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oli

Joined: 30 Aug 2006
Posts: 194
Location: Germany, Frankfurt

PostPosted: Mon 17 Mar 2008, 08:14    Post subject:  

I had a search at the web. I suggest to use dokuwiki ( http://wiki.splitbrain.org/wiki:dokuwiki ) for the manual. Eric (Caneri) or Tom (tombh), could you install dokuwiki at the website and send me a link so that I can make some tests with the manual?
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raffy

Joined: 25 May 2005
Posts: 4839
Location: Manila

PostPosted: Mon 17 Mar 2008, 12:12    Post subject: Done a test site  

Oli, I've done a test site for Dokuwiki and informed you via PM of the access info. Am afraid that servage's server software could be too old - hope the scripts will work.
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ttuuxxx


Joined: 05 May 2007
Posts: 11193
Location: Ontario Canada,Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Mon 17 Mar 2008, 12:32    Post subject:  

Hey guys if a Forum is needed let me say one thing, PhpBB is terrible for spam, I used to get over 100 xxx post a month, some were just over the top for a linux website, I then Deleted PhpBB and installed SMF forum and have 0 spam for over 1 month now. It is so nice, I will never go back to PhpBB
ttuuxxx

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Pizzasgood


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 6266
Location: Knoxville, TN, USA

PostPosted: Mon 17 Mar 2008, 13:04    Post subject:  

That may not be because of better forum software. I've gotten the same effect by just moving my forum to another directory. After a month or two the bots seemed to find me again. I don't know if the URL changed in your case, but the methods of posting will certainly have, so right now you might just be in the lull period while you wait for the bots to adjust.

Not saying something else wouldn't help. The less mainstream the better as far as spam goes. But I do think you need to give it three months or so before you can judge how good it really is.

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Dingo


Joined: 11 Dec 2007
Posts: 1434
Location: somewhere at the end of rainbow...

PostPosted: Mon 17 Mar 2008, 14:00    Post subject:  

oli wrote:
I had a search at the web. I suggest to use dokuwiki ( http://wiki.splitbrain.org/wiki:dokuwiki ) for the manual. Eric (Caneri) or Tom (tombh), could you install dokuwiki at the website and send me a link so that I can make some tests with the manual?

o yeah my site is based on dokuwiki

http://puppylover.netsons.org/dokupuppy/doku.php

and dokuwiki can be expanded with many plugins adding extra features

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LOF


Joined: 15 Dec 2006
Posts: 115
Location: UK

PostPosted: Tue 18 Mar 2008, 03:44    Post subject:  

LOF wrote:
...The problem is that I don't know if a hierarchy system is possible to do with Wikka. The category feature is the closest thing that I know of but this has proved very confusing to orchestrate. I also would suggest not going with a Drupal extension wiki as realistically the wiki needs to have the power of a dedicated content system. Would a change of wiki software be possible? I know that http://moinmo.in/ (used by Ubuntu wiki) is capable of doing subpages (e.g. .../Manual/French)


Bump.

What do people think of changing the wiki software if we start it over from scratch?

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HairyWill


Joined: 26 May 2006
Posts: 2946
Location: Southampton, UK

PostPosted: Tue 18 Mar 2008, 04:12    Post subject:  

LOF
Are you talking about a manual wiki, other or everything combined into one wiki.

I am strongly against throwing away the existing content. There is over 800 pages there and this action gives a very bad signal to those that have put the most effort into it. These are also the people most likely to contribute to the new wiki. If we choose to move to a new wiki engine all the existing material should be transferred. Each page should be automatically marked as "Needs review for style and content", then we can edit and reorganise as time allows. Maybe it is possible to automatically add these pages to a category NeedsReview.

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WhoDo


Joined: 11 Jul 2006
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Location: Lake Macquarie NSW Australia

PostPosted: Tue 18 Mar 2008, 04:41    Post subject:  

HairyWill wrote:
I am strongly against throwing away the existing content.

@LOF - I'm with Will on this one. There are also a myriad of links, HOWTO's and other stuff that is very important for understanding Puppy.

Either we should go for the upgraded version of Wikkawiki (our current wiki engine), or move the content to Drupal's wiki for better control and security. Either way, the content is indispensable, IMHO.

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Lobster
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Joined: 04 May 2005
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PostPosted: Tue 18 Mar 2008, 05:13    Post subject:  

WhoDo wrote:
go for the upgraded version of Wikkawiki (our current wiki engine)


I am already using an updated wakkawiki for tmxxine and the main difference is in better editing facilities.
It seems to be stable but the security updates for spam have not yet been added
http://docs.wikkawiki.org/WikkaReleaseNotes1164

A wakkawiki update is due this month - however I heard that one 4 months ago Smile

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raffy

Joined: 25 May 2005
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Location: Manila

PostPosted: Tue 18 Mar 2008, 11:02    Post subject: mod_php4  

Surprise, surprise - I saw it last night but could not believe it. Now am starting to believe. The Apache server at puppylinux.org has no version* number and it runs mod_php4 (version 4.3.11).

Oli can't get dokuwiki to work since yesterday, and am running out of solutions, so I looked again at phpinfo. AFAIK, servers should now be running PHP5, and dokuwiki coders know this.

I could be wrong, but I have used dokuwiki before in a netfirms site, without problems.

Possible solution: use another server that can run dokuwiki.

-------------------
* phpinfo says "Servage.net Cluster/(Enhanced Apache)" without giving any number.

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LOF


Joined: 15 Dec 2006
Posts: 115
Location: UK

PostPosted: Tue 18 Mar 2008, 13:03    Post subject:  

WhoDo wrote:
HairyWill wrote:
I am strongly against throwing away the existing content.

@LOF - I'm with Will on this one. There are also a myriad of links, HOWTO's and other stuff that is very important for understanding Puppy.

Either we should go for the upgraded version of Wikkawiki (our current wiki engine), or move the content to Drupal's wiki for better control and security. Either way, the content is indispensable, IMHO.


Good point guys. Sorry I completely forgot about the need to change all links around and reformat everything when transferring content. I guess I just thought of copying and pasting. Soz.

Anyway, a quick question. Have people considered using the current wiki for the manual? If there are technical problems in setting up a new one, and we can somehow set access levels for users of a particular catergory on the existing wiki (can this be done?), then surely it would make sense to put manual development onto the existing structure.

Just throwing some ideas out there, feel free to shoot them down...

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Lobster
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Joined: 04 May 2005
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PostPosted: Tue 18 Mar 2008, 13:43    Post subject:  

html can be displayed on a wiki page by putting it between a set of double quotation marks

eg
http://puppylinux.org/wikka/AdditionalPrograms

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tombh


Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 422
Location: Bristol, UK

PostPosted: Tue 18 Mar 2008, 14:52    Post subject:  

Sorry to have not contributed for the past few days, I was discussing some stuff with raffy.

So anyway, Drupal, yes my favourite, the self-proclaimed provider of "community plumbing". It is the complete Content Management System, not really possessing a specific speciality, but excelling in adaptability whilst keeping all its functionality under one roof. With only Joomla to compete with it is widely considered to be the most powerful non-commercial CMS.

It literally has thousands of modules and a huge, friendly and helpful community following. The Internationalisation module (which I have some experience with) and the Localisation module might be interesting to Oli (there are even more translation modules that I have not looked at) -- let me know if you'd be interested in trying them out.

Its core functionality is all about providing means to manage and manipulate large amounts of varied content, pages, wikis, images, blogs and even custom content types. Also part of the core is the ability to finely control privileges on a per user and per role basis.

Drupal is perfectly built for the kind of project that we are talking about here, it's the kind of thing were, scattered throughout its code, there will be numerous gadgets, gizmos and features that cover eventualities that we could have never foreseen. I think it would also be a great investment for the future, because if we ever start thinking about adding new features to Puppy's web life, we can just consider adding new modules rather than a whole new piece of separate software that needs to be separately installed, themed, administrated, maintained and registered with unique usernames.

If anyone would like admin access to the Drupal backend of my proto-site, just PM me.

PS Oli's been sorted out with his test docuwiki installation, so no worries there.
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oli

Joined: 30 Aug 2006
Posts: 194
Location: Germany, Frankfurt

PostPosted: Wed 19 Mar 2008, 05:29    Post subject:  

Thanks to Raffy, Tom and Eric I can test dokuwiki now. It is very easy to use and - if everything I need works - I would like to use it for the manual.

Perhaps Raffy and Eric can manage to run dokuwiki at the prospective website (www.puppylinux.org ?) too. Then there should be a login so that only the manual's maintainer can edit.
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tombh


Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 422
Location: Bristol, UK

PostPosted: Wed 19 Mar 2008, 06:28    Post subject:  

@Oli: What do you think about using Drupal? I can see that Dokuwiki is certainly capable of maintaining the manual, but from the wider point of view of the whole Puppy website there would be many advantages to just using one CMS.

From what I have read I can see that maintaining the manual will require 3 main areas:
Revision Control: If someone makes a change to a manual page the old version needs to be retained automatically. Drupal has this as standard.
Access Control: Only users that are trusted translators or maintainers should be able to edit manual pages. Again Drupal has this functionality as standard.
Notification Support: Whenever a manual page is updated, in ANY language, the maintainers of the other manual pages need to be notified. Drupal has a notification module. It also provides a comment feature for all content types, access to read/write these can be finely controlled.

There is also a clone module that may come in useful when upgrading the manual to a new version -- we can simply make a copy of the entire manual, then hide it from public view and edit it privately until it is ready, then simply switch the manuals around.

I appreciate that this maybe a compromise for you, learning something which might be quite new to you. However, I mention it because I think it would be worth considering from the broader perspective of the other features that we need to integrate now (ie, the general WIKI and main website) and in the future.
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