i can install other versions of Mozilla and Firefox without much problem ... sometimes there is a slight conflict if i still have the old config files

if you delete /root/.mozilla (hidden folder) it might help

[Glitchman]

if you delete /root/.mozilla (hidden folder) it might help

Yeah, that was what I did initially. I even deleted it again after running Mozilla 1.7.11 (which automatically re-creates the directory), but to no avail. It's puzzling.

[Bruce B]

I find it so hard to believe you are still having problems. I came up with the second procedure just for you because I could see the resolving the symlinks were causing frustration. I did not post just a theory about what would work and be easy for you. I set up a new pup001 and tested it first. I used the very version of Mozilla you used.

Did you do all this and no more and no less?

Steps involved.

* download and extract Mozilla

* Install a fresh brandnew Puppy. (pup001 file)

* delete /root/.mozilla

* run mozilla's install program and directed it to install in /usr/lib/mozilla

note: /usr/lib/mozilla is not a directory rather a symlink to /usr/lib/mozilla-1.8b1.4, but the install program liked it better when installed via the symlink, bossy thing that it is. It warned me of an existing version and gave me a choice to delete the files and I let it delete the files. It then installed Mozilla 1.7.11 without a hitch.

[Glitchman]

Did you do all this and no more and no less?

Steps involved.

* download and extract Mozilla

Check. I even re-burned the .iso's for both the standard and chubby versions of Puppy 1.04.

* Install a fresh brandnew Puppy. (pup001 file)

Check. I deleted pup001 from Windows 95 to allow a fresh one to be created.

* delete /root/.mozilla

Check.

* run mozilla's install program and directed it to install in /usr/lib/mozilla

Check.

[Bruce B]

A pictrure helps a lot.

The red X you are talking as I remember is particular to fvwm95. I use icewm. I think red X is a feature of fvwm95.

You are not running in full screen mode as can easily be detected by the control button in the upper right corner of the windows just to the left of the X

The window is also resizable manually.

The fonts look normal to me. Do they to you? BTW I like the default fonts in Firefox better.

In any event the fonts can be changed to suit your tastes. Also ctrl- or ctrl+ as you need to make a quick change in size, but not font face.

Is it possible you only think something is wrong?

Try and push the full screen button I described above, see if that fixes it. Let me know. There are always solutions.

[GuestToo]

that does look weird
i just downloaded and unzipped Mozilla to /tmp
and made a symlink to /usr/lib
it seems to work ok on my machine

http://tinypic.com/aynbpt.jpg

[GuestToo]

i think the red x is normal ... it's the standard fvwm95 icon for an executable file

i can make the menus bar disappear by clicking the textured button (under the red x on your pic) but there is a button to click to bring it back

http://tinypic.com/aynig1.jpg

[Glitchman]

A pictrure helps a lot.

The red X you are talking as I remember is particular to fvwm95. I use icewm. I think red X is a feature of fvwm95.

The red X was not there in any versions of Mozilla that were bundled with any version of Puppy. I prefer fvwm95 since JWM is too awkward, and some other window managers are too "XP-ish" for my tastes, but that's another topic.

You are not running in full screen mode as can easily be detected by the control button in the upper right corner of the windows just to the left of the X

The window is also resizable manually.

Believe it or not, that IS Full-screen mode, as broken as it is. I did that from View - Full Screen. I have also done that from F11 (after "fixing" the F11 key in .fvwm95rc by commenting out the appropriate lines.)

The fonts look normal to me. Do they to you? BTW I like the default fonts in Firefox better.

In any event the fonts can be changed to suit your tastes. Also ctrl- or ctrl+ as you need to make a quick change in size, but not font face.

I realize that the about: screen was not the best example of the strange fonts; in fact, that screen has some of the most readable fonts. I am aware of the shortcuts for resizing fonts. The problem is not so much in the size of the fonts but the actual fonts themselves. I may see if I can find a better example, but for now the previous screenshot was inentionally taken from the about: screen to show that the 1.7.11 version did install.

Is it possible you only think something is wrong?

I wish. I guess I have an eye for things that are out of place or wrong, hence the screen name.

Try and push the full screen button I described above, see if that fixes it. Let me know. There are always solutions.

As described above, the functionality is broken. Changing to full-screen from the menu or from F11 keeps the window the same size. The "2nd" minimize button does nothing, the 2nd restore button goes back to the "non-full-screen" window, and the 2nd close button does actually function.

And yes, I agree that there are always solutions. Every glitch happens for a reason.

[Bruce B]

I just validated that the red X is a feature of fvwm95 for sure.

I observed a nomenclature problem that was my bad. Fullscree != maximized.

I was thinking maximized and you were thinking actual fullscreen.

I tested fullscreen in fvwm95 and it works but is not fully supported it seems. I think icewm supports the fullscreen better. I can't validate this at this moment becuase I'm using the Puppy that most corresponds with yours and icewm is not installed on this computer.

About the fonts. Here are my thoughts, I wonder if Mozilla anti-aliases fonts as well as Firefox on any Linux. I've noted for a long time that the fonts look better in Firefox as opposed to Mozilla. It seems to me that they would both anti-alias the same, but maybe not.

I simply don't find Mozilla fonts as pleasing as Firefox fonts under any scenerio.

If you are talking about font rendering which I think you are - we are on the same page.

Also font face and size is a factor. I don't think Mozilla's authors picked the same faces and sizes as Firefox. We can set things to our liking with some trial and error.

I'll be right back after some tests.

[Bruce B]

About fonts: I just did some testing of sorts. Subjective tests if you will. I convinced in my mind that Mozilla simply doesn't render fonts as well as Firefox or something of that nature.

Among other things I checked the option to not allow documents to use other fonts. I am not impressed at all with the Mozilla defaults.

I read something about Puppy allowing for MS true types. I think the process is something like make a directory /root/.fonts and drop your true types and what ever in there. Maybe having those font sets and allowing document fonts would help. I do not know.

The only thing I can think to do with the font display quality in Mozilla is work with what we have and improve on it somehow.

I write this with the idea in mind that we are having the same perceptions of the font display issue. And that there is nothing bizarre going on.

As for the XP look you mentioned. I don't care for it much, the screen shot I posted was icewm with the silver theme.

[GuestToo]

the gtk-1 versions of Mozilla do not support antialiased fonts at all ... the gtk-1 version was the one in my pics (Puppy 1.0.5 is supposed to have the gtk-1 version i think)

the gtk-2 version of Mozilla does support antialiased and true type fonts, and it can use fonts in /root/.fonts

i prefer the Firefox interface myself, but that is largely a matter of preference

[Glitchman]

Curiously enough, I decided to try the same thing, only this time on Puppy 1.03. The same glitches still happen. It may be worth noting that I continue to get segmentation faults whenever I try to reboot. I never used to get this prior to tampering with the broken beta Mozilla. It's peculiar.

As for the red X, yes it is unique to fvwm95, but what I was trying to say was that it does not appear in any of the Mozillas that are already bundled with all versions of Puppy. The red X was merely the first thing that alerted me that something was wrong. In this case, I think it is somehow related to the full-screen option not working. The bundled versions of Mozilla can go into full-screen mode without any problems even in fvwm95. It's just that a user-installed Mozilla does not properly go into full-screen mode (at least for me.)

I guess I should call it a night since I've been staring at this monitor too long. Perhaps a new day will shine some light on things. Thank you everyone for your input.

[flamesage]

Is there anyway to uninstall mozilla if we don't want it?
And if we were to update, would it just come back?