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 Forum index » Off-Topic Area » Programming
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Moose On The Loose


Joined: 24 Feb 2011
Posts: 773

PostPosted: Tue 01 Sep 2015, 10:02    Post subject: Re: HTML Tables  

kjdixo wrote:
Useful tip Technosaurus, thanks.

Here is a basic intro to html tables.
http://css-tricks.com/complete-guide-table-element/
It also highlights some more advanced aspects and some gotchas (ie deprecated attributes).
Most of the commenters think it is a good article.


I tried and tried to get the positioning to work with CSS in the attached and finally just gave up and went back to using tables. The problem I think stems from a certain arrogance built into CSS where it thinks it knows better than I do about where things should appear. Tables are extremely modest in that they assume the Table Rows and Table Divs are arranged on a grid and exactly as specified by the web designer.

Yes, it is a silly game. I made it mostly to practice fiddling SVG on the fly.
tangle.zip
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zip

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Filename  tangle.zip 
Filesize  8.33 KB 
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kjdixo

Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Tue 01 Sep 2015, 14:06    Post subject:  

Moose On The Loose
Re. Tangle
Very inventive / ingenious that game (and code).
The first time I played the game I got interconnecting lines which I could untangle to win the game.
The above was what I expected.
I pressed the New Game button and then get only dots with no interconnecting lines.
I clicked some dots and they changed color.
So I have no lines to untangle . . . Am I missing something or do I have to imagine where the lines are?
I might have an incompatible browser setting.
Thanks
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L18L

Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 3431
Location: www.eussenheim.de/

PostPosted: Tue 01 Sep 2015, 14:06    Post subject: Re: HTML Tables  

Moose On The Loose wrote:
I tried and tried to get the positioning to work with CSS in the attached and finally just gave up and went back to using tables.


Try tableless version please
tangle1.html.gz
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Moose On The Loose


Joined: 24 Feb 2011
Posts: 773

PostPosted: Tue 01 Sep 2015, 21:28    Post subject: Re: HTML Tables  

L18L wrote:
Moose On The Loose wrote:
I tried and tried to get the positioning to work with CSS in the attached and finally just gave up and went back to using tables.


Try tableless version please


The zip file appears corrupt
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Moose On The Loose


Joined: 24 Feb 2011
Posts: 773

PostPosted: Tue 01 Sep 2015, 21:30    Post subject:  

kjdixo wrote:
Moose On The Loose
Re. Tangle
Very inventive / ingenious that game (and code).
The first time I played the game I got interconnecting lines which I could untangle to win the game.
The above was what I expected.
I pressed the New Game button and then get only dots with no interconnecting lines.
I clicked some dots and they changed color.
So I have no lines to untangle . . . Am I missing something or do I have to imagine where the lines are?
I might have an incompatible browser setting.
Thanks


What web browser?

The new game should have more circles and a lot more lines

On Firefox, it works up to the point where I have well over 100 circles.
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muggins

Joined: 20 Jan 2006
Posts: 6734
Location: hobart

PostPosted: Wed 02 Sep 2015, 00:21    Post subject:  

Quote:
The zip file appears corrupt


Just rename to tangle1.html
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kjdixo

Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Wed 02 Sep 2015, 02:47    Post subject: Browser  

Quote:

What web browser?

The new game should have more circles and a lot more lines

On Firefox, it works up to the point where I have well over 100 circles.


Pale Moon web browser.
http://www.palemoon.org/
Quote:

Pale Moon offers you a browsing experience in a browser completely built from its own, independently developed source that has been forked off from Firefox/Mozilla code, with carefully selected features and optimizations to maximize the browser's speed*, stability and user experience, while offering a rich collection of extensions and themes (including compatibility with many Firefox extensions users have come to love and rely on).


So it is based on Firefox, I changed a year ago because firefox had become too slow and bloated.
Even Palemoon has far too many settings and obviously 'behind the scenes unseen functionality' in the about:config for my liking. Ideally I would like a browser that simply renders the html and does not feed-back information to developers or google or the government or anyone. All tracking and targeted advertising should be made illegal in my opinion (also rip down those spy cameras in the streets and trash their control rooms).
Some websites won't even serve you html unless they have analysed your browser signature so they know what browser you are using.
I read that only 1.3 percent of users have JavaScript switched off, it is easy to switch off CSS in most browsers but not so easy (fiddly) to switch off JS, plus many users do not even know what what JS is. Not all websites are considerate enough to design a nice accessible page that works with JS and CSS swiched off, so minimal browsers like Dillo web browser are not a realistic option for daily browsing.
Palemoon is a good compromise for now, until I find something better.

Rant over . . . for now.
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Moose On The Loose


Joined: 24 Feb 2011
Posts: 773

PostPosted: Wed 02 Sep 2015, 09:49    Post subject: Re: HTML Tables  

L18L wrote:
Moose On The Loose wrote:
I tried and tried to get the positioning to work with CSS in the attached and finally just gave up and went back to using tables.


Try tableless version please


That looks like one of my many failed attempts. Notice:

1) The buttons over to the right of the game are shoved way over to the right

2) The "game number" and circles are way below the bottom edge of the game.

3) If you shrink your browser window, the controls to the right suddenly pop to below the game area.
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Moose On The Loose


Joined: 24 Feb 2011
Posts: 773

PostPosted: Wed 02 Sep 2015, 09:54    Post subject: Re: Browser  

kjdixo wrote:
Quote:

What web browser?

The new game should have more circles and a lot more lines

On Firefox, it works up to the point where I have well over 100 circles.


Pale Moon web browser.
http://www.palemoon.org/


I expect it is a bug in the browser. The code uses the NewGame() function on startup to do the first game and the same function for each new game. The code puts down the circles and then does the lines. It could be that the section that does this didn't complete correctly. When I get a bit of time, I will look into it a bit more.
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kjdixo

Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Wed 02 Sep 2015, 13:23    Post subject:  

Thanks Moose OTL
When I get time I will try your tangle game in some other browsers.

Digressing a little.
Line and dots and more lines and dots suggest to me charting and graphs.

This FLOT graph I did a long time ago and can't remember much about it.
My website has been mostly dormant and not used for a few years.
I used PHP to decode the Yahoo Finance Query CSV file.
http://kdworld7.net/financial/graph2.html

FLOT (Flot is a pure JavaScript plotting library for jQuery, with a focus on simple usage, attractive looks and interactive features.)
http://www.flotcharts.org/

This CSS only (no flot) graph I did a long time ago and can't remember much about it.
I used PHP to decode the Yahoo Finance Query CSV file.
http://kdworld7.net/financial/graph.html?s=GOOG

Maybe there is a thread/topic on this forum here, dealing with web page charts and graphs or perhaps someone could start one.
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kjdixo

Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Wed 02 Sep 2015, 14:17    Post subject:  

Converting scanned bitmap images of graphs from books and journals to csv files (data points) is done quite well by this windows program.
http://www.chem.uoa.gr/misc/specscan.htm
I wonder how it works?
Is there web code that could do similar?
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seaside

Joined: 11 Apr 2007
Posts: 915

PostPosted: Wed 02 Sep 2015, 17:05    Post subject:  

kjdixo wrote:
Converting scanned bitmap images of graphs from books and journals to csv files (data points) is done quite well by this windows program.
http://www.chem.uoa.gr/misc/specscan.htm
I wonder how it works?
Is there web code that could do similar?


kjdixo,

I've often thought of converting bitmaps to svg and then to data points.

Here's a program called "engauge" that looks quite promising.

Quote:
This open source, digitizing software converts an image file showing a graph or map, into numbers. The image file can come from a scanner, digital camera or screenshot. The numbers can be read on the screen, and written or copied to a spreadsheet.

The process starts with an image file containing a graph or map. You add three axis points to define the axes, then other points along your curve(s).The final result is digitized data that can be used by other tools such as Microsoft Excel and Gnumeric.


http://digitizer.sourceforge.net

Cheers,
s
(I haven't tried the program, so I can't provide any feedback)
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kjdixo

Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Thu 03 Sep 2015, 04:26    Post subject:  

Thanks Seaside this looks very interesting.

I installed engauge-digitizer_5.2-1 from the ubuntu-trusty-universe repos in quirky puppy tahr 6.05.
It installed fine but the help files were not installed and the manual was not in usr/share/doc however the online help is very good.
http://digitizer.sourceforge.net/usermanual/index.html
The engauge program has some very advanced features and is quite complicated for a newbie (on a level with the GIMP or MtPaint when it comes to trying to work out how to do very basic tasks with a minimum of clicks quickly) . . . . compared to the specscan program which was from my recollection, 4 clicks and completely automatic.
I do get CSV data from engauge, but only after a lot of ' mouse clicking' and 'head scratching' and even the automatic mode has manual steps.
I think it takes time to learn it and so when I find out the shortcuts and easy ways I will post them here.
One thing I haven't tried that might be worth trying is to install specscan on linux using wine.
Thanks for showing me engauge.
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kjdixo

Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Thu 03 Sep 2015, 05:16    Post subject:  

Moose On The Loose
I tried Midori browser and the Tangle game works properly and progresses to more complex tangles and it all seems to work, so the problem was I think the browser, as you said a bug in Palemoon browser.
Thanks
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Moose On The Loose


Joined: 24 Feb 2011
Posts: 773

PostPosted: Thu 03 Sep 2015, 10:46    Post subject:  

kjdixo wrote:
Moose On The Loose
I tried Midori browser and the Tangle game works properly and progresses to more complex tangles and it all seems to work, so the problem was I think the browser, as you said a bug in Palemoon browser.
Thanks


This is good to know.

I tried to code for "lowest common denominator" while being within the standard and in this case using SVG to do graphics. I have done other stuff using TABLEs and DIVs to do graphics by changing sizes and changing background colors. It looks kind of blocky but I could code stuff to do graphs and games.

The trick for graphs without SVG is to use the left border of an item at a short vertical line and either the top or bottom as the horizontal line. On up slopes, you use the top. On down slopes, you use the bottom. This lets you make nice stepwise lines. The graph looks quite good with only about 100 steps in it. Javascript can loop 100 times quickly so it is reasonable to make a continuously updating display such as some signal changing as the user fiddles a control up and down.
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