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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Derivatives
Introducing PULP - 125 MB Puplet for older hardware
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zenfunk

Joined: 18 Mar 2009
Posts: 222

PostPosted: Tue 13 Oct 2009, 05:25    Post_subject:  

Quote:
Christian,
How hard would it be to put this script into the distro with a menu entry next time you remaster?

I know I can do it because its right here and I see it, but for others down the road, that is a hugely useful function to have 'out of the box'

FYI, I'll mirror PULP this week and let you know when its up.

Just a thought,
Sully
This is exactly what I have planned for, but as I said before the next release very likely has to wait until puppy5 is released.

Have you tried out the docview script? Wickedly fast isn't it? You could run docview 5 times before abiword would start, let alone openoffice.

About the siag office issues - I really have no idea. I just did some basic typing just to make sure it works- that's about it.
Although I love tinkering with my otherwise "obsolete" low end laptops, my main computer still is a core2duo where all the "serious" work gets done, so I haven't used Siag much.

Quote:
My skills are way below his and yours but his blog really made the "tinkerer" in me curious Slight update now this old lap dog has a 60 gig hd,not sure why it see's 55 gigs, but i sow a post some where (cant find dam link now) that these older satellite's have a very forgiving bios.
see ya round the dog pound ,and again nice lil pup you made
I have two sattelites myself. While the bios might be very forgiving, the graphics card gives me headaches each time I boot a fresh puppy. Xvesa doesn't work, trident driver in xorg doesn't too, so you have to use xvesa driver in xorg(!!!) to get it going. Wicked.
Nevertheless, nice machines.
The oldest laptop I got has a 8082 processor and 1 MB RAM with a 1 MB kredit card type RAM expansion card. The MS- DOS 3.something is stored in ROM!!! (no harddrive, only floppy disk). While not for Linux (Linux only boots down to a 386 IMHO), the boot time of this old beast is about 12 seconds. Nice little machine for tetris or something.
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mrreality13

Joined: 03 Oct 2008
Posts: 95
Location: arlington texas

PostPosted: Tue 13 Oct 2009, 20:23    Post_subject:  

mine runs fine in xvesa BUT with that being said im havein a hell of a time finding a video player that will play .avi files it SEEMS that mplayer and xine rely on xorg drivers.
And i was also wondering how to chance the background i cant find the file you mentioned that was broke in jwm,
Thanx Wink
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zenfunk

Joined: 18 Mar 2009
Posts: 222

PostPosted: Sun 18 Oct 2009, 18:31    Post_subject:  

Tuuxxx very kindly reuploaded the Abiword 1.0.2 version:

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=212246#212246

Will get back to you about the background color,. I'm not at my PULP machine right now.
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sullysat


Joined: 16 Oct 2007
Posts: 364
Location: San Antonio, TX

PostPosted: Sun 18 Oct 2009, 18:50    Post_subject:  

zenfunk wrote:
Tuuxxx very kindly reuploaded the Abiword 1.0.2 version:

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=212246#212246

Will get back to you about the background color,. I'm not at my PULP machine right now.


I'm looking forward to trying this version of Abiword after all the problems I'm seeing with Siag Office.

Are you going to try it out too zen?

Sully

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zenfunk

Joined: 18 Mar 2009
Posts: 222

PostPosted: Tue 20 Oct 2009, 13:16    Post_subject:  

Changing the backround color:
Open ~/.jwm/jwmrc-personal in your texteditor and change the line that begins with <Background...... to something like this:

<Background="solid">#524A7F</Background>

The wicked series of numbers and letters is a colorcode.
You can find a code for the color you like with the Gcolor2 color chooser in the graphics menu.

Now on to abiword... downloading now.

Cheers, Christian
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zenfunk

Joined: 18 Mar 2009
Posts: 222

PostPosted: Tue 20 Oct 2009, 13:33    Post_subject:  

Apparently the abiword from the above link seems to work. Yeehaw...

Have fun- and a big thanks to Tuuxxxx (again).

Christian
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sullysat


Joined: 16 Oct 2007
Posts: 364
Location: San Antonio, TX

PostPosted: Tue 20 Oct 2009, 16:35    Post_subject:  

Wellllllll... it sort of works.

It loads, and runs, but it doesn't add to the menu properly. I added it to the menu, but then jwm didn't work right.

If it worked for you, please tell me what you did to make that happen.

I haven't had a chance to play with it since I loaded it, but I'm really hoping we can sort it out. It would be a good replacement for pathetic write, which lives up to its name completely.

I've seen several distros (not puppy, but DSL and a couple others) that run siag spreadsheet and some other word processor. My opinion based on how this version of abiword runs is, that you do that with the next version of PULP, provided that Siag will work better once its not tied up with the word processor.

I've never had a problem using siag, but on both PULP and ttuuxxx's 3.01Retro Lite, neither the word processor or the spreadsheet work correctly. I could do without a spreadsheet in a light distro, but a decent browser (firepup or dillo2) and a word processor are essential IMO.

Anyway, there you go.

Sully

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zenfunk

Joined: 18 Mar 2009
Posts: 222

PostPosted: Wed 21 Oct 2009, 02:47    Post_subject:  

I simply ran fixmenus after the installation and restarted jwm. Abiword was found in the documents submenu. I had no probs at all. What did you do?
(Nevertheless, I shot my system shortly afterward by installing a new glibc or something- how dumb is that? Grrrrr- will have to reinstall...).
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sullysat


Joined: 16 Oct 2007
Posts: 364
Location: San Antonio, TX

PostPosted: Wed 21 Oct 2009, 10:06    Post_subject:  

I'm not sure what happened zen, but I did fixmenus then restarted jwm and it all went whacky.

I'm going to delete and reinstall PULP, then run it again and see what happens. I'll put an update here and let you know how that goes.

Sully

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sullysat


Joined: 16 Oct 2007
Posts: 364
Location: San Antonio, TX

PostPosted: Wed 21 Oct 2009, 10:54    Post_subject:  

I'm not sure what I did, but all kinds of jwm craziness was going on!

So, I deleted my PULP install and started over. I did a new frugal install and then installed Abiword and everything seems to be working fine now.

I don't know what you're shooting for, resource-wise but on my machine PULP is using only 21MB of RAM with HTOP and Abiword open. On all the machines I'm currently working on, that would be pretty acceptable, especially given the additional capability of reading and writing to .doc files.

I really don't know of a better tiny spreadsheet than Siag, but I've used that in other distros without PW and its worked just fine. Am I the only one who's reported font and sizing issues on that program?

Now that its starting to cool off, I'm going to get my workbench cleaned up and put together a low spec system to test PULP on. I appreciate your efforts with this and look forward to testing its lower limits.

Thanks,
Sully

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zenfunk

Joined: 18 Mar 2009
Posts: 222

PostPosted: Wed 21 Oct 2009, 12:31    Post_subject:  

So far I'm very pleased with the resources pulp uses. Abiword GTK1 starts fine in a couple of seconds on my Pentium IIs.
The thing with the whole siag office suit is that modern file formats are not supported very well. I very seldomly (is this a word?) create new office documents (mostly work with text files to be honest). So the office suites I use are mostly for opening existing documents. This renders siag, and other not wide spread office suites, fairly useless for most of my tasks. Abiword is definitely a keeper, because it supports .doc files quite well.

Really annoying is that there seems to be no support for open document format files on slow computers. Dspite of being open and well documented and all, all the existing solutions involve openoffice at some point. Openoffice needs over 5 seconds to start on my dual core- how long would it take on my Pentium II?

Ironically the proprietary .doc format is much better supported in PULP ATM.


Cheers, Christian
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sullysat


Joined: 16 Oct 2007
Posts: 364
Location: San Antonio, TX

PostPosted: Wed 21 Oct 2009, 14:49    Post_subject:  

zenfunk wrote:
<SNIP>
The thing with the whole siag office suit is that modern file formats are not supported very well.
Agreed
I very seldomly (is this a word?) [It is now!] create new office documents (mostly work with text files to be honest). So the office suites I use are mostly for opening existing documents. This renders siag, and other not wide spread office suites, fairly useless for most of my tasks. Abiword is definitely a keeper, because it supports .doc files quite well.
We certainly agree on that!

Really annoying is that there seems to be no support for open document format files on slow computers. Despite of being open and well documented and all, all the existing solutions involve openoffice at some point. Openoffice needs over 5 seconds to start on my dual core- how long would it take on my Pentium II?

Ironically the proprietary .doc format is much better supported in PULP ATM.
Cheers, Christian


I'm still in a place where, for compatibility purposes, most of my documents are saved and processed in .doc format, so I haven't used open document formats for much yet, though I'm moving in that direction.

In the mean time, I've found that as long as I can write to pdf or doc I can usually do whatever I need to do. This is a good deal for your little distro, IMO.

So, whatcha gonna do about the spreadsheet? Wink Question

Sully

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Puppyt

Joined: 09 May 2008
Posts: 568
Location: Gatton, Queensland

PostPosted: Wed 21 Oct 2009, 23:45    Post_subject:
Sub_title: Toshiba laptop 430cds and Pulp
 

Hi zenfunk,

just a few comments - I'm dashing this off in Pulpv3 now, attempting to pre-configure it on my main (P4) machine before porting it across via "brain transplant" into a Satellite Pro 430CDS, 120MHz Pent., 16MB RAM. Have tried loads of other puplets to get around the Toshiba-laptop-Xvideo issues, HOW DID YOU DO IT? To paraphrase, "zenfunki-wan, you're my only hope..." I'll update on that issue later, please don't bother with a serious and detailed reply I think I'm close to solving it- I supect the video issue is slowing overall processing speed but then I only have fleabit -size RAM.

Your Firepup runs the Firefox add-on and bibliographic tool "Zotero". Don't know why I've not been able to get the two to gel in previous attempts in other puplets, but this rates. Seriously useful! (I didn't know Firepup was ttuuxx's - he's worked his magic again)

I second puppyiso's and Lobster's assessment of TextMaker - I used it pre-installed in a puplet (?) yonks ago, liked it so much I downloaded the "free" versions for Windows. I don't recall if the TextMaker pet in the official repostitories also has PlanMaker (Excel), albeit seriously limited to 40 rows of data - but I wonder what progress has been made with the SoftMaker company and licencing to Puppy as it might be the solution to the Word/Excel-type issues mentioned earlier in the thread.

I appreciate your work on Pulp very much, by the way! Good Work!
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zenfunk

Joined: 18 Mar 2009
Posts: 222

PostPosted: Thu 22 Oct 2009, 04:31    Post_subject:  

OK- the xorg- toshiba issue:
not sure it works on your particular toshiba:
I selected xorg, because the xvesa only gave me a completely messed up screen (looked a bit like a tv with no antenna cable plugged in- weird).
The auto detection loaded the trident driver which I manually changed to vesa in teh xorg.config. (select 'Test' in xorgwizard, quit the test and select 'edit xorg.config manually')

So I actually run xorg with the vesa driver- don't ask me why I tried that out in the first place - but it worked for one of my toshibas.

The other toshiba I got worked with xvesa right away, so YMMV.

As I said before: Textmaker is not free software, so it will not be in PULP but you can of course allways install it afterwards if you choose to. It's all about choice.

Quote:
Your Firepup runs the Firefox add-on and bibliographic tool "Zotero". Don't know why I've not been able to get the two to gel in previous attempts in other puplets, but this rates. Seriously useful! (I didn't know Firepup was ttuuxx's - he's worked his magic again)

The firefox that is in PULPv003 is a firefox 2.something compiled with gtk 1.2.
Firepup is firefox 1.5 compiled with recent security updates by Tuuxxxx.
Since the GTK 1.2 version gave a more consistent look with all the other GTK 1.2 apps and felt a bit faster (not much though)- I stuck with it.
Nevertheless, Firepup is a nice piece of work.

Spreadsheet:
I probably will leave it out completely in the next version. Probably Siag will stay as a stopgap, but as I said before, it's rather useless nowadays.
Not yet sure about it all.
If someone finds a pet for a GTK 1.2 gnumeric I'll use that with pleasure.

It's funny how the other light and small distros tweak here and there, use this or that window manager just to shave off a few kB of ram usage and whatnot.
Although PULP also has a lot of background processes turned off etc., I think the single, most prominent performance gain in PULP came from throwing gtk 2.0 over board and sticking with GTK 1.2 apps. GTKedit is up and runnung in one second vs. leafpad opening in about 5 seconds on my Pentium II. Rox takes forever to get going (when its not backgrounded and eating up 6 MB RAM all the time!!!), emelfm takes just under a second to start.
When you use a "proper" computer (say a Pentium IV with about 2 GHz- plenty of RAM), the texteditor in PULP is alive when you release the mouse button.

I really think of rolling out a new version of PULP sooner. Now that I actually have users... this motivates a lot. Please keep the suggestions for improvement coming. Wink
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zenfunk

Joined: 18 Mar 2009
Posts: 222

PostPosted: Thu 22 Oct 2009, 04:59    Post_subject:  

Just did a bit of googling, it seems that your toshiba has a Chips & Technologies CT-65550 graphics chip. It is supported in xorg by the 'chips' driver.

With 16 MB of RAM you need a swap partition before you can boot and install (and even then I'm not sure Puppy/PULP will run).
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