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 Forum index » Taking the Puppy out for a walk » Misc
Linus Torvalds prefers KDE over Gnome
Moderators: Flash, JohnMurga
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jcagle

Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Posts: 634

PostPosted: Wed 14 Dec 2005, 02:46    Post subject:  Linus Torvalds prefers KDE over Gnome  

http://linuxarts.caglewebcreations.com/index.php?id=1,15,0,0,1,0

Also, if you e-mail me about what window manager/desktop you prefer and why, I will be posting it on the Linux Arts web site.

Last edited by jcagle on Thu 15 Dec 2005, 22:50; edited 1 time in total
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MU


Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 13647
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany

PostPosted: Wed 14 Dec 2005, 03:07    Post subject:  

For a while I prefered Gnome (0.9 - 1.4).
But then they used Gtk2 (awfull slow the first versions), and started hiding/removing options.
So later, the first I did on new systems, was installing additional programs giving me back control.
This is what I still do, actually I use fluxbox, that has a nice and fast panel, with some addons like the icon-menu and the Drag'n'Drop-icons.
Then the PuppyBasic-Gtk-Themeselector and Mousecursor-selector, plus Puppys Wizards of course (that replace the Gnome-control-center).
Together with Rox and XFileExplorer I have nearly everything I need concerning a "basic Desktop" (not talking about applications like office or multimedia).

Gnome might be good for beginners, but it should have an "advanced mode" for people who like to custimize their desktop.
The speed has become better in newer releases already.
Today I just tried to get Gnome 1.4 running on puppy, but my binaries crash with a segfault. Would be nice having the old, fast Gnomepanel Smile

Mark
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Lobster
Official Crustacean


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 15588
Location: Paradox Realm

PostPosted: Wed 14 Dec 2005, 03:54    Post subject:  

MU wrote:

Today I just tried to get Gnome 1.4 running on puppy, but my binaries crash with a segfault. Would be nice having the old, fast Gnomepanel Smile
Mark


People believe uber-penguin Linus can say and do no wrong.
Wrong!
I prefer Gnome to KDE, I find KDE klunky and confused. Xfce is much simpler and pleasant (to my ignorance) - but I am running JWM . . . why? Because it is the Puppy default and I am using 107a (right from where it first came out). I find clicking on icons sometimes brings up menus inadvertently but it seems stable enough to use (even on an Alpha release)

Emotionally people like to play and alter their environment, so adding Gnome - why not. KDE is also great in the two Puppy versions (Barrys and Nathans) which I have got running. I have no need for them to be honest - others do.

The recent drag and drop facilities will be an enhacement (maybe linked to an "advanced desktop" menu selection) - and Puppy Basic and these sort of facilities DnD make our OS easier.

I don't need Gnome or Icewm or Xfce or KDE or fluxbox - I just like them. There are things I do need that not all Puppys have:

Screen display
connection
sound
printing

90% of my play (work - work is play) is browser based and I have stopped adding themes after one (pinball) was causing me problems with resizing (never could understand why no one else had this problem)

OK - enough ranting fom me . . .

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Ian
Official Dog Handler


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 1238
Location: Queensland

PostPosted: Wed 14 Dec 2005, 04:37    Post subject:  

I worked hard to get Gnome with Enlightenment working in 1998 in RedHat 5.2 on a 486, in RedHat 6.0, 6.1, and 6,2 it improved but I never really took to it although I love the ideas behind it and the fact that an "Aussie" is the developer.

I found fvwm95 worked ok, Afterstep was a bit kluggy but I really liked Window Maker.

Being a simple soul all I really need is a place to type so the choice of window manager is really not an issue but if I have to work in a GUI my choices would be either fvwm95 or Window Manager as I can adjust myself to work with any WM.
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jcagle_not_logged_in
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PostPosted: Wed 14 Dec 2005, 13:28    Post subject:  

I'm still deciding between XFCE and Fluxbox.
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Rich

Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 278
Location: Middlesbrough - UK

PostPosted: Wed 14 Dec 2005, 15:00    Post subject:  

I've tried IceWm and fluxbox in the past, all nice and customisable - with many themes available. BUT in the same way that mobile phones have ringtones and wallpapers available, all I need is a phone.
All I need is something that is clean and reliable - FVWM95 is always the one I end up using.

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jcagle

Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Posts: 634

PostPosted: Wed 14 Dec 2005, 15:32    Post subject:  

I guess the looks of the window manager and customization are especially important to a graphic designer such as myself. But I understand the need for some people to have something that just works, nothing flashy needed.
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bombayrockers


Joined: 24 Sep 2005
Posts: 427
Location: Mumbai, India

PostPosted: Wed 14 Dec 2005, 15:58    Post subject:  

Yes fvwm95 is very fast for me and that was what I was trying to use as a default desktop for my kde+puppy. However I could not get the systemtray to work in fvwm95 and in the meantime MU made fluxbox.pup which is kde and gnome compliant.

my choice - if not using kde - xfce is best, if using kde - then I use fluxbox.

Various wm's I have tested in puppy
jwm
fvwm95
fvwm2
equinox
fluxbox
blackbox
openbox
matchbox
oroborus
framer (a simple wm for rox desktop)
xfce
kde
enlightenment dr16.7
tde (a brazilian language desktop based on qt - very small only 3-5 Mbs, very fast compared to kde, available in debian packages)
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rarsa


Joined: 29 May 2005
Posts: 3053
Location: Kitchener, Ontario, Canada

PostPosted: Wed 14 Dec 2005, 22:44    Post subject:  

Quote:
Linus Torvalds wants you to use KDE!
I think this is the wrong interpretation of what really transpired on that mailing list.

Quoting people out of context almost always gives the wrong impression.

One can almost never put all the context in a single sentence so just reading a sentence or parragraph is not enough to understand the real meaning.

The actual issue in that mailing list thread was that he thinks that the GNOME designers use the 'it will confuse users' argument too frequently. And when people complains about that he responds "use KDE".

So, that phrase was thrown as an expresion of "Use something else". It's clear when he says that he "voted with his feet".

OK, having clarified the issue here are my comments:

I find GNOME too sterile and booring. But I think that's good because that's the intention: Make everything look the same and don't allow too much customization to avoid weird side effects.

I don't agree with all Linus' original arguments but again, in context it's clear that they were too viceral (He acknowledges that latter in the thread). GNOME has a clear direction whether he or I like it or not. Other people like it. Linux is about choice. Some people never monkey around with the interface. They even use the same wallpaper that the OS came with.

As I mentioned in another thread. After playing around with too many WMs I found that my functionality requirements are quite low so most of them do the work.

Some people confuse the WM with the default configuration with such WM. That's a viceral reaction and I've been guilty of that. I didn't like fluxbox until I realized that what I didn't like was the default menu and how easy it is to change it. I didn't like Fvwm95 because of the default Focus follows mouse. etc.

So, for now, I will stick with JWM in Puppy, Why? because it's there, It's small, It does what I need it for (show a menu, taskbar, manage windows).

I use KDE in Fedora because it's in a fast computer and It's there. (I didn't even install GNOME, which is the Fedora default).

I've found that after the 'distromania' cools down one goes into the 'WMmania'. I think it's part of maturing as a Linux user. It get's to a point where it really does not matter. You will startup with a distro/WM closest to what you require for a particular task and evolve from there. If you have a different task that's not suitable for that distro/WM you just use it.
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Flash
Official Dog Handler


Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 13653
Location: Arizona USA

PostPosted: Wed 14 Dec 2005, 23:12    Post subject:  

Thanks rarsa, I agree 100%. Smile
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jcagle

Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Posts: 634

PostPosted: Thu 15 Dec 2005, 22:47    Post subject:  

Quote:
I think this is the wrong interpretation of what really transpired on that mailing list.


You're right, it isn't exactly what Linus said it and I didn't mean to make it sound that way. I just typed that quickly. What would probably have fit more would be "Linus would prefer you to use KDE over Gnome".

If people click the link, though, they should see that anyway.
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jcagle

Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Posts: 634

PostPosted: Thu 15 Dec 2005, 22:51    Post subject:  

ok, I've fixed the subject to, hopefully, more accurately display Linus Torvald's feelings.
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bongmaster


Joined: 18 Dec 2005
Posts: 50

PostPosted: Sun 18 Dec 2005, 13:58    Post subject:  

i've prefered kde since red hat 9.. it friendly. obviously not very good for a low end system.. but great for a main desktop system..
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Chuck the Plant


Joined: 04 Nov 2005
Posts: 17
Location: USA

PostPosted: Tue 20 Dec 2005, 16:43    Post subject: While we're discussing window managers and environments...  

The adaptation of XFCE to Puppy available via dotpup was a godsend. For someone like me moving over from the Microsoft universe, the GUI menu-driven adaptability is really useful. JWM is decent, Fluxbox is fast and I really like Icewm, but I keep going back to XFCE. Maybe I'm just lazy...but it seems a perfect compliment to Rox Filer, MUT and other utilities set up to take some of the arcane elements out of Linux computing.
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jcagle

Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Posts: 634

PostPosted: Wed 21 Dec 2005, 02:26    Post subject:  

XFCE is good, but I've decided I like Fluxbox better.
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